Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana and Marriott Ownerships

[VacationForever]

I have a question for those who own post-2010 Marriott resale weeks and have attended sales presentations.

In general, does Marriott ever provide offers to trade in your existing week in exchange for a DP purchase?

From what I have read on TUG, it seems like they are sometimes willing to enroll your existing resale week if you either purchase additional DP or make a developer week purchase (Aruba seems to be a popular choice). But there is some speculation on the Vistana forum that they may want to take weeks to have people move directly into DP.

I'm skeptical and think while they may have some sort of conversion offer for the Flex programs, they likely don't want to hold too much inventory in the trust and would prefer to just enroll weeks via the selling of more DP.

I have not heard of such offers.

 

[DanCali]

I have a question for those who own post-2010 Marriott resale weeks and have attended sales presentations.

In general, does Marriott ever provide offers to trade in your existing week in exchange for a DP purchase?

From what I have read on TUG, it seems like they are sometimes willing to enroll your existing resale week if you either purchase additional DP or make a developer week purchase (Aruba seems to be a popular choice). But there is some speculation on the Vistana forum that they may want to take weeks to have people move directly into DP.

I'm skeptical and think while they may have some sort of conversion offer for the Flex programs, they likely don't want to hold too much inventory in the trust and would prefer to just enroll weeks via the selling of more DP.

Vistana was into those offers, especially with our WKV weeks where they have no ROFR.

We never got an offer like this from Marriott. I think they probably get better deals with ROFR and, as a business strategy, it's better to offer people something they don't have (access to DC points) then offer to take away a deeded week they probably like.

 

[dioxide45]

I have never seen a trade in offer with MVC like we used to see with Vistana. Vistana was heavy into these when selling Sheraton Flex early on. THey soaked up a lot of weeks that may have otherwise made it to resale markets. When Marriott Vacations Worldwide bought ILG, these trade in options didn't last much longer. I get the impression that MVC doesn't like that method to sell new product. Marriott is more about enrolling weeks as part of a purchase. I suspect the same will happen in the future with voluntary resale, mandatory resale and resale flex contracts. The ability to enroll those in the combined program with the purchase of DC trust points.

 

[Dean]

I have a question for those who own post-2010 Marriott resale weeks and have attended sales presentations.

In general, does Marriott ever provide offers to trade in your existing week in exchange for a DP purchase?

From what I have read on TUG, it seems like they are sometimes willing to enroll your existing resale week if you either purchase additional DP or make a developer week purchase (Aruba seems to be a popular choice). But there is some speculation on the Vistana forum that they may want to take weeks to have people move directly into DP.

I'm skeptical and think while they may have some sort of conversion offer for the Flex programs, they likely don't want to hold too much inventory in the trust and would prefer to just enroll weeks via the selling of more DP.

I have seen several reports of trade offers and received one myself when I inquired about the others I'd seen. At the time I was offered a competitive value for the week I was considering (about 2/3 what I paid) and the then discounted price per point for the retail purchase. For what I had asked about (Aruba OF or event week), the price difference was still too great but was reasonable if I were going to make a retail purchase anyway.

 

[2boysmom]

We were in HH last weekend and received an offer to credit the equity of our 2 DSVII red weeks towards a purchase of the equivalent number of points (4300) but at the 'new and not yet announced' pp of $19+pp plus they would enroll our 1 post 2010 resale week (oceanfront Surf Watch gold). The net cost would have been $40K+ and we said no. We were shocked they were trying to float this new point price since it isn't even official. Would have gotten us to Presidential but we told them we were finished buying anything and wanted Marriott to consider a flat rate to enroll resale weeks as we suspect a lot of owners like us are out there. Willing to pay something but not tens of thousands.

 

[VacationForever]

We were in HH last weekend and received an offer to credit the equity of our 2 DSVII red weeks towards a purchase of the equivalent number of points (4300) but at the 'new and not yet announced' pp of $19+pp plus they would enroll our 1 post 2010 resale week (oceanfront Surf Watch gold). The net cost would have been $40K+ and we said no. We were shocked they were trying to float this new point price since it isn't even official. Would have gotten us to Presidential but we told them we were finished buying anything and wanted Marriott to consider a flat rate to enroll resale weeks as we suspect a lot of owners like us are out there. Willing to pay something but not tens of thousands.

Sounds like it wasn't legitimate and a teaser. How can they sell you points at $19 per point?

 

[kozykritter]

Sounds like it wasn't legitimate and a teaser. How can they sell you points at $19 per point?

Maybe MVC is following the lead of Hilton in their merger with DRI where they created HGV Max, a level most existing owners have to buy in to with big $$$ to get access to DRI properties as well as any other new properties Hilton brings on board. Perhaps they might roll something out like this for existing MVC owners to get Vistana access... That would be an awful shock!

 

[CKMason]

We are currently at Sheraton Broadway Plantation in Myrtle Beach and attended a sales presentation for Vistana on April 23. According to the salesperson the locations in Myrtle Beach and in Orlando (both Marriott and Vistana) are engaged in “pre-rollout” sales presentations relating to the rollout of the “blended” system on July 1—or as our salesperson put it “late summer”. In addition to the presentations at Myrtle Beach and Orlando, there are also dog and pony shows for invited owners in other locations, including Washington DC.

Before I go further, you need to know that our situation may not be typical. We are 3-Star Elite with Vistana and Chairman’s Club with Marriott all with developer purchases. (Yes, I know but that is a discussion for another time.). I do not know how Vistana/Marriott will handle resale purchases in this new system.

According to what the salespersons (one from the Vistana side and one from the Marriott side) told us, if you buy into the blended system, both your StarOptions and your Marriott ownership (for us points and weeks) will show up together on both the Vistana dashboard and the Marriott web account. You will be able to move, at no further cost, Vistana points into Destination Points and vice versa. You will be able to make Marriott reservations in the Vistana system and vice-versa. If you have an II account for Marriott and one for Vistana, those will also be merged into one account. The blended system will also move your Vistana points into the Marriott Trust, which will then allow for Vistana StarOptions to be resold to Marriott [Vistana currently does not do buy-backs] and, according to the sales people, will ease inheritance issues, especially if your children don’t want the timeshares [never could get this straight in my mind, except that with Vistana, it appears that the timeshares roll into your estate automatically, but I thought that the executor could always reject them.]

In addition, instead of the various fees that Vistana charges [banking, point conversion to Marriott Bonvoy, II fees for internal (Marriott to Vistana and vice-versa) exchanges, reservation cancellations, guest fees], these will now all be covered by the standard Marriott fee for the appropriate level, The Marriott fee covers both Vistana and Marriott membership, but I suspect it will go up proportionately. In addition, there will be no more housekeeping fees as we now experience with Vistana when the number of uses of points exceeds a certain level.

In the blended system, there is no more Home Resort window for reservations. All Vistana resorts will be able to be booked 12 months out and all Marriott resorts 13 months out, at least for Chairman’s Club level members. I am assuming that to book a Marriott with Vistana StarOptions, one would first have to convert the number needed and then the timeframe would apply.

The process requires one to turn in their current ownership of StarOptions and repurchase at the current StarOption point value. We were given full credit for the dollars we spent on our current ownership plus credit for an Explorer package we had purchased earlier plus credit for the hotels we stayed in on the road getting to Myrtle Beach. [They give up to 10 days credit coming and going; we got a good deal because we stayed on Marriott Bonvoy points on our trip and got credit for full value of the room rate.].

We have 176,700 StarOptions which would be valued at 5,140 Destination Points in the blended system. [34.37 StarOptions to 1 Destination Club Point]. It does appear that there will still be some “skim” in the system from Vistana to Marriott. I did a quick analysis comparing 2-bedroom lockouts in prime time [February/March] for Marriott Desert Springs II [3,775 Destination Club Points] and Westin Mission Hills [148,100 StarOptions] with the result of 39.23 StarOptions points to 1 Destination Club Point]. [Purchase price: 34.37; spend price 39.23]. Even in the blended system, it probably would be better to use StarOptions for Vistana resorts and Destination Club points for Marriott resorts.

The claim is, and I have no idea if it is true, it will be more expensive on the Marriott side to buy into the system. Essentially the current going price for a StarOption is about $.43 per point which should make a Marriott Destination Club point run about $14.72.

That is pretty much my brain dump about what we were told. Of course, there is NO paperwork to undergird the statements made. We are supposed to get it in the coming weeks as the system rolls out for good. Caveat emptor.

I started by posting this on the Vistana board, but thought that Marriott owners might find it interesting also.

 

[TravelTime]

This is interesting, I have a question. You said:

“You will be able to move, at no further cost, Vistana points into Destination Points and vice versa.”

“The process requires one to turn in their current ownership of StarOptions and repurchase at the current StarOption point value.”

So I am a bit confused. Does this mean there is or is not a cost to participate in both systems?

 

[CKMason]

This is interesting, I have a question. You said:

“You will be able to move, at no further cost, Vistana points into Destination Points and vice versa.”

“The process requires one to turn in their current ownership of StarOptions and repurchase at the current StarOption point value.”

So I am a bit confused. Does this mean there is or is not a cost to participate in both systems?

Yes, there is a cost to >>join<< the blended system [the cost of repurchasing the StarOptions] but after joining all most all of the miscellaneous fees that Vistana charges go away, including any charges for converting points in one system to the other. Sorry I wasn't more clear.

 

[VacationForever]

We are currently at Sheraton Broadway Plantation in Myrtle Beach and attended a sales presentation for Vistana on April 23. According to the salesperson the locations in Myrtle Beach and in Orlando (both Marriott and Vistana) are engaged in “pre-rollout” sales presentations relating to the rollout of the “blended” system on July 1—or as our salesperson put it “late summer”. In addition to the presentations at Myrtle Beach and Orlando, there are also dog and pony shows for invited owners in other locations, including Washington DC.

Before I go further, you need to know that our situation may not be typical. We are 3-Star Elite with Vistana and Chairman’s Club with Marriott all with developer purchases. (Yes, I know but that is a discussion for another time.). I do not know how Vistana/Marriott will handle resale purchases in this new system.

According to what the salespersons (one from the Vistana side and one from the Marriott side) told us, if you buy into the blended system, both your StarOptions and your Marriott ownership (for us points and weeks) will show up together on both the Vistana dashboard and the Marriott web account. You will be able to move, at no further cost, Vistana points into Destination Points and vice versa. You will be able to make Marriott reservations in the Vistana system and vice-versa. If you have an II account for Marriott and one for Vistana, those will also be merged into one account. The blended system will also move your Vistana points into the Marriott Trust, which will then allow for Vistana StarOptions to be resold to Marriott [Vistana currently does not do buy-backs] and, according to the sales people, will ease inheritance issues, especially if your children don’t want the timeshares [never could get this straight in my mind, except that with Vistana, it appears that the timeshares roll into your estate automatically, but I thought that the executor could always reject them.]

In addition, instead of the various fees that Vistana charges [banking, point conversion to Marriott Bonvoy, II fees for internal (Marriott to Vistana and vice-versa) exchanges, reservation cancellations, guest fees], these will now all be covered by the standard Marriott fee for the appropriate level, The Marriott fee covers both Vistana and Marriott membership, but I suspect it will go up proportionately. In addition, there will be no more housekeeping fees as we now experience with Vistana when the number of uses of points exceeds a certain level.

In the blended system, there is no more Home Resort window for reservations. All Vistana resorts will be able to be booked 12 months out and all Marriott resorts 13 months out, at least for Chairman’s Club level members. I am assuming that to book a Marriott with Vistana StarOptions, one would first have to convert the number needed and then the timeframe would apply.

The process requires one to turn in their current ownership of StarOptions and repurchase at the current StarOption point value. We were given full credit for the dollars we spent on our current ownership plus credit for an Explorer package we had purchased earlier plus credit for the hotels we stayed in on the road getting to Myrtle Beach. [They give up to 10 days credit coming and going; we got a good deal because we stayed on Marriott Bonvoy points on our trip and got credit for full value of the room rate.].

We have 176,700 StarOptions which would be valued at 5,140 Destination Points in the blended system. [34.37 StarOptions to 1 Destination Club Point]. It does appear that there will still be some “skim” in the system from Vistana to Marriott. I did a quick analysis comparing 2-bedroom lockouts in prime time [February/March] for Marriott Desert Springs II [3,775 Destination Club Points] and Westin Mission Hills [148,100 StarOptions] with the result of 39.23 StarOptions points to 1 Destination Club Point]. [Purchase price: 34.37; spend price 39.23]. Even in the blended system, it probably would be better to use StarOptions for Vistana resorts and Destination Club points for Marriott resorts.

The claim is, and I have no idea if it is true, it will be more expensive on the Marriott side to buy into the system. Essentially the current going price for a StarOption is about $.43 per point which should make a Marriott Destination Club point run about $14.72.

That is pretty much my brain dump about what we were told. Of course, there is NO paperwork to undergird the statements made. We are supposed to get it in the coming weeks as the system rolls out for good. Caveat emptor.

I started by posting this on the Vistana board, but thought that Marriott owners might find it interesting also.

I highly suspect that most of the process that you have listed here had been made up by the local sales team. Move DC points to Vistana system and vice versa? Doesn't sound like a one blended system.

 

[TravelTime]

Yes, there is a cost to >>join<< the blended system [the cost of repurchasing the StarOptions] but after joining all most all of the miscellaneous fees that Vistana charges go away, including any charges for converting points in one system to the other. Sorry I wasn't more clear.

As a person who bought Vistana and MVC from the developer, what did they say would be your out of pocket cost to join the blended system?

 

[dioxide45]

Yes, there is a cost to >>join<< the blended system [the cost of repurchasing the StarOptions] but after joining all most all of the miscellaneous fees that Vistana charges go away, including any charges for converting points in one system to the other. Sorry I wasn't more clear.

Realiase you were at a presentation where they were trying to sell you more timeshare. From other contact people have on the boards, if you own developer purchased StarOptions or enrolled Marriott weeks or Trust points, there should be no need to purchase anything new. Vistana owners that own "enrolled" VOIs won't have to buy anything new or pay any additional fee to "join".

 

[CKMason]

Realiase you were at a presentation where they were trying to sell you more timeshare. From other contact people have on the boards, if you own developer purchased StarOptions or enrolled Marriott weeks or Trust points, there should be no need to purchase anything new. Vistana owners that own "enrolled" VOIs won't have to buy anything new or pay any additional fee to "join".

I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens at the rollout in the summer.

 

[jmhpsu93]

I highly suspect that most of the process that you have listed here had been made up by the local sales team. Move DC points to Vistana system and vice versa? Doesn't sound like a one blended system.

For what it's worth, if that's made up that's quite a lot of work that went into spinning that yarn.

 

[Eric B]

For what it's worth, if that's made up that's quite a lot of work that went into spinning that yarn.

I could see it taking a lot of work to come up with some problem that can only be solved by making another purchase when the buyer already owns as much or more than they can use. Plus, they didn't have to sell anything that the buyer didn't already have and liked! I wonder how much the closing costs were for that one.

 

[Dean]

For what it's worth, if that's made up that's quite a lot of work that went into spinning that yarn.

It's probably more half truths than completely made up. I don't think anyone should buy anything based on their thoughts of a combined program until they have enough information to make an informed decision which no one has at this point.

 

[Steve Fatula]

It's probably more half truths than completely made up. I don't think anyone should buy anything based on their thoughts of a combined program until they have enough information to make an informed decision which no one has at this point.

Agree. It could have even been correct information at the time, but until implemented and announced, subject to change anyway.

 

[Bird01]

Re: "In the blended system, there is no more Home Resort window for reservations". I'm not sure what that means. Today, as a Vistana owner, I can make a Home Resort reservation at 12 months. It seems that they must preserve the Home Resort priority for those owners. Maybe Marriott owners and Vistana options (not Home Resort) can only reserve Vistana properties at 8 months out? That's the way it is today for Star Options reservations at properties other than your Home Resort.

 

[VacationForever]

Re: "In the blended system, there is no more Home Resort window for reservations". I'm not sure what that means. Today, as a Vistana owner, I can make a Home Resort reservation at 12 months. It seems that they must preserve the Home Resort priority for those owners. Maybe Marriott owners and Vistana options (not Home Resort) can only reserve Vistana properties at 8 months out? That's the way it is today for Star Options reservations at properties other than your Home Resort.

There is still the concept of "Home Resort" booking window in MVC system for weeks. Weeks and DC points are 2 separate inventory buckets.

 

[TravelTime]

There is still the concept of "Home Resort" booking window in MVC system for weeks. Weeks and DC points are 2 separate inventory buckets.

Then it might make sense that MVC could roll out the new program allowing DP owners, converted points from enrolled weeks and owners with more than one week (whether it is a Marriott or Vistana week), to book at 13 months. For single week owners of Marriott and Vistana, they would get the 12 month booking window. Then the program is pretty easy to integrate into the overall MVC program.

 

[Bird01]

Maybe. We have 5 weeks in Marriott now and can book at 13 months as I recall. And we are Elite 4 in Vistana. At our recent Vistana update we were told we would get a 13-month booking window. However, I do no recall if that was because of multiple Vistana properties (7 "weeks") or the Elite status level.

 

[TravelTime]

I have been thinking of whether to buy 3500 DPs on the resale market to get to Chairman’s Club level in the event they create more benefits for Chairman’s Club. But I have been waiting to see whether MVC will have a low cost way to enroll my Vistana week because that will get me past the requirement for Chairman’s Club.

 

[dewco]

Currently at Ko Olina on a 5-night, $699 package that requires the sales presentation. Bought this package in May 2019 with a 12 month usage under my name. The deadline was extend several times because of COVID but we are finally using it. We are staying in a ground floor studio with a view of the garden shrubbery. This studio is a huge downgrade from a Westin studio; more spacious, washer/dryer, full size refrigerator, two burners & dishwasher. We attended a presentation at Ko Olina in December 2019 where they offered points for sale but we didn’t buy anything. The integration is to happen in June But they are showing the combined package of properties is currently at 92. They seem to have all the property points loaded into their system. If we had taken the time, we could have been shown the point cost for a Westin property under

My other half owns several Westin properties, no Flex, and do not own anything Marriott so we are very interested in understanding the new combined program. We have always attended presentations together. We attended a Westin Princeville presentation in September 2021 as guests of our friends who we were staying with. During the Kauai trip we also had a Marriott presentation at the Kauai Beach Club location.

We attended the presentation on May 1 and kept quite about the Westin properties, waiting to see how much information the had on me/us. The only thing they had in their file is that I attended a presentation at a desert property in 2011. We were very low key during the presentation and didn’t want to bring up the Westin ownerships. We were mostly focused on the Marriott points they were trying to sell but did get around to discussing a bit of how the Westin would integrate with the new program. She showed us how a 2 bedroom lock off, island view, platinum, annual Westin Kaanapali Ocean Resort Villa would become 6200 Club Points. The maintenance fee would do a double from the current fee under Westin. It would seen that this should be a really hard sell if people understood what will happen if they hand over their deeded Westin weeks for a bunch of points.

We don’t know the value of Marriott points so I can’t speculate about what we would get at a Marriott property but it seems hard to imagine that it would be anything that justify the huge increase in maintenance fees. The only thing we were shown was 20 examples of what one could do with1500 points. I glazed over when the price was discussed because I knew we weren’t interested. They did say the point price was to increase on May 3.

There is still lots to learn for us but we feel the learning process will be better at a Westin presentation.

 

[kozykritter]

She showed us how a 2 bedroom lock off, island view, platinum, annual Westin Kaanapali Ocean Resort Villa would become 6200 Club Points. The maintenance fee would do a double from the current fee under Westin. It would seen that this should be a really hard sell if people understood what will happen if they hand over their deeded Westin weeks for a bunch of points.

Wait, when you say hand over do you turn that ownership over to Marriott permanently and replace it with a points ownership? That's the only way having to pay maintenance fees to Marriott would make sense. What's been discussed through many sales presentations detailed on TUG instead is enrolling the ownership with Marriott and then deciding each year if you want to convert it into points. There's been no discussion that a Vistana owner would pay Marriott maintenance fees whenever they converted to DC points in a given year instead of paying maintenance fees to Vistana. This would change the whole equation for many people and I suspect permanently have them say no way!