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Wyndham limiting access by non-owners during most sought-after dates/locations

chapjim

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If their resorts are on this list for those holidays, yes. I wouldn't count on Wyndham canceling it right away. It could happen immediately, or the day before check-in. Does it matter when it gets canceled or if it might get canceled? It's still too risky to rent that week for both the buyer and seller.

Thank you for your insight.
 

josegm888

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I was making a point about how little control you actually have overall. When it comes to timeshares, the developers have the most control. They purposely set it up that way. The question still remains, where is it in writing that you have a "right" to bring a guest to your "shared" real property? Just because you have a deed, doesn't give you carte blanche to do what you want because it's shared property. You partly own it with many other owners who also don't have carte blanche.

If Wyndham wasn't allowed to do this, they would have figured that out last year when they put in a similar policy. They wouldn't have done it again this year. They also have an army of lawyers telling them what they can and cannot get away with. It's one thing to play dumb when it comes to sales practices. It's a whole another thing to make a public announcement in writing. If they announced that they were doing something that was illegal, they would be opening themselves up to a bunch of slam dunk lawsuits. If they do backtrack on this policy, it won't likely have anything to do with legality. It would be more to please the owners. The owners on Facebook for the most part like the idea. The ones making the most noise are the ones who profit from their timeshare. Since they are breaking the "not for commercial" use rule, they won't have a leg to stand on in court. That doesn't leave many people left who'd be willing to take on that long and expensive battle,.

If we didn’t have the right to do it in the first place we wouldn’t be having this discussion, but we do, hence Wyndham does it as well(rent points). And no, I wouldn’t waste my time suing Wyndham. Wyndham is not the only timeshare program out there, let alone their point value is close to nothing in the resale market. If some owners really think this is going to hurt “profiteers” there’re as naive as the Wyndham sales person wants them to be.


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Richelle

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If we didn’t have the right to do it in the first place we wouldn’t be having this discussion, but we do, hence Wyndham does it as well(rent points). And no, I wouldn’t waste my time suing Wyndham. Wyndham is not the only timeshare program out there, let alone their point value is close to nothing in the resale market. If some owners really think this is going to hurt “profiteers” there’re as naive as the Wyndham sales person wants them to be.


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Just because they allow something to happen, doesn’t mean it’s a “right”. They have chosen not to do anything about it before, because it wasn’t a big enough issue. The last time they went out of megarenrers, it’s because they found a major issue with the system. Otherwise some of them would probably still be around. The only thing naive here is someone thinking they have more control and “rights” then they actually do.

If this wasn’t hurting profiteers, why are they the ones screaming the loudest on Facebook? I’ve seen a few complaints from owners who are naive enough to think they have complete control over what they do with their points. I’ve seen a few complaints from people who hand not put their relatives name on the reservation yet. The latter are the ones I feel bad for. Not the profiteers that are “outraged” by Wyndham not allowing them to use their points as they see fit. They are trying to get the ownership base stirred up because they know they cannot do anything about it, since they are breaking the “no commercial use” rule. It might not be breaking the bank enough to put some out of business, but they still have to pay back all that money and find another place for all those points. If that means people stop renting Wyndham resort rooms, I’m cool with that. I like seeing owners in rooms. I don’t need to rent.


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josegm888

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Just because they allow something to happen, doesn’t mean it’s a “right”. They have chosen not to do anything about it before, because it wasn’t a big enough issue. The last time they went out of megarenrers, it’s because they found a major issue with the system. Otherwise some of them would probably still be around. The only thing naive here is someone thinking they have more control and “rights” then they actually do.

If this wasn’t hurting profiteers, why are they the ones screaming the loudest on Facebook? I’ve seen a few complaints from owners who are naive enough to think they have complete control over what they do with their points. I’ve seen a few complaints from people who hand not put their relatives name on the reservation yet. The latter are the ones I feel bad for. Not the profiteers that are “outraged” by Wyndham not allowing them to use their points as they see fit. They are trying to get the ownership base stirred up because they know they cannot do anything about it, since they are breaking the “no commercial use” rule. It might not be breaking the bank enough to put some out of business, but they still have to pay back all that money and find another place for all those points. If that means people stop renting Wyndham resort rooms, I’m cool with that. I like seeing owners in rooms. I don’t need to rent.


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Again the real profiteers is Wyndham. Do you really think Wyndham would put in place a restriction on renting points that would limit their flexibility and profitability in doing so? Whats good for one profiteer is good for another.


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Sandi Bo

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When they did this last year, wasn't it a blanket policy at all resorts at all times, instead of a handful of resorts over major holidays? I think this time, the number of people complaining would be lower than it was last year. I could be wrong, but I think it's less likely they will backtrack this time.
Yes, last year was a blanket policy. Interesting they didn't do anything to address one of the big concerns many had about friends and family using their timeshare (what happened to having a list of friends and family)? Affecting a subset of the resorts and only certain blackout dates might make some happy (phew, our reunion is in Daytona Beach so it doesn't matter). But it's more complicated, poorly communicated, make it easier to spread fear amongst the masses.

Still, I wish it were more clear what 'subject to cancellation' means. I thought last year when we added the guest confirmation, it either got cancelled right away or it was okay and we didn't have to worry about it being cancelled. It's not realistic to be at risk of cancellation up until checkin day. (Back to wanting to know what the rules are - must be the QA person in me).

I will say it may have interesting benefits as far as getting people on vacation. If someone were planning a reunion at Bonnet Creek, it may have just gotten moved to Kingstown Reef, etc. Or pick different dates. Maybe the overall effect is more weeks get used across the system. I'm not saying it's right or that I agree with what they did. Just saying that maybe that's a plus to this (and it will help get rid of the glut of points sitting out there).

And, I'll say it again. I just want to know the rules so I can plan accordingly. (Still super shady how it was implemented, but then again, this is timeshares and Wyndham certainly gets an assist for the shady side of much of this business).
 

Richelle

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Yes, last year was a blanket policy. Interesting they didn't do anything to address one of the big concerns many had about friends and family using their timeshare (what happened to having a list of friends and family)? Affecting a subset of the resorts and only certain blackout dates might make some happy (phew, our reunion is in Daytona Beach so it doesn't matter). But it's more complicated, poorly communicated, make it easier to spread fear amongst the masses.

Still, I wish it were more clear what 'subject to cancellation' means. I thought last year when we added the guest confirmation, it either got cancelled right away or it was okay and we didn't have to worry about it being cancelled. It's not realistic to be at risk of cancellation up until checkin day. (Back to wanting to know what the rules are - must be the QA person in me).

I will say it may have interesting benefits as far as getting people on vacation. If someone were planning a reunion at Bonnet Creek, it may have just gotten moved to Kingstown Reef, etc. Or pick different dates. Maybe the overall effect is more weeks get used across the system. I'm not saying it's right or that I agree with what they did. Just saying that maybe that's a plus to this (and it will help get rid of the glut of points sitting out there).

And, I'll say it again. I just want to know the rules so I can plan accordingly. (Still super shady how it was implemented, but then again, this is timeshares and Wyndham certainly gets an assist for the shady side of much of this business).

Can you type up your list of questions, so I can copy and pasted it into an email? I’ll reach out to one of the senior owner care manager that HitchHiker71 and I talk to, and see if I can get some definitive answers.


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Richelle

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Again the real profiteers is Wyndham. Do you really think Wyndham would put in place a restriction on renting points that would limit their flexibility and profitability in doing so? Whats good for one profiteer is good for another.


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AGAIN, they are not renting these dates on Extra holidays. They are not renting anything.


I’m going to put in my conspiracy theory hat on for a second and say, if they are not doing it for the owners, they are doing it for good PR. Good PR=points sales. Common sense. They don’t need to rent. They make people happy, they are more likely to get people to buy. Their best customers are existing owners. That’s why they want resorts packed with owners on major holidays. More sales. They make more money in points sales then They do rentals. So why not put happy owners in their and increase you likelihood of selling points.

Wow, that hat was REALLY tight. Maybe that idea you can get onboard with because you refuse to believe the possibility that this benefits the owner. I think it’s both. It’s for both the owner and them.


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josegm888

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AGAIN, they are not renting these dates on Extra holidays. They are not renting anything.


I’m going to put in my conspiracy theory hat on for a second and say, if they are not doing it for the owners, they are doing it for good PR. Good PR=points sales. Common sense. They don’t need to rent. They make people happy, they are more likely to get people to buy. Their best customers are existing owners. That’s why they want resorts packed with owners on major holidays. More sales. They make more money in points sales then They do rentals. So why not put happy owners in their and increase you likelihood of selling points.

Wow, that hat was REALLY tight. Maybe that idea you can get onboard with because you refuse to believe the possibility that this benefits the owner. I think it’s both. It’s for both the owner and them.


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Haha good PR? Go to BBB and see how many complaints they have. If they want good PR stop tricking clueless buyers into buying something that’s worth dirt. Common sense is not to buy into something for thousands of dollars that’s worth only hundreds or less in the resale market, let alone with other competitors in the timeshare business who aren’t as petty which allow owners to rent to guests and don’t even charge for a guest confirmation. Don’t get me wrong I like Wyndham, but the way they do business is sketchy. It’s funny how they have problem with people renting out what they paid for but I’m sure they don’t have a problem with selling junk for thousands of dollars to someone who can be our grandmother or grandfather and not give two... I’m all about business but come on let’s be real.


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chapjim

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Koala has an article about Wyndham's new guest policy. There's nothing particularly useful.

 

chapjim

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AGAIN, they are not renting these dates on Extra holidays. They are not renting anything.


I’m going to put in my conspiracy theory hat on for a second and say, if they are not doing it for the owners, they are doing it for good PR. Good PR=points sales. Common sense. They don’t need to rent. They make people happy, they are more likely to get people to buy. Their best customers are existing owners. That’s why they want resorts packed with owners on major holidays. More sales. They make more money in points sales then They do rentals. So why not put happy owners in their and increase you likelihood of selling points.

Wow, that hat was REALLY tight. Maybe that idea you can get onboard with because you refuse to believe the possibility that this benefits the owner. I think it’s both. It’s for both the owner and them.


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The problem with trying to make owners happy is that in making one class of owners happy, they honk off another class of owners. Maybe that's what Wyndham wants. Make large owners unhappy so they will bail out and give points back through Ovations (insert latest program name here).
 

dgalati

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Can you type up your list of questions, so I can copy and pasted it into an email? I’ll reach out to one of the senior owner care manager that HitchHiker71 and I talk to, and see if I can get some definitive answers.


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Ask them when they will stop the abuse of VIP owners using resale points with VIP discounts and free upgrades. Think about all the rentals that could be eliminated and the inventory that would become available for owners eliminating this loophole. Remember cancel and rebook at one time was also considered a benefit as this is now.
 

montygz

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The problem with trying to make owners happy is that in making one class of owners happy, they honk off another class of owners. Maybe that's what Wyndham wants. Make large owners unhappy so they will bail out and give points back through Ovations (insert latest program name here).
Yes, no matter what Wyndham does someone will be unhappy. I'm sure owners who are shut out of reservations don't like looking on ebay and seeing dozens of them up for bid.

When these timeshare programs were conceived they had no idea about how the internet would be able to turn them into mini rental businesses. They've obviously had years to do something about it, but what do you do? Many of the benefits enjoyed by regular Wyndham users are also used by big renters.

Wyndham also enjoys having fresh renter cattle to lure to sales meetings and it knows that renting helps owners pay their maintenance fees and avoid costly defaults.
 

Richelle

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Ask them when they will stop the abuse of VIP owners using resale points with VIP discounts and free upgrades. Think about all the rentals that could be eliminated and the inventory that would become available for owners eliminating this loophole. Remember cancel and rebook at one time was also considered a benefit as this is now.

It is true some see it as a benefit, but those who watched what happened when cancel rebook went away, know it’s not a benefit unless it’s in writing. The main difference between the two, is the sales guys were promoting cancel rebook as a benefit. They are not promoting buying resale. Resale is a bad word to them. They ingrained that into their head. In the timeshare sales world, The number one rule about the resale market is, you don’t talk about the resale market. So if a sales person did start talking about the resale market, it would get nipped in the bud pretty quick. If we didn’t have mega renters, VIP benefits being used with resale points wouldn’t be an issue.

You already know my story. How most of my points are used on family vacations. We book large rooms far out. No discounts and little to no chance of upgrades. I have 700k that count as retail. My discounted and upgraded reservations don’t total more then that on a normal year., even when I really try. 700k during the standard window Could get me a week (or less) to 8 or 9 weeks. In the discount window, with free upgrades, I can easily double that and I’m only Gold. I like to think I’m pretty savvy on how I use my points. Maybe a little bit more then your average bear. If I’m not getting much more then that, then probably at least half the other VIP base that has resale are not getting enough discounted or upgradable reservations that total more then their retail points. So why punish the entire VIP base for one group of owners?

It may sound simple to separate resale and retail by setting a flag, but that’s only one step. You have a ton of rules that you have to set up on the system. What points get burned off first? What happens if you have to use a mix of resale and retail to book a reservation. Is it still eligible for the discount? Is it eligible for an upgrade? Can you use a mix of both resale and retail in the RARP window? Do you have two separate deadlines for moving points forward? Can you use those extra free GC of a reservation made with resale points? If not, what happens if you have both a mix or resale and retail? Which guest certificates get burned off first? The two that can be used for any reservation or the three that are eligible? Ok so the ones that are made with resale can only the two GC. What happens when you run out of the two resale and are have three, are you supposed to pay for more? Talk about confusing the owner. It’s a mammoth undertaking that would also require educating the owner. I’m not saying it’s impossible. I’m not even saying it will never happen. It very well could. If Wyndham finds they can do it in a reasonable amount of time, at a reasonable cost, and the benefits are work the risk, they will. However, in order for them to go through all that trouble, they have to ask themselves. Is it a big enough problem to go through all this? If it is a big problem, is there a cheaper and cleaner way to address it. I’m thinking the guest certificate policies over major holidays may be a start. Target the guest certificates and it keeps renters from picking up prime weeks. Let the people offsetting their maintenance fees offer their points up for rental instead of holding a reservation for months in hopes of renting it when someone else could book it and use it for themselves.


This is your one for the week. I will acknowledge your broken record/minced horse meat comments once a week. If you want more banter from me, come up with something original. If I ignore one of your comments, it’s because you already used up your one for the week.

Edit: once here, and if I’m feeling generous, once on Facebook to.


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Richelle

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Yes, no matter what Wyndham does someone will be unhappy. I'm sure owners who are shut out of reservations don't like looking on ebay and seeing dozens of them up for bid.

When these timeshare programs were conceived they had no idea about how the internet would be able to turn them into mini rental businesses. They've obviously had years to do something about it, but what do you do? Many of the benefits enjoyed by regular Wyndham users are also used by big renters.

Wyndham also enjoys having fresh renter cattle to lure to sales meetings and it knows that renting helps owners pay their maintenance fees and avoid costly defaults.

Good points. There is a benefit to bringing in fresh meat and it does help offset maintenance fees for regular owners. So rentals do have some benefit to Wyndham. I did ask a Wyndham executive if Wyndham was ok with the occasional rental. They said they were ok with the occasional rental. However, if it’s more then that, it’s up to them (Wyndham) to figure out how to help the owner because they obviously have more points then they can use. I think that’s why they have certified exit. It’s no longer just one way to exit your timeshare and no longer limited to just contracts that are paid off. They offer other options to owners to either help find a way to get them through tough financial times by deferring payments or helping them find a way to exit. They might even help them downsize their contracts if they need to. It’s cheaper to help the owner then it is to let it go into collections.

I got a bit side tracked. They are ok with the occasional rental. They never said they were ok with renting for profit. They never said they were ok with people setting up businesses. In fact, the directory expressly forbids commercial renting. I think what needs to happen is that they need to put their foot down. Put on the directory that if they suspect an owner is using their timeshare for commercial purposes, their account in the Club Wyndham system will be suspended or terminated. Right now it says “for personal use and enjoyment. Not for commercial use”. The RCI terms of use explicitly says that there are consequences to renting. They don’t have to terminate all renting like RCI does. Just commercial. Specificity mention that “commercial” use will be grounds for suspension or termination of your membership into the club. Once that’s in there, Wyndham can start swing the axe on these rental companies.

Don’t get me wrong. If someone wants to rent enough to completely pay off their fees, that’s fine in my book. Not many people are willing to go through the trouble, so if the only people renting were regular owners who also use their timeshare for themselves, it wouldn’t be an issue. It’s when you turn it into a business that I have a problem with. To turn a profit you have to rent out a lot and a lot of it has to be prime weeks. Plus it’s breaking the commercial use rule. The rest of us have to follow the rules. Why do they get to break them?

These are just my thoughts. :)


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It is true some see it as a benefit, but those who watched what happened when cancel rebook went away, know it’s not a benefit unless it’s in writing. The main difference between the two, is the sales guys were promoting cancel rebook as a benefit. They are not promoting buying resale. Resale is a bad word to them. They ingrained that into their head. In the timeshare sales world, The number one rule about the resale market is, you don’t talk about the resale market. So if a sales person did start talking about the resale market, it would get nipped in the bud pretty quick. If we didn’t have mega renters, VIP benefits being used with resale points wouldn’t be an issue.

You already know my story. How most of my points are used on family vacations. We book large rooms far out. No discounts and little to no chance of upgrades. I have 700k that count as retail. My discounted and upgraded reservations don’t total more then that on a normal year., even when I really try. 700k during the standard window Could get me a week (or less) to 8 or 9 weeks. In the discount window, with free upgrades, I can easily double that and I’m only Gold. I like to think I’m pretty savvy on how I use my points. Maybe a little bit more then your average bear. If I’m not getting much more then that, then probably at least half the other VIP base that has resale are not getting enough discounted or upgradable reservations that total more then their retail points. So why punish the entire VIP base for one group of owners?

It may sound simple to separate resale and retail by setting a flag, but that’s only one step. You have a ton of rules that you have to set up on the system. What points get burned off first? What happens if you have to use a mix of resale and retail to book a reservation. Is it still eligible for the discount? Is it eligible for an upgrade? Can you use a mix of both resale and retail in the RARP window? Do you have two separate deadlines for moving points forward? Can you use those extra free GC of a reservation made with resale points? If not, what happens if you have both a mix or resale and retail? Which guest certificates get burned off first? The two that can be used for any reservation or the three that are eligible? Ok so the ones that are made with resale can only the two GC. What happens when you run out of the two resale and are have three, are you supposed to pay for more? Talk about confusing the owner. It’s a mammoth undertaking that would also require educating the owner. I’m not saying it’s impossible. I’m not even saying it will never happen. It very well could. If Wyndham finds they can do it in a reasonable amount of time, at a reasonable cost, and the benefits are work the risk, they will. However, in order for them to go through all that trouble, they have to ask themselves. Is it a big enough problem to go through all this? If it is a big problem, is there a cheaper and cleaner way to address it. I’m thinking the guest certificate policies over major holidays may be a start. Target the guest certificates and it keeps renters from picking up prime weeks. Let the people offsetting their maintenance fees offer their points up for rental instead of holding a reservation for months in hopes of renting it when someone else could book it and use it for themselves.


This is your one for the week. I will acknowledge your broken record/minced horse meat comments once a week. If you want more banter from me, come up with something original. If I ignore one of your comments, it’s because you already used up your one for the week.

Edit: once here, and if I’m feeling generous, once on Facebook to.


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Don't under estimate Wyndham's IT department! It could be easy as just another update to enhance the user experience.
 
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tstreetervp

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I wonder if they will limit their renting of inventory they control to non owners?
Lol great point of course not. I had ads up on home away and they strong armed them and told them they were the only ones who could rent out Wyndham properties. These Tumeshare companies are turning into mafia type organizations and I worked in the business for 20 years they are making a killing giving you very little for a cruise and then renting out their points online
 

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Why would an owner EVER give any weeks or points to EH?!
Their portion of whatever they say they rented it for is ridiculous.
 

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I repasted the resorts and dates below. Even if I were ok with this for the holidays, I think Wyndham painting with an overly broad brush for Independence Day and Christmas. June 25 is 9 days before Independence day. That is 15 days of the summer blocked off that I can't book for friends or family let alone rent out. It's 15 days at Christmas too and Dec 17-20th is actually fairly low demand even in some of the resorts listed.



Memorial Day (May 28 – June 2)
  • Club Wyndham Bonnet Creek
  • Club Wyndham Governor’s Green
  • Club Wyndham Skyline Towers
  • Club Wyndham National Harbor
Independence Day (June 25 – July 9)
  • Club Wyndham Bonnet Creek
  • Club Wyndham Skyline Tower
  • Club Wyndham Midtown 45
  • Club Wyndham Desert Blue
  • Club Wyndham Austin
  • Club Wyndham Riverside Suites
  • Club Wyndham La Cascada
  • Club Wyndham Park City
Labor Day (Sept. 3-8)
  • Club Wyndham Glacier Canyon
  • Club Wyndham National Harbor
  • Club Wyndham Old Town Alexandria
  • Club Wyndham Panama City Beach
  • Club Wyndham Emerald Grande at Destin
  • Club Wyndham at Majestic Sun
  • Club Wyndham Riverside Suites
  • Club Wyndham La Cascada
  • Club Wyndham Park City
Thanksgiving, Christmas & New Year’s Eve (Nov. 19-27 & Dec. 17 – Jan. 2, 2022)
  • Club Wyndham Santa Barbara
  • Club Wyndham Sea Gardens
  • Club Wyndham Royal Vista
  • Club Wyndham Palm-Aire
  • Club Wyndham Bonnet Creek
  • Club Wyndham Cypress Palms
  • Club Wyndham Star Island
  • Club Wyndham Reunion
  • Club Wyndham Midtown 45
  • Club Wyndham Harbour Lights
  • Club Wyndham Great Smokies Lodge
  • Club Wyndham Glacier Canyon
  • Margaritaville Vacation Club by Wyndham - St. Thomas
  • Club Wyndham Elysian Beach Resort
  • Club Wyndham Resort at Avon (Only limited from Dec. 17 – Jan. 2)
  • Club Wyndham Park City (Only limited from Dec. 17 – Jan. 2)
 

Richelle

TUG Review Crew
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Wyndham Canterbury
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Williamsburg Plantation
Again the real profiteers is Wyndham. Do you really think Wyndham would put in place a restriction on renting points that would limit their flexibility and profitability in doing so? Whats good for one profiteer is good for another.


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It will solely depend on how many points sales they get during those holidays. Like I said, existing customers are their best customers. If net profit from sales exceeds the rentals, you better believe they will continue with blocking off major holidays for the most popular resorts. It has the added bonus of making them look good. Obviously, it will not be every resort. If they can figure out how to single out actual friends and family while keeping out renters, they will do it. Friends and family are the second easiest sale because their friend or a family member has already sold it to them. It's just up to the sales guy to give them a number they can swallow. My family knows better than to buy. I told them they need to talk to me first before buying in. If they really really want in, after I tell them the drawbacks, I would point them to the resale market. Not all members know to do that.

I don't give BBB reviews much credit. First, because people will complain more than they will compliment. If something goes right, it's rare someone notices. It's even rarer for them to leave a review on BBB. I couldn't tell you when I last left a review on BBB for anyone. If something goes wrong, they notice. That's when they start speaking up. So the reviews are going to be skewed towards the negative. Second, many of these people bit off more than they can chew because they let a total stranger tell them what's best for them. Or they didn't bother to learn about the product. There was one woman who was so infuriated because she hasn't been able to use her timeshare for three years. Turns out she was trying to book a year out at resorts that were not her home resort. She has to put her vacation time in a year out, so that's when she started looking. Had she taken 10 minutes to read about the booking windows, it would have saved her 3 years' worth of frustration. Now she is saying it's too complicated to figure out when she can book. I know I would be pretty mad if I could never fund anything. However, I wouldn't wait three years to ask why. So I take any BBB reviews with a huge grain of salt. That goes for any company. Not just Wyndham.

As far as PR goes, they have been making changes in an attempt to garner goodwill. Do you think they would have had such a generous cancellation policy in place last year if they didn't. Do you think they would have allowed owners until the end of their use year to move points forward to next year if they didn't care at all about the owner? They even waived the fee. Do you think they would have waived fees for converting your points to Wyndham rewards points? Wyndham rewards conversion is not the best return, but waiving that money-making $99 fee made it a better deal. I won't argue that they didn't make a series of missteps last year with the website, but I won't get into that here. There is an entire thread dedicated to that. However, they have been changing the way they do things. They were starting to roll out a program where they email the owner before they arrive, asking them to sign up for a meeting and choose their gift. One lady said she declined, and no one asked her at check-in to go to one. They just handed her the room keys and sent her on her way. That was supposed to be rolled out system-wide in 2020, but COVID changed thier priorities. Not sure when they will make that a priority again, but I suspect, for now, they are focused on making back some of that lost income from the resorts being closed last year.

I get you to have a negative view of Wyndham, and you want so badly to think they are evil, but they are not. They are a for-profit business. Like every for-profit business, they do things to make a profit. Believe it or not, doing things that benefit the owner does help with that. If you cannot see that, maybe you should take a class on consumer behavior.
 

josegm888

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It will solely depend on how many points sales they get during those holidays. Like I said, existing customers are their best customers. If net profit from sales exceeds the rentals, you better believe they will continue with blocking off major holidays for the most popular resorts. It has the added bonus of making them look good. Obviously, it will not be every resort. If they can figure out how to single out actual friends and family while keeping out renters, they will do it. Friends and family are the second easiest sale because their friend or a family member has already sold it to them. It's just up to the sales guy to give them a number they can swallow. My family knows better than to buy. I told them they need to talk to me first before buying in. If they really really want in, after I tell them the drawbacks, I would point them to the resale market. Not all members know to do that.

I don't give BBB reviews much credit. First, because people will complain more than they will compliment. If something goes right, it's rare someone notices. It's even rarer for them to leave a review on BBB. I couldn't tell you when I last left a review on BBB for anyone. If something goes wrong, they notice. That's when they start speaking up. So the reviews are going to be skewed towards the negative. Second, many of these people bit off more than they can chew because they let a total stranger tell them what's best for them. Or they didn't bother to learn about the product. There was one woman who was so infuriated because she hasn't been able to use her timeshare for three years. Turns out she was trying to book a year out at resorts that were not her home resort. She has to put her vacation time in a year out, so that's when she started looking. Had she taken 10 minutes to read about the booking windows, it would have saved her 3 years' worth of frustration. Now she is saying it's too complicated to figure out when she can book. I know I would be pretty mad if I could never fund anything. However, I wouldn't wait three years to ask why. So I take any BBB reviews with a huge grain of salt. That goes for any company. Not just Wyndham.

As far as PR goes, they have been making changes in an attempt to garner goodwill. Do you think they would have had such a generous cancellation policy in place last year if they didn't. Do you think they would have allowed owners until the end of their use year to move points forward to next year if they didn't care at all about the owner? They even waived the fee. Do you think they would have waived fees for converting your points to Wyndham rewards points? Wyndham rewards conversion is not the best return, but waiving that money-making $99 fee made it a better deal. I won't argue that they didn't make a series of missteps last year with the website, but I won't get into that here. There is an entire thread dedicated to that. However, they have been changing the way they do things. They were starting to roll out a program where they email the owner before they arrive, asking them to sign up for a meeting and choose their gift. One lady said she declined, and no one asked her at check-in to go to one. They just handed her the room keys and sent her on her way. That was supposed to be rolled out system-wide in 2020, but COVID changed thier priorities. Not sure when they will make that a priority again, but I suspect, for now, they are focused on making back some of that lost income from the resorts being closed last year.

I get you to have a negative view of Wyndham, and you want so badly to think they are evil, but they are not. They are a for-profit business. Like every for-profit business, they do things to make a profit. Believe it or not, doing things that benefit the owner does help with that. If you cannot see that, maybe you should take a class on consumer behavior.

I don’t have a negative view of Wyndham, reason being I bought in the system for what it is worth in the resale market and put my money on other timeshare programs that weren’t worth dirt. I just don’t sugar coat things so that they’re easier to swallow. I’m definitely not an advocate like you. I have multiple timeshares and when I compare them to Wyndham I’ve come to the conclusion that Wyndham is one of the most complicated, least transparent, pretty unstable when it comes to their rules/restrictions and plus they charge for everything. With that said is someone asked me, should I buy into Wyndham? I would reply with a maybe and give them what would be my first option based on their cash flow and income, but Wyndham probably wouldn’t be my first choice.


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Last edited:

rpeacock

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I don't recall seeing in this thread the exact verbage of the limit on guest reservations. This screenshot was from a reservation we just made at Bonnet creek. It's found in the small print of the reservation confirmation. We never received any email from Wyndham regarding this new "temporary" policy.
d39656374610490900e8c312dee6a7b8.jpg


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Cyrus24

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I don't recall seeing in this thread the exact verbage of the limit on guest reservations. This screenshot was from a reservation we just made at Bonnet creek. It's found in the small print of the reservation confirmation. We never received any email from Wyndham regarding this new "temporary" policy.

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You received the message with a confirmation after actually applying the Guests name and getting the certificate? Just curious. It sounds like the system let's you book for a guest and gives you a warning with the confirmation. Please let us know if/when your reservation gets cancelled. It would be nice know what they are actually doing with the 'subject to cancellation' clause. I'm needing a GC for Memorial Day weekend at one of the noted resorts and have warned the family member that the reservation could get cancelled. Hopefully Wyndham doesn't wait until 24 hours before arrival to cancel. That would be cruel.
 

rickandcindy23

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Wyndham Founder; Disney OKW & SSR; Marriott's Willow Ridge,Shadow Ridge,Grand Chateau;Val Chatelle; Hono Koa OF (3); SBR(LOTS), SDO a few; Grand Palms; WKORV-OF (2),Westin Desert Willow.
I hope WorldMark is not doing this. I have had reservations for summer at Dolphin's Cove for a year, in hopes that Disneyland would reopen, and it just may reopen soon.
 

paxsarah

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The problem with trying to make owners happy is that in making one class of owners happy, they honk off another class of owners.
The owner who already had a large unit booked months ago, or the owner who books last-minute for a small party will probably not be affected. Setting aside the renters, the owner who's decided to travel with relatives because everyone's vaccinated by summer, but it's too late to luck into a large unit and they need more small units than they have owners on the account, they're going to be peeved.

it's more complicated, poorly communicated

But, but, but Wyndham told us all the other recent changes were done to SIMPLIFY things for us! :p
 

rpeacock

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When you asked: "You received the message with a confirmation after actually applying the Guests name and getting the certificate? Just curious."

We did not apply a guest reservation to this reservation. So we did not test the limit.

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