Wyndham limiting access by non-owners during most sought-after dates/locations

[CO skier]

One result of this restricted use policy that no one has posted, is that it eliminates the all-to-common complaint of (for example), "I wanted to use my points to reserve Bonnet Creek for New Years, but there is no availability on the Club Wyndham website, yet there is availability through AirBnB, VRBO, Redweek, etc. Why am I paying maintenance dues and then have to pay someone to stay in the Club Wyndham resort where I want to stay?"

That is a very good question.

There will still be a few rentals advertised for the restricted resorts and times, but only until the uninformed landlords get burned by the cancellation when the guest name is added.

 

[dioxide45]

One result of this restricted use policy that no one has posted, is that it eliminates the all-to-common complaint of (for example), "I wanted to use my points to reserve Bonnet Creek for New Years, but there is no availability on the Club Wyndham website, yet there is availability through AirBnB, VRBO, Redweek, etc. Why am I paying maintenance dues and then have to pay someone to stay in the Club Wyndham resort where I want to stay?"

That is a very good question.

There will still be a few rentals advertised for the restricted resorts and times, but only until the uninformed landlords get burned by the cancellation when the guest name is added.

It sounds like owners renting out a reservation can still add two guest certificates a year to restricted dates. So I would suspect they will pick the highest demand dates to do so. Will that be Christmas and New Years at WBC?

 

[CO skier]

It sounds like owners renting out a reservation can still add two guest certificates a year to restricted dates. So I would suspect they will pick the highest demand dates to do so. Will that be Christmas and New Years at WBC?

And the megarenter will have to cancel the other eight unnamed guest reservations at WBC that will return to inventory. And the megarenter will have to cancel ALL of the other speculative rentals at the resorts and dates listed.

And think about if this policy continues next year how many speculative reservations will not be made by the megarenters because they will have only two Guest Confirmations available.

 

[dgalati]

And the megarenter will have to cancel the other eight unnamed guest reservations at WBC that will return to inventory. And the megarenter will have to cancel ALL of the other speculative rentals at the resorts and dates listed.

And think about if this policy continues next year how many speculative reservations will not be made by the megarenters because they will have only two Guest Confirmations available.

Surely a win for the owner looking to book for personal use. Back to my original question how many owners will be tapping out because of the limiting of GC"s? I suspect these policies are here to stay. In one form or another.

 

[CO skier]

Surely a win for the owner looking to book for personal use. Back to my original question how many owners will be tapping out because of the limiting of GC"s? I suspect these policies are here to stay. In one form or another.

Few, if any, because the affected reservations are so few, relative to the Club Wyndham universe. This restricted access program would have to be greatly, and I mean GREATLY extended (like restricting all resorts during the summer), for any renters to "tap out" of their business as a result, or any "little renter" to not rent to recover at least some of their maintenance fees.

Even then it would be little compared to the abusers who were booted out of the Club; or renters who self-eliminated out of the Club, as a result of the introduction of automatic upgrades.

 

[dgalati]

Few, if any, because the affected reservations are so few, relative to the Club Wyndham universe. This restricted access program would have to be greatly, and I mean GREATLY extended (like restricting all resorts during the summer), for any renters to "tap out" of their business as a result, or any "little renter" to not rent to recover at least some of their maintenance fees.

Even then it would be little compared to the abusers who were booted out of the Club; or renters who self-eliminated out of the Club, as a result of the introduction of automatic upgrades.

I do believe the free upgrades can be profitable but with the added restrictions and the online web issues it has probably been a real headache for the rental gamers. I guess it will all come out in the wash eventually. As long as sales keeps selling the strategy of buying more points to pay maintenance fees there will always be a opportunity to rent for less.

 

[chapjim]

I'm usually pretty cynical when it comes to "mega corp making changes that don't pass the smell test", but in this case, it's pretty obvious they are doing it to let owners get units at high demand locations. It was proven already that none of the inventory is going into extra vacations or to RCI... which was one of the conspiracy theories floated by the likes of our resident Curmudgeon...



I'm open to hear your theories on how this move in any way helped anyone BUT "the little guy"...



I'd be curious as to where you have reservations at... I know it's not weeks and probably not at in-demand resorts. It's likely tues-thurs at places like the glade or other really low demand location

I had 3 bookings made months ago that I had been sniping to try to re-book inside 60 days and no luck on all 3.

Theory: If renters become discouraged and decide to divest some or all of their ownership through Ovations, Wyndham is a big winner. Way bigger than any purported benefit to the "little guy." Only the naive can discount this as a possible motivation for the restrictions, with the "little guy" a secondary beneficiary.

Current open reservations: Cypress Palms (2), Star Island (2), Santa Barbara, Skyline Tower, Patriots' Place, Austin. None less than a full week. No Fairfield Glade. Biggest reason I don't have more reservations is that I'm running out of points for 2021 (135K remaining). Any reservations that meet the time and price requirements are on LMR.

 

[dgalati]

Theory: If renters become discouraged and decide to divest some or all of their ownership through Ovations, Wyndham is a big winner. Way bigger than any purported benefit to the "little guy." Only the naive can discount this as a possible motivation for the restrictions, with the "little guy" a secondary beneficiary.

My thoughts exactly. Ovations is the gift that keeps giving. You forgot to add most of your reservations are 2 bedrooms or presidential units at less then $115 per day. No way I can own cheaper then renting at these prices! Then again what do I know owning Canterbury at a $3.70/1000?

Wyndham National Harbor, 2BR Presidential, July 17-24

$800 Floor plan may be different. PM me, please!

tugbbs.com

 

[chapjim]

It sounds like owners renting out a reservation can still add two guest certificates a year to restricted dates. So I would suspect they will pick the highest demand dates to do so. Will that be Christmas and New Years at WBC?

Since I don't know what the highest demand dates are, I'll go with known high demand dates and the reservations during those dates that required the most points. Probably 4BR Presidential units at Bonnet Creek during Spring Break (weeks before and after Easter). I have more than two of those so I'll keep two and cancel the rest. I don't know yet which two I'll keep so for the time, I'll keep them all.

Since the supply of 4BR Presidential units for non-owners at Bonnet Creek during Spring Break will go down, I would expect to be able to raise the price of the two units I rent. Plus, Easter in 2022 is not in Prime season so my cost in points is less than in a lot of years.

 

[paxsarah]

There will still be a few rentals advertised for the restricted resorts and times, but only until the uninformed landlords get burned by the cancellation when the guest name is added.

Or if it's one of that owner's two unaccompanied guest reservations. But there's really no way for a renter to confirm that they're okay vs. subject to cancellation.

 

[paxsarah]

Will that be Christmas and New Years at WBC?

If it were me I'd do Thanksgiving at WBC, because I'd guess the demand among renters is almost as high but the points are way lower.

 

[Cyrus24]

And the megarenter will have to cancel the other eight unnamed guest reservations at WBC that will return to inventory. And the megarenter will have to cancel ALL of the other speculative rentals at the resorts and dates listed.

And think about if this policy continues next year how many speculative reservations will not be made by the megarenters because they will have only two Guest Confirmations available.

Do you think for one minute that the mega renter won't book an overlapping reservation in their name to get past the limit of 2 GC's? I don't. These people know how to work the system and how to make the money they need to make. I don't defend what they do, in fact I hate what they do, but, they are savvy and they will still be sucking down coveted dates at coveted resorts. If Wyndham wants to shut down mega renters due to membership violations, that need to shut down mega renters and quit changing rules that, at the end of the day, help no one.

 

[Cyrus24]

Since I don't know what the highest demand dates are, I'll go with known high demand dates and the reservations during those dates that required the most points. Probably 4BR Presidential units at Bonnet Creek during Spring Break (weeks before and after Easter). I have more than two of those so I'll keep two and cancel the rest. I don't know yet which two I'll keep so for the time, I'll keep them all.

Why would you cancel any of the 4br's? Just do an overlapping 1br for your personal use and spread that cost across the rentals you are working. Work from WBC for a few days over Easter. You are showing us exactly how to work the system. I don't like it, but, I have to applaud your willingness to show us exactly how stupid this new Wyndham rule is.

 

[55plus]

I suspect these policies are here to stay. In one form or another.

I'm hoping the policy is here to stay. I have family on my deeds that can now travel to the nicer places during the nicer times of the year instead going places just to burn up points. I was thinking about dumping some points, but now, if this change is here to stay, my ownership just became more valuable to me.

 

[chapjim]

I would like to see some reports of successful uses of the overlapping 1BR tactic before I rent weeks for a few thousand each. I don't want to put at risk family vacations and I hate to refund money!

I'll be retired by then and can stay for however long it takes. In fact, I'm going to see if I can book a small unit for April 9-23 or, to just get enough to overlap with both weeks --
April 15-17.

Edit: Done! Booked the full two weeks -- April 9-23. We haven't been to Bonnet Creek for a few years. It'll be fun!

 

[rickandcindy23]

One result of this restricted use policy that no one has posted, is that it eliminates the all-to-common complaint of (for example), "I wanted to use my points to reserve Bonnet Creek for New Years, but there is no availability on the Club Wyndham website, yet there is availability through AirBnB, VRBO, Redweek, etc. Why am I paying maintenance dues and then have to pay someone to stay in the Club Wyndham resort where I want to stay?"

That is a very good question.

There will still be a few rentals advertised for the restricted resorts and times, but only until the uninformed landlords get burned by the cancellation when the guest name is added.

We have never been able to get holiday weeks, except maybe Thanksgiving. Christmas and New Year's week are always gone before we get on the computer. So you have exactly the same opportunity that mega renters have of getting holiday weeks at a year out. Great competition for those. We don't have as many points as some do (I know one person who owns 60,000,000 points). That would be terrifying for us to own that many points.

 

[dgalati]

We have never been able to get holiday weeks, except maybe Thanksgiving. Christmas and New Year's week are always gone before we get on the computer. So you have exactly the same opportunity that mega renters have of getting holiday weeks at a year out. Great competition for those. We don't have as many points as some do (I know one person who owns 60,000,000 points). That would be terrifying for us to own that many points.

Also very panful once a month. I couldn't imagine the pain they went through during the COVID shut down last year.

 

[55plus]

We don't have as many points as some do (I know one person who owns 60,000,000 points).

Sixty million points? Holy crap! I have 2 million points and thought that was a lot. I was going to dump my non developer points and just keep my VIP Platinum points because of past nonavailability. We mainly travel/snowbird to Florida for the winter. Now, if the change stays in effect we'll be able to travel year round to nicer places, not just to the "leftover" locations. It's the mega owners/renters that prevent other owners from traveling to the nicer places during nicer timeframes. I think Wyndham got it right this time.

 

[rickandcindy23]

Sixty million points? Holy crap! I have 2 million points and thought that was a lot. I was going to dump my non developer points and just keep my VIP Platinum points because of past nonavailability. We mainly travel/snowbird to Florida for the winter. Now, if the change stays in effect we'll be able to travel year round to nicer places, not just to the "leftover" locations. It's the mega owners/renters that prevent other owners from traveling to the nicer places during nicer timeframes. I think Wyndham got it right this time.

Inventory is there for you to grab, just as it is for everyone else. You have the same discount we do as platinum. Although we are also founders/ platinum. I don't get what you are saying. You just have to spend some time at it. I don't see that changing because 550,000 members are booking their own vacations.

I don't have to spend the time because our daughter does it for us. I wouldn't be able to do it myself. So maybe you are like me and don't really like being on the Wyndham site constantly. It's not a game I enjoy, that constant watching and maybe catching of the good stuff. I would rather go fishing in a river or a lake. Our daughter sends me a list of things she needs to book but when I look, which is a few times a day, I never see anything she needs. And she doesn't rent Bonnet Creek much at all. Great competition for those units, and all of the competition isn't coming from the mega renters.

Do you use all of your points, or do you rent some reservations? Just wondering because that is a lot of points. I remember thinking that 1,000,000 points would be enough to live in small units all year long with our discounts. I figured it out before we started any kind of business. But making that work would be a lot of planning. I like my house. I don't want to live in timeshare, but 16 weeks of vacation have been fun the last six years that Rick has been retired. We will have more like 20 weeks by the end of this year. I had Wyndham points I had to transfer to RCI after Covid. 3,000,000+ points transferred after being unable to use them.

 

[chapjim]

Sixty million points? Holy crap! I have 2 million points and thought that was a lot. I was going to dump my non developer points and just keep my VIP Platinum points because of past nonavailability. We mainly travel/snowbird to Florida for the winter. Now, if the change stays in effect we'll be able to travel year round to nicer places, not just to the "leftover" locations. It's the mega owners/renters that prevent other owners from traveling to the nicer places during nicer timeframes. I think Wyndham got it right this time.

Frankly, I don't see why you would have a problem booking a holiday at any resort that you can ARP into. If you want to ARP into a resort where you don't own, hop on ebay and pick up a contract.

It's just my wife and me on the account so I can only book two reservations at a time. It's not like I'm wiping out a resort. I don't think I qualify as a reviled "megarenter" but even if I am, I don't think I'm part of your problem.

 

[55plus]

We live six months a year during the winter months at Wyndham Resorts in Daytona Beach and Destin, with an occasional week or two in Clearwater if I can pick up a cancellation, all at half points. This was my plan when I bought in at the beginning almost 30 years ago. It's family who want the other locations where you have to book at least 10 months out to get in. Planning 10 months out is not practical for some due to work, etc. When I do look there isn't availability on Wyndham's website, but there is on Extra Holidays, Craigslist, etc. I believe owners' personal usages should come first. And I have rented to others when plans change within the 15 day points refund timeframe. I'll rent to offset the lost points.

 

[ilya]

Not too long ago, few months back , I did see a lot of inventory for the end of summer and about a month ago for Holiday times... Now after this change all the holiday times I was looking at are gone... If I really wanted them I could have booked it, 5-6 months out..

Two months ago a person I know went to an update and was convinced to spend $$$ on a new contract to lower maintenance fees... They were already Reserve with 1.7 mill points... The sales pitch was "you can bring your cats" and then gave him the number of a points manager for him to rent the points.. Got home gave 1 mill points to the points manager for $9 /1000. Not really smart to spend an extra $40,000 plus to get more Reserve points to only get $9,000..

So they are still at the game of renting..

If owners can't book then why is Wyndham promoting specials .. Seems like they have extra inventory they need to get rid off.

 

[55plus]

Screenshot of reply from Michael Brown, Wyndham CEO, to my email, subject line: Wyndham got it right this time!

 

[dgalati]

Screenshot of reply from Michael Brown, Wyndham CEO, to my email, subject line: Wyndham got it right this time!

View attachment 36900

Nice! So they do have a plan on helping owners rent personal vacations.

 

[dgalati]

We live six months a year during the winter months at Wyndham Resorts in Daytona Beach and Destin, with an occasional week or two in Clearwater if I can pick up a cancellation, all at half points. This was my plan when I bought in at the beginning almost 30 years ago. It's family who want the other locations where you have to book at least 10 months out to get in. Planning 10 months out is not practical for some due to work, etc. When I do look there isn't availability on Wyndham's website, but there is on Extra Holidays, Craigslist, etc. I believe owners' personal usages should come first. And I have rented to others when plans change within the 15 day points refund timeframe. I'll rent to offset the lost points.

I personally never have a problem booking a 1 bedroom in the 60 day window. It helps to be flexible with the travel plans and own at Wyndham and Worldmark. This spring I had a trip to Scottsdale planned but the COVID infection rate there was the highest in the world at the time we were planning on going. So I canceled the Scottsdale trip and booked Pompano beach within 17 days of traveling. We had a great time in Pompano and ended up booking Scottsdale about 5-6 weeks later to catch a Indians spring training game at Salt River field at talking stick. The stadium is about 1 mile walk from Scottsdale Worldmark and saved me about a hours drive to the Indians spring training facility in Goodyear AZ. The best thing about Worldmark is the wait list feature. No sitting around and waiting or checking 100 times daily for availability. It would be nice if Wyndham would have a waitlist feature. Like the sniping feature on ebay I am surprised that there is no software to book these last minute deals.
https://saltriverfields.com/