Wyndham limiting access by non-owners during most sought-after dates/locations

[chapjim]

I'm in the process of making reservations for 2022 that are not on the restricted list. Also, waiting for Amendment 1 to the list to be issued with all the places they left out.

 

[dgalati]

I wonder How many Owners tapped out with this last curve ball limiting GC's on blackout dates?

 

[troy12n]

I wonder How many Owners tapped out with this last curve ball limiting GC's on blackout dates?

If any did, good riddance... the only people who give a crap about this are renters.

 

[Ty1on]

If any did, good riddance... the only people who give a crap about this are renters.

I get it completely, but I do try to understand that many of these renters are there because salesmen laid out for them how they could exploit the Wyndham system to pay for maintenance fees and even make a profit. So they bought, and bought, and bought, and then Wyndham started slowly closing the spigot on them. Yes it is in club charter and contract terms that ownership is not for commercial purposes, but then you have a salesman walking you through how to do it and you go home and do it and it works.

 

[dgalati]

If any did, good riddance... the only people who give a crap about this are renters.

Wow! Thats a pretty insensitive reply. Many owners were sold more points then they could possibly use. Sales used a stategy to have them buy more points to rent and cover maintenance fees. Have some consideration for the owners struggling to pay their monthly dues.

 

[dgalati]

I get it completely, but I do try to understand that many of these renters are there because salesmen laid out for them how they could exploit the Wyndham system to pay for maintenance fees and even make a profit. So they bought, and bought, and bought, and then Wyndham started slowly closing the spigot on them. Yes it is in club charter and contract terms that ownership is not for commercial purposes, but then you have a salesman walking you through how to do it and you go home and do it and it works.

Yes it is still happening every day. Sales still uses this strategy but corporate is turning up the heat on commercial renters and it will eliminate most over time.

 

[troy12n]

Wow! Thats a pretty insensitive reply. Many owners were sold more points then they could possibly use. Sales used a stategy to have them buy more points to rent and cover maintenance fees. Have some consideration for the owners struggling to pay their monthly dues.

I have a harder time feeling sorry for people who were duped into buying more points than they needed under the guise of "renting your points to pay for MF"...

I feel more strongly for people who can't use their ownership because people with millions of points are taking up occupancy and selling it. That was why Wyndham did this...

Your illuminati like conspiracy theory of them doing this to put units into Extra Vacations was debunked months ago

 

[wjappraise]

If any did, good riddance... the only people who give a crap about this are renters.

Jeez.

Somebody needs more roughage in his diet.

Very myopic dude. Maybe you don’t use guest reservations now. But maybe you will in the future. And for those of us who do - we care! Renters or not. Some of us have friends. Maybe you don’t. But we do. And those friends love to go to Wyndham resorts. And I love using those trips as gifts and bonuses for my employees. So, yeah. I give a crap.

Plus it is an erosion of your bundle of rights. And this will continue until it impacts you. Maybe then you’ll care.

 

[troy12n]

Yes it is still happening every day. Sales still uses this strategy but corporate is turning up the heat on commercial renters and it will eliminate most over time.

"It's still happening every day"... says the guy who doesn't go to the "updates"...

I realize this was a sales tactic, they did it to me at at least two, last one being Canterbury in 2019. It didn't influence me. But the last 3 I have been to, this was not part of the sales pitch. So I think you are, again, talking out of your backside. And correct me if I am wrong, but you are no longer an owner, so why are you even here?

 

[troy12n]

Jeez.

Somebody needs more roughage in his diet.

Very myopic dude. Maybe you don’t use guest reservations now. But maybe you will in the future. Ans for those of us who do - we care! Renters or not.

Plus it is an erosion of your bundle of rights. And this will continue until it impacts you. Maybe then you’ll care.

Look... everyone is struggling to find places to vacation right now with too many points and not enough units to put people in. I have a hard time feeling sorry for renters right now. Period...

The facebook groups are full of people complaining about not being able to use their points. They are the ones who are going to give up, and default. Which will impact everyone more long term than a small handful of mega million renters trying to run a small business out of their (and others) timeshare points...

Also, pretty melodramatic considering it was what, a small list of what, 10 resorts they restricted this activity at?

 

[troy12n]

I'm glad I made my reservations months ago, rather than risk trying to get in under 60 days, it's slim pickings out there right now, and as it is it looks like i'm dumping about 250k into 2023 before the end of the month when my 9 months in this use year is up...

 

[wjappraise]

Look... everyone is struggling to find places to vacation right now with too many points and not enough units to put people in. I have a hard time feeling sorry for renters right now. Period...

The facebook groups are full of people complaining about not being able to use their points. They are the ones who are going to give up, and default. Which will impact everyone more long term than a small handful of mega million renters trying to run a small business out of their (and others) timeshare points...

You didn’t say that.

You said the only ones who give a crap about erosion of usage rights are renters.

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[troy12n]

You didn’t say that.

You said the only ones who give a crap about erosion of usage rights are renters. And I’m throwing the BS flag on that petulant diatribe.

If you go back and look, I said that in a separate post, right before you replied to me initially...

 

[paxsarah]

people with millions of points are taking up occupancy and selling it

These are owners who own points that are in circulation and with the right to use them. Do you expect these owners to simply let their points expire, unused? Because that's the only way that true availability will open up.

 

[55plus]

If any did, good riddance... the only people who give a crap about this are renters.

I believe owner usage should come before rentals during high demand timeframe and at high demand event locations. If someone needs to rent, then rent outside the restricted windows. The policies Wyndham implemented over the years hurt renters, but benefited owners who actually use their points for what they are intended - personal travel. If Extra Holidays is exempted from the restrictions, then it's not about, Owners First, it's about Wyndham's bottom line. Time will tell.

 

[dioxide45]

Why not allow guest certificates to be added to reservations made inside of 60 days, even inside these owner priority periods?

 

[chapjim]

<snip>
I feel more strongly for people who can't use their ownership because people with millions of points are taking up occupancy and selling it. That was why Wyndham did this...
<snip>

That is why Wyndham SAID they did this. Time after time, Wyndham has shown itself able to spin what it does -- making itself sound righteous while acting cynically.

Powerful arguments can be made that Wyndham is not looking out for the "little guy" with its latest move.

 

[chapjim]

Look... everyone is struggling to find places to vacation right now with too many points and not enough units to put people in. I have a hard time feeling sorry for renters right now. Period...

The facebook groups are full of people complaining about not being able to use their points. They are the ones who are going to give up, and default. Which will impact everyone more long term than a small handful of mega million renters trying to run a small business out of their (and others) timeshare points...

Also, pretty melodramatic considering it was what, a small list of what, 10 resorts they restricted this activity at?

BS!! All the 2021 reservations I'm making now are made inside 60 days of check-in. If they are available at 60 days, the Facebook people can't be looking very hard.

By my count, 53 resorts were affected. See attached.

 

[biggen]

Will be interesting to see how this goes moving forward and if there are any loopholes. We have been renting at WBC for 8 years now on average twice a year. Really sucks to think we may not be able to do that anymore since most of our times fall in the September/October time frame.

 

[troy12n]

That is why Wyndham SAID they did this. Time after time, Wyndham has shown itself able to spin what it does -- making itself sound righteous while acting cynically.

I'm usually pretty cynical when it comes to "mega corp making changes that don't pass the smell test", but in this case, it's pretty obvious they are doing it to let owners get units at high demand locations. It was proven already that none of the inventory is going into extra vacations or to RCI... which was one of the conspiracy theories floated by the likes of our resident Curmudgeon...

Powerful arguments can be made that Wyndham is not looking out for the "little guy" with its latest move.

I'm open to hear your theories on how this move in any way helped anyone BUT "the little guy"...

BS!! All the 2021 reservations I'm making now are made inside 60 days of check-in. If they are available at 60 days, the Facebook people can't be looking very hard.

I'd be curious as to where you have reservations at... I know it's not weeks and probably not at in-demand resorts. It's likely tues-thurs at places like the glade or other really low demand location

I had 3 bookings made months ago that I had been sniping to try to re-book inside 60 days and no luck on all 3.

 

[bnoble]

These are owners who own points that are in circulation and with the right to use them. Do you expect these owners to simply let their points expire, unused? Because that's the only way that true availability will open up.

There could be a more nuanced way to look at this.

There is a natural expiration rate of points each year--owners who, for whatever reason, neither use, deposit, nor forward them. Given enough time, the backlog of points will work its way out of the system through this natural attrition. In the meantime, the rest of us will have to resort to some combination of use/deposit/forward---and while we are doing that, availability will be tight.

In the meantime, "encouraging" landlords to move their points forward into the next year or two in favor of owner use maybe isn't what I would have done, but I can see why someone might have done it.

 

[CO skier]

I get it completely, but I do try to understand that many of these renters are there because salesmen laid out for them how they could exploit the Wyndham system to pay for maintenance fees and even make a profit. So they bought, and bought, and bought, and then Wyndham started slowly closing the spigot on them. Yes it is in club charter and contract terms that ownership is not for commercial purposes, but then you have a salesman walking you through how to do it and you go home and do it and it works.

The policy is not intended to eliminate renters or mega-renting. A very few resorts are affected for a very few timeframes during the year. There are still ample opportunities for anyone to book and rent reservations to cover their maintenance fees.

All the scare tactics (by renters) and debunked Extra Holidays conspiracy theories are a tempest in a teapot.

 

[rickandcindy23]

I am hoping that this is temporary and because people are traveling more with Covid and saved points to this year maybe have become tough for some owners to use. So this is maybe how Wyndham is handling things. Maybe. May just be wishful thinking on my part because we have owned since 2007, and this seems so drastic.

BocaBum99 was so much smarter than me. I just want to say that. What has happened to him?

 

[CO skier]

These are owners who own points that are in circulation and with the right to use them. Do you expect these owners to simply let their points expire, unused? Because that's the only way that true availability will open up.

You must have missed this part of the email or missed the meaning:

"To help you cross different destinations off your bucket list, we are continuing our efforts to prioritize owner reservations by limiting access by non-owners at select resorts during peak travel times. Since we began these efforts in March, we’ve heard feedback from many owners that you’ve been able to achieve your vacation plans and visit many popular destinations during your desired travel times — and that you’d like to see these options expanded even further. "

Sure the same points will be used oveall, but the policy is pushing out non-owners to make way for owners to use their points to reserve these reservations and stay in the units -- you know, like a vacation Club instead of a rental business.

"True availability" will not change, but "owner availability for personal use instead of non-owner use" at some of the most sought-after resorts during the most sought-after times definitely did change in favor of owners wanting to take their families on a primo vacation.

 

[CO skier]

Powerful arguments can be made that Wyndham is not looking out for the "little guy" with its latest move.

As a result of this latest move, there are going to be a lot of "little guys" who will be enjoying a Bonnet Creek, or Colorado Christmas skiing, or other high demand vacation this year that they paid for as a Club Wyndham owner in units previously reserved for rental to yet-to-be-named non-owners.