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[Closed - new thread started] Will Hawaii Open by [OCTOBER???] [Please use this thread for all Hawaii Coronavirus discussions]

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Monica808

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Sorry I did not intend to offend anyone with my post and I am truly sorry if I did. But some resorts are still open with reduced work force and I have talked to a few people that are still working at some of them. Everyone says the same thing that we need guest/owners to return asap. They need rooms filled to keep jobs.
 

Tamaradarann

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Sorry I did not intend to offend anyone with my post and I am truly sorry if I did. But some resorts are still open with reduced work force and I have talked to a few people that are still working at some of them. Everyone says the same thing that we need guest/owners to return asap. They need rooms filled to keep jobs.

Please don't take my being offended by your post personally it wasn't meant to be a personal attack. I wanted to express a sentiment that the Government and people of Hawaii need to be sensitive to visitors, and since this is a timeshare group specifically timeshare owners, that have been prevented from using their ownership that they paid taxes and maintenance fees for when they contemplate raising taxes to cover the revenue shortfall due to the coronavirus. Governor Ige correctly protected the citizens of Hawaii by implementing the 14 day quarantine which, in practical terms, prevented tourists from coming. That has injured many timeshare owners and tourists. Taking advantage of the effects of the 14 day quarantine or penalizing the timeshare owners or tourists with raising taxes disproportionately due to the effects of the 14 day quarantine is adding insult to injury.

Timeshare owners and tourists do want to return to Hawaii. Lifting the 14 day quarantine is the key to filling those rooms so people keep or get back their jobs. Doing it smartly is the challenge.
 

csodjd

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I totally understand the politics and agree with what you are saying if taken as an isolated statement without context. However, the direction of this discussion took started with Monica 808, who lives in Maui, asking if anyone has a week that they would be losing due to the coronavirus and would like to donate it to her and her family. There were comments made pro and con on doing it.

I mentioned that I found the request offensive in view of the fact that a prime reason that the owner of a timeshare would not be using their timeshare and would be losing it would be because Monica 808's Government imposed a 14 day quarantine so that tourists would not come to Hawaii. So now she was asking to benefit from that retriction implement by her Government.

Yellowfin then made a comment that perhaps the local government would remimburse taxes for the months that they are keeping the islands closed to tourist with the quarantine.

That assertion, which I am sure won't happen, prompted me to make the comment that if the Hawaii Government raised property taxes more on timeshares and hotels than on other properties due to the lost revenue from the corona virus it would be adding insult to injury after implementing the 14 day quarentine which prevented people from using their timeshares.
I guess that begs the question. Let's assume that Monica808 wasn't a Hawaii resident, she was just someone who had cleared the 14-day quarantine and was in Hawaii, and would be thrilled if she could stay another week if someone had an unusable place and didn't mind her using it. Is it the fact that she's a Hawaii resident, and therefore it is "her Government" that imposed the quarantine that makes a difference?

I might also ask, to the extent any of us own timeshares in Hawaii, it's it "our" government too? We depend on that government quite a bit, to provide fire and police, pave roads, ensure safe restaurants, maintain beaches, etc.
 

Tucsonadventurer

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There are quite a few Hawaii resorts under Accommodation certificates so that would be an inexpensive way to quarantine. Sounds horrid to me but there are some for most of the islands. I was surprised to see them.
 

amy241

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There are quite a few Hawaii resorts under Accommodation certificates so that would be an inexpensive way to quarantine. Sounds horrid to me but there are some for most of the islands. I was surprised to see them.

It is doubtful you could get 2 consecutive weeks at the same resort in the same unit — anything short of that would be a quarantine violation. You can’t go change your room or the resort in the middle of the 14 days.
 

Henry M.

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I don't feel there was anything wrong in posting an interest to take a week if someone couldn't use it otherwise. As a matter of fact, I find it a good idea to pursue giving someone local my week if I were not able to use it or otherwise rent it. It would be a lot better than letting it go to waste. Thanks to Monica, I'll be thinking about that option if I'm ever in that position.

Monica's suggestion is no different than someone else's, a while back, that proposed giving unused Staroptions away to a charity. In the current situation, a charity would have as much of a hard time getting a benefit out of Staroptions as any other out-of-state guest, so local use is a better alternative.
 

Tucsonadventurer

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It is doubtful you could get 2 consecutive weeks at the same resort in the same unit — anything short of that would be a quarantine violation. You can’t go change your room or the resort in the middle of the 14 days.
We have 5 or 6 certificates so it is possible .I wouldnt want to do it, but am just surprised to see them posted. We are hoping to visit in Jan and Feb but have all refundable reservations in case.
 

Yellowfin

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There is no question that taxes will be going up in the furture. Local, State as well as Federal Taxes. However, my point about the timeshare real estate taxes and the TAT is that Hawaii already taxes timeshares at a higher real estate rate than other condominiums and Hawaii is the only state in the United States that levies a TAT Transient Accomodations Tax. Therefore, if they increase those taxes disproportionately it would be adding insult to injury since not only did the Hawaii Government implement a 14 day quarantine to discourage(in reality prevent) tourists from coming, since tourists didn't come they didn't pay the TAT and GET(sales taxes) that they normally do to support Hawaii they need to make up their deficit by socking it to timeshares.
Furloughs are not off the table. It would be tragic for many families, especially those where one parent working in tourism or other services had already lost the job.

 
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echino

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Another annoying development: all my craigslist timeshare rental ads for Hawaii get promptly flagged and removed. That did not happen before the virus. The dates are in December 2020 and in 2021, so I don't think it violates anything? Who goes flagging craigslist postings indiscriminately, Hawaii locals?
 

amy241

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Another annoying development: all my craigslist timeshare rental ads for Hawaii get promptly flagged and removed. That did not happen before the virus. The dates are in December 2020 and in 2021, so I don't think it violates anything? Who goes flagging craigslist postings indiscriminately, Hawaii locals?

Many locals definitely seem proactive in limiting tourism right now so you may be right that they are flagging your ads. That speaks to well organized opposition to tourism if true. They are especially active and organized as it relates to quarantine violators. The article gives the link to their (closed) Facebook group, Hawaii Quarantine Kapu Breakers.

 
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csodjd

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"Gov. David Ige is expected to announce the lifting of the interisland quarantine this afternoon, he said on the Honolulu Star-Advertiser’s COVID-19 Care Conversation. Interisland travelers, however, will undergo health screenings, a temperature scan and paperwork on their travel history, residence, and where they will be staying on the island “so we can know where you came from and where you traveled to” and make sure that “no one has traveled to out of state and visited any of the other communities where the virus has actively been circulated.”

"On reopening trans-Pacific travel, Ige said authorities will focus on communities with low virus incidence first, including New Zealand and Australia “as first candidates that we would be interested in,” and “obviously from an economic perspective, Japan and South Korea.”

That's a discouraging and troubling comment by the Governor. He's inclined to allow non-American tourism before American. But there is huge variation in the US, even among Counties. There are 10 counties in California, for instance, with a combined total of 31 cases at all, and 25 counties with zero new cases and 9 more with 2 or 1 new case reported. And the "economic perspective" is very interesting, because that seems to suggest there's room to compromise risk for money. I'm biased, but I think a US State should find a way to allow Americans in first.
 

gdrj

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Hawaii will have their hands out for Federal money, just like every other state. And from your post it sounds like you assume they don't pay any federal taxes.

No I dont assume they dont pay any taxes. My point (though maybe not clear), is if the Governor is going to keep tourist out longer than needed, large parts of the economy which rely on tourism will remain shuttered causing economic chaos. Hawaii is the 6th highest State dependent on Federal tax dollars. A State cant just shut down their State and than come to the US taxpayers and say we need your help. Decisions by the Governor has consequences, and he shouldnt expect to be bailed out. When Hawaiian AIr, the largest employer has to layoff everyone or shut down for good it is a problem. To say there is no timetable on reopening is irresponsible. To not communicate to travel industry or to the tourist will just cause further delays in a rebound. Hawaii travel typically takes longer to plan. So as he piddles away time tourist make other plans for the Fall and those dollars wont just come back which means when tourism opens up hotels, restaurants, tour operators wont need as much staff IF they even reopen. For some hotels it will be better to stay closed than operate without mainland tourists
 

rickandcindy23

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Another annoying development: all my craigslist timeshare rental ads for Hawaii get promptly flagged and removed. That did not happen before the virus. The dates are in December 2020 and in 2021, so I don't think it violates anything? Who goes flagging craigslist postings indiscriminately, Hawaii locals?
All it takes is one person to decide your ads are offensive or just plain competition for their properties. Surprisingly, a lot of the Hawaii residents have rental homes and condos they rent until paid for, then they move into that property after many years of paying that mortgage down or off completely.

I have had my ads taken down in Orlando, Branson, Myrtle Beach. People do not like competition. I would keep putting them back up.
 

BagsArePacked

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Another annoying development: all my craigslist timeshare rental ads for Hawaii get promptly flagged and removed. That did not happen before the virus. The dates are in December 2020 and in 2021, so I don't think it violates anything? Who goes flagging craigslist postings indiscriminately, Hawaii locals?

My experience with Craigslist is that bots will flag posts that appear to be spam and frequent reposts, posts that are cross-listed, or contain very similar information. Maybe change it up a bit and give it a few days.
 
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Tamaradarann

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I guess that begs the question. Let's assume that Monica808 wasn't a Hawaii resident, she was just someone who had cleared the 14-day quarantine and was in Hawaii, and would be thrilled if she could stay another week if someone had an unusable place and didn't mind her using it. Is it the fact that she's a Hawaii resident, and therefore it is "her Government" that imposed the quarantine that makes a difference?

I might also ask, to the extent any of us own timeshares in Hawaii, it's it "our" government too? We depend on that government quite a bit, to provide fire and police, pave roads, ensure safe restaurants, maintain beaches, etc.

Yes it is because she is a Hawaii resident and CAN VOTE in Hawaii elections, therefore, it is HER GOVERNMENT which she has a voice in. She would be taking advantage of the results of the 14 day quarantine on timeshare owners that her elected officials have implemented and are continue to implement.

csodjd, this is accord with your previous quote on this thread, "That's true. However, if you're going to raise taxes, as a politician, do you raise taxes on those that vote, or on those that cannot vote?"

Furthermore, the real message of my posts are that if the Hawaii Government covers their revenue deficit unproportionally on the backs of timeshare owners and tourists it would be adding insult to injury since the deficit was and is being expanded due to the 14 day quarantine.
 

csodjd

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Yes it is because she is a Hawaii resident and CAN VOTE in Hawaii elections, therefore, it is HER GOVERNMENT which she has a voice in. She would be taking advantage of the results of the 14 day quarantine on timeshare owners that her elected officials have implemented and are continue to implement.

csodjd, this is accord with your previous quote on this thread, "That's true. However, if you're going to raise taxes, as a politician, do you raise taxes on those that vote, or on those that cannot vote?"

Furthermore, the real message of my posts are that if the Hawaii Government covers their revenue deficit unproportionally on the backs of timeshare owners and tourists it would be adding insult to injury since the deficit was and is being expanded due to the 14 day quarantine.
I don't necessarily disagree with your premise, but as a practical matter, raising taxes on the ones that cannot afford it or pay it isn't very productive, or a path to reelection. Taxing things like flights into Hawaii, as they do in London, would be more effective and less controversial to voters, even if viewed by TS owners as unfair.
 

csodjd

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Yellowfin

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That's the model that seems best. And on the backend they shore up their ability to trace and isolate any new infection that slips through.
Lt. Gov. Josh Green : “Right now I’m still waiting on some of the details like how they’re going to get testing."
Why do they need to wait for the details from Alaska in order to implement their own plan?
 

csodjd

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Lt. Gov. Josh Green : “Right now I’m still waiting on some of the details like how they’re going to get testing."
Why do they need to wait for the details from Alaska in order to implement their own plan?
It's always nice when you can see what's working well and what's not, and not having to reinvent the wheel on the details. While the testing before flying is seemingly pretty straight forward (though there may be detail issues, like does it matter the test method used, or who performed it, or what if you have two tests and get different results, do you have to disclose ALL tests taken, etc.), testing upon arrival requires some infrastructure, and enforcing a quarantine also has challenges once tourists are allowed in.
 

Yellowfin

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It's always nice when you can see what's working well and what's not, and not having to reinvent the wheel on the details. While the testing before flying is seemingly pretty straight forward (though there may be detail issues, like does it matter the test method used, or who performed it, or what if you have two tests and get different results, do you have to disclose ALL tests taken, etc.), testing upon arrival requires some infrastructure, and enforcing a quarantine also has challenges once tourists are allowed in.
It is also possible that the Lt. Gov. cannot convince others without first showing them proof that it is a viable solution.
 

csodjd

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It is also possible that the Lt. Gov. cannot convince others without first showing them proof that it is a viable solution.
True. Hopefully it goes well, or he may convince them of the wrong thing.
 

Tamaradarann

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I don't necessarily disagree with your premise, but as a practical matter, raising taxes on the ones that cannot afford it or pay it isn't very productive, or a path to reelection. Taxing things like flights into Hawaii, as they do in London, would be more effective and less controversial to voters, even if viewed by TS owners as unfair.

I don't have a problem with raising taxes on flights into Hawaii since everyone tourists as well as locals that travel would need to pay it. What I would object to is raising property taxes on timeshares and hotels disproportionately higher to cover the revenue shortfall which was made worst by the 14 day quarantine on incoming travellers to the islands, and the TAT which locals who have benefited from the 14 day quarantine don't pay.
 

csodjd

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I don't have a problem with raising taxes on flights into Hawaii since everyone tourists as well as locals that travel would need to pay it. What I would object to is raising property taxes on timeshares and hotels disproportionately higher to cover the revenue shortfall which was made worst by the 14 day quarantine on incoming travellers to the islands, and the TAT which locals who have benefited from the 14 day quarantine don't pay.
I'm not sure I see much distinction between taxing flights and taxing the location the people flying stay in. Flights tax each visitor a single amount irrespective of length of stay. Taxing hotels and timeshares taxes each family/visitor unit based on length of stay, or, in the case of timeshares, since that goes into MF, based on ownership type. That's all more form than substance.
 

Yellowfin

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I am wondering if companies would not reevaluate their long term plans in Hawaii given they may perceive the current developments not very business friendly.
 
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