[2008] Belaire Golf Resort and Spa

[Great Dane]

[Edited to delete response to personal attack. Dave M, BBS Moderator]

 

[pammex]

great dane..you have been reading these posts for 8 months and finally decided to join what Tug, or just to post, you are listed as a guest not a TUG member.

Many of the posters are giving facts..the facts they were told while at a Belair sales presentation.....some have posted pictures....some have no motive other than to help others who may or may not be financially hurt in this venture.

TUG is all about helping each other out in regards to timeshares and well forewarned is forearmed.

You say you are a Belair member, so are you happy with your purchase? Have the promises or things said and or written ( well better go just on the written) come to fruition. If so, or if not so, I would like to hear your story.

I have no motive other than to be a TUG member which means to me to help or be helped by other TUG members in all things involving timeshares, as well as other things at times. We are a community per say....for information.

I am not a member of Belair, nor did I buy for many reasons, I was told many untruths in presentation, the contract was full of loopholes, we were told we would make our money back in 2 years and no taxes etc..then we could join them in their next venture in the same way..( we were also told that immigration and the IRS were going to start questioning all who visited mexico if they made any gifts or money at a timeshare presentation and that they would have to pay taxes on that...now come on immigration does not even deal with taxes, hacienda does and like they have the man power to do this and an IRS agent at the aiport )..we were also told the airport would be moved to Southside and an additional one was going to be built and a road going right thru the military base to decrease time to NV...too good to be true...and also I had known valuable info from the TUG community previous to my going, and also had heard things that did not actually make me want to be involved in this throughout PV. Yes, things being said by locals who actually live in PV.

In light of all that has been said I have to say that I would never refer someone to purchase here as there is just too many problems and not access to use, with timeframes just being pushed further and further out....and I do own timeshares in Mexico and I enjoy them very much, some I may have got caught in some tactics and paid too much , others I fared well, but either way I have use to them and have had good vacations with them and most of the promises made were kept. Every thing written in my contracts is true and I have had no issues with any of my timeshares in Mexico nor US.

Personally I do not know brucecz, but have followed his posts and I feel he is just being an informed, helpful Tug member, I do not see him as having any motive other than to help others in seeing the reality of this Belair concept. He does own another timeshare in Mx., and has not complained or posted negatives about that one.....It does appear to be funny that most of the very positive posters are guests....

You say you did not receive anything when you made your Belair purchase but have you received anything as yet, considering no one buys a timeshare to not get even a week of use.....So you paid money and got no compensation, okay that is fine, but are you getting the promised use of a timeshare or fractional ownership as promised.

There are many who purchased who have taken a killing financially without even the hope of fruition.....some of these people are retirees who planned to spend their time vacationing and retiring with these units....others are people who bought with all good intentions of using this as their vacation escape....I would certainly be pretty upset if I had purchased and had nothing to use....

The only motive here by telling the stories of what is occurring and has happened and such is to make others aware of what is being told to prospective buyers, to help those who feel they have erred and want out, or to let those who may be thinking of purchasing what they are getting into.

There are many timeshare or fractional ownerships throughout mexico and this happens to be the only one where I see so many problems , other than the usual possibly unscrupulous sales tactics, but those owners are at least getting to make use of what they bought!

Personally I am finding each and every new post is bringing more and more info to the forefront, and frankly none of it sounds too good...

I continue to hope for the best for those who are in this...but I also at the same time, fear for whether it will actually come to fruition.

 

[Dave M]

...you are listed as a guest not a TUG member.

....

It does appear to be funny that most of the very positive posters are guests....

In my role as moderator, all should be advised that there is no stigma associated with being a "Guest" rather than a "TUG Member". TUG's ownership has made it clear that the BBS is free to all and that TUG membership is not required to obtain and retain BBS posting privileges. There are numerous longtime Guests who post on the BBS. All Guests are welcome to post here.

 

[pammex]

If we hadn't read thr posts from Bruce and our Moderator Karen G, we would be out over $24,000 dollars! And would have thought we had given up our other timeshare in PV.

So anyone who wants to question Bruce's motivation to share information that is helpful should know that if it wasn't for his detailed messages and replies we would be in absolute turmoil. Instead, we followed all of the advice given to us by Bruce and Karen G. As a result of following their advice we have a letter from our credit card company stating that our money is fully refunded and the case is closed.

THANKS to Bruce's motivation we sleep at night!!!!

I am so happy that Brucecz and Karen G. were able to help you and that your story has a happy ending!!!!!!

That is what this site is all about...helping each other in instances like this....thanks for sharing that story snappy sam.

 

[Great Dane]

Panamex,

I appreciate the more rational nature of your message. I have found however, that the majority of information on this site is from a very select few who may have indeed had a very bad experience and have decided to make it well known to others. I feel compelled to show that there are people who are just as happy with their Belaire purchase. We have seen posts from them but they are always rail-roaded by the more vocal negative posters.

I indicated I own two other timeshares and I can honestly say that almost none of what was presented to me in either of those presentations has turned out to be true. On the other hand, everything that Belaire has told me they have lived up to. As I mentioned, I have gotten exchanges to go other places, I have seen the construction proceeding in person and I will address some of the other things that were in their presentation in a separate thread.

I doubt that very many people have purchased a preconstruction property and contract. It is completely different. If you expected to be able to use the property right away then of course you would be unhappy. If it didn't get finished on the date they may have told you then again you may be disappointed but that doesn't mean it is all lies and you will lose all your money.

Indeed it may not be right for everyone but the people on this thread who it is not right for are indicating it is not a good purchase for anyone. Tell them your experience and let them decide. After someone tells a negative experience everyone pats them on the back and tells them how smart they are. When someone tells a positive story there is nothing but ridicule and a continuous string of posts trying to tell them how their experience is a sham. I do not find this in the spirit of why this BBS has been provided. Let each tell their story and leave it at that.

Even though I have had a very negative experience with my timeshare ownership I don't think that those who own at those place would appreciate me going to their BBS thread and telling everyone to stay away. They just lie, do not go there, do not buy from them, do not vacation there, you will lose all the money you spend.

 

[pammex]

I am sorry if I implied a stigma being associated with being a guest here, was not my intent to offend any guest, I realize there are many valuable long time guest posters here, so I am retracting, if that is possible my statement. I think it was in context of what poster had said, but that is neither here nor there, so any guest posters please accept my apologies if I offended or implied you were in any way not as important as any other poster here on TUG.

 

[pammex]

Panamex,

I appreciate the more rational nature of your message. I have found however, that the majority of information on this site is from a very select few who may have indeed had a very bad experience and have decided to make it well known to others. I feel compelled to show that there are people who are just as happy with their Belaire purchase. We have seen posts from them but they are always rail-roaded by the more vocal negative posters.

I indicated I own two other timeshares and I can honestly say that almost none of what was presented to me in either of those presentations has turned out to be true. On the other hand, everything that Belaire has told me they have lived up to. As I mentioned, I have gotten exchanges to go other places, I have seen the construction proceeding in person and I will address some of the other things that were in their presentation in a separate thread.

I doubt that very many people have purchased a preconstruction property and contract. It is completely different. If you expected to be able to use the property right away then of course you would be unhappy. If it didn't get finished on the date they may have told you then again you may be disappointed but that doesn't mean it is all lies and you will lose all your money.

Indeed it may not be right for everyone but the people on this thread who it is not right for are indicating it is not a good purchase for anyone. Tell them your experience and let them decide. After someone tells a negative experience everyone pats them on the back and tells them how smart they are. When someone tells a positive story there is nothing but ridicule and a continuous string of posts trying to tell them how their experience is a sham. I do not find this in the spirit of why this BBS has been provided. Let each tell their story and leave it at that.

Even though I have had a very negative experience with my timeshare ownership I don't think that those who own at those place would appreciate me going to their BBS thread and telling everyone to stay away. They just lie, do not go there, do not buy from them, do not vacation there, you will lose all the money you spend.

Your post is the first I have read on this thread stating you actually got use of your membership, possibly there are others who have to but they have not shared that info.

I must say I am curious to hear more of your stay at Velas though since I am familiar with that resort and what unit you stayed in as some are much better than others. I would hope you got a good unit since the Belair show units are certainly top notch.

Sorry your timeshares you own before belair have not worked for you, I personally have had wonderful luck with mine, despite a few potholes here and there. Of course it was a learning curve.

My observations of Belair have been based on my personal experience with them and my experience in buying pre-construction which was nothing like what is occurring at Belair. Just a note aside my husband is a builder, so there is some knowledge of construction coming from this end.

 

[pammex]

Was out of internet connection last night and well frequently thru last few days so please forgive my so many posts in a row I had them pending....and since I am connected this moment, thought I would get them in quick...

Kholmes35....I am happy that it all worked out for you the way you wished....

 

[Great Dane]

Your post is the first I have read on this thread stating you actually got use of your membership, possibly there are others who have to but they have not shared that info.

I have talked to several others who have made use of their Belaire memberships. They would have no reason to be on the TUG BBS as they are again happy members so you will not likely hear from many of them. That is also why I am only a Guest and not a Member of TUG because I have no reason to join and utilize this site for any other purpose other than to share this current information.

 

[TimeShare Junky]

I have talked to several others who have made use of their Belaire memberships. They would have no reason to be on the TUG BBS as they are again happy members so you will not likely hear from many of them. That is also why I am only a Guest and not a Member of TUG because I have no reason to join and utilize this site for any other purpose other than to share this current information.

I personally will not be happy until I can use these units and perks. I would have pefered to use the unit there and did not want to use for trading purposes. I own 15 + week and can go anywhere, except the place defined as a golden oportunity. People who join Tug use it for the vast information and timeshare oportunities, not to complain about this specific issue.

I would also like to mention that the online cameras show the same images
as a week ago or maybe longer.

 

[Great Dane]

I would also like to mention that the online cameras show the same images
as a week ago or maybe longer.

I just checked the cameras and they do not show the same information as a week ago. There is one additional layer of rebar wrapped around the first two rows that was not there last week. Once you bring up the page it will not change or refresh automatically. You have to hold the control key and press F5. This will refresh them image. If you do this three or four times, at say 1 or 2 second intervals, you will see people moving around the site working, cars going by on the street, etc. Let me know if you have futher problems.

 

[Blondie]

I just checked the cameras and they do not show the same information as a week ago. There is one additional layer of rebar wrapped around the first two rows that was not there last week. Once you bring up the page it will not change or refresh automatically. You have to hold the control key and press F5. This will refresh them image. If you do this three or four times, at say 1 or 2 second intervals, you will see people moving around the site working, cars going by on the street, etc. Let me know if you have futher problems.

Wow- an additional layer of rebar in one week.
That is impressive! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: How foolish we tuggers look. Because, after all, if things were going well at Belaire nobody on Tug would have a reason to exist, now would we? Surprising that so many "guests" here are quite adamant about the wonderful goings on at Belaire, albeit two years late. I mean, really, what DO they have to gain? :hysterical:

 

[california-bighorn]

Building Progress

I just checked the cameras and they do not show the same information as a week ago. There is one additional layer of rebar wrapped around the first two rows that was not there last week. Once you bring up the page it will not change or refresh automatically. You have to hold the control key and press F5. This will refresh them image. If you do this three or four times, at say 1 or 2 second intervals, you will see people moving around the site working, cars going by on the street, etc. Let me know if you have futher problems.

We will be at Velas Vallarta in February. At that time I will walk over to the Belair site and I fully expect to see addition layers of rebar wrapped around another row or two (of pilings?). I'll be sure to report back.
Where do I sign up to take the Belair tour? :hysterical:

 

[Archie583]

Belaire Golf Resort and Spa

I will also be in Purerto Vallarta(Mayan Palace and the Marina) between January 2, 2009 through April 24, 2009. At various times I will visit Belaire and attempt to keep memebers up to date.

 

[retiring soon]

Appealing a credit card company charge

MissDaisy10,
I am interested in finding out what information you supplied your credit card company to win. I am in the process of appealing my charges to Belaire and I would appreciate any words of wisdom. Thanks!!!!!

 

[Snappy Sam]

New thread for Belaire Spa and Resort in PV

As predicted, the last Belaire thread was closed down. I mentioned on two separate occasions that closing that thread would happen if we allowed ourselves to get caught up with those who have reason to want the thread to no longer be active. Perhaps baiting others was intentional rather than reactionary. So let's not be a part of that as the information shared is just so valuable for so many people who potentially could lose thousands of dollars. That certainly would have been us if we hadn't found the Belaire threads!!!
Most of us know the negatives about Belaire by now. And we all know if we respond with negative personal attacks we will be closed again. My guess is that feeds in to exactly what Belaire wants to have happen!
So, let's not let this happen again.
If you are new to this website we welcome you and invite you to read the previous Belaire Resort and Spa threads for lots of great information. And those of us who have had experience with Belaire are here to continue to help you.

 

[Snappy Sam]

September letter from Belaire

I'm surprised that no one has mentioned receiving an update letter from Belaire. We did by email (although I am sure he didn't realize that it went to us as it was an old email address that we had used temporarily while in PV) from Jonathan Tomasello, Antonio Copela's son who seems to be in charge. Here's what he had to say:
To all our members,
Another month has gone by and summer is quickly drawing to an end. This is a time that generally means changing routines and schedules for the fall season. For those that have been checking the real-time video camera feeds frequently, you will understand why this is actually good news. Summer means lots of nightly rains in Puerto Vallarta making the construction efforts very difficult as we have to pump thousands of gallons of water each day from the site before work can begin. However we have been continuously working through this period and you should be able to clearly see the foundation taking shape. The cement has been poured for the elevator area and now work is progressing on the first tower foundation.

Our attention remains focused on the building construction as we know this is just as important to our members. With the price of steel continuing to rise, we have finalized the purchase of the steel necessary to complete the building. Therefore, once we get through these particularly difficult and most time consuming foundational elements you will start to see floors going up quite rapidly. We expect this to be in the mid-October timeframe.

At this point, we are still expecting to have the tower up in the first quarter of 2009. We appreciate your patience, as things take shape and we move closer to your dreams becoming reality.

We have become aware that some of you are still asking about exchange capabilities. Our original arrangement with the Registry Collection did not work out as expected. We apologize that they did not honor the commitment they made with us for our members even though we paid our fees to them long ago. We then looked what our members really wanted and the issues that existed with the current external exchange companies. For example, having minimal inventory even when booking many months in advance, getting only basic timeshare units in many locations, and dealing with all the points versus weeks designations. Sometimes good things come out of such situations.

As a result, Beláire members have their own dedicated Concierge and Travel Services Center, toll free from the U.S. and Canada (phone numbers removed per request of the resort...these are intended for members only not the general public) , which will happily to assist you with any exchange and travel needs. Remember your membership does not have any yearly registration dues or any weekly maintenance fees. We have made things very simple in that you only pay the relevant weekly exchange fees. Yet you will find that you truly have access to the finest hotels, resorts and travel services anywhere in the world including those offered through the other exchange companies. Many of your fellow members have already experienced the superb personal service and exceptional travel options available.

We are always looking at new and exciting ways to enhance your member experience and will continue to communicate them to you in future newsletters. Again, I want to remind all our members that if you have any questions or concerns please email us at (emails removed per request of the resort as they are intended for members only, not the general public) as we want to hear from you.

Sincerely,

Jonathan Tomasello

I've removed an editorial comment that might provoke other comments that would lead to the thread being closed. Please post just the facts and try not to "editorialize" even in jest. Thanks, Karen G, Moderator

 

[Karen G]

Okay, here we go again with a Belaire thread. For anyone who just now is finding TUG and this thread, this is the long thread referenced in the first post. It contains a lot of information and first-hand experiences with the resort. However, it was closed because some posters did not follow the "be courteous" rules.

In order for this current thread to remain open, please post only new information about Belaire that has not been covered in the thread above. And please adhere to all TUG posting rules. This thread will be closely monitored and offending posts will be deleted or the thread itself will be closed, probably with no questions asked.

As the moderator of this Mexico forum, I want us to be able to help anyone who needs help with timesharing and I want us to be able to share our experiences and questions with each other. But, we must do so in a civil manner and we must abide by TUG rules. TUG is owned by an individual--it is not a democracy--the owner/administrator is free to operate this site however he wishes and to establish whatever policies he deems necessary and satisfactory. I'm happy to be a volunteer moderator, partake of all TUG offers, and follow the rules for posting. Please help me do so.

 

[Archie583]

New Thread for Belaire Spa and Resort in PV

Karen,
I know this is a long time in the future but my wife and I will be in Mexico from January 2, 2009 through April 24, 2009. We will be in the Marina area for this entire time period. We will visit Belaire at various times and attempt to report to TUG members. Since my wife and I are owners at Belaire we do not believe we will have any trouble accessing the site.
Maybe this problem will be resolved by the time we get to Mexico but I doubt this will happen.
Thank you for your help on this matter.

 

[Karen G]

Karen,
I know this is a long time in the future but my wife and I will be in Mexico from January 2, 2009 through April 24, 2009. We will be in the Marina area for this entire time period. We will visit Belaire at various times and attempt to report to TUG members. Since my wife and I are owners as Belaire we do not believe we will have any trouble accessing the site.
Maybe this problem will be resolved by the time we get to Mexico but I doubt this will happen.
Thank you for your help on this matter.

That's cool! We'll look forward to your reports.

 

[zara]

Belaire

For those of you looking at the webcam, you can see that cement is being poured today and progress is being made. That's great!

 

[TUGBrian]

Since another topic was started ignoring the request of a previous admin, and since this topic has been wildly popular...this thread is open again (ill merge the other one here in a second)

To address some "rumors" I can assure you that this thread was closed for NO other reason than people could not follow the be courteous rule, that is the #1 cause of threads being closed here...period.

Speaking your personal opinion is covered by free speech, completely and totally. Those that think differently are welcome to argue it but will have zero success.

Our only stipulation to your free speech right, is that you must remain courteous while doing so.

From now on in this thread, anyone not following that rule will have their post 100% removed. not just the violating line or comment.

Our moderators and admin staff are not babysitters, you are all adults and all agreed to the posting guidelines during registration here.

If you failed to read them, or chose to flat out ignore them, your posting priviledges will be suspended.

 

[Snappy Sam]

Thank You Brian and info for Retiring Soon

Thanks for linking the threads once more Brian.

Information for "retiring Soon".....
We gave our credit card company the following:
Copy of our contract with Belaire
Copy of the Letter of Recission that we delivered to Belaire
Copy of our credit card receipt
Copy of letter from Belaire agreeing to refund our money signed and dated when we hand delivered the letter to Marcos, Antonio Copela and Jonathan Tomasello
Copy of letter to Profeco

Hope this helps.

 

[esk444]

I was looking at the Redweek.com forum regarding Belaire. http://www.redweek.com/forums/messages?thread_id=14685

Some poster claims that they talked to Nico in Puerto Vallarta and he told them that TUG moderators closed its previous Belaire threads because they are full of lies and because TUG was threatened by the Belaire's attorneys.

Can the Moderators confirm or refute this allegation? (which sounds kind of ludicrous to me).

 

[Karen G]

Can the Moderators confirm or refute this allegation? (which sounds kind of ludicrous to me).

Yes, that is ludicrous. See the post from TUGBrian, owner of TUG, three posts above this one.