[2008] Belaire Golf Resort and Spa

[missdaisy10]

Marcos at Belaire

Marcos was at Belaire, then gone from Belaire (fired is what I was told), and recently I have heard that he is back. The day we bought he was playing the role of "personal concierge".

The sales people seem to come and go and some come back again during the next prime sales season.

When we purchased in June, 2007, Belaire was too new to show up on this site or anywhere else on the internet (other than their own web site which, of course, was a complete fabrication). I know, because when I left Belaire on purchase day 1, I went immediately to an internet cafe in the Marina and tried to research the project and the principals. Couldn't find anything. The poor schmucks buying Belaire today at least can find all kinds of warning if they do a search. If they choose to go ahead, they at least have been forewarned. If they choose to get out, there is ample instruction as to how to rescind within the five day period.

I do think that Belaire PV's days are numbered now that their cover has been blown. That's why I find the rumors that Nico has gone to Cancun and that Belaire is being sold to be so interesting. Now that this cash cow is going dry, they are going to have to build another one.

I know some of the members are trying to organize and hire an PV attorney to go after Antonio, et al, to get their money back. I have not participated in this as I have no hope that, even if they get a judgement in their favor, there is anything monetary remaining (that they will be able to find). Antonio is too smart to leave anything of value that they can go after.

I still get emails on occasion from other members. One is trying to get everyone to "shut up" because the bad publicity lessens the chance that the project will ever be completed. I am not going to keep my mouth shut because (1) I decided months ago to take my losses and move on, and (2) I don't want other unwary visitors to PV to get sucked into this thing and get fleeced like we were.

 

[brucecz]

I know some of the members are trying to organize and hire an PV attorney to go after Antonio, et al, to get their money back. I have not participated in this as I have no hope that, even if they get a judgement in their favor, there is anything monetary remaining (that they will be able to find). Antonio is too smart to leave anything of value that they can go after.

I still get emails on occasion from other members. One is trying to get everyone to "shut up" because the bad publicity lessens the chance that the project will ever be completed. I am not going to keep my mouth shut because (1) I decided months ago to take my losses and move on, and (2) I don't want other unwary visitors to PV to get sucked into this thing and get fleeced like we were.

First, I agree that the way some of the contracts were written that with loopholes that they we not be able to recover any money even if a suit was sucessfull.

Secondly, some of those sending you emails as So called members may not be people who bought at the Belaire but maybe work for the Belaire.

In one of the first 2 Belaire strings one poster who claimed to have bought at the Belaire and said they were in the US email address was found to be from PV.

Bruce

 

[pammex]

I have heard from another (unhappy) Belaire member that she has been told that Belaire is in the process of being sold. Has anyone else heard this?

If Nico has moved to Cancun, he may be getting the next "project" ready to go. I fully expect them to repeat elsewhere what they have done in PV.

Oh my......I hate to hear this.....I do not have a contract as I did not buy but I believe one of my hubby's ?'s was regarding something either in contract or said in regards to if Belair was sold..and it did not sound good to him..his words were ( my hubby's), so "in essence if it was sold, we would own nothing". I'll recheck with hubby and get back with more info if possible. ( he is in states and well was/ is scheduled to fly thru Houston which is closed, so working on it).

We were also told that the next development would be Cancun and then they would do another and another, so you should join the band wagon.....we did not...obviously!

Oh, for the buyers this is really bad news.....another bad news thing is you all really need profeco behind you. ( It is Nationwide, that includes Cancun). Lawyers are one thing in Mexico, Notarios are above them and frankly the laws are different here, and I forsee a long, expensive battle from foreigners with possible no results. Who can you trust? You do not live here? Who does Belair have affiliation with? Will you just be paying and paying and paying on top of your loss already? I am sure any monies and such are well gone or hidden. We were told of many things when there ie: offshore accounts..funding from unaffiliated sources, oh it was just all over the field with frankly bull...Mexico is a land of no time....do you realize the timeframe you could be looking at.....more than a few years, maybe more like decades of years. I do not really know this for fact but I will tell you when you put a foreigner up with a national, who do you think will win and if you shoudl win, what will there be t win and will your costs be beyond what you even paid already...not trying to be negative....this is just the reality as I see it and my distress over this newest bit of news has really upset me for all who are involved.

There are so many loopholes in the contracts from what we saw, and the one we saw was many, way too many pages, to the point of being ridiculous.

An owner should immediately contact Belair and see what they say? Also contact Profeco regarding this new news, JMHO.

This is disturbing news to me, I was so hoping to be wrong about all this!!!

 

[missdaisy10]

An Owner Should Immediately Contact Belaire?

Panmex, you say "An owner should immediately contact Belaire and see what they say." Since when has anything they say meant anything? They lie...then lie...then lie some more. As with all habitual liars, their lies have led to so many contradictions that no one really knows what the truth is. Their stories and statements are all self serving to keep the myth alive just a little bit longer so that they can make one last sale. How can you tell when they are lying? "When their lips are moving..."

 

[pammex]

Panmex, you say "An owner should immediately contact Belaire and see what they say." Since when has anything they say meant anything? They lie...then lie...then lie some more. As with all habitual liars, their lies have led to so many contradictions that no one really knows what the truth is. Their stories and statements are all self serving to keep the myth alive just a little bit longer so that they can make one last sale. How can you tell when they are lying? "When their lips are moving..."

Oh I totally agree with you but I just think anytime something comes up you or the buyers should confront it with Belair and then post the replies, you may find differing replies etc.. once again showing the discrepancies. A response one person may get and share, may help another who knows, even though we already know it will all be contradictions......

Plus the more posts and such the more aware people may become and less likely to get caught....as so many did...I am sorry if I upset you I am just trying to help in whatever way I can to prevent so much loss to others....

 

[brucecz]

I was out of my 5 day window. I would think I could fight it. I have been looking at the webcam every day. There actually was visible progress when I looked earlier this morning. I just looked again and more progress. I am going to give it a little more time and gamble, even though I remain sick to my stomach. Actually, this is all I think about.
I am going to make some phone calls to different places based on info we got while we were there. I will look into registry collection again, it may have been a while since that post. They are also suppose to be with SFX. I will post my findings once I have them.

Mary

Mary, you can ask sfx. Here is a link. http://www.timeshareforums.com/forums/ask-sfx/

Note my post to TPI posted on Tug ask TPI and TPI's reply stating that the Belaire was incorrect saying the Belaire was with TPI. Here is that link
http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64978

IMHO you should try and recind by contacting Profeco as some had been able to get out of Mayan contracts well after the 5 day right of recission time period had passed.

Bruce

 

[Jane Doe]

For the people thinking of hiring a lawyer, I would not. I would follow the advice of pammex on the 14 sept. Not only will it cost you a fortune, but the guy will be paid by belaire, or in the end possibly the judge. Regardless of how wrong they are they will win, they have more power, and for sure more money and that, I am sorry to say is how things work here. You should contact Perfeco for sure regardless of how long it has been. And as far as nailing Antonio, if that is even his real name, because I had heard it had been changed at least once before, forget it. The company is not in his name, and he is not even listed anywhere in the papers as project manager, director or whatever. Someone named Jason is though. I saw his immigration file, about 3inches thick. Plus, I have heard that the money they have coming from off shore is orginated in Vegas. So it is a bigger can of worms than you think.

 

[missdaisy10]

Panmex: When I re-read what I wrote, I can see why you might think I was upset with you. I'm not. The only people I am upset with are at Belaire. I merely wanted to point out what they are...habitual liars. Because they are, I am sure we can trap them into more contradictory statements if we try. But why bother? They are what they are and they don't really care what we think or what we demonstrate they are. The depend on "There's one born every moment..." and when the last one in PV runs out they will either retire on the millions they have already foisted or come up with another, even better conceived scam somewhere else. Besides, they won't talk to me since I am a "former" member who's contract was cancelled and funds forfeited when I dared to file a dispute with my credit card company. Which is a story for another posting...

 

[Snappy Sam]

Please share

Panmex: When I re-read what I wrote, I can see why you might think I was upset with you. I'm not. The only people I am upset with are at Belaire. I merely wanted to point out what they are...habitual liars. Because they are, I am sure we can trap them into more contradictory statements if we try. But why bother? They are what they are and they don't really care what we think or what we demonstrate they are. The depend on "There's one born every moment..." and when the last one in PV runs out they will either retire on the millions they have already foisted or come up with another, even better conceived scam somewhere else. Besides, they won't talk to me since I am a "former" member who's contract was cancelled and funds forfeited when I dared to file a dispute with my credit card company. Which is a story for another posting...

Missdaisy...Don't leave us hanging...please share the story!!!!

 

[zara]

belaire

The construction is progressing daily. They should be ready to pour the concrete soon, I think. Maybe all the negative people will be surprised come spring. Let's hope so. Many of us have large investments, and want to see the resort become a success. Have some faith.

 

[mterra]

I called Belaire this morning. spoke with Paul Diaz. He is the sales manager and I guess owner's representative, or something like that. He has taken over the role of dealing with members because people were not having questions answered, emails or phone calls returned. Anyway he explained why things have taken so long to get going: They had to get a separate license because of an american company. Also there were issues related to money, in that World Resorts Marketing is from the states, so the money coming in was american, not mexican. The money situation has been taken care of and all licenses are in order. Once all was finally in place the rainy season started.

He did say that those that have a contract can use their time that they have at another resort. He also said that another resort of theirs Miramar, will be opening in December. Miramar is in Concithinas(?spelling) Just south of Puerto Vallarta. When I was down there in Aug, Marcos was also talking about Porto Fino right there in PV and Punta Mita, which I believe is north of PV. It might be worth trying to call and see if you can set something up at any of those places. Even if you don't really want it just to test it out.

He said he expects this to be completed by summer 2009. We should notice things going up faster once the foundation is set.

He told me that information would be coming out in the next couple weeks. Marcos also told me (last week) that an update would be coming out in Oct. If anyone else wants to call and see what kind of info they get, I would be interested in hearing what is said.


Mary

 

[Blondie]

The construction is progressing daily. They should be ready to pour the concrete soon, I think. Maybe all the negative people will be surprised come spring. Let's hope so. Many of us have large investments, and want to see the resort become a success. Have some faith.

Zara- Many here are not negative--just realistic. Believe me when I say NOBODY wants you and the others to lose your large investment. Faith? I think there is a fine line between faith and foolhardiness. You have a right to demand answers and results from these people and they should be held accountable. Believe it or not alot of people here are on you side although you may not see it that way.

 

[brucecz]

I called Belaire this morning. spoke with Paul Diaz. He is the sales manager and I guess owner's representative, or something like that. He has taken over the role of dealing with members because people were not having questions answered, emails or phone calls returned. Anyway he explained why things have taken so long to get going: They had to get a separate license because of an american company. Also there were issues related to money, in that World Resorts Marketing is from the states, so the money coming in was american, not mexican. The money situation has been taken care of and all licenses are in order. Once all was finally in place the rainy season started.

He did say that those that have a contract can use their time that they have at another resort. He also said that another resort of theirs Miramar, will be opening in December. Miramar is in Concithinas(?spelling) Just south of Puerto Vallarta. When I was down there in Aug, Marcos was also talking about Porto Fino right there in PV and Punta Mita, which I believe is north of PV. It might be worth trying to call and see if you can set something up at any of those places. Even if you don't really want it just to test it out.

He said he expects this to be completed by summer 2009. We should notice things going up faster once the foundation is set.

He told me that information would be coming out in the next couple weeks. Marcos also told me (last week) that an update would be coming out in Oct. If anyone else wants to call and see what kind of info they get, I would be interested in hearing what is said.


Mary

Mary, in my post # 231 yesterday I quoted your posting that you would let the readers on this string know asap if the SFX exchange company had any type of working exchange relationship with the Belaire like the Belaire said they did. You said you would the answer asap, but you must have forgotten to post the results.

So here is the string http://www.timeshareforums.com/forums/ask-sfx/75854-bel-aire-puerto-vallarta.html you started and were got your negitive answer from SFX this morning that the Belaire does not have type of working exchange relationship with SFX.

Marcos has been saying for well over a year that they had working relationships with the Registry Collection which has been proven to be false.

Marcos showed us a brochure and also said the Belaire can do exchanges through TPI but the link on Tug and the TPI reps reply on Tug said that was also false claim made by the Belaire.

The comment by one of the salesmen that they were going to move the airport to South PV was amazing. First even if the land was flat the cost would be 100 times the worth of the Belaire even if the Belaire got built.

That area south side of town is a mountain that is very steep that comes down to the water and would take Millions if not Billons of dollars to make level to build on.

In fact that area includes the area is were their “Miramar”is to be built. So Marcos contradicts himself again unless they are going to rip down "their Miramar" to build the airport.

Those are 4 lies told by the Belaire reps that were easily proved beyond a reasonable doubt to be outright balant lies.

I am very surprised that you in your post above said Quote "He also said that another resort of theirs Miramar, will be opening in December. Miramar is in Concithinas(?spelling) Just south of Puerto Vallarta. When I was down there in Aug, Marcos was also talking about Porto Fino right there in PV and Punta Mita, which I believe is north of PV. It might be worth trying to call and see if you can set something up at any of those places. Even if you don't really want it just to test it out. " Unquote

Note they did not make the same mistake again and say they were affiliated with any reputable exchange company, but promised some type of exchanges. What they may have done was buy some or rent some weeks at a few resorts for inventory promotional reasons so they can say they do have inventory for the people who spent money with the Belaire. They could be worth next to nothing blue like weeks.

They could promise to have something and then you could be canceled at the last mintue. Remember all of the many promises they have made and then broken or found out to be outright lies.

Go back to the first posting on this string and think about your chances of even staying at the Belaire are based on that ex Belaire employees posting.

The problem they supposedly had bringing in US money into Mexico and not Pesos is IMHO is not even close to being believable. Almost every one who comes in from the US brings dollars and have many places to exchange money. Mexico needs that investment money and maybe that is the reason why they let the Timeshare developers do what a lot of them do to their buyers.

In regards to the rainy season this is the second, third or fourth year they have been advertising and selling.

Lets not forget the lies about no income tax on doubling your money that have been told on some of the 3 Belaire strings. Those who bought because of those promises were victims of their own greed.


The untruths by the Belaire being addressed in this posting of mine are just a very small percentage of the provable Belaire lies in the 3 Belaire strings.


To the ones who are saying do not be negative if a muddy hole in September 2008 after advertising since 2005 is a sign of progress then I do hope it is built for their sake.

But if a person has noted all of the lies told by the Belaire noted in all three strings, IMHO a rational person after reading about all of the broken promises and lies would try to bail even if they would lose their deposit and a few payments..

I am glad after being awed by the sample unit we rescinded our small $5,950. Belaire Club contract for (supposedly) 10 weeks usage in any size Belaire unit. We rescinded last September 13, 2008 one day after our Wedding Anniversary, and not have that sick feeling that a lot of the Belaire buyers have posted about. The first post in this string tells me that we would not gotten access even through it was in our contract.

I feel so very fear full for those who bought over a year ago and only have a mud hole at this point to point at as a sign of building progress.

Bruce

 

[pammex]

Panmex: When I re-read what I wrote, I can see why you might think I was upset with you. I'm not. The only people I am upset with are at Belaire. I merely wanted to point out what they are...habitual liars. Because they are, I am sure we can trap them into more contradictory statements if we try. But why bother? They are what they are and they don't really care what we think or what we demonstrate they are. The depend on "There's one born every moment..." and when the last one in PV runs out they will either retire on the millions they have already foisted or come up with another, even better conceived scam somewhere else. Besides, they won't talk to me since I am a "former" member who's contract was cancelled and funds forfeited when I dared to file a dispute with my credit card company. Which is a story for another posting...

missdaisy, yes I did kind of think you were upset with me and I am just trying to help and feel so bad for all of you. I too am upset at Belair and all the people they have hurt financially and psychologically.
I suggest showing their discrepancies to maybe prevent others from falling into the same situation and also to maybe help in the dealings with profeco and also to keep enlightening those who are being so aptient and faithful which I truly pays off for them in the end...but I have my doubts..BIG ONES!

You cancelled but forfeited your money?? Pls. share the story with us....I am sorry if you too lost money, but I am hoping it was not a hefty amount, though any amount is unsatisfactory I know.

Missdaisy...Don't leave us hanging...please share the story!!!!

Yes, let the truth be told....share the story....please..

I called Belaire this morning. spoke with Paul Diaz. He is the sales manager and I guess owner's representative, or something like that. He has taken over the role of dealing with members because people were not having questions answered, emails or phone calls returned. Anyway he explained why things have taken so long to get going: They had to get a separate license because of an american company. Also there were issues related to money, in that World Resorts Marketing is from the states, so the money coming in was american, not mexican. The money situation has been taken care of and all licenses are in order. Once all was finally in place the rainy season started.

He did say that those that have a contract can use their time that they have at another resort. He also said that another resort of theirs Miramar, will be opening in December. Miramar is in Concithinas(?spelling) Just south of Puerto Vallarta. When I was down there in Aug, Marcos was also talking about Porto Fino right there in PV and Punta Mita, which I believe is north of PV. It might be worth trying to call and see if you can set something up at any of those places. Even if you don't really want it just to test it out.

He said he expects this to be completed by summer 2009. We should notice things going up faster once the foundation is set.

He told me that information would be coming out in the next couple weeks. Marcos also told me (last week) that an update would be coming out in Oct. If anyone else wants to call and see what kind of info they get, I would be interested in hearing what is said.


Mary

So you are telling me that after ALL this time they needed another license and did not know it nor with all their funds could not push it thru....

American money, Mexican money all the same...money in exchanged every day here...it is not a problem.....that is just totally ridiculous!!!!

The rains started, oh my how unexpected, the rains come every single year at the same time give r take a week....was this a surprise....does Mexico construction stop in rainy season...NO.....you do realize rainy season if from June to Sept. or oct and sometimes into Nov. That is a minimum of 4-6 months, so everything gets put on hold for almost half a year every year in Mexico...I think not!!!

Maybe you mean Conchas Chinas area with Miramar...a resort that is not according to your post opening till Dec. What good is that?? It is not open now then! Porto Fino also can be used well how lovely. Someone get on the phone and try to book into Porto Fino or even Miramar after Dec. ( Make sure you are not one of those who is trying to get out via Profeco, as probably if you book or use anything then would null and void any ability to recind , no matter how long ago you bought I would try to recind)

Oh now the date for completion is summer of 2009! When will the foundation be set? Will they possibly be able to do that in the rainy season which has not ended yet? Ah yes I am sure once the foundation in the big muddy hole, once set, then things will progress much faster, until the next problem with money, rain, r who knows what...probably Mexico will run out of cement. ( I know I am being sarcastic but this really is getting to be a bit much!!!!!!)

Oh an update will be coming out, well that will calm the waters! I say all members/owners call and see what they are told....this is just the worst scenario I have ever heard of.....I am continually amazed at it all...

Obiviously Mary this is not aimed at you...it is just mind boggling and we , wel I appreciate your posting your info...

Mary, in my post # 231 yesterday I quoted your posting that you would let the readers on this string know asap if the SFX exchange company had any type of working exchange relationship with the Belaire like the Belaire said they did. You said you would the answer asap, but you must have forgotten to post the results.

So here is the string http://www.timeshareforums.com/forums/ask-sfx/75854-bel-aire-puerto-vallarta.html you started and were got your negitive answer from SFX this morning that the Belaire does not have type of working exchange relationship with SFX.

Marcos has been saying for well over a year that they had working relationships with the Registry Collection which has been proven to be false.

Marcos showed us a brochure and also said the Belaire can do exchanges through TPI but the link on Tug and the TPI reps reply on Tug said that was also false claim made by the Belaire.

The comment by one of the salesmen that they were going to move the airport to South PV was amazing. First even if the land was flat the cost would be 100 times the worth of the Belaire even if the Belaire got built.

That area south side of town is a mountain that is very steep that comes down to the water and would take Millions if not Billons of dollars to make level to build on.

In fact that area includes the area is were their “Miramar”is to be built. So Marcos contradicts himself again unless they are going to rip down "their Miramar" to build the airport.

Those are 4 lies told by the Belaire reps that were easily proved beyond a reasonable doubt to be outright balant lies.

I am very surprised that you in your post above said Quote "He also said that another resort of theirs Miramar, will be opening in December. Miramar is in Concithinas(?spelling) Just south of Puerto Vallarta. When I was down there in Aug, Marcos was also talking about Porto Fino right there in PV and Punta Mita, which I believe is north of PV. It might be worth trying to call and see if you can set something up at any of those places. Even if you don't really want it just to test it out. " Unquote

Note they did not make the same mistake again and say they were affiliated with any reputable exchange company, but promised some type of exchanges. What they may have done was buy some or rent some weeks at a few resorts for inventory promotional reasons so they can say they do have inventory for the people who spent money with the Belaire. They could be worth next to nothing blue like weeks.

They could promise to have something and then you could be canceled at the last mintue. Remember all of the many promises they have made and then broken or found out to be outright lies.

Go back to the first posting on this string and think about your chances of even staying at the Belaire are based on that ex Belaire employees posting.

The problem they supposedly had bringing in US money into Mexico and not Pesos is IMHO is not even close to being believable. Almost every one who comes in from the US brings dollars and have many places to exchange money. Mexico needs that investment money and maybe that is the reason why they let the Timeshare developers do what a lot of them do to their buyers.

In regards to the rainy season this is the second, third or fourth year they have been advertising and selling.

Lets not forget the lies about no income tax on doubling your money that have been told on some of the 3 Belaire strings. Those who bought because of those promises were victims of their own greed.


The untruths by the Belaire being addressed in this posting of mine are just a very small percentage of the provable Belaire lies in the 3 Belaire strings.


To the ones who are saying do not be negative if a muddy hole in September 2008 after advertising since 2005 is a sign of progress then I do hope it is built for their sake.

But if a person has noted all of the lies told by the Belaire noted in all three strings, IMHO a rational person after reading about all of the broken promises and lies would try to bail even if they would lose their deposit and a few payments..

I am glad after being awed by the sample unit we rescinded our small $5,950. Belaire Club contract for (supposedly) 10 weeks usage in any size Belaire unit. We rescinded last September 13, 2008 one day after our Wedding Anniversary, and not have that sick feeling that a lot of the Belaire buyers have posted about. The first post in this string tells me that we would not gotten access even through it was in our contract.

I feel so very fear full for those who bought over a year ago and only have a mud hole at this point to point at as a sign of building progress.

Bruce

Bruce has spent a lot of time posting on this thread and shared some invaluable info....listen to him....no Belair is not affiliated with TPI, SFX or Registry Collection. How could they be they have nothing but a big hole in ground to exchange....

The airport...I was one who was told that...absolutely incredible.....we just laughed...it is a mountain, like the Sierra Madre mountians set over the ocean...really come on.....listen to Bruce, the costs would be atronomical as well as fact that I highly doubt the government would undertake that and then think how long that would take.....we were also told there was going to be 2 airports, okay that sounds feasible...we just laughed and no the salesman did not like it..but we are familiar with the area and this is all hogwash..the airport is staying, there is not going to be a road thru the military base...

Read and reread the posts...read and reread Bruce's posts from way back....

Oh I to am so fearful for all of you who bought a long time ago and have only as Bruce says a mud hole for progress...

I have to go to bed now..this whole issue has exhausted me and I have not even invested,but my thoughts are with those who have....

 

[brucecz]

Thank you Mule for your candid observation. I have been following this thread since its inception.It is very clear to me as well as to the motives of some of the responses.

Judy23, I find your posting I quoted above and your complimenting and agreeing with the Mule about the Belaire very interesting and disturbing in light of all of the proven lies told by the Belaire and their shills.

When I asked the Mule to post a link to his claim, the Mule said he could not and offered such a transparently false excuse which IMHO is a Belaire MO. I on the other hand have provided links to validate my claims. Here is the Mules post # 164 in this string Quote "Sorry Bruce but Tug will not let me post any negative report. Im sure its because it will show all the deceit that some tug members have been posting about the Belaire." Unquote

The Mule then does not IMHO respond to the issue raised but then makes another blatant false claim to divert attention that he could not offer proof of that "Special report" he alluded to.

I do have to wonder about your motives and your agenda in your posting seemingly supporting the "Mules" posting and his support about the Belaires blatant lies that have been proven many times beyond a reasonable doubt to be nothing but lies.

You seemed to have supported his position in your posting I quoted.

If you are truly a misguided buyer, then I truly feel sorry for you if you feel your support of the Belaire and the Mules postings is somehow going to fix the problem of lack of progress on the Belaires lacl of real progress.

Were you maybe taken in by the False promise of doubling your money in 2 years that you put into the Belaire, or having by not to pay US Taxes if you are a US Citizen?

A IRS agent posted in one of the earlier Belaire strings that if someone tryed to do that the Belaire agents said in regards in not paying US taxes, they would end up having big legal problems with the IRS. What the Belaire said about paying no US taxes on any profit is so transparently illegal.

But do not worry as there will be no 200% profits in 2 years for those who bought over a year or more ago to hide if you try to sell the contract assigned to you if you were a buyer of a Belaire contract.

IMHO it is pretty hard for any one to double their money in 2 years after buying into the Belaire as promised by Marcos and other Belaire sales people after investing in a 1 year old mud hole.

When we were there a year ago last September there was some dirt moved. In just one years sort time they now have made great progress and now it is a beautiful mud hole if you like mud holes instead of the promised accomations made by the Belaire.

Bruce

 

[mterra]

Bruce, you are right, I did not follow up on SFX. I did just find that out yesterday, and that is a NO. I did write in about the registry collection. I am also looking into Make a Wish Foundation. I was told that they support the Foundation and donate money to them. Being in Alaska sometimes it's difficult to get phone calls done and followed up on with time differences, working, etc. I have other timeshares, so kinda thought I knew what I was doing, questions to ask etc. I guess I am a little more naive than I thought. However all the ones I have are existing. This is my first preconstruction, that I doubt I will ever do again. I have read and re-read all the threads over the last few weeks. Most of how we "paid" for this was with the idea that we were going to give them some of our timeshares. So, that is all on hold. We did give some money, but maybe not as much as others. I am not willing to lose any of my timeshares to them, but had considered an "exchange." So, all is on hold and I will see what comes of this.

Pammex: When I said others should call, or see about making a reservation somewhere, it was just because someone else had mentioned different people calling and seeing if the same story was told to others. So I told the story I was given.

Anyway, I am driving my other half crazy with all of this. He will probably take the computer away pretty soon.

Off to work. Mary

 

[brucecz]

Mary, IMHO if they did support the Foundation and donate money to them IMO it was only so they could use it as part of the Belaire presentation. I think the Belaire may have made a small donation just for good PR.

Of course what they told you about their support of the foundation may be just as not valid as the statements about the reputable exchange companies that they are doing exchanges with.

But even if they did make a donation to the Foundation I doubt it was very subtstanial. If it was supposely a donation in the form of timeshares taken in on trade I would be very carefull.

Other Timeshare companies have supposely taken in timeshares on trade, and only when a maintenance invoice has come into the owner does the owner know that that timeshare was not transferred out of their names and they are liable for maintenance and late payment fees.

Good luck to you.

Bruce

Bruce

 

[judy23]

bruce,
That posting was weeks ago, and right after that mule was removed fro posting on Tug. Just to set the record straight we were never promised to double our money in two years. We bought and traded in the GM because we no longer wanted it and we spent very little monies as compared to a lot of other members. They gave us $4000 credit right on our credit card for referring two members while we were still in PV.That led us to believe it was legit. As others have stated tug was not a vehicle for us because we purchased before all the negative posts started. I have been in contact with a large number of members and we are communicating all of our concerns. It's unfortunate that the construction has taken so long but if you look at the web cam (which by the way, I was able to verify is real from someone who lives there) you will see that they are getting ready to pour the foundation. I have been actively involved on a daily basis of gathering information as to what is going on and will continue to do so. I choose not to share my information on this forum. It's to the point where all of these postings are getting repetive by the same people. I am not defending the Belaire and their management I am just trying to protect myself and all of the other members who put out a lot of money for this resort. Please don't bother replying because I am finished with this post. Judy

 

[brucecz]

bruce,
That posting was weeks ago, and right after that mule was removed fro posting on Tug. Just to set the record straight we were never promised to double our money in two years. We bought and traded in the GM because we no longer wanted it and we spent very little monies as compared to a lot of other members. They gave us $4000 credit right on our credit card for referring two members while we were still in PV.That led us to believe it was legit. As others have stated tug was not a vehicle for us because we purchased before all the negative posts started. I have been in contact with a large number of members and we are communicating all of our concerns. It's unfortunate that the construction has taken so long but if you look at the web cam (which by the way, I was able to verify is real from someone who lives there) you will see that they are getting ready to pour the foundation. I have been actively involved on a daily basis of gathering information as to what is going on and will continue to do so. I choose not to share my information on this forum. It's to the point where all of these postings are getting repetive by the same people. I am not defending the Belaire and their management I am just trying to protect myself and all of the other members who put out a lot of money for this resort. Please don't bother replying because I am finished with this post. Judy

Quote" have been actively involved on a daily basis of gathering information as to what is going on and will continue to do so. I choose not to share my information on this forum." Unquote

To set the record straight, many were promised to double their money with in 2 years after they bought. If you disagree with that a few have posted that fact on the 3 Belaire strings. Frankly I do not care what you were told to get you to buy IF you bought.


Judy, you were not shy about "shared" info, your views and your opinions before in support, but now you want to claim that what you posted is out date seeing you posted it less than a month ago in regards to the Mule and supposed agendas of others who dared to disagree with the Mules postings.

Of course you do not want any replies that use FACTS to contradict your postings. The truth is never out of date and the fact is you supported the Mule in your posting and slammed those who did not buy the Mules excuses and false claims on behalf of the Belaire.

How do you know the Mule has be removed from Tug? I find that interesting that you supposely know that if it is indeed true. Did the Mule tell you that?


You did thank the Mule on Tug as per quoted below.
Quote:
Originally Posted by judy23
Thank you Mule for your candid observation. I have been following this thread since its inception.It is very clear to me as well as to the motives of some of the responses." Unquote

So you just posted that you supposedly made $4,000 on 2 referrals for the Belaire. Do you think you have helped your creditability with your last posting admitting that fact? And you questioned others creditability who disagreed with the Mule or posted about the many problems with the Belaire?

Is that what mean that Quote "I am just trying to protect myself and all of the other members who put out a lot of money for this resort. " Unquote ? Buy making more referral money off of others?

Did the Belaire tell you that you did not have to declare that as taxable income seeing you supplyed them a service and were paid for that service?

Quoting you "They gave us $4000 credit right on our credit card for referring two members while we were still in PV. " Unquote.

Thank you for inadvertently letting on what some of your agenda is in regards to your getting several $2,000 referrals from the Belaire. Thank you for your post as it is very clear to me as well as to the motives of some of the responses like yours who defend the Belaires and people like the Mule.

But what those supposedly $2,000 referral credits may have been is very similar to a documented tactic that the Mayan Palace uses. They Claim because they are short of rental weeks they will give the buyer a $2,000 or $3,000 credit off of the price if the buyer will give them their first week.

They appealed to the greed and gullibility of the buyer so the buyer will not hopefully any due diligence until it is to late. At least anyone that bought from the Mayans in the past year and a half have a timeshare to use or exchange unlike the people who belived the Belaire promises and lies.

Marcos told us in September of 2007 that we would be able to use the Belaire to stay at this February 2008.

In your post above you said you "We bought and traded in the GM"
Did your referance to the GM mean the Grand Mayan by any chance?

Seeing you posted in another posting in this string that you had the bussiness cards of most sales people at the Belaire including Marcos a of the Belaire crew had worked for the Mayan Group.

Bruce

 

[Great Dane]

brucecz,

Why do you feel it is necessary to badger and try to suggest that every member of Belaire that posts on this forum has a motive and can't possibly believe that what they purchased is legitimate?

What exactly is your motive?

I have been reading these postings for about 8 months and finally decided it was time to join to respond to people like you and others that are great with lots of opinions (look at how many messages in this tread include IMHO) which are not backed with facts.

Just so that you don't question my motives. I am a Belaire member and I did not receive anything when I made my purchase.

 

[pammex]

Bruce, you are right, I did not follow up on SFX. I did just find that out yesterday, and that is a NO. I did write in about the registry collection. I am also looking into Make a Wish Foundation. I was told that they support the Foundation and donate money to them. Being in Alaska sometimes it's difficult to get phone calls done and followed up on with time differences, working, etc. I have other timeshares, so kinda thought I knew what I was doing, questions to ask etc. I guess I am a little more naive than I thought. However all the ones I have are existing. This is my first preconstruction, that I doubt I will ever do again. I have read and re-read all the threads over the last few weeks. Most of how we "paid" for this was with the idea that we were going to give them some of our timeshares. So, that is all on hold. We did give some money, but maybe not as much as others. I am not willing to lose any of my timeshares to them, but had considered an "exchange." So, all is on hold and I will see what comes of this.

Pammex: When I said others should call, or see about making a reservation somewhere, it was just because someone else had mentioned different people calling and seeing if the same story was told to others. So I told the story I was given.

Anyway, I am driving my other half crazy with all of this. He will probably take the computer away pretty soon.

Off to work. Mary

You may have misunderstood my post..I am with you I think everyone should call and see if indeed they can get accomadations/reservations. And also call to see if stories match up....I am with you, and think people should share what they are told etc....just another way to expose the truth, if there indeed does lie any truth in all this!

 

[brucecz]

brucecz,

Why do you feel it is necessary to badger and try to suggest that every member of Belaire that posts on this forum has a motive and can't possibly believe that what they purchased is legitimate?

What exactly is your motive?

I have been reading these postings for about 8 months and finally decided it was time to join to respond to people like you and others that are great with lots of opinions (look at how many messages in this tread include IMHO) which are not backed with facts.

Just so that you don't question my motives. I am a Belaire member and I did not receive anything when I made my purchase.

Great Dane, feel free to express your opinions about me while and the issues raised about the many documented Belaire lies, but please try be more accurate unlike some of the Belaire supporters.

To answer the first of your questions, no, I never have suggested that every one who posted about their buying at the Belaire was not legitimate. Some buyers that were in their rescission period took our advice and along with their previous misgivings and rescinded one they learned how they were lied to by the Belaire.

Those who were not able to rescind have posted the many valid reasons why they wish they could have recinded. Whats your opinon on those "Belaire Buyers" who have expressed their "buyers remorse". Are all of those people wrong who rescinded and the others who expressed "buyers remorse"?


To answer your second and last question you asked me Quote" What exactly is your motive?" Unquote

If you have fully read the 3 Belaire strings, my motive and the motive of many others like me is very plain. It is to warn others about not getting suckered by all of the many broken promises, missed deadlines and PROVED outright lies made to the Belaire buyers and to people who did a Belaire presentation over the past several years. That is my simple agenda.


Feel free to dispute the facts contained of any link I have provided in a posting of yours if you can. I have a feeling that you will not dispute any of the facts contained in those links.

Now that I have answered all of your direct questions fair play by you would be to answer the direct questions I will ask you. I did not or will claim that you bagdered me by asking me your questions.

What type of package and how long ago did you purchase? Do you claim that the Belaire has kept every verbal and written contract promise made to you?

You seemingly want to control the agenda on this string by saying I badgered Judy23. Remember she bought up the suject of motives and so did you, but you then post Quote "Just so that you don't question my motives." Unquote.
Interesting tactic by both of you.

I see you like Judy23 seemingly want to question other peoples motives, but you in your frist posting do not want your motives questioned, correct?

There is proof of apparent shills posting as Belaire buyers in one of the earlier Belaire strings on Tug that you said you have followed for 8 months.

Did you see that posting by the Tug Administrator about that being a Puerto Vallarta IP address instead of a claimed California home address?

That posting had to do with the Belaire salespeople telling US Citizens that they would not having to pay IncomeTax on any profits made with the Belaire.

The proof is that the shill claimed to be a Belaire owner living and posting from California when their IP address was identified as really coming from PV. Great Dane what do you have to say about that Belaire supporter being caught in a blatant lie?


You like a lot of the Belaire supporters have not addressed or disputed one fact that I have backed up by with a posted link. Your answer to this question is?

Until you address those link issues containing proveable facts that are unfavorable to the Belaire, then you might earn some creditability with the long time Tug members.


In the first two Belaire strings it was noted that there were a lot Belaire supporters who were new posters who made a lot of claims for reasons to buy at the Belaire that turned out to be PROVEN to be false claims.

When the Mule posted something as fact and when I asked him to provide a link of proof of what he said was true, he could not and blamed Tug saying Tug would not let him. His stated reason why Tug would not was proved by simple logic and facts to be wrong.

Great Dane, do you care to comment on that posting were the Mule claimed that Tug would not let him post that link to support his claim?. Read that post of the Mule and if you do not post you disagree with the Mule, then maybe your motives just might become suspect by others.

Judy23 left information in her post claiming to have as I pointed out that she made $4,000 from the Belaire. That was her choice.

Noting that I have a Great Dane I would wonder about your choice of that handle seeing I just posted in the past 2 weeks about our 10 year old Great Danes recent health problems causing us the cut short our Anniversary Puerto Vallatra Trip by 7 days this September.

Or do you have a Great Dane or are you a Dane? It makes me wonder why you picked that posting name.

Bruce

 

[Snappy Sam]

To the point for us...

If we hadn't read thr posts from Bruce and our Moderator Karen G, we would be out over $24,000 dollars! And would have thought we had given up our other timeshare in PV.

So anyone who wants to question Bruce's motivation to share information that is helpful should know that if it wasn't for his detailed messages and replies we would be in absolute turmoil. Instead, we followed all of the advice given to us by Bruce and Karen G. As a result of following their advice we have a letter from our credit card company stating that our money is fully refunded and the case is closed.

THANKS to Bruce's motivation we sleep at night!!!!

 

[brucecz]

Thanks Sam.

If people go to post number 134 on the string link posted below by the Mule, they might note that they are very similar in struture and content to he the first posting of the Great Dane's posting. The MO's are so very similar.

Feel free to draw your own conclusions.

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=61301&page=6

Bruce

 

[brucecz]

brucecz,

Why do you feel it is necessary to badger and try to suggest that every member of Belaire that posts on this forum has a motive and can't possibly believe that what they purchased is legitimate?

What exactly is your motive?

I have been reading these postings for about 8 months and finally decided it was time to join to respond to people like you and others that are great with lots of opinions (look at how many messages in this tread include IMHO) which are not backed with facts.

Just so that you don't question my motives. I am a Belaire member and I did not receive anything when I made my purchase.

Here for the Great Danes benifiet is a link and the post numbers if he or others want to comment on these issues of the many recurring lies and broken promises and illegal tax breaks promised by the Belaire that have been reported by some owners going back as far as early 2007.

NOT just IMHO but if you go to the first Belaire string (here is a link) http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52034&page=2 you will find some interesting postings on that string made mostly by others and not me about the many lies and broken promises made to many others by the Belaire.

Great Dane, Post number 43 by Dave M condradicts the posting number 41 on that string from the shill who claimed to be from San Diego and was getting huge tax breaks, etc by buying at the Belaire, who's IP address was really from Puerto Vallatra and NOT San Diego as claimed by that shill.

Post number 38 on that string is about a reported sales offer by the Belaire that sounded a lot better than what you might have bought seeing you said you were offered nothing extra in your post.

Post number 9 on that string is about the construction as of Nov 10, 2007.

Note my posting number 35 on that string made on Dec 6 over 9 months ago. In it I said Marcos said that we were promised that the Belaire would be ready for use by the owners by August or September of 2008.

The Belaire is really going to have to hustle to get it completed in the next 11 days to fullfill the promises made by Marcos to us when he though he had us hooked to be used by the owners for their vacations.

But even if the Belaire is built the present owners may not get use of it because of the loopholes in varying contracts others on this string have posted their concerns about.

Some of the other posts by likely Belaire shills are so transparent they are almost funny, but do show what lenghts the Belaire will go to sell timeshares.

Bruce