Wyndham limiting access by non-owners during most sought-after dates/locations

[Lisa P]

I received an email from Club Wyndham yesterday, 10/20/21. Since I don't always get the same emails as others have posted, I thought I'd share here, the most pertinent points from this one:
________________________________________________________

Prioritizing Owner Reservations ​

What started as a pilot earlier this year has helped more timeshare owners stay at the most sought-after destinations during the busiest holidays and events. We have seen some impressive examples of owners taking advantage of the prioritization opportunities, such as:​

​

Fourth of July Holiday Period:​

• Club Wyndham Bonnet Creek — owner occupancy up 19%​

• Club Wyndham Riverside Suites — owner occupancy up 18%​

​

Labor Day Holiday Period:​

• Club Wyndham Park City — owner occupancy up 30%​

• Club Wyndham Ocean Boulevard — owner occupancy up 35%​

​

We will continue to closely monitor opportunities to help more owners get on vacation. Your owner website is your best resource for the latest information on which resorts and peak travel periods are being prioritized for timeshare owner usage.​

________________________________________________________
The email continued with suggestions for upcoming holidays/destinations and then referred to the recent "owners' meeting" with a link to view the broadcast recording. I appreciated all of this info. Hope others received it as well.

 

[chapjim]

I received an email from Club Wyndham yesterday, 10/20/21. Since I don't always get the same emails as others have posted, I thought I'd share here, the most pertinent points from this one:
________________________________________________________

Prioritizing Owner Reservations ​

What started as a pilot earlier this year has helped more timeshare owners stay at the most sought-after destinations during the busiest holidays and events. We have seen some impressive examples of owners taking advantage of the prioritization opportunities, such as:​

​

Fourth of July Holiday Period:​

• Club Wyndham Bonnet Creek — owner occupancy up 19%​

• Club Wyndham Riverside Suites — owner occupancy up 18%​

​

Labor Day Holiday Period:​

• Club Wyndham Park City — owner occupancy up 30%​

• Club Wyndham Ocean Boulevard — owner occupancy up 35%​

​

We will continue to closely monitor opportunities to help more owners get on vacation. Your owner website is your best resource for the latest information on which resorts and peak travel periods are being prioritized for timeshare owner usage.​

________________________________________________________
The email continued with suggestions for upcoming holidays/destinations and then referred to the recent "owners' meeting" with a link to view the broadcast recording. I appreciated all of this info. Hope others received it as well.

Wyndham has to make a better argument for restrictions than this. The owner-occupancy increases could be nothing more than people getting out of their homes and going places.

It is totally misleading to compare July and September 2021 with July and September 2020, which probably had the lowest owner-occupancy rates ever. Let's compare 2021 with 2019.

Wyndham execs shouldn't be spiking the football over these statistics.

 

[kaljor]

It is totally misleading to compare July and September 2021 with July and September 2020, which probably had the lowest owner-occupancy rates ever. Let's compare 2021 with 2019.

These are the same figures they quoted at the Annual Meeting a few weeks ago, and at that point they did clearly state that these figures were compared to 2019 and not 2020

 

[chapjim]

These are the same figures they quoted at the Annual Meeting a few weeks ago, and at that point they did clearly state that these figures were compared to 2019 and not 2020

Okay, thanks for that. That makes more sense.

Odd that the email doesn't mention that. I'm sure I'm not the only one who had the same question.

 

[Sandi Bo]

I received an email from Club Wyndham yesterday, 10/20/21. Since I don't always get the same emails as others have posted, I thought I'd share here, the most pertinent points from this one:
________________________________________________________

Prioritizing Owner Reservations ​

What started as a pilot earlier this year has helped more timeshare owners stay at the most sought-after destinations during the busiest holidays and events. We have seen some impressive examples of owners taking advantage of the prioritization opportunities, such as:​

​

Fourth of July Holiday Period:​

• Club Wyndham Bonnet Creek — owner occupancy up 19%​

• Club Wyndham Riverside Suites — owner occupancy up 18%​

​

Labor Day Holiday Period:​

• Club Wyndham Park City — owner occupancy up 30%​

• Club Wyndham Ocean Boulevard — owner occupancy up 35%​

​

We will continue to closely monitor opportunities to help more owners get on vacation. Your owner website is your best resource for the latest information on which resorts and peak travel periods are being prioritized for timeshare owner usage.​

________________________________________________________
The email continued with suggestions for upcoming holidays/destinations and then referred to the recent "owners' meeting" with a link to view the broadcast recording. I appreciated all of this info. Hope others received it as well.

And what do these numbers really tell us?

What was total occupancy compared to previous years?
What percentage of the occupancy rates were EH in the past?

"There are lies, damned lies and statistics."

 

[rickandcindy23]

And what do these numbers really tell us?

What was total occupancy compared to previous years?
What percentage of the occupancy rates were EH in the past?

"There are lies, damned lies and statistics."

I was going to say that these should be higher. So what are they bragging about?

Did you know that 78% of statistics are made up on the spot?

 

[KimmieM]

I received an email from Club Wyndham yesterday, 10/20/21. Since I don't always get the same emails as others have posted, I thought I'd share here, the most pertinent points from this one:
________________________________________________________

Prioritizing Owner Reservations ​

What started as a pilot earlier this year has helped more timeshare owners stay at the most sought-after destinations during the busiest holidays and events. We have seen some impressive examples of owners taking advantage of the prioritization opportunities, such as:​

​

Fourth of July Holiday Period:​

• Club Wyndham Bonnet Creek — owner occupancy up 19%​

• Club Wyndham Riverside Suites — owner occupancy up 18%​

​

Labor Day Holiday Period:​

• Club Wyndham Park City — owner occupancy up 30%​

• Club Wyndham Ocean Boulevard — owner occupancy up 35%​

​

We will continue to closely monitor opportunities to help more owners get on vacation. Your owner website is your best resource for the latest information on which resorts and peak travel periods are being prioritized for timeshare owner usage.​

________________________________________________________
The email continued with suggestions for upcoming holidays/destinations and then referred to the recent "owners' meeting" with a link to view the broadcast recording. I appreciated all of this info. Hope others received it as well.

This explains why rooms have been available on the busier holiday weekends. Glad to hear Wyndham is proactively helping owners book for personal use.

 

[rickandcindy23]

This explains why rooms have been available on the busier holiday weekends. Glad to hear Wyndham is proactively helping owners book for personal use.

If they were available for me as a "mega renter" within 60 days, they were available to you. I don't have priority over inventory within 60 days, but I do get discounts.

 

[HitchHiker71]

And what do these numbers really tell us?

What was total occupancy compared to previous years?
What percentage of the occupancy rates were EH in the past?

"There are lies, damned lies and statistics."

The level of detail they are quoting isn't published publicly AFAIK - so there's not any way to validate the statements - at least not over a specific holiday weekend and specific to owner occupancy. The CWA POS does contain occupancy rate data for the vast majority of resorts - but I don't have a recent copy of the CWA POS with a 2020 or 2021 publish date - if anyone does - please send it to me.

Here's an exerpt from the 5/1/2018 CWA POS and what I can see for 2017 occupancy rate data - I'm highlighting WBC resort for reference since this is one of the resorts mentioned:

 

[Sandi Bo]

The level of detail they are quoting isn't published publicly AFAIK - so there's not any way to validate the statements - at least not over a specific holiday weekend and specific to owner occupancy. The CWA POS does contain occupancy rate data for the vast majority of resorts - but I don't have a recent copy of the CWA POS with a 2020 or 2021 publish date - if anyone does - please send it to me.

Here's an exerpt from the 5/1/2018 CWA POS and what I can see for 2017 occupancy rate data - I'm highlighting WBC resort for reference since this is one of the resorts mentioned:

View attachment 41320

Thanks for the information. To me it will be interesting, if the data is available, to see how the occupancy rates compare to this year when restrictions are in place. In the end, I really don't care much, as in I don't think it effects me one way or another. But it amazes/surprises me the comments made about this. I see a lot of confused people, mostly to Wyndham's advantage, but some angry because they really don't understand (they are angry when they should not be, IMO). I am referencing some comments I've seen on FB as well as here. And totally my opinion, of course.

I also ponder this... when Wyndham states this:
• Club Wyndham Bonnet Creek — owner occupancy up 19%

Is that an total percentage increase or a percentage of the 2019 numbers. For example, say owner occupancy is 50% in 2019 (I have no idea what it actually was, just using 50% as an example). Does that mean 2021 was 69% (50+19) or is it a 19% increase over 2019 which would be a 9.5% net increase and the number would be 59.5% Easy to throw numbers around and daze and confuse folks. Wyndham math may not be all that strait-forward, but the daze and confuse seems to sell a lot of timeshares.

 

[Eric B]

I was going to say that these should be higher. So what are they bragging about?

Did you know that 78% of statistics are made up on the spot?

That may be true, but only 38% of those are believed to be accurate….

 

[Jethro37]

Is that an total percentage increase or a percentage of the 2019 numbers.

The way it reads and in all likelihood it's the latter. i.e. 2021 percent = 2019 percent x 1.19

Which could be going from 30% to 35.7%

 

[lost patience]

I’m utterly frustrated with Wyndham’s implementation and management of the “owner priority” dates. I've called a few times just to keep a pulse on how the 2 allowed guests are being tracked. I know very well that I've used "one" of my "two" for 2021. I have heard all kinds of answers from the VCs. One told me I had not used any because they removed the older months from the list, so she could not see them any longer. Another told me that as my guest checked in on a Thursday it did not count. They all state there is no "count" listing on our "accounts". The VCs have no idea as they were manually comparing my reservations to the owner priority list posted on the web site. The Thursday check in is just so utterly wrong. I sent feedback via the website and in addition I sent an email to the Michael Brown email. I NEVER received a response. What other options do we have to get Wyndham’s attention? Wyndham can spend a lot of time and energy making these lists and creating some kind of “search” to ferret out and then cancel offenders. What can we do to help them realize that they need better documentation of use of the 2 GPs/year as well as improved education of the Vacation Counselors.

 

[Sandi Bo]

I’m utterly frustrated with Wyndham’s implementation and management of the “owner priority” dates. I've called a few times just to keep a pulse on how the 2 allowed guests are being tracked. I know very well that I've used "one" of my "two" for 2021. I have heard all kinds of answers from the VCs. One told me I had not used any because they removed the older months from the list, so she could not see them any longer. Another told me that as my guest checked in on a Thursday it did not count. They all state there is no "count" listing on our "accounts". The VCs have no idea as they were manually comparing my reservations to the owner priority list posted on the web site. The Thursday check in is just so utterly wrong. I sent feedback via the website and in addition I sent an email to the Michael Brown email. I NEVER received a response. What other options do we have to get Wyndham’s attention? Wyndham can spend a lot of time and energy making these lists and creating some kind of “search” to ferret out and then cancel offenders. What can we do to help them realize that they need better documentation of use of the 2 GPs/year as well as improved education of the Vacation Counselors.

I 100% agree with you. VC's making stuff up has always been a problem. As far as the owner priority, I have had them tell me my reservation wasn't okay, read them the information we have available and convinced them it was okay, and been told I don't need to do anything, everything will be okay. But no warm fuzzies here, surely there has to be some type of indicator that a reservation is okay (or not). Hearing people have had 'overrides' after pleading their cases, Wyndham has to somehow have a way to mark a reservation safe or not, and yet so much confusion.

 

[paxsarah]

It seems like this (the 2 safe guest certificates) should have some prime real estate on the Benefits Summary page.

 

[CO skier]

We have seen some impressive examples of owners taking advantage of the prioritization opportunities, such as:

Fourth of July Holiday Period:
• Club Wyndham Bonnet Creek — owner occupancy up 19%
• Club Wyndham Riverside Suites — owner occupancy up 18%

Labor Day Holiday Period:
• Club Wyndham Park City — owner occupancy up 30%
• Club Wyndham Ocean Boulevard — owner occupancy up 35%

And what do these numbers really tell us?

What was total occupancy compared to previous years?
What percentage of the occupancy rates were EH in the past?

"There are lies, damned lies and statistics."

The way it reads and in all likelihood it's the latter. i.e. 2021 percent = 2019 percent x 1.19

Which could be going from 30% to 35.7%

Except Wyndham Bonnet Creek is probably booked as close to 100% for the July Holiday Period as it ever gets. Same for Park City at Labor Day. That would mean the 19% and 30% increases are "for real."

Suggesting that Bonnet Creek is only 50% occupied for July 4th or Park City is only 30% occupied for Labor Day to try to minimize the effects of the owner priority policy is just making up some irrelevant math.

 

[Sandi Bo]

We have seen some impressive examples of owners taking advantage of the prioritization opportunities, such as:

Fourth of July Holiday Period:
• Club Wyndham Bonnet Creek — owner occupancy up 19%
• Club Wyndham Riverside Suites — owner occupancy up 18%

Labor Day Holiday Period:
• Club Wyndham Park City — owner occupancy up 30%
• Club Wyndham Ocean Boulevard — owner occupancy up 35%





Except Wyndham Bonnet Creek is probably booked as close to 100% for the July Holiday Period as it ever gets. Same for Park City at Labor Day. That would mean the 19% and 30% increases are "for real."

Suggesting that Bonnet Creek is only 50% occupied for July 4th or Park City is only 30% occupied for Labor Day to try to minimize the effects of the owner priority policy is just making up some irrelevant math.

These are owner occupancy rates, not overall occupancy rates. I said it would be nice to see the actual occupancy rates.

 

[CO skier]

These are owner occupancy rates, not overall occupancy rates. I said it would be nice to see the actual occupancy rates.

Fair point, but is it reasonable or an exaggeration (you know, one of "those kinds" of statistics) to suggest Bonnet Creek was only 50% owner occupied and Park City was only 30% owner occupied during these holidays in 2019 to make the de minimis math work out?

 

[paxsarah]

Fair point, but is it reasonable or an exaggeration (you know, one of "those kinds" of statistics) to suggest Bonnet Creek was only 50% owner occupied and Park City was only 30% owner occupied during these holidays in 2019 to make the de minimis math work out?

I think the point, rather than trying to suggest that the hypothetical owner-occupancy rates were accurate, is just to say that Wyndham is being vague enough about their percent increases that we don't really know the concrete impact.

 

[chapjim]

Fair point, but is it reasonable or an exaggeration (you know, one of "those kinds" of statistics) to suggest Bonnet Creek was only 50% owner occupied and Park City was only 30% owner occupied during these holidays in 2019 to make the de minimis math work out?

Does anyone really think that Wyndham would have told us if the numbers had shown a decline or a de minimis change?

Does anyone really think that Wyndham is above manipulating data?

 

[Ty1on]

Thanks for the information. To me it will be interesting, if the data is available, to see how the occupancy rates compare to this year when restrictions are in place. In the end, I really don't care much, as in I don't think it effects me one way or another. But it amazes/surprises me the comments made about this. I see a lot of confused people, mostly to Wyndham's advantage, but some angry because they really don't understand (they are angry when they should not be, IMO). I am referencing some comments I've seen on FB as well as here. And totally my opinion, of course.

I also ponder this... when Wyndham states this:
• Club Wyndham Bonnet Creek — owner occupancy up 19%

Is that an total percentage increase or a percentage of the 2019 numbers. For example, say owner occupancy is 50% in 2019 (I have no idea what it actually was, just using 50% as an example). Does that mean 2021 was 69% (50+19) or is it a 19% increase over 2019 which would be a 9.5% net increase and the number would be 59.5% Easy to throw numbers around and daze and confuse folks. Wyndham math may not be all that strait-forward, but the daze and confuse seems to sell a lot of timeshares.

I'm pretty sure it's a percentage increase (current occ - prior occ / prior occ)

As far as the CWA Occ table shown by HitchHiker, that really doesn't tell any story with respect to the owner occ increase claim, because the table represents occupancy across all guest types: Owner, guest of owner, extra holidays, RCI, etc. The idea is that if owner occ is up 19%, some other category is dropping.

 

[chapjim]

I'm pretty sure it's a percentage increase (current occ - prior occ / prior occ)

As far as the CWA Occ table shown by HitchHiker, that really doesn't tell any story with respect to the owner occ increase claim, because the table represents occupancy across all guest types: Owner, guest of owner, extra holidays, RCI, etc. The idea is that if owner occ is up 19%, some other category is dropping.

Why not show raw data? How many owners checked in at [resort name] for Week X in 2019? How many owners checked in at [resort name] for Week X in 2021? What is the difference in raw numbers? What was the percentage change?

 

[Ty1on]

Why not show raw data? How many owners checked in at [resort name] for Week X in 2019? How many owners checked in at [resort name] for Week X in 2021?

You know the answer to this question LOL

 

[chapjim]

You know the answer to this question LOL

Yeah, I think I do! <grin>

Since Wyndham didn't give any really useful information, what does that tell us about Wyndham (other than being good at spinning data)?

 

[HitchHiker71]

I think the point, rather than trying to suggest that the hypothetical owner-occupancy rates were accurate, is just to say that Wyndham is being vague enough about their percent increases that we don't really know the concrete impact.

I can always make the ask on the owner occupancy rates statements referred to in the owners meeting and now in the follow up email recently sent.

In fact, let’s start a feedback bullet list and a list of follow up questions. The SVP just emailed me asking for collective feedback loops on the annual owners meeting, so now is the time to list out our feedback bullets. I’m on my phone right now so my ability to provide a list is limited, but if anyone else wants to make the effort to start a bullet list please do.


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