Need assistance planning a visit to Italy

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Accessible Venice (Disability Travel) | Venice for Visitors

From Venice for Visitors: Venice wasn't built with wheelchair travel in mind, but it's more accessible for handicapped tourists than you might think.

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[Carolinian]

Pompeii is the best single thing in Italy, imho. You can day trip it from Rome or it can be your shore excursion from Naples.

Don't miss the Vatican. Period.

I agree that Venice is a must see, but only once and only for 2-3 days. It's good that it's your first stop because you will be jet lagging.

Make your train reservations in advance; DW and I got some very poor advice from our hotel concierge and we ending up standing on the train from Venice to Florence because we hadn't reserved seats.

I agree on Pompeii. It is an easy train ride from Rome. There are lots of walking tours, but I prefer getting a decent printed guide and walking around on your own.

In Venice, you can see a lot riding the vaporettos, but the older boats with the best seats in the bow for seeing the sites are going out of service.

In Rome, I usually stay around the Terminii train station, which has frequent trains to and from the airport, as well as trains to get to places outside of Rome that one wants to see, and a metro station to get around in Rome. There are lots of hotels and restaurants in the area.

 

[beejaybeeohio]

So much for you to digest here, DaveNV! So just 2 brief tips from me-

Sistine Chapel- IDK if there is a direct way to get there without going through the huge Vatican Museum first. That trek is unpleasant enough due to heat and throngs of tourists. Try to find a tour that takes you only to the chapel.

Rick Steves Italy Travel forum: https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/italy. I've only started using this forum and it has been invaluable for planning our upcoming trip to France and Switzerland.

 

[DaveNV]

So much for you to digest here, DaveNV! So just 2 brief tips from me-

Sistine Chapel- IDK if there is a direct way to get there without going through the huge Vatican Museum first. That trek is unpleasant enough due to heat and throngs of tourists. Try to find a tour that takes you only to the chapel.

Rick Steves Italy Travel forum: https://community.ricksteves.com/travel-forum/italy. I've only started using this forum and it has been invaluable for planning our upcoming trip to France and Switzerland.

Excellent ideas. Thanks!

And yes, as you say, lots to digest. I'm starting to get clearer broad ideas of what and where, but need to fine tune it with specifics. That's where the challenges lie - so many options!

Dave

 

[klpca]

Well, just read through this thread. What a trip (the thread). Lol.

I am no expert but on our one and only trip (which was supposed to be the first of many) we did some things that made the trip better.

Venice - yes, it is a wandering place. We wandered everywhere and had a fantastic time. We did a gondola ride just for the picture, but we have fun memories too. Our gondolier, dressed in the traditional way, smoked like a stack and talked on his cell phone throughout. We still laugh about it. We are glad that we have the picture. We stayed at the Hotel Bucintoro (for a map reference) and from a walking perspective it felt kind of far away when we returned every night. With some mobility issues, I would get closer to the center of Venice because you are on foot in a lot of Venice. Fwiw (this could be stale info) we booked this place because when bundled with airfare on Expedia the hotel was essentially free - i.e air+hotel on Expedia was about $100 more than airfare alone booked on the airlines website. With Expedia bookings, I always hold my breath. The customer service is usually a 3/10 on a good day.

Florence - our best stay. We stayed at a B&B run by a couple, one of whom was a chef who provided a delicious breakfast every morning and would prepare a dinner for you for a few extra $$. They were a font of knowledge and they are the reason that we walked around town on Notte Bianca, and were able to have fabulous pizza at a hole in the wall place that we wouldn't have found otherwise. It was just across the street from Boboli Gardens. http://gigliobianco.it/ We took a bus tour to the Chianti region that left from Florence. It was just ok - bus tours aren't my thing, but at least we were able to see that region.

Manarola - This is the place that I thought we would like the best because of the hiking and natural beauty, but for us, the Italian cities were the star of the show. With mobility issues, Cinque Terre would be a nightmare, imo. It was beautiful and wow, this place provide some funny stories, but I don't think that it would work for you guys (not that you were considering it anyway). This was the place where we hiked in rain that was falling so hard that we were soaked to the skin, rode the train back to Manarola from Riomaggiore standing the whole way because we were so wet that we were dripping , and then discovering why every room at our hotel was stocked with a bottle of Scotch. I hate scotch, but there is truly nothing better when you are soaked to the bone and freezing.

Rome - I truly dreaded the thought of Rome. It seemed big, dirty, and crowded but I was doing this for my husband. It was my absolute favorite place in Italy. The energy of this city is amazing. We hired a private guide for our first day. It was relatively expensive but worth every penny. We saw a lot (almost too much for me to be honest) but we skipped lines, and went to places that we wouldn't have gone on our own. We walked, used the metro and buses so that we would be comfortable with them. (A subway is no big deal, but buses in an unfamiliar city are always a challenge for us because we never know where our stop is). He took us to a food hall so that we could shop try a bunch of different foods, plus we saw other more familiar places throughout the day. I highly recommend a private guide in a large city. He made the remainder of our stay so much better because we felt a bit more familiar with things. (Btw we thought that it was great seeing the Pantheon).

My European must haves - we rarely stay in a hotel, preferring a small B&B. We try to find a place with a host that speaks English, just in case you need help - like when my metro pass wouldn't work in Rome (answer, just go through the turnstile with my husband, lol). Hiring a guide in a large city is helpful for getting your bearings or at least taking a hop-on, hop off bus on day 1. Research how to skip the line at popular places - either with a guide or a small group. At Versailles, we skipped an hour+ long line by booking a €10 tour. Win/win - we got a private tour before the gates opened and skipped the line. We also try to find audio walking tours - someone mentioned Rick Steves - his audio tour was especially good for the Accademia Gallery in Florence. I also agree about prebooking train tickets between cities - it is just nice to know that you have a seat. FYI, for those of us from cities that don't have subways, the front cars are first class, the ones behind the first two or three are second class. Ask me how I know

I am sure that you will have a fabulous time! One of these days we will get back there. In the mean time, I will travel vicariously though the rest of you.

 

[ScoopKona]

but need to fine tune it with specifics. That's where the challenges lie - so many options!

This doesn't have to be hard, either. A map. Either one of the useful online maps (the Trenitalia map is ideal) or find/print a paper map of the area of Italy you'll be visiting. (Venice to Naples, or even Florence to Naples.)

Draw a circle in pen around every place the cruise ship is going to stop. You have no control over this, so you can use ink. And then pencil every place you'd like to see on your own. Go nuts. Every place on your wish list assuming time and money are no object.

Now see if there are any patterns. If you have a cluster somewhere on the map, that's where you should focus most of your time and energy -- both in the planning and execution. Finally, erase the outliers and stragglers from your map.

 

[DaveNV]

This doesn't have to be hard, either. A map. Either one of the useful online maps (the Trenitalia map is ideal) or find/print a paper map of the area of Italy you'll be visiting. (Venice to Naples, or even Florence to Naples.)

Draw a circle in pen around every place the cruise ship is going to stop. You have no control over this, so you can use ink. And then pencil every place you'd like to see on your own. Go nuts. Every place on your wish list assuming time and money are no object.

Now see if there are any patterns. If you have a cluster somewhere on the map, that's where you should focus most of your time and energy -- both in the planning and execution. Finally, erase the outliers and stragglers from your map.

The ship departs at 5:00PM from Civitavecchia, stops the next day in Naples, then departs at 6:00PM and goes on to Greece. This is why we're planning the land portion of Italy ahead of the cruise, and limiting what we'll try to do. In Naples we're just doing a tour to Pompeii. Then we'll probably head back to the ship because I expect my husband will be exhausted from all the walking on uneven surfaces and cobbles. That's especially difficult for him. This isn't a race.

The choices for you aren't hard because you've been there, apparently multiple times. You've learned for yourself and how you travel what works and doesn't work for you. The choices for me are vast, because I haven't been there under these circumstances, and I'm traveling with someone with physical challenges. I'm trying to learn a lot in a short time so I can make smart decisions. But I also have no intention of making inappropriate choices, like overdoing things one day, and having my husband laid out for a day or two afterwards to recover. Slow and steady is what works for us.

I'll definitely check a map before committing to anything. Thanks for the suggestion.

Dave

 

[Glynda]

It's the sunlight and just the atmosphere. It's a brief stop but I'm glad I saw it.

Yes, and the wonder of it comes with knowing its history.

 

[Glynda]

Excellent ideas. Thanks!

And yes, as you say, lots to digest. I'm starting to get clearer broad ideas of what and where, but need to fine tune it with specifics. That's where the challenges lie - so many options!

Dave

The 7:30 AM tour directly through the Vatican will be the best. As I understand it from the Facebook group I told you about, you will be first in and ahead of others. No back up standing around waiting for other groups to move on. And you will have more time in the Sistine Chapel without being shoulder to shoulder from wall to wall.

 

[DaveNV]

The 7:30 AM tour directly through the Vatican will be the best. As I understand it from the Facebook group I told you about, you will be first in and ahead of others. No back up standing around waiting for other groups to move on. And you will have more time in the Sistine Chapel without being shoulder to shoulder from wall to wall.

This is very helpful. It'd be worth it to take that tour time. The standing around waiting is the worst.

Dave

 

[ambere]

Italy is so magical. I'd recommend getting a Rick Steves book on traveling Italy. Some great tips for seeing the best, or more local things, many of which are free, and you can see what interests you. You're going to some great cities:

Florence: the museums, the views from Piazza Michelangiolo

Rome: of course the Vatican, the catacomb tours are cool; as much as you can see

Venice: the cathederals and museums are great, but honestly, last time, we just walked all around, bought a ticket on the Vaporetto and did a "Grand Canal Cruise" listening to Rick Steves' free audio tour; cheap and so interesting.

For your extra week, I have to say we loved the Italian seaside towns, and the Cinque Terra are amazing. So is Capra and/or Iscchia.

Have a wonderful trip!

 

[ScoopKona]

I'll definitely check a map before committing to anything. Thanks for the suggestion.

I'm suggesting a map to see if you can find any kind of pattern you can leverage. (Everyone knows what Italy looks like.)

You can't see it all in one trip. You can't see it all in a dozen trips. And unless there are some bucket list items which can't be missed, you can skip entire cities. Nobody is going to see it all -- not even Italians. Last time we traveled with our Italian friends, it was the first time ever they visited Parma -- and they live a few hours away by train. And they're around your age. (Probably in the same ballpark, at least.)

I think the worst-case scenario is that someone is injured because Italy is not particularly friendly to people with mobility issues. Weight and distance increases the degree of difficulty. Italy can also be fairly compact -- with "most of the best stuff" all in an area about the size of South Florida. That's what I'm hoping you'll be able to leverage. And their train system is outstanding -- and so much more convenient than anything in the US. It is possible to make this a "not have to lug bags around constantly" excursion, rather than an expedition. My wife and I travel like this, even though we don't have mobility issues -- because it's far more relaxing.

 

[Glynda]

Italy is so magical. I'd recommend getting a Rick Steves book on traveling Italy. Some great tips for seeing the best, or more local things, many of which are free, and you can see what interests you. You're going to some great cities:

Florence: the museums, the views from Piazza Michelangiolo

Rome: of course the Vatican, the catacomb tours are cool; as much as you can see

Venice: the cathederals and museums are great, but honestly, last time, we just walked all around, bought a ticket on the Vaporetto and did a "Grand Canal Cruise" listening to Rick Steves' free audio tour; cheap and so interesting.

For your extra week, I have to say we loved the Italian seaside towns, and the Cinque Terra are amazing. So is Capra and/or Iscchia.

Have a wonderful trip!

Yes, Italy is magical! I can't wait to go back.

The problem with most of the seaside towns are that they are straight up cliffs. Lots of steps or steep hills with the railroad at the top of the cliff and the sea at the bottom. I am so glad that we saw Cinque Terra when we did, in October, and before the post COVID tourist craze and knee replacements looming. Still, even then, it was not without a lot of tourists. Just not like it is in the summer.

 

[Glynda]

I'm suggesting a map to see if you can find any kind of pattern you can leverage. (Everyone knows what Italy looks like.)

You can't see it all in one trip. You can't see it all in a dozen trips. And unless there are some bucket list items which can't be missed, you can skip entire cities. Nobody is going to see it all -- not even Italians. Last time we traveled with our Italian friends, it was the first time ever they visited Parma -- and they live a few hours away by train. And they're around your age. (Probably in the same ballpark, at least.)

I think the worst-case scenario is that someone is injured because Italy is not particularly friendly to people with mobility issues. Weight and distance increases the degree of difficulty. Italy can also be fairly compact -- with "most of the best stuff" all in an area about the size of South Florida. That's what I'm hoping you'll be able to leverage. And their train system is outstanding -- and so much more convenient than anything in the US. It is possible to make this a "not have to lug bags around constantly" excursion, rather than an expedition. My wife and I travel like this, even though we don't have mobility issues -- because it's far more relaxing.

Some of your suggestions and manner of travel are how I wish to travel to Italy alone or with others who have done the grand tour of famous cities and landmarks. We did our last trip of 21days, flying with carry-on luggage only and from Milan by train as we moved from place to place. We even had to pack for two black tie events. We did have hotel reservations at each of our destinations, Milan, Bellagio on Lake Como, Portifino, and Venice staying on Giudecca. On our last day in Italy, we left Venice on the Venice Simplon Orient Express to London. It was a very special trip. However, the next trip will be to smaller, less visited, towns with rail stations. We will do day trips as you seem to. Our schedule will be far more flexible than in the past and we will stay longer. Hopefully at least a month. I doubt I can do so without reservations for lodging though.

But for Dave's purposes, as stated, I don't see your method as feasible.

 

[ScoopKona]

But for Dave's purposes, as stated, I don't see your method as feasible.

And I think the linear trip is going to be excruciating. It would be one thing if they were starting on one end of the boot and ending at the other. But they're going to see the grand tour sights. This is a north-south distance of about 200 miles. There's nowhere in this area that is more than 90 minutes away on an inexpensive train. (And I'm hoping they get the pass so they don't have to buy tickets each time -- for the time savings more than anything else. Tickets are relatively cheap for what you get.) They could, if they wanted, unpack once in some central location -- preferably where the station is mere steps from the hotel/AirBnb -- and start each day with a train ride. Most places, the train station is right in the middle of everything. (Siena is a notable exception -- definitely get a taxi/uber.) Get off the train and it's straight to the grand tour sights.

Best of all, the places they talk about visiting are all on the fast central line. (There are three fast lines -- one on each coast, and the central from Milan to Rome. After Rome, that line is so close to the Tyrrhenian line that they may as well just merge them. (But redundancy is a good thing in transportation.) When I go there, I manage our entire trip from a place not far from Genoa. Anything in Liguria, Emilia-Romagna and Tuscany is an easy trip from my Italian headquarters. Anything more south than that, and I'll set up a new headquarters where Lazio and Campania meet. The goal is always a largish town or smallish city -- something tourists aren't drawn to. But also a place that has hundreds of daily arrivals and departures at the station. That way, depending on the weather and what we feel like doing, we can strike out in a logical direction and be there in 90 minutes or less. Usually less. And it doesn't matter when we arrive at the station because there's going to be a departure every 15 minutes.

Last time we visited we had just one Airbnb. I could do the trip they're describing with two BnBs and a hotel for the Venice bit. It sure beats the "we're falling behind on our timetable and we need to make this train because we need to check in at the next place" routine. I'll never understand why so many people are in love with that kind of trip.

 

[pedro47]

You will need Euros or a major credit card in the City of Rome. Because many establishments in Rome will not take/honor the American dollar..

Suggestion only. I would stay two (2) days in Rome prior to the cruise; just to visit many of the historical sites and the Vatican City

Final suggestion you will need a good wide hat to cover your head from the hot sun and some good sunscreen.

Please enjoy the City of Rome and its many Excellence restaurants.

 

[nightnurse613]

Don't forget AirBnB. I stayed in one on my last trip to Rome. I like to get out and mingle with the natives.

 

[1Kflyerguy]

You have received some solid advice so far.

We used Walks of Italy earlier this year for tours of both the Vatican and the Colosseum. We booked the early "skip the line" tours for both, and there was still some lines, they were not too bad.

We stayed near the Pantheon in Rome, and enjoyed the location.

 

[Glynda]

And I think the linear trip is going to be excruciating. It would be one thing if they were starting on one end of the boot and ending at the other. But they're going to see the grand tour sights. This is a north-south distance of about 200 miles. There's nowhere in this area that is more than 90 minutes away on an inexpensive train. (And I'm hoping they get the pass so they don't have to buy tickets each time -- for the time savings more than anything else. Tickets are relatively cheap for what you get.) They could, if they wanted, unpack once in some central location -- preferably where the station is mere steps from the hotel/AirBnb -- and start each day with a train ride. Most places, the train station is right in the middle of everything. (Siena is a notable exception -- definitely get a taxi/uber.) Get off the train and it's straight to the grand tour sights.

Best of all, the places they talk about visiting are all on the fast central line. (There are three fast lines -- one on each coast, and the central from Milan to Rome. After Rome, that line is so close to the Tyrrhenian line that they may as well just merge them. (But redundancy is a good thing in transportation.) When I go there, I manage our entire trip from a place not far from Genoa. Anything in Liguria, Emilia-Romagna and Tuscany is an easy trip from my Italian headquarters. Anything more south than that, and I'll set up a new headquarters where Lazio and Campania meet. The goal is always a largish town or smallish city -- something tourists aren't drawn to. But also a place that has hundreds of daily arrivals and departures at the station. That way, depending on the weather and what we feel like doing, we can strike out in a logical direction and be there in 90 minutes or less. Usually less. And it doesn't matter when we arrive at the station because there's going to be a departure every 15 minutes.

Last time we visited we had just one Airbnb. I could do the trip they're describing with two BnBs and a hotel for the Venice bit. It sure beats the "we're falling behind on our timetable and we need to make this train because we need to check in at the next place" routine. I'll never understand why so many people are in love with that kind of trip.

What I don't understand is when they have a desire to spend several (three) days in each city, why would they want to board a train each morning and evening to go into and out of that city where they want to be? Who wants to ride a train back to a hotel in another town when they have had a hot day touring only to turn around the next morning and head back to the same place? Instead they could be having a relaxing morning Italian breakfast of caffe and croissants and before dinner drinks in the piazza of their choice! Yes, twice they throw their things in their bags and move to the next city. But once there they have around the clock to do as they wish.

 

[Ken555]

What I don't understand is when they have a desire to spend several (three) days in each city, why would they want to board a train each morning and evening to go into and out of that city where they want to be? Who wants to ride a train back to a hotel in another town when they have had a hot day touring only to turn around the next morning and head back to the same place? Instead they could be having a relaxing morning Italian breakfast of caffe and croissants and before dinner drinks in the piazza of their choice! Yes, twice they throw their things in their bags and move to the next city. But once there they have around the clock to do as they wish.

Yup, totally correct. This is what I normally do, though for 3-5 nights in each location. I don’t like long tourist days, so being where I want to be is ideal.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[clifffaith]

Yes, and the wonder of it comes with knowing its history.

Sitting for four hours during Cliff’s infusion was made less boring today by stumbling upon Rick Steves at the Parthenon and other parts of the Roman Empire. I saw the Parthenon 51 years on a school trip ago and would definitely see it again after having Rick remind me of its age and beauty. I’m hoping we’ll find Antiques Roadshow at 1pm and Rick at 2pm the next five weeks too!

ETA PANTHEON!

 

[ScoopKona]

What I don't understand is when they have a desire to spend several (three) days in each city, why would they want to board a train each morning and evening to go into and out of that city where they want to be? Who wants to ride a train back to a hotel in another town when they have had a hot day touring only to turn around the next morning and head back to the same place? Instead they could be having a relaxing morning Italian breakfast of caffe and croissants and before dinner drinks in the piazza of their choice! Yes, twice they throw their things in their bags and move to the next city. But once there they have around the clock to do as they wish.

Because most of their train trips will be in the half-hour/hour vicinity. Central Italy is not by any means big.

And that means no bags or a small backpack 90% of the trip, instead of having haul everything every 2-3 days. Fewer reservations means fewer potential problems means more time enjoying. Less lugging means less chance of injury means more time enjoying.

I'm guessing you (and others) either don't like trains or don't use them often. The 30-60 minutes on the morning train is GREAT. Breakfast, coffee, beautiful scenery, and read up on the area we're visiting. This is hardly wasted time.

And I can't stress this enough, when "home" for the evening, the traveler has the advantage of experience. They already know the gelato place they like. They know the wine bar which treats them like old visiting friends, they know the menus at a few restaurants -- and know what they want to try next. You never get to experience that if you're hopping to a new place every few days.

Since I use the same headquarters time after time, arrival is the easiest day of the trip. Just get our stuff to where we're staying. We already know where we want to eat, where to shop, and best of all -- a few of these people know us. "Ahh! Signor Scoop! Sei tornato! (You have returned)." You can't put a price on that. I like to see things, sure. But I like to experience things more. And what I want to experience most is a stress-free, pain-free, relaxed visit -- where I'm treated like a long-lost friend. Not like sheep to be sheared.

 

[Carolinian]

@DaveNV, if your travel agent is no help, I would recommend the Lonely Planet guides. On our first five plus week trip to Europe (after not living there,) we used Let's Go guides, because we were by ourselves in our early 30s. On the next, 15 years later, we did use a travel agent (because we were visiting people, too, so needed someone to work out the Point A to Point B logistics, around the dates that different people would be in Point A and Point B....and it was beyond my time capacity) and had a 9 year old with us--but we supplemented with the Lonely Planet guides, which we found had a similar sensibility to Let's Go, but geared to the next age (and price point) bracket. We went with independent, smaller hotels both times--none of the large, American chains. (Although you might want to, if you've got hotel points to burn.)

My only concern about Venice is the mobility issue....I consider to be the most pedestrian-friendly city in Europe, but that also comes with a lot of walking (and more small ups and downs steps than other cities.)

I found Rome in the summer to be exhausting, so we limited our time there on those trips. If you are planning to catch a cruise out of Rome, give yourself *plenty* of time to get to the cruise port in Civitavecchia. It's just a train ride away from Rome, but still a train ride. And sometimes, trying to catch a cab from the heart of Rome in the summer to the train station can be way more time-consuming than one might think. (I might be tempted to book a hotel room there the night before the cruise leaves.)
https://www.booking.com/city/it/civitavecchia.html

In full disclosure, the way I feel about Florence is tinged by the fact that we were coming from the Italian Alps, and it was SPRING and we were expecting it to be at least warm-er. Instead, it was gray and cold and it even SNOWED while we were there. Which will probably not be the case in summer. (Upside? Not as many crowds in March/April, LOL!)

I concur on Lonely Planet. If I am going somewhere I am not familiar with, I rely on Lonely Planet and Rough Guides series guidebooks. They are head and shoulders above the rest. If the InYourPocket series has a city guide for somewhere I am going, that is another one that is one of my standbys. The internet site I find most useful on accomodations is booking.com, and they often have B&B's as well as hotels.

 

[DaveNV]

Because most of their train trips will be in the half-hour/hour vicinity. Central Italy is not by any means big.

The high speed train from Venice to Florence is about 2 hours and 15 minutes. The high speed train from Florence to Rome is about 2 hours and 30 minutes. Not sure where you're getting this half hour or one hour schedule. The train schedules on the ticket selling sites are pretty specific.

The bottom line is we only change hotels twice, several days apart, as Glynda says. If we're staying near the train station, we walk across the street (or whatever) board the train, relax and enjoy the scenery during the one ride, and arrive in the next city a few hours later. From that location we find the next hotel booked nearby, check in, and we're done. We do that two times over about a ten day period. Unless you know something I'm not seeing, I don't see what is so excruciating about that. We've done much worse changing timeshares every week on multi-week trips for years.

Dave

 

[ScoopKona]

The high speed train from Venice to Florence is about 2 hours and 15 minutes. The high speed train from Florence to Rome is about 2 hours and 30 minutes. Not sure where you're getting this half hour or one hour schedule. The train schedules on the ticket selling sites are pretty specific.

The bottom line is we only change hotels twice, several days apart, as Glynda says. If we're staying near the train station, we walk across the street (or whatever) board the train, relax and enjoy the scenery during the one ride, and arrive in the next city a few hours later. From that location we find the next hotel booked nearby, check in, and we're done. We do that two times over about a ten day period. Unless you know something I'm not seeing, I don't see what is so excruciating about that. We've done much worse changing timeshares every week on multi-week trips for years.

Dave

I'm talking about the loop from Pisa to Florence. And the loop from Rome to Naples. You haven't nailed down any specifics. But a cruise ship day in Naples and Venice aside, you're talking about a 200-mile swath of the skinny part of Italy.

Like I suggested, pencil all the places you think you want to see. And then see if there's a pattern. And train from one central area. From my home base, Florence is about as far as I'm willing to go from HQ. That's 2 hours. But all that means is I take an early train in the morning, and I'm there at 10am -- just as everything is opening. There is absolutely no advantage to staying IN Florence compared to what I'm doing. I'm spending less on lodging and food. I'm getting better lodging and food. And I have the advantage of spending the bulk of my trip in one town -- mornings and evenings. That's just huge. Having a home away from home is better than being a pair of gypsies -- even if it means some extra train time. It won't mean any extra train money, because that's what rail passes are for.

The fast trains in Italy hit 220mph. You're really not thinking this through.

And if you're just on the cusp of "this is further than I want to train it in a day," THAT is when you move your HQ to the next most central location. Frankly, I think you're trying to make this unnecessarily difficult.

I've tried to explain it in a Nevada way -- imagine if every place in Nevada, SoCal and Arizona was linked by rail. Tickets cost next to nothing. And anything from Bakersfield to Flagstaff, Mesquite to Laughlin was a maximum of two hours away. But most places are 30-60 minutes away. That's your trip, as you are currently describing it. You really only need one or two places to hang your hat.