Marriott Aruba Ocean Club Owners Being Ripped Off By Marriott - READ IF AN OWNER

marksue · Nov 6, 2008

you are right about 218 rooms.

As for the comment previously about $450. That represents an estimate of 5 million that I believe Marriott owes us. I don’t want to sue; I want this settled in a way that we the owners are treated fairly. I have said this in numerous posts. If Marriott refuses to due anything I certainly won’t take it and a lawsuit is the only option we would have left.

Just think if we had that 5 million and it was earning interest for us, our maintenance fees would be more inline. Why should a 1 bedroom at the Ocean Club only be less than $100 then the cost of a 2 bedroom in the surf club.

I have seen the posts here from people regarding Frank not returning calls and emails; I have also received many emails stating the same thing. What is he afraid of? As an owner you always new if you had a question or concern Allan would listen to you and get back to you in a timely manner. These days Frank and the board have become silent. They don’t even want anything on the website.

I think we should seriously consider getting ourselves a new board that will work for us, and not against us. Also we need a board which will be open and haring, not hiding so owners are still in the dark. With all that is going on you have to wonder why the board is so quiet. Is it that they can not argue the facts that are posted here?

To this day most owners still do not know about the new fees. Wait till that happens and the sh.... hits the fan.

esk444 · Nov 6, 2008

I've been involved in many class action lawsuits. The attorneys get about 30 to 40% of the settlement, so you aren't going to get $450 per person. Also, the money would go directly to the class members (less atty fees), not the timeshare. So you are still going to have a high MF and/or special assessment to fix the place up.

Also, the class action attorneys aren't really in it to fight for the long haul. They just want a quick settlement and then move on the next case. That's why they pressure their clients to accept worthless settlements like $100 in coupons for future stays in Marriott hotels that can only be used in non-peak times. They still get the 30% to 40% of the nominal value of those coupons even if only a fraction of them are ever redeemed. So the attorneys extract millions from Marriott, while the plaintiffs get coupons that they probably could have found on retailmenot.com without a lawsuit.

Kelly&Sean · Nov 6, 2008

What I am missing in all this is what happen to Allan? As far as I know, the president was not up for election. I actually signed the proxy statement to give Allan the authority to vote for me. Please help me out here. I have spoken to Allan a number of times prior to this and thought that he was doing a great job and was truly representing us.

lovearuba · Nov 6, 2008

class action suits

I was interested in a class action suit but I think we should get a quorum and ask the board or Marriott directly what their response is to our concerns. I bought Marriott because of the name, it was reputable. If given the choice I ask for a Marriott. I'm not always the most complimentary about them but lets see if we can turn this around and get Marriott to work with us. To be quite frank I prefer the Ocean club over any other resort in Aruba.

Lets try to work this out, lets see if we can get a formal response from the board. We need an official response letting us know what they think about our concerns. What can they do to satisfy our concerns before this gets any further out of hand. Lets think of ways to cut down on that maintenance fee. There must be a way to work with Marriott on this one.

marksue · Nov 6, 2008

I agree with you. As I have said all along a suit is the last action if we get no response from Marriott. I would love the opportunity to work this out. I don't have a lot of confidence in the board as they came across as Marriott puppets.

Based on how Frank has acted, not getting back to anyone, I wonder if there is a way we can get Allan back as president. I do believe he would be better for us owners. At least he would post updates on the web, not take them off.

I have not spoken to Allan since I saw him at the owners meeting so I have no idea if he would even want it.

In the meantime I would like to collect email addresses of all owners so if we can get an owners committee togehter to address these issues, we can keep everyone in the loop.

Marriott this is an open invite to reach out talk with the owners and be fair with us.

OCsun · Nov 6, 2008

All Ocean Club units were inspected today!

The morning, a letter was left under the door which read. "Please be informed on Thursday 6th of November 2008 our Chief Engineer will be accessing all the villa units of the Aruba Ocean Club. This inspection is in connection with the upcoming villa refurbishment. . . . . the duration of this inspection will only take about 3 to 5 minutes per unit."

The first question that came to mind was - shouldn't a complete assessment of all the villa's have been completed prior to a decision to proceed with the refurbishment?

Pam

lovearuba · Nov 7, 2008

Lets work with Marriott

Marksue has made some good points and there are so many of us that are upset over the prices. Lets see if we can work up a letter that asks Marriott to help us turn this situation around. We can try and address all of our concerns but lets give Marriott the opportunity to speak from their perspective. We should try the board first because they represent us. If that doesnt work we can look to replace them.

If you are interested in trying this approach let me know and we can work together putting something together for owner signatures. No one really really wants to sell their unit. We bought these units because we love the Marriott name and the Ocean club. Lets try and turn this situation around.

I bought this unit with what little inheritance I got when my mom passed away. I wanted to use the money for something fun after spending two years fighting an awful disease. I planned to leave it to my beautiful daughter who looks forward to going to Aruba every year. I'm sure others have similar stories and reasons why they are not ready to throw in the towel.

Send me a private message if you are interested in working on the letter. Thanks

OCsun · Nov 7, 2008

lovearuba said:
Marksue has made some good points and there are so many of us that are upset over the prices. Lets see if we can work up a letter that asks Marriott to help us turn this situation around. We can try and address all of our concerns but lets give Marriott the opportunity to speak from their perspective. We should try the board first because they represent us. If that doesnt work we can look to replace them.

Send me a private message if you are interested in working on the letter. Thanks

You are right - let' work this out! Did Allan Cohen step down? Pam

lovearuba · Nov 7, 2008

I take it I can sign you up

Send me a pm with your email. As for Allan, he is still on the board and I think they have some limit on how long you can be president.

tlwmkw · Nov 7, 2008

I am not an owner at this resort but have read the many posts with interest. I can see why everyone is frustrated with the situation but I imagine Marriott are also not happy that the roof has failed, and the other problems. My one thought is that you should be careful threatening law suits for a number of reasons.
1. You said Marriott agreed to pay 43% of the cost of the new roof- if they leave the resort and no longer manage then will this money be off the table? If so you will be in an even worse position.
2. Do research on class action law suits and you will find that you, as owners, will probably not get much out of a settlement even if you do win.
3. The reason that information has disappeared from the Web site is probably because of the threats of law suits- as soon as you threaten them they circle the wagons and hunker down. It becomes much harder to negotiate if you are threatening them
4. Consider if you owned a condo at the beach- the management company (if you use one to rent it out when you are not there) will not give any assistance if there is a problem with the roof or windows or anything else. You pay 100% of the costs. Marriott could easily take that attitude and offer no assistance with the costs so you want to be careful how you demand things. I know this from personal experience- that is why I like the timeshare model just because there is someone else handling all the day-to-day costs and management issues (which can be very significant). I think it is worth the management fee not to do that myself.
5. Is the resort under US or Aruban laws? This will be very important if you do sue because it may have a significant effect on the outcome.

Regardless what happens I do hope this works out in a way that everyone is happy with the results.

Dave M · Nov 7, 2008

tlwmkw said:
5. Is the resort under US or Aruban laws? This will be very important if you do sue because it may have a significant effect on the outcome.

I'm virtually certain that U.S. law would not apply. Marriott has one or more separate international corporations that own the unsold units at the non-U.S. timeshares and manage those resorts.

Jay12 · Nov 7, 2008

My understanding is that Allan was voted out as President. It takes three votes and Marriott cast one and the existing Board Members cast the other two.
The Treasurer asked for some financial assisstance and I was one of about forty that volunteered. She sent us some financial information to look at and it was very amateurish. I quickly saw why we are in the poor financial shape we are in regarding the accessment and concluded that the Treasurer's position is a ceremonial position.

lovearuba · Nov 7, 2008

Not sure it matters

Hi
Im not sure what difference it makes on why Allan is no longer around. What is important is resolving our issues. I would like to try to work it out with Marriott first. If you would like to support that effort let me know. If I dont get a lot of response I will just let it alone. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks for those who have responded.

Kelly&Sean · Nov 7, 2008

Allan's Removal

I think that it is important for people to know what happened to Allan. I personally felt that he was looking out for the best interests of the timeshare and its owners. I can not understand how he can just be removed by the other officers when there are thousands of owners with an investment in this property that get no say. Further, if these officers did vote him out, again for me personally, it does not say a lot for them. Allan was fighting with Marriott to protect our investment and he gets voted out. That's a problem which would seem to indicate that these current officers are not looking out for us but Marriott. We need to establish who these officers are looking out for.

marksue · Nov 7, 2008

I agree with you. I have had concerns with the board since the annual meeting. If what is stated about Allan is true then I am really get angry with with this board of ours. I think this shows that the board is not looking out for the owners. We need representation of 10% of all sold rooms. If an owner owns more than 1 room then the number of rooms they own will go against the 10% of members we need to recall the board.

I know we are trying to get an owners group together to work with Marriott, to come up with an agreeable resolution to the issues addressed in this blog. In additon, if they did force Allan out I believe we need to ask all board members except Allan to resign or we start a recall effort.

Please get the word out to other owners so we can start moving forward. In the meantime we the owners will try to get an audience with Marriott to discuss a solution to these issues.

lovearuba · Nov 8, 2008

Need help for a letter to Marriott

Hi
I am not dismissing concerns over Allans removal. I voted for him and I also was very happy with him representing us. But right now he is not the president and there does not appear to be anyone helping get our concerns addressed. Maintenance fee bills will probably be coming out next month, we need to act now.

Given this I am suggesting we the owners put together a letter to the board and to Marriott letting them know how upset we are and that we want them to explain to us what they are doing to resolve our concerns.

The bottom line is none of us feel we should be paying the huge increase in maintenance fees. We thought our maintenance fees would be used for refurbishnents and now we find out they will be charging us special assessments on top of maintenance fees. I for one think that maintenance fee is too high now and dont want to see it increased. I will swallow the fact that a special assessment is going to happen and I'll have to find a way to pay it. I would like to have some more oversight on the finances for these maintenace fees. I shouldnt be paying $500 more this year than last year for maintenance. I recommend that we ask Marriott to reduce that and keep it in line with the fees for the surf club since we area already being assessed the special assessments.

If the board does not respond we can move to remove them and put Allan back if that is what he wants. If I were him I would probably want to walk away from this ugly situation. But lets at least try to get an answer because right now we have two options, we can try to work through them or we can support Marksue and start a class action suit. I know Marksue has plenty of names to get that going but it does take years and we have not officially heard Marriott's point of view.

Because this thread is getting so long and people are responding to comments that are no longer relative I am opening a new one titled, "Aruba Ocean Club Owners, Sign up for a letter to Marriott regarding Maintenance Fees".

marksue · Nov 8, 2008

Lovearubas suggestion is the way to go. As I ahve said allalong a lawsit is a last ditch effort. I support the letter effort 100% and will work with Lovearuba on getting this done.

Dave M · Nov 8, 2008

All discussion and comments regarding writing a letter to Marriott should be posted in this separate thread..

JimC · Nov 8, 2008

Older resorts cost more to maintain then new resorts. And there is probably some economy of scale; so smaller resorts are likely to cost more than larger resorts on a per unit week.

marksue · Nov 9, 2008

Jim to some extent you may be right. But there is no justification of a 35% increase in 1 year. If Marriott had been paying thier fare share of the space they have been using for the Surf Club sales office and for the damages due to the subpar building they purchased then our fees would not be as high as they are.

THe issue here is the Ocean Club board is not representing the owners but being Marriott Puppets. Based on comments here it seems like the board forced out the president who everyone has respected and felt like he was looking out for our best interest.

JimC · Nov 9, 2008

Mark - I used to own AOC and sold it for a profit when I realized you could visit it for less than owning it. Thought is was a great island with a nice but aging resort, but a disappointing development of the Surf Club site -- in my opinion too much resort for the footprint. I have no quarrel with your frustrations in this situation.

My point is that you need a very tight rationale if you are going to put your HOA and Marriott at task. Simply comparing OC with SC or any other resort is not persuasive.

It would seem that your best approach is an objective presentation of the facts; an analysis of where process and disclosure did not follow the rules/governing documents and/or best timeshare governance and operating practices; and a well thought out list of remedies. It may be helpful to pay for an adviser who is familiar with this industry and these types of situations. I am not advising litigation, but rather someone who can counsel you on your rights in this situation and the process to follow. Engaging in frank discussion is a good initial step since the owners, the HOA and Marriott all need to live with each other after this is all over.

lovearuba · Nov 11, 2008

Judy from my threat

Hi
Can you go into the other thread and respond to Judy, give her some information on what happenend at the owners meeting. Thanks

modoaruba · Nov 11, 2008

my 2 cents

Hi,

To introduce ourselves,we own 4 weeks at the OC.
We bought 2 weks in'98 and the other 2 '02.

When we were given the sales pitch ,the numbers made sense that it was not for an investment but a prepaid vacation which was OK with us back then.
By now we would be ahead of the game.
BUT ARE WE???
No one ever mentioned the fees that we now have to face.
If this was an investment yes it would be but now we have a loss.

Try to play the Marriott game of what we could do with our weeks.
We could trade for points. Well having a 1 BR gives us 90,000 pts.
Wow where could you go of equal value?

Renting? It worked out great for us using Marriott to rent through. They must have figured out that we made more than our maintainance fees so they changed that system. Now only they can make the money.

Selling? Try it. Not in this economy. Selling through Marriott gives them all of our gains. If we could break even that would be great.

We placed a week through Redweek as someone suggested.What a shocker to see that our units could be had for as little as $500/week!!!

Why buy the cow for a glass of milk.

So much for our introduction.

As for the existing Board---Marriott puppets???

lovearuba · Nov 11, 2008

HMM the sales pitch was just that

Hi
I've always asked on this site why Marriott allows sales people to misrepresent the truth. I had the same speel and could go on and on about what a wonderful place Michelle (a guy) pitched to us. First the points, we got 100K and I couldnt believe I couldnt rent my same unit for that. In addiition, once I got enought points (it took years), I could not find one week in the entire year where I found an opening using reward points, there was plenty of availability just not with points. I called Marriott and they just wouldnt help, they saw availability in both the surf and ocean and they knew those units would go unrented but they still wouldn't help.

When I bought this unit, I didnt know that Marriott couldnt be trusted. Trust is huge, I trusted Marriott. Why would I think a company as well known and respected as Marriott would allow that type of deception. :cheer:

We also tried the rental angle, it was a joke. If my husband could have reached through the phone the person on the other end would be missing his head.

Well so we were also taken as many folks are. Up until last year I really did enjoy the timeshare. I brought friends and family with me. I have a two bedroom and wouldnt think of inviting someone and asking them to pay. Its so different now. Its just an ugly story.

I want Marriott to step up to the plate and fix this, they contributed to it and they need to address it.

Our first attempt will be a letter to the board. After that we are likely to have to take additional steps. I'm in it for the long hall. My daughter is going to college next year and I will have plenty of time on my hands to keep this active if I need to.

vincenzi · Nov 11, 2008

Several Questions About Board Members

I am confused as to why all the e-mail addresses of our board members have been removed from the Marriott Aruba Ocean Club website. Who removed them? Marriott? If they represent us (the owners), why aren't we able to communicate with them? It doesn't seem right to me.