Introducing HGV Max — Our New Membership Program (Official announcement from HGVC)

[Mongoose]

So DRI owners who are members of HGV Max will have access to HGVC resorts at six months. Isn’t this going to make it much harder for HGVC owners to book club reservations six months or less? If that is the case, this isn’t good news for HGVC members who don’t want to join HGV Max. Am I missing something?

No you nailed it. It will destroy open access.

 

[Mongoose]

During the original press conference announcing the merger, the HGV leadership said this merger would allow them to roll out a trust much faster than creating their own trust, shaving a a few years off the process. I was sort expecting the HGVMAX product to be a trust, but so far there is no real indication they are going that route.

I think main goal with a trust is the ability to smaller incremental sales. with deeded weeks you can't sell less than a week. With a pure trust you sell people a points in small chucks..

It could be that going forward they will only sell trust points, like Hyatt and HICV.

 

[HuskerATL]

This is correct... I recently attended a "membership update."
First, I was told that open season was going away for "resale owners." (Which I still think is BS... because unlike HH point conversion, Rule book, even after2022 max update, does not say that benefit is subject to change. maybe we won't have access to Diamond open season, and they are using confusion to pressure people.)

They said that normally I will need to "legitimatize" my timeshare by upgrading it, and then pay the $7,000 HGVMax fee... but only today I can simply upgrade. She said I would receive a $120,000 buy-back credit for my one-bedroom ocean premier Grand Islander, but would need to upgrade to something $50,000 more expensive. Essentially, swap out to a new deed for an extra $50k to become a "legitimate" owner to get access to HGVMax.
She also said Hilton never negotiates even one cent on price, so $120,000 property will never sell for$119,999.99, and so forth. For a while, she dangled a $15,000 upgrade to a two-bedroom, which is still crazy, because essentially I'd be paying an extra $15,000 for just 2,000 extra club points (old system; 3200 new system), but would have access to Max... but she called whoever and they declined because it's a minimum $50,000 upgrade. Think she only lowered it because I was ready to walk out, so she kept me there for extra 3 hours and then went back to a $50,000 upgrade, which is beyond ridiculous.

I really don't like how they treat us like "second-class citizens." Other than not having eee elite status, that's the only difference, other than now we cannot enter HGVMax. I think they're trying to use this to pressure us into "upgrading" at crazy prices.

Here's a question: Why can't we just buy into a Diamond property on the resale market and access that inventory that way? If someone is owner of DGI + HGVC, will those somehow be combined eventually into one account? Or will you basically have to always pay separate club dues?

Well, that is bunk. They offered it to me for $25k and a lady in the Facebook group just got it for a $17k upgrade so they can do what they want, if they want to as long as new money is coming in. I guess the only other issue could be the sales office, regional ones can sell from anywhere so maybe the one you talked to couldn't. But they can do it for less than $50k.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

This is correct... I recently attended a "membership update."
First, I was told that open season was going away for "resale owners." (Which I still think is BS... because unlike HH point conversion, Rule book, even after2022 max update, does not say that benefit is subject to change. maybe we won't have access to Diamond open season, and they are using confusion to pressure people.)

They said that normally I will need to "legitimatize" my timeshare by upgrading it, and then pay the $7,000 HGVMax fee... but only today I can simply upgrade. She said I would receive a $120,000 buy-back credit for my one-bedroom ocean premier Grand Islander, but would need to upgrade to something $50,000 more expensive. Essentially, swap out to a new deed for an extra $50k to become a "legitimate" owner to get access to HGVMax.
She also said Hilton never negotiates even one cent on price, so $120,000 property will never sell for$119,999.99, and so forth. For a while, she dangled a $15,000 upgrade to a two-bedroom, which is still crazy, because essentially I'd be paying an extra $15,000 for just 2,000 extra club points (old system; 3200 new system), but would have access to Max... but she called whoever and they declined because it's a minimum $50,000 upgrade. Think she only lowered it because I was ready to walk out, so she kept me there for extra 3 hours and then went back to a $50,000 upgrade, which is beyond ridiculous.

I really don't like how they treat us like "second-class citizens." Other than not having eee elite status, that's the only difference, other than now we cannot enter HGVMax. I think they're trying to use this to pressure us into "upgrading" at crazy prices.

Here's a question: Why can't we just buy into a Diamond property on the resale market and access that inventory that way? If someone is owner of DGI + HGVC, will those somehow be combined eventually into one account? Or will you basically have to always pay separate club dues?

Wow! 50k? I would have walked immediately. The only thing true in what the rep said is that they don't negotiate on the unit price. I believe they are limited to corporate price lists. However they do a lot of gymnastics (aka negotiating) with trade-in price, minimum revenue amount ($10 - $20k) and Bonus points. Bonus points are at the discretion of the Rep.

 

[dioxide45]

No, I want those to come directly into HGVC.

I would think the only way they could do that would be to give them affiliate status like the SW Florida, Bay Club and a few other resorts. I just don't see that happening though because it would give current HGVC owners access to them and they want to be able to sell that access. Thus getting them available through Max somehow.

 

[Mongoose]

This is correct... I recently attended a "membership update."
First, I was told that open season was going away for "resale owners." (Which I still think is BS... because unlike HH point conversion, Rule book, even after2022 max update, does not say that benefit is subject to change. maybe we won't have access to Diamond open season, and they are using confusion to pressure people.)

They said that normally I will need to "legitimatize" my timeshare by upgrading it, and then pay the $7,000 HGVMax fee... but only today I can simply upgrade. She said I would receive a $120,000 buy-back credit for my one-bedroom ocean premier Grand Islander, but would need to upgrade to something $50,000 more expensive. Essentially, swap out to a new deed for an extra $50k to become a "legitimate" owner to get access to HGVMax.
She also said Hilton never negotiates even one cent on price, so $120,000 property will never sell for$119,999.99, and so forth. For a while, she dangled a $15,000 upgrade to a two-bedroom, which is still crazy, because essentially I'd be paying an extra $15,000 for just 2,000 extra club points (old system; 3200 new system), but would have access to Max... but she called whoever and they declined because it's a minimum $50,000 upgrade. Think she only lowered it because I was ready to walk out, so she kept me there for extra 3 hours and then went back to a $50,000 upgrade, which is beyond ridiculous.

I really don't like how they treat us like "second-class citizens." Other than not having eee elite status, that's the only difference, other than now we cannot enter HGVMax. I think they're trying to use this to pressure us into "upgrading" at crazy prices.

Here's a question: Why can't we just buy into a Diamond property on the resale market and access that inventory that way? If someone is owner of DGI + HGVC, will those somehow be combined eventually into one account? Or will you basically have to always pay separate club dues?

Is that in peso’s or Monopoly money?

 

[Nowaker]

He said deeds are too expensive and challenging to manage.

More challenging to manage for HGVC - that's for sure. More expensive for them - probably too.

But in a grand scheme of things - it's less expensive for owners (and their HOA) to own & operate. Deeded ownership only benefits owners, and not HGVC.

 

[dioxide45]

More challenging to manage for HGVC - that's for sure. More expensive for them - probably too.

But in a grand scheme of things - it's less expensive for owners (and their HOA) to own & operate. Deeded ownership only benefits owners, and not HGVC.

Trusts are great because they can pass on all the costs to the trust and have the trust owners cover those costs as part of the administrative costs of the trust.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

+1 Trusts are also great (for the developer) because they can throw all of their crap deeds for mud weeks they cannot sell in it, guarantee MF payments by owners on those deeds (vs. owners walking away), and make it appear like there is a lot of deed availability to potential buyers.

Trusts are typically more expensive maintenance fee-wise because you are paying for all of those crap mud week deeds.

It is harder to walk away from a trust if you suffer health or black swan event because multi-state deeds in a trust make it difficult to enforce state real estate foreclosure consumer protection laws. And they can also change program rules more easily because it is really unclear what you really own.

For these reasons, I say "no thank you" to trusts and will only own deed or RTU for a specific week even if it has more limited flexibility.

 

[Tamaradarann]

Thisis an HGVC group so everyone here has been discussing joining the HGV Club from the HGVC costs and perspective. Does anyone know what they are selling the Diamond Members as far as costs. Is it buying an HGVC property, or a Diamond Property, or paying $7K + 1K/property owned? How does it work for the trust owners where "a property" is not owned?

 

[WORLD TRAVELER]

I found this post in an HGVC Facebook group that I belong to from someone that posted a summary of an owner update presentation they attended. This is the clearest explanation of the new program that I have seen so far but it is from sales update, so info may be taken as grain of salt:


There will be 3 active reservation systems moving forward so draw 3 columns on your note pad. System 1 - Legacy HGVC, System 2 - HVC Max, System 3 - Diamond Legacy.

Under System 1, this is our current HGVC portfolio and Mtce Fee structure. No new properties will be added to this portfolio s of 4/4/22. These will remain as deeded properties. Reservation windows remain the same. Mtce fees also remain with the deed same as today. If you opt to stay legacy only, the current portfolio as of 4/4/22 will be the only properties available to reserve in the legacy HGVC system. Nothing new will be added here as all new efforts will be put into the new HVC Max program.

System 3- Diamond Legacy. Will function same as System 1 for legacy Diamond folks.

System 2 - HVC Max. This is the new reservation system for our new combined company. All future investments will go into this system. Portfolio will contain all properties. This is a Right to Use system vs. a deeded property system. All new sales will be in Max system only. All sales presentation will be focused on Max system as legacy system is no longer being promoted. You will still buy points in the new system, but without deeds, the mtce fee will be fixed at 22 cents per point. The reservation window for the Max system is 6 months; however, you will have Search Requests (only available to Elite and above owner) that you can use to book 10 months out. These Search Request are basically reservation request. As properties come available at the 10 month out date, they will process the outstanding search requests and ask the owners if they are still interested. You will have a 24hr or so window to confirm. Once confirmed, you get the reservation. Those without search request will not be able to book until 6 months out. The rub here is that legacy owners only will have a 9 month window for HGVC properties and 12 for your home week. So, a HVC Max elite search request will have a 10 month window and will be processed before the properties are available in HGVC legacy system. Max owners can have several outstanding Search Requests pending at all times based on their elite level. As one is fulfilled, another can be added. So, based on this understanding, Max Elite Owners will have a 1 month advantage over Legacy owners at HGVC properties via these Search Requests (10 months vs. 9 months); but Legacy owners will still have the 12 month window for our home week property. So, I own a 2PP at Ocean Tower. I could still book that out 12 months as my home week, but if I wanted a 1BX at Ocean Tower, I may lose out to a Max Search Request booking.

You can get into Max several ways. 1. Buy new points in Max. 2. upgrade your current deed, for a limited time, retain your deed as legacy owner and mtce fee (which we did). This will get us access into the Max system and also keep our HGVC legacy features like deeds, mtce fees, home week. 3. Pay a fee to buy into Max. As for Elite tiers, there is a new status structure in Max as well, which offers more Search Requests per level. No fees in the new MAX system, but dues does increase to $281 per year currently. If you want access to any Properties other than today’s current HGVC portfolio, then you must move into the HVC Max system.

Reservation Priority is as follows:

1. HGVC legacy home week 10-12 months out
2. HGVC Max Elite Search Requests all properties 10 months out
3. HGVC legacy at Legacy properties 9 months out
4. HGVC Max non elite all properties 6 months out

 

[GT75]

but it is from sales update, so info may be taken as grain of salt

And that is exactly how I am taking this until the rules are stated in written form either on the website or via an email from HGV.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

@WORLD TRAVELER Thank you for sharing. This is by far the clearest explanation I have heard. Why haven't they announced this in writing? When do you anticipate that they will formally announce these details? The April announcement has been problematic because no one knows what to believe or understands what Max even is.

I am also curious as to whether your weeks automatically deposit into MAX (can you go back and reserve in Legacy if you don't find the properties you want available in MAX), or you deposit into MAX every year like MVC DPs and there is no going back to legacy for the year? or is it flexible e.g. look in one system or the other for inventory dynamically. (Akin to the two systems HGV had in 2015 for reservations.)

 

[BingoBangoBongo]

.

System 2 - HVC Max. This is the new reservation system for our new combined company. All future investments will go into this system. Portfolio will contain all properties. This is a Right to Use system vs. a deeded property system. All new sales will be in Max system only. All sales presentation will be focused on Max system as legacy system is no longer being promoted. You will still buy points in the new system, but without deeds, the mtce fee will be fixed at 22 cents per point.

That would be equivalent to a MF of over $.35/pt under the old HGVC point structure and is more than double what I’m paying now and 2.6x higher, renting out a ski week I own EOY.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

IMHO...if what @WORLD TRAVELER posted is true, HGV Legacy sounds similar to MVC deed enrollment in Destination Points (DP). The key is how they handle inventory.

I see 3 possible scenarios: (my apologies for the long post)

1) Firewall the inventory into a separate trading pool from HGVC and Diamond Legacy ("MVC DP Model"): Max owners will have access to different weeks in Max than Legacy Systems because owners deposit their weeks into MAX. With buy-in requiring a minimum $7k purchase or an upgrade, this approach could take years to build up decent inventory and will be full of unsold crap mud weeks from HGVC And Diamond that HGV throws into the system.

Clues:

• An unhappy Max upgrade buyer on Facebook said they logged into MAX and "they could only see a few properties" in MAX which implies this approach #1 with separate inventory.
• "No new properties in Legacy for HGVC and Diamond inventory after 4/4/22"
• MVP DP has an exchange system that pulls inventory from Deed owners who opt in their points for a use year and from DP points trust into a common reservation exchange pool. Same model?
• Future Trust Points only purchases @ .22 cents / point MF to pay for High cost mud weeks deposited into the trust. MVC DP has high MF trust points. That's all MVC sells now.

Under this scenario, Max Elite gets 10 months priority but it is not for regular HGVC Club inventory - it is for inventory that new and upgraded HGV and Diamond owners have enrolled after April 4, those who paid $7k MAX access this inventory, and unsold mud weeks aka "10 months in a small inventory pond." i.e. it will take a very long time for 10 month priority to matter. Unsold weeks and trade-ins will be deposited to the Max pool instead of the Legacy Pools slowly reducing inventory from legacy pools.

FWIW...It has taken MVC more than a decade to get 60% of their deed base to opt into DP exchange with MVC. And they gave free (not $7k) access to deed owners prior to 2010 when they announced. Plus MVC had no points trading system like HGVC so the value proposition to enroll was stronger. Vistana Flex has had similar slow build.

If this scenario is true, best to wait and let inventory build.

2) Set up MAX as an overlay to access existing inventory in HGVC and Diamond Legacy Plus Max trust points pools. This would be a good option and reason to buy into MAX Elite - 10 month reservations would matter.

Clues:

• " HGVC Max Elite Search Requests all properties 10 months out" (all properties of what? MAX pool? Max plus All HGV and Diamond Inventory Pools? This data point came from a sales rep so YMMV
• Unlike MVC's DP rollout, HGV is not giving elites and legacy deed owners free access to MAX, which could be implied that they don't need inventory to build a separate exchange pool.

3) Access both Legacy and MAX systems: Owners can look for inventory buy switching back and forth between systems and use their points where they deem best. This is similar to #2 but you would need to manually switch between systems to search inventory. Like #2 this might convince me to move to Max, Max would be the access into Diamond Legacy and Max trust points pools by opening the door at 6 months.

YMMV. These are just my observations and musings so far. I have not been to a presentation so learning from others. We need a lot more details in writing about how inventory is managed and how owners can access both Max and Legacy inventory pools.

 

[escanoe]

I am suspending any belief in these changes are happening until they are all in writing by HGVC. Is anyone actually being marketed a trust product now? To my knowledge everyone (on HGVC side) that is getting into HGVC Max now with deeds and that is what they are selling today.

There are 2 evidence points that do land significant credibility to the trust story, though.

1) @dayooper pointing out multiple times about the disappearance of units in the traditional HGVC ownership.

2) The official FAQ on HGV Max implying heavily that if there is future access to Embarc it will only be through HGV Max.

 

[iiderman]

I would think the only way they could do that would be to give them affiliate status like the SW Florida, Bay Club and a few other resorts. I just don't see that happening though because it would give current HGVC owners access to them and they want to be able to sell that access. Thus getting them available through Max somehow.

With this Max program existing elite members are the losers along with resales.. after spending all that cash being promised a better club with more destinations, they benefit zero from the merger! what HGV should do is reestablish the same relationship they had with embark years ago and make inventory available to all HGV legacy members..give early access to elites first, followed with access to the general membership at nine months and finally access into the six month pool for the rest including Max. That would be the right thing but I’m not holding my breath.

 

[HuskerATL]

I found this post in an HGVC Facebook group that I belong to from someone that posted a summary of an owner update presentation they attended. This is the clearest explanation of the new program that I have seen so far but it is from sales update, so info may be taken as grain of salt:


There will be 3 active reservation systems moving forward so draw 3 columns on your note pad. System 1 - Legacy HGVC, System 2 - HVC Max, System 3 - Diamond Legacy.

Under System 1, this is our current HGVC portfolio and Mtce Fee structure. No new properties will be added to this portfolio s of 4/4/22. These will remain as deeded properties. Reservation windows remain the same. Mtce fees also remain with the deed same as today. If you opt to stay legacy only, the current portfolio as of 4/4/22 will be the only properties available to reserve in the legacy HGVC system. Nothing new will be added here as all new efforts will be put into the new HVC Max program.

System 3- Diamond Legacy. Will function same as System 1 for legacy Diamond folks.

System 2 - HVC Max. This is the new reservation system for our new combined company. All future investments will go into this system. Portfolio will contain all properties. This is a Right to Use system vs. a deeded property system. All new sales will be in Max system only. All sales presentation will be focused on Max system as legacy system is no longer being promoted. You will still buy points in the new system, but without deeds, the mtce fee will be fixed at 22 cents per point. The reservation window for the Max system is 6 months; however, you will have Search Requests (only available to Elite and above owner) that you can use to book 10 months out. These Search Request are basically reservation request. As properties come available at the 10 month out date, they will process the outstanding search requests and ask the owners if they are still interested. You will have a 24hr or so window to confirm. Once confirmed, you get the reservation. Those without search request will not be able to book until 6 months out. The rub here is that legacy owners only will have a 9 month window for HGVC properties and 12 for your home week. So, a HVC Max elite search request will have a 10 month window and will be processed before the properties are available in HGVC legacy system. Max owners can have several outstanding Search Requests pending at all times based on their elite level. As one is fulfilled, another can be added. So, based on this understanding, Max Elite Owners will have a 1 month advantage over Legacy owners at HGVC properties via these Search Requests (10 months vs. 9 months); but Legacy owners will still have the 12 month window for our home week property. So, I own a 2PP at Ocean Tower. I could still book that out 12 months as my home week, but if I wanted a 1BX at Ocean Tower, I may lose out to a Max Search Request booking.

You can get into Max several ways. 1. Buy new points in Max. 2. upgrade your current deed, for a limited time, retain your deed as legacy owner and mtce fee (which we did). This will get us access into the Max system and also keep our HGVC legacy features like deeds, mtce fees, home week. 3. Pay a fee to buy into Max. As for Elite tiers, there is a new status structure in Max as well, which offers more Search Requests per level. No fees in the new MAX system, but dues does increase to $281 per year currently. If you want access to any Properties other than today’s current HGVC portfolio, then you must move into the HVC Max system.

Reservation Priority is as follows:

1. HGVC legacy home week 10-12 months out
2. HGVC Max Elite Search Requests all properties 10 months out
3. HGVC legacy at Legacy properties 9 months out
4. HGVC Max non elite all properties 6 months out

This is basically what we heard last week but shared much better than I did.

 

[letsgobobby]

That would be equivalent to a MF of over $.35/pt under the old HGVC point structure and is more than double what I’m paying now and 2.6x higher, renting out a ski week I own EOY.

If HGVC Legacy availability declines over time, resale deeds anywhere other than desirable locations will decline in value, too. Then they can Exercise ROFR at lower prices, and resell those units in Max. I guess that's good business in their part, especially if there are enough suckers willing to pay developer prices and now, Max MFs.

I have always wondered about the economics of resale. How can I buy a week for $1200 at location A and pay a MF of $1500 and reserve a week in a 2 BR in Hawaii and have the economics work out? I'm getting a deal that's too good to be true, who's footing the bill?

 

[Mongoose]

If HGVC Legacy availability declines over time, resale deeds anywhere other than desirable locations will decline in value, too. Then they can Exercise ROFR at lower prices, and resell those units in Max. I guess that's good business in their part, especially if there are enough suckers willing to pay developer prices and now, Max MFs.

I have always wondered about the economics of resale. How can I buy a week for $1200 at location A and pay a MF of $1500 and reserve a week in a 2 BR in Hawaii and have the economics work out? I'm getting a deal that's too good to be true, who's footing the bill?

The original developer purchaser footed the bill. You are paying for O&M. That’s why a smart resale buy is such a steal.

 

[Mongoose]

I was running the MF numbers last night for the US Collection for Sedona Summit. They are around $.21 per point. I pay $.14 for my Bay Club. I just don’t see HGVMax in my future at those fees, regardless of resale issues.

 

[dioxide45]

I found this post in an HGVC Facebook group that I belong to from someone that posted a summary of an owner update presentation they attended. This is the clearest explanation of the new program that I have seen so far but it is from sales update, so info may be taken as grain of salt:


There will be 3 active reservation systems moving forward so draw 3 columns on your note pad. System 1 - Legacy HGVC, System 2 - HVC Max, System 3 - Diamond Legacy.

Under System 1, this is our current HGVC portfolio and Mtce Fee structure. No new properties will be added to this portfolio s of 4/4/22. These will remain as deeded properties. Reservation windows remain the same. Mtce fees also remain with the deed same as today. If you opt to stay legacy only, the current portfolio as of 4/4/22 will be the only properties available to reserve in the legacy HGVC system. Nothing new will be added here as all new efforts will be put into the new HVC Max program.

System 3- Diamond Legacy. Will function same as System 1 for legacy Diamond folks.

System 2 - HVC Max. This is the new reservation system for our new combined company. All future investments will go into this system. Portfolio will contain all properties. This is a Right to Use system vs. a deeded property system. All new sales will be in Max system only. All sales presentation will be focused on Max system as legacy system is no longer being promoted. You will still buy points in the new system, but without deeds, the mtce fee will be fixed at 22 cents per point. The reservation window for the Max system is 6 months; however, you will have Search Requests (only available to Elite and above owner) that you can use to book 10 months out. These Search Request are basically reservation request. As properties come available at the 10 month out date, they will process the outstanding search requests and ask the owners if they are still interested. You will have a 24hr or so window to confirm. Once confirmed, you get the reservation. Those without search request will not be able to book until 6 months out. The rub here is that legacy owners only will have a 9 month window for HGVC properties and 12 for your home week. So, a HVC Max elite search request will have a 10 month window and will be processed before the properties are available in HGVC legacy system. Max owners can have several outstanding Search Requests pending at all times based on their elite level. As one is fulfilled, another can be added. So, based on this understanding, Max Elite Owners will have a 1 month advantage over Legacy owners at HGVC properties via these Search Requests (10 months vs. 9 months); but Legacy owners will still have the 12 month window for our home week property. So, I own a 2PP at Ocean Tower. I could still book that out 12 months as my home week, but if I wanted a 1BX at Ocean Tower, I may lose out to a Max Search Request booking.

You can get into Max several ways. 1. Buy new points in Max. 2. upgrade your current deed, for a limited time, retain your deed as legacy owner and mtce fee (which we did). This will get us access into the Max system and also keep our HGVC legacy features like deeds, mtce fees, home week. 3. Pay a fee to buy into Max. As for Elite tiers, there is a new status structure in Max as well, which offers more Search Requests per level. No fees in the new MAX system, but dues does increase to $281 per year currently. If you want access to any Properties other than today’s current HGVC portfolio, then you must move into the HVC Max system.

Reservation Priority is as follows:

1. HGVC legacy home week 10-12 months out
2. HGVC Max Elite Search Requests all properties 10 months out
3. HGVC legacy at Legacy properties 9 months out
4. HGVC Max non elite all properties 6 months out

Is seems that a lot of emphasis is being placed on Elite ownership here and how they may somehow pillage all the great inventory. They probably make up less than 5% of the total ownership base.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Is seems that a lot of emphasis is being placed on Elite ownership here and how they may somehow pillage all the great inventory. They probably make up less than 5% of the total ownership base.

And unlike MVC when they rolled out their DP program, HGV is not giving Elites and Legacy owners free access to MAX which sucks. I would expect Elites to have free access at a minimum.

Perhaps it is because the New Max contracts have updated (i.e. negative) terms on resale and other benefits which owners need to agree with? I would tread very carefully before signing. I would love for someone to provide a copy of the new Max contract (Personally Identifying details deleted) for Tuggers to read.

 

[HuskerATL]

And unlike MVC when they rolled out their DP program, HGV is not giving Elites and Legacy owners free access to MAX which sucks. I would expect Elites to have access at a minimum.

Perhaps it is because the New Max contracts have updated (i.e. negative) terms on resale and other benefits which owners need to agree with? I would tread very carefully before signing. I would love for someone to provide a copy of the new Max contract (Personally Identifying details deleted) for Tuggers to read.

I can tell you that there isn't much paperwork. When we almost upgraded to the Kohala Suites, the paperwork is sprinkled with Max language and we would agree to pay the $281 fee and $199/contract activation fee but that is about it.... With the promise of a future separate website giving us access to DRI and HGV. I guess that I can scan it and post, taking out personal info. Maybe folks would see something that I missed.

 

[dayooper]

@HuskerATL and @WORLD TRAVELER

I can see World Traveler’s post above how things will work. This makes sense. I will never trust what a timeshare salesman says, but this seems like it’s the way things will happen.

If I take what’s said above as how it will shake out, here’s my take.

1. The 10 month search function will sting, but won’t be very limiting to us legacy members. HGV Max members can only reserve a limited amount of trips and that’s based on their status. With the prices HGV is charging, the amount of search weeks won’t be too limiting and many members will go for the exclusive, high point resorts. Legacy members will have a hard time booking certain resorts, but places that can be booked now will probably be able to be booked then.

2. Resale points are very limited in Max. With the amount of searches based on your Elite (I know it’s called something else), resale points are only good for either extending stays or 6 month reservations. By basing the searches on retail points, resale points will struggle to be used where people want to go. As people buy into Max (dumb name, the marketing person who decided on that name should be fired), they will be wanting to sell their weeks back to HGV, putting more weeks into the system.

3. Existing Elite members do have an advantage, but they will pay for it. Either pay $7000 or buy more for more money. Not only that, but many of those deeds purchased by many elite were lower MF resorts. Will those owners still pay their lower MF’s or will they have to pay that outrageous $0.22 cost (not convinced that will be the cost as the salesman may have embellished to get the sale and the commission).

4. Scotland was a bigger deal than we knew. @HuskerATL made the best move they could have. Buying that many points to get elite at the cost they did was huge. If the goal was Max, then, for just over $18,000 (with the $7000 Max fee), the status came about as cheap as you can get it.

5. As more resorts are introduced, the legacy resorts will become less popular with Max. This is conjecture, of course but we all love the new, shiny places that HGVC will push as exclusive to them.

6. Owners of hard to book resorts that paid a premium to own there won’t be joining Max if they have to give up their weeks. Places like Oahu, Valdoro, and Hilton Head will want to keep those weeks.

Questions I still have:

1. How will legacy members of Max have their deeds dealt with? Will they have to turn them over? Will they have to pay the Max MF’s?

2. How will this effect Legacy members MF’s? Will they skyrocket or will they keep steady like the other system’s legacy members?

3. How will HGV deal with Max members that don’t want their points anymore? Will they have a buyback or return policy? Will there be a resale market?

4. Is Max a trust or a vacation club? If it’s a trust, when will it come around? If it’s a vacation club, where is the protection for members?

If you got this far in this beast of a post, thanks. It helps my thoughts when I can put them in writing. I’m sure there will be more questions as we learn more about Max.