Arriving Guest Information [merged]

[Fasttr]

Has anything changed for adding guest names to reservation when you are making a points reservations? I typically add the names when I make the initial reservation.

I believe that process will be unchanged. When doing so, the additional guest names also show on the Marriott confirm email you receive, so should be no problem if one of your guests arrive before you do (although if that is to occur, I usually reach out to the resort directly to let them know).

I believe the new form is targeted towards adding guests, and/or changing who's name the ressy is in, after the initial confirmation has been sent.

 

[igopogo]

I believe that process will be unchanged. When doing so, the additional guest names also show on the Marriott confirm email you receive, so should be no problem if one of your guests arrive before you do (although if that is to occur, I usually reach out to the resort directly to let them know).

I believe the new form is targeted towards adding guests, and/or changing who's name the ressy is in, after the initial confirmation has been sent.

If this remains possible, it suggests that the new policy is tightly aimed at those who make speculative bookings for future rentals. That would make sense, as I think this is where the points transfer abuse was taking place. I hope that’s true.

 

[Fasttr]

If this remains possible, it suggests that the new policy is tightly aimed at those who make speculative bookings for future rentals. That would make sense, as I think this is where the points transfer abuse was taking place. I hope that’s true.

I concur.

 

[dioxide45]

Has anything changed for adding guest names to reservation when you are making a points reservations? I typically add the names when I make the initial reservation.

When making a reservation with points, do you have to provide as much information as the new form is requesting?

 

[Fasttr]

When making a reservation with points, do you have to provide as much information as the new form is requesting?

Nope....just name for additional guests.

 

[WahooWah]

This is nonsense. It is almost 48 hours since I filled out the form and no confirmation email yet from Marriott. This should be a slam dunk class action lawsuit if they intend to radically move the goalposts like this.

 

[Superchief]

When making a reservation with points, do you have to provide as much information as the new form is requesting?

Previously, I could just add the names as I was completing my reservation process. I haven't done this for a few months, but I hope this process doesn't change.

 

[WahooWah]

Yes, you wouldn't use this form. You would just add guests to the room at checkin.

Did you get confirmation of the guest change after filling out the form last Wednesday? How long did it take?

 

[alexb]

I filled in form yesterday guest got confirmation yesterday but I have not received any confirmation.

 

[DanCali]

I filled in form yesterday guest got confirmation yesterday but I have not received any confirmation.

You will not get a confirmation because they likely removed your Bonvoy number from the confirmation and set the guest's email as the default email for confirmations.

In such a case, your "confirmation" is seeking the week drop out of your "My Trips" page on marriott.com

 

[jmhpsu93]

Funny that's it's easier to change guest info and Bonvoy number on an Interval trade than a MVC reservation.

 

[WahooWah]

I filled out the guest change form on Sunday. I had received no confirmation of the change earlier today so I called a VOA. They confirmed that the reservation was in the guest's name and attached to the guest's email and that I should not have received a confirmation. I asked the VOA to send me one. I then reached out to the guest and they said they had not received confirmation (checked their spam folder and everything). I had to then forward to the guest the confirmation email that the VOA forwarded to me. How ridiculous.

 

[Fasttr]

I filled out the guest change form on Sunday. I had received no confirmation of the change earlier today so I called a VOA. They confirmed that the reservation was in the guest's name and attached to the guest's email and that I should not have received a confirmation. I asked the VOA to send me one. I then reached out to the guest and they said they had not received confirmation (checked their spam folder and everything). I had to then forward to the guest the confirmation email that the VOA forwarded to me. How ridiculous.

Sounds like its working to "MVC-Perfection". (insert eye roll emoji here!!)

 

[igopogo]

There is now a link to the form on the reservation summary (from manage points reservations). "Change arriving guest information."

 

[RENTER]

Marriott needs to accept responsibility for creating the big time rental monster and need to come up with a better way to DEFINE commercial and phase into a level of tolerance in the entire system, points and weeks. It needs to be both points and weeks because MVC modified the program to be flexible and it should be fully flexible.

There is HISTORY of sales department TOUTING RENTING. There is also history for “how to use your ownership” as PRECEDENCE to show MVC ENCOURAGED, FACILITATED and TOLERATED rentals.

When we bought in ‘99 Marriott gave the option to rent through them. As I remember it, Ocean Pointe it was a 65/35 split but at Aruba Ocean Club it was 40/60. Then after points were initiated MVC no longer wanted to facilitate this option and limited the weeks they would accept. Since renting wasn’t prohibited but was no longer facilitated by MVC owners found other options and the big rental monster was born.

I say it wasn’t prohibited because OS reps we’re understanding when you called to change names on the ressie. They would even ask if you were staying or asked if you were renting and remove your personal Bonvoy information. The PRECEDENCE was MVC was ACCOMODATING!

HISTORY, FACILITATION, ACCOMMODATION, PRECEDENCE, TOLERANCE, SELLING THE OPTION.

MVC needs to ACCEPT responsibility for the big rental problem, define commercial and make allowances for what they promised as part of the program they sold.

It’s the Marriott Way.

I just had a heated argument with a Mariott salesperson over this issue. She wanted me to buy more points and when I said I do not need more points she said you can rent them out. I told her it was BS because I just went thru this with Wyndham where they changed the rules on renting. Renting was ok as long as you paid Wyndham 40% and Mariott 35%. But once owners figured out they can rent themselves on online rental sites, they started to lose business and started to change the rules. Wyndham owners started to fight back and pointed out the hypocrisy that you an rent thru them but cannot rent on your own. Also owners fought back about the definition of commercial and pointed out the courts and the IRS do not consider individuals renting a commercial business. They pointed out that homeowner associations usually win their cases against homeowners except in the case where they declare a homeowner renting their home a commercial business. Then they always lose. They also told Wyndham they are crazy if they think people can afford these points if they do not rent. The owners do not know if it is a trap or they made their point, but Wyndham since the fall has partnered with these short-term rental sites and are allowing owners to rent on them as long as they have the right of approval on the wording of the rental posting. The wording they wanted included, many owners already had in their posting. She brought in her supervisor who told me rules always change. I told him then do not ask me for more money if rules always change.

 

[WahooWah]

I just had a heated argument with a Mariott salesperson over this issue. She wanted me to buy more points and when I said I do not need more points she said you can rent them out. I told her it was BS because I just went thru this with Wyndham where they changed the rules on renting. Renting was ok as long as you paid Wyndham 40% and Mariott 35%. But once owners figured out they can rent themselves on online rental sites, they started to lose business and started to change the rules. Wyndham owners started to fight back and pointed out the hypocrisy that you an rent thru them but cannot rent on your own. Also owners fought back about the definition of commercial and pointed out the courts and the IRS do not consider individuals renting a commercial business. They pointed out that homeowner associations usually win their cases against homeowners except in the case where they declare a homeowner renting their home a commercial business. Then they always lose. They also told Wyndham they are crazy if they think people can afford these points if they do not rent. The owners do not know if it is a trap or they made their point, but Wyndham since the fall has partnered with these short-term rental sites and are allowing owners to rent on them as long as they have the right of approval on the wording of the rental posting. The wording they wanted included, many owners already had in their posting. She brought in her supervisor who told me rules always change. I told him then do not ask me for more money if rules always change.

Does anyone have any links to this saga between Wyndham and Wyndham owners and how it concluded? Also any links to court decisions or proclamations by the IRS about their interpretation of renting as a commercial business?

 

[Tride]

Does anyone have any links to this saga between Wyndham and Wyndham owners and how it concluded? Also any links to court decisions or proclamations by the IRS about their interpretation of renting as a commercial business?

want to get other peoples opinions on this “new” policy for changing guests names on a existing reservation. We are now liable for any damage done by a renter? And what is considered commercial use? Are we not able to rent out our weeks or points anymore?


The Owner/Member identified above hereby submits this Guest Form and provides the following certifications and acknowledgments:

I have obtained consent from the Guest to provide Marriott Vacation Club International and its affiliates (“MVCI”) the required Guest information.

I have advised the Guest of MVCI’s Global Privacy Statement and agree to hold harmless and indemnity MVCI for any claim by the Guest relating to MVCI’s collection and use of the Guest information.

Guest name and contact information provided are accurate and I have advised the Guest that, should MVCI be unable to verify the Guest information prior to arrival, the Guest will not be allowed to check-in.

I have advised the Guest that the Guest must check-in at the front desk of the property with valid identification and a valid credit card.

I am responsible for any damages to the property caused by the Guest and others associated with the Guest.

If I do NOT stay at the property, I will not receive Marriott Bonvoy Elite night credits.

If I do stay at the property, I will not receive Marriott Bonvoy Elite night credits unless I present valid identification and check-in at the front desk.

Commercial use of Accommodations, Base Exchange Benefits, Base Plus Exchange Benefits, Special Benefits or Use Periods, including a pattern of rental activity, is prohibited under the Abound Exchange Procedures and may result in cancellation of reservations. I certify that this reservation is not for any commercial purpose and release Exchange Company and its affiliates from any and all liability relating to or arising from such reservation cancellation.
Please choose one of the follow:

I intend to stay at the property for substantially the full length of the stay according to the confirmation details.

I DO NOT intend to stay at the property for substantially the full length of the stay according to the

 

[Dean]

I think we've always been liable for our guests though the risks are minimal IMO. They haven't formally published a definition of commercial renting but I think the only ones that would have risk are the ones who are renting a considerable volume repeatedly where most reasonable people would agree that it's commercial. The only issue I have is having to send the info in and hope they get it changed in a reasonable period of time.

 

[sponger76]

Does anyone have any links to this saga between Wyndham and Wyndham owners and how it concluded? Also any links to court decisions or proclamations by the IRS about their interpretation of renting as a commercial business?

IRS definition of business activities

See the above link for IRS definition of what constitutes a business.

It starts off with: "A trade or business is generally an activity carried on for a livelihood or in good faith to make a profit." (emphasis mine)

It goes on to list some of the "facts and circumstances used to make this determination," including:

• regularity of the activities
• production of income

Based on the above, my personal interpretation is that if every once in a while you happen to be unable to occupy your timeshare so you rent it out to recoup the maintenance fees only (no profit), its not a business. However, if you are doing it consistently (regularity of the activity) and/or for profit (production of income), you are engaged in business activity.

 

[Dean]

IRS definition of business activities

See the above link for IRS definition of what constitutes a business.

It starts off with: "A trade or business is generally an activity carried on for a livelihood or in good faith to make a profit." (emphasis mine)

It goes on to list some of the "facts and circumstances used to make this determination," including:

• regularity of the activities
• production of income

Based on the above, my personal interpretation is that if every once in a while you happen to be unable to occupy your timeshare so you rent it out to recoup the maintenance fees only (no profit), its not a business. However, if you are doing it consistently (regularity of the activity) and/or for profit (production of income), you are engaged in business activity.

IMO this is completely different that the IRS guidelines which are tax based. Since we are allowed to rent but not for Commercial use, profitability per se isn't going to be a component of the equation. From a practical standpoint MVC wouldn't be able to track profits even if they wanted to.

 

[sponger76]

IMO this is completely different that the IRS guidelines which are tax based. Since we are allowed to rent but not for Commercial use, profitability per se isn't going to be a component of the equation. From a practical standpoint MVC wouldn't be able to track profits even if they wanted to.

I agree, from MVC or any timeshare company's standpoint, they won't be able to track profitability. I was responding to someone asking if the IRS had an interpretation of renting as a business. While it doesn't specify renting, the page does talk about what the IRS considers to be a business. For me personally, this is a quick litmus test way for an owner considering renting to define whether or not they may be engaged in a commercial business. The part where the timeshare companies could track it is regularity.

 

[Tride]

I think we've always been liable for our guests though the risks are minimal IMO. They haven't formally published a definition of commercial renting but I think the only ones that would have risk are the ones who are renting a considerable volume repeatedly where most reasonable people would agree that it's commercial. The only issue I have is having to send the info in and hope they get it changed in a reasonable period of time.

Do they keep the owners credit card on file to charge for any damages? And why wouldn’t they charge it to the guest who has occupied the unit when they need to provide a credit card when they check in

 

[Dean]

Do they keep the owners credit card on file to charge for any damages? And why wouldn’t they charge it to the guest who has occupied the unit when they need to provide a credit card when they check in

They wouldn't have to have your CC, they could simply hold your account hostage. While they generally would take a CC from the person checking in, this is something that can be bypassed. Also, for someone low enough to cause a major problem, they can cancel the CC mid stream, I know if this happening. Still very low risk IMO and non't something that would prevent me from renting, but it is among the reasons I wouldn't rent to someone I got a bad vibe from.

 

[Dean]

I agree, from MVC or any timeshare company's standpoint, they won't be able to track profitability. I was responding to someone asking if the IRS had an interpretation of renting as a business. While it doesn't specify renting, the page does talk about what the IRS considers to be a business. For me personally, this is a quick litmus test way for an owner considering renting to define whether or not they may be engaged in a commercial business. The part where the timeshare companies could track it is regularity.

Maybe I missed the iRS part previously though I still see zero applicability to the issue of commercial timesahare renting and not just because of the difficulty of tracking profits. I suspect you could ask 100 people on TUG for their definition and you'd get 100 different answers ranging from no renting to unlimited. Mine personally would be volume based and possibly a dedicate website. Now if renting were contractually forbidden, like with II, it'd be different. But there certainly are things they can do to make it more difficult and I guess this is one but IMO, it's a weird one that doesn't make a lot of sense in how it's being implemented. Certainly acknowledging the risks, obligations and provide the contact info is reasonable, but 30 days?

 

[sponger76]

Maybe I missed the iRS part previously though I still see zero applicability to the issue of commercial timesahare renting and not just because of the difficulty of tracking profits. I suspect you could ask 100 people on TUG for their definition and you'd get 100 different answers ranging from no renting to unlimited. Mine personally would be volume based and possibly a dedicate website. Now if renting were contractually forbidden, like with II, it'd be different. But there certainly are things they can do to make it more difficult and I guess this is one but IMO, it's a weird one that doesn't make a lot of sense in how it's being implemented. Certainly acknowledging the risks, obligations and provide the contact info is reasonable, but 30 days?

I'm not disagreeing with you about how onerous the new process is for changing names on reservations. I was just engaging in the tangential topic of how to define commercial (business) use. We all know that pretty much all the major timeshare players prohibit "commercial" use, but most systems don't outright prohibit all renting. Most TUG users who've been around for a few minutes or more realize that there are as many opinions of what commercial use is as there are TUG members. Again, I was just responding to somebody who specifically asked if there was an IRS definition of renting as a commercial business.