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2015 Program Changes [merged]

vacationhopeful

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It appears IF you have ARP and booked during the ARP window .. you could have LOTS of units overlapping more than 10 per night. No cancellation due to the "NEW" policy. But when you can & rebook to save "points" using any VIP discount .. those "new/recent" reservation are with points NOT in the ARP booking window; subject to cancellation.

So the NEXT real question I have is:
I book during the ARP window a Royal Vista unit with 2017 Regular points for FRI Jan 7, 2017 .... I cancel the reservation (work keeps me home) for Dec 23 ... my points are returned as Regular Points. I immediately book with those newly Returned Regular points using their ARP again for Royal Vista the week before Christmas & NYE.

I feel that is within the new procedure ... as no cancelled points; hence, the can be ARP points again ... later in the year, as long as the new reservation is made within the ARP window.

Dang ,,, this would also work for Myrtle Beach ARP and late June reservation.
 
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ronparise

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Co-skier is exactly right, there is no increased availability.

For the high demand stuff that gets taken in the first few minutes 13 months in advance, (Mardi Gras and Bike Week come to mind) there is no change,

for the moderately high demand stuff (like Myrtle Beach in the summer. or Glacier Canyon weekends) Most of this gets taken in the ARP period, and the rest in the first few minutes at ten months.

At a hypothetical 300 unit resort, it doesnt make any difference to the bulk of the ownership whether 10 owners get 30 reservations each or 30 owners get 10 each, or 300 get one each, any way you slice it all the best stuff is gone when everyone else goes looking. in other words most owners will still come up short.

bottom line: the change will affect a few individuals like me and Eric, (and we will no doubt have to make some changes in the way we operate) but nothing changes for the rest of the owner base.

The big question is why was the email I got addressed to Richard Raspenti,
 
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Bigrob

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The big question is why was the email I got addressed to Richard Raspenti,

I'm glad you said this. Because mine was addressed to Robert Lennon.
 

traveldaddy

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I'm glad you said this. Because mine was addressed to Robert Lennon.

And we are supposed to believe they will track points correctly back to their origination?

Good call on the screenshot before Aug 3 btw.

Jeesh.

I still haven't received the e-mail, but am looking forward to seeing whom it will be addressed to.
 

Vacationfuntips

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I borrowed points from 2016 (didn't use the credit pool) to make a reservation for 2015. If I cancel the 2015 reservation that I made, would my points go back for my allotment of 2016 regular use year points?

Or would points stay in 2015 since I brought them over before the change? I would cancel after the new rule - would this extend my points to use for 2016 (now that I don't need the 2015 reservation) and these were the borrowed 2016 points to begin with?

I am confused. ..?

Cynthia T. :)
 

ronparise

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I could see how it could be interpreted that way as well, since the language is slightly ambiguous. BG was at least very clear in their explanation.

It isnt a question of how we might understand the rule, or even how the guy that wrote the rule understands it, The question is how the it guy writes the code. Once we understand what the computer does when we make our reservations we will know what we can get away with
 

Vacationfuntips

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I am thinking that this new rule will make planning more complicated, that is if I DO want to deposit into RCI and I have an odd amount of points in my account at the end of the use year. I might have to purchase the difference? I never had to do that before.
Cynthia T. :)
 

paxsarah

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I'll miss the ability to convert pool credits into something that can be deposited to RCI, and the ability to borrow into express, cancel, and rebook into Standard. But, on balance, this does make things simpler, and the ability to keep credits in the credit pool might provide some value.

Edited to add: thinking about this more, you can still accomplish borrow-for-standard by credit pooling the required future year's points, so the flexibility is still there, it just costs a few bucks to do.

Thanks for pointing this out. I just dodged a bullet! (and by bullet, I mean getting stuck with June 2016-expiring pool credits that I had intended to deposit to RCI)
 

Bigrob

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I borrowed points from 2016 (didn't use the credit pool) to make a reservation for 2015. If I cancel the 2015 reservation that I made, would my points go back for my allotment of 2016 regular use year points?

Or would points stay in 2015 since I brought them over before the change? I would cancel after the new rule - would this extend my points to use for 2016 (now that I don't need the 2015 reservation) and these were the borrowed 2016 points to begin with?

I am confused. ..?

Cynthia T. :)

Cynthia, the way it was explained to me is that there is a migration overnight on August 3rd. The points sitting there as cancelled points will be converted to regular use year points with no associated contract, for the use year in which they are sitting. If you cancel before Aug 4th, they will be sitting as cancelled points that will get converted to 2015 regular use year points. If you cancel after Aug 4th, I'm not sure what will happen since you booked the reservation before the change, but would have cancelled it after the change. If you make that reservation after August 4th and cancel it, the points will definitely go back to 2016.

My guess is that if the reservation you made was made with regular use year points from 2016, that they will go back to 2016 if you cancel after August 4. This is because the system would still know what contract the points came from. Once the points are cancelled points, there is no traceability back to a contract.
 

am1

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Better do all the cancellations in the same day or moment as more than 10 arp reservations are fine but they will still count towards the 10 reservation limit if any new reservations are made inside 10 months to check in

You are onto something with the ARP exemption.

10 one bedrooms and 10 3-or-4 bedroom Presidentials may be reserved during ARP (20 units for the same nights).

At 60 days, cancel and rebook the 1 bedroom for 50%, then cancel a Presidential and upgrade.

There are now 18 ARP units and 1 unit subject to the new rule.

Repeat this 10 times (unlikely, but theoretically just as possible as before the new rule), and the result is 10 Presidentials booked for 50% of the 1 bedroom price plus 10 1 bedroom units back in inventory -- exactly as what can occur now. Here, again, I do not see how availability was improved under the rule.
 

Ty1on

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For some reason, I am reminded of this thread and wondering if the OP was a "test case" for Wyndham applying this policy.

http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=225157

<common non-profane exclamatory redacted in honor of the TUG Religious Police> what a painful thread that was to read. Do you think a shill would actually take the time to brew up that entire story, type long, detailed updates, and report after some time that it was resolved? I'm not sure their attention span would last long enough to keep it up.
 

Bigrob

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Better do all the cancellations in the same day or moment as more than 10 arp reservations are fine but they will still count towards the 10 reservation limit if any new reservations are made inside 10 months to check in

I don't think it will be "moments" as I suspect it will at least require an overnight batch run. But the point is... if you only did one (cancel/rebook/upgrade) and left the other 18 to do for the next day, the one booked in the standard reservation window (reservation 19) is at risk of cancellation. And of course it is the one you most want to keep. So the point is right... you would need to do all of the cancel/rebooks on the same day.

At some point, I'm hoping someone will ask for (and subsequently post) the 20% inventory by location. What I would hate to have happen is to be over the NUL and not know it, because the resort only has 24 units for example.

For "resorts" with many different HOAs, I wonder if the NUL applies to the "resort" in aggregate, or to each of the individual neighborhoods? If you upgrade, you may not know you're going to a different neighborhood for which you might go over the NUL (thinking about locations such as Smuggs).
 

Ty1on

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I don't think it will be "moments" as I suspect it will at least require an overnight batch run. But the point is... if you only did one (cancel/rebook/upgrade) and left the other 18 to do for the next day, the one booked in the standard reservation window (reservation 19) is at risk of cancellation. And of course it is the one you most want to keep. So the point is right... you would need to do all of the cancel/rebooks on the same day.

At some point, I'm hoping someone will ask for (and subsequently post) the 20% inventory by location. What I would hate to have happen is to be over the NUL and not know it, because the resort only has 24 units for example.

For "resorts" with many different HOAs, I wonder if the NUL applies to the "resort" in aggregate, or to each of the individual neighborhoods? If you upgrade, you may not know you're going to a different neighborhood for which you might go over the NUL (thinking about locations such as Smuggs).

It could be monks with 10-keys tabulating each member's points usage :D
 

antjmar

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None of my UDI deeds mention anything about Advance Reservation Priority.
No but they do say you own a small percentage of the total points at that resort. It would be unlawful to forbid you to reserve what you own on a deed. Just my opinion..
 

Bigrob

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<common non-profane exclamatory redacted in honor of the TUG Religious Police> what a painful thread that was to read. Do you think a shill would actually take the time to brew up that entire story, type long, detailed updates, and report after some time that it was resolved? I'm not sure their attention span would last long enough to keep it up.

No idea. I and several others were pretty convinced early on the story was manufactured. But I could not come up with a plausible rationale for someone to craft such a story.
 

Ty1on

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No idea. I and several others were pretty convinced early on the story was manufactured. But I could not come up with a plausible rationale for someone to craft such a story.

I'd say a very intelligent and persistent troll, perhaps, but based on her storyline, I don't see the endgame for Wyndham.
 

Ty1on

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No idea. I and several others were pretty convinced early on the story was manufactured. But I could not come up with a plausible rationale for someone to craft such a story.

Interesting....I just picked up on the fact that the "Owner advocate" who "used to work for them" has all of five posts on Tug.
 

CO skier

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Better do all the cancellations in the same day or moment as more than 10 arp reservations are fine but they will still count towards the 10 reservation limit if any new reservations are made inside 10 months to check in

That's not the way the new rule it written:

"The Nightly Unit Limit applies to new Standard and Express reservations booked after October 1, 2015 (ARP reservations are not limited)."

ARP reservation are unlimited, so the new 10 limit does not apply to them, and they do not count towards other reservations that do fall under the new rule, because they are not Standard or Express reservations.

Someone could have 60 ARP reservations and 10 cancelled-rebooked or regular reservations all for the same nights and still be in compliance with the new rule. Nothing gets cancelled, days, weeks, or months later.

How the new rule is written and how it is interpreted by whoever is responsible for cancelling out-of-compliance reservations can be debated until someone actually tries it.
 

am1

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That's not the way the new rule it written:

"The Nightly Unit Limit applies to new Standard and Express reservations booked after October 1, 2015 (ARP reservations are not limited)."

ARP reservation are unlimited, so the new 10 limit does not apply to them, and they do not count towards other reservations that do fall under the new rule, because they are not Standard or Express reservations.

Someone could have 60 ARP reservations and 10 cancelled-rebooked or regular reservations all for the same nights and still be in compliance with the new rule. Nothing gets cancelled, days, weeks, or months later.

How the new rule is written and how it is interpreted by whoever is responsible for cancelling out-of-compliance reservations can be debated until someone actually tries it.

I was told the 10 or more arp reservations would count as 10. Any more booked inside 10 months would be in violation.
 

Ty1on

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I was told the 10 or more arp reservations would count as 10. Any more booked inside 10 months would be in violation.

Who told you that?
 

CO skier

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None of my UDI deeds mention anything about Advance Reservation Priority.

No but they do say you own a small percentage of the total points at that resort. It would be unlawful to forbid you to reserve what you own on a deed. Just my opinion..

You are correct of course, but it completely missed the point that Advance Reservation Priority (ARP) is an administrative rule, not a deeded right.

If Wyndham has the option to limit reservations to 10 in the Standard or Express reservations, they could do the same for ARP reservations. There is no deeded right protecting this. If the objective of the new administrative rule is to somehow increase availability, exempting ARP reservations from the 10 unit/20% rule runs completely contrary to this goal.
 
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