You're Being Lied to About Electric Cars

[HitchHiker71]

Commercial level solar needs the storage problem solved as well. Peakers can be used anytime, day or night. If a major power plant suffers a setback for whatever reason. The peaker is there. Off peak storage needs a solution. First round of lithium is not the next round solution. It is a huge deal for renewable growth.

Tesla’s megapack business is already using second gen tech and is evaluating third gen tech at present. Megapacks are already replacing peak power plants both here in the US and internationally. This is a huge growth business for Tesla. 1st gen tech was LI-NMC batteries. 2nd gen megapacks are using LFP which has lower energy density but has much higher cycle capabilities and is much less prone to any combustion issues. A three acre megapack farm can on average replace an entire peak power plant - which is a much smaller footprint than the plant being replaced.

 

[easyrider]

This is an incredibly selfish perspective. Sorry I can’t say I’m surprised.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Why would you think that attitude is selfish ? I'm surprised you would say that.

Bill

 

[easyrider]

Residential solar, at least from what I have observed, isn’t as cost efficient nor is it at the lower costs of commercial scale solar arrays. I wish it was, and there is talk about the democratization of solar toward residential to promote a distributed energy generation grid rather than what we have today, which is still largely centralized power generation districted via the aging power grid, but we just aren’t there yet. I’ve priced solar for my home and I just cannot justify the conversion costs - my break even is 20+ years out given my current energy consumption and the limited sizing of a solar array I can put on my roof. My home faces due north, so I only have southern exposure on half of my roof that qualifies for solar roofing - whether panels or solar shingles. Even with the 30% federal tax credit I still cannot make the numbers work for residential solar for my specific scenario. I’d at least consider solar if the ROI was ten years or less, but we are also far from certain that we will be staying in our current home that long. There’s nothing wrong with taking personal economics into account - no one should have to fall on their own swords so to speak - until and unless is makes solid financial sense to do so.

That’s why I’m advocating for mass adoption of commercial scale solar arrays with megapacks to - at least initially - completely eliminate the need for peak power plants. This is already well under way - but I think we could accelerate this transition quite a bit especially now that it makes more economic sense to do so.

Have you read about the Ivanpah solar plant that was using mirrors. It came online and was a big failure loosing enormous amounts of money. It still is loosing money. Tonopah solar is no better. I think these projects will be scrapped along with many of the rooftop solar panels as they age. None of it is recyclable unless more money is spent than what can be generated through the recycling process. It's a large scale environmental problem which is indicative of most products regarding solar and ev's, imo.

Bill

Central Station Solar: Ivanpah Fail ($2.2 billion bust) - Master Resource

“The 2200 million dollars per 120 million watts represents an 18 dollars per watt ($/W) investment. By way of comparison, another nonpolluting source of electricity, nuclear power plant, the Millstone reactor No. 2 in Connecticut, operating at 880 MW since 1975, cost 0.5 $/W, making Ivanpah 36...

www.masterresource.org

 

[DrQ]

World's largest battery maker announces major breakthrough in energy density

"A new era of universal electrification of sea, land and air transportation." CATL announces new battery that doubles energy intensity.

thedriven.io

 

[HitchHiker71]

Have you read about the Ivanpah solar plant that was using mirrors. It came online and was a big failure loosing enormous amounts of money. It still is loosing money. Tonopah solar is no better. I think these projects will be scrapped along with many of the rooftop solar panels as they age. None of it is recyclable unless more money is spent than what can be generated through the recycling process. It's a large scale environmental problem which is indicative of most products regarding solar and ev's, imo.

Bill

Central Station Solar: Ivanpah Fail ($2.2 billion bust) - Master Resource

“The 2200 million dollars per 120 million watts represents an 18 dollars per watt ($/W) investment. By way of comparison, another nonpolluting source of electricity, nuclear power plant, the Millstone reactor No. 2 in Connecticut, operating at 880 MW since 1975, cost 0.5 $/W, making Ivanpah 36...

www.masterresource.org

Read about Redwood Material’s success in recycling up to 95% of the minerals within spent BEV battery packs. The science for battery recycling is complete, Redwood is already recycling battery packs today in their Nevada plant, and is building a 3.5bb mass recycling plant in South Carolina that will be online by end of year. This is one of the biggest benefits of BEVs when compared to ICE vehicles. With ICE vehicles, fossil fuels are burned into the atmosphere and cannot ever be recycled or reused.

Redwood Materials announces $3.5 billion EV battery recycling plant in South Carolina

Redwood received $226 million in taxpayer-funded incentives.

www.theverge.com

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[HitchHiker71]

World's largest battery maker announces major breakthrough in energy density

"A new era of universal electrification of sea, land and air transportation." CATL announces new battery that doubles energy intensity.

thedriven.io

It’s exciting to see these technological developments with leaps in energy density. Many of these likely won’t reach mass production or won’t be scalable for mass production but we only need a few breakthroughs that are scalable for mass production to see the electrification of other segments of the transportation fleet like airlines buses, trains, etc.

 

[HitchHiker71]

Have you read about the Ivanpah solar plant that was using mirrors. It came online and was a big failure loosing enormous amounts of money. It still is loosing money. Tonopah solar is no better. I think these projects will be scrapped along with many of the rooftop solar panels as they age. None of it is recyclable unless more money is spent than what can be generated through the recycling process. It's a large scale environmental problem which is indicative of most products regarding solar and ev's, imo.

Bill

Central Station Solar: Ivanpah Fail ($2.2 billion bust) - Master Resource

“The 2200 million dollars per 120 million watts represents an 18 dollars per watt ($/W) investment. By way of comparison, another nonpolluting source of electricity, nuclear power plant, the Millstone reactor No. 2 in Connecticut, operating at 880 MW since 1975, cost 0.5 $/W, making Ivanpah 36...

www.masterresource.org

Solar steam generating plants have a very different cost model and aren’t nearly as efficient as mass solar arrays using megapacks for direct power storage. This plant was also built over ten years ago now - and given solar costs alone have dropped 90% over that same time period - this really isn’t a good example of why we should be using solar today given how steeply costs have dropped since this plant was brought online. That said, nuclear power is certainly one of the least expensive ways of generating large amounts of power and should be part of our future energy generation plan.

 

[Tia]

I actually heard Gerardo Rivera say he was buying a Bentley ev in 2025 while arguing that every one needs to get an ev.

Bill

Heard that he currently was driving a Bentley think

 

[easyrider]

Read about Redwood Material’s success in recycling up to 95% of the minerals within spent BEV battery packs. The science for battery recycling is complete, Redwood is already recycling battery packs today in their Nevada plant, and is building a 3.5bb mass recycling plant in South Carolina that will be online by end of year. This is one of the biggest benefits of BEVs when compared to ICE vehicles. With ICE vehicles, fossil fuels are burned into the atmosphere and cannot ever be recycled or reused.

Redwood Materials announces $3.5 billion EV battery recycling plant in South Carolina

Redwood received $226 million in taxpayer-funded incentives.

www.theverge.com

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If it were not for the 226 million tax payer funds being diverted to this project I doubt that this project would be a project. What I expect is this company will take the tax payer funds and pay the people that approved the funds back through proxy construction and research costs. As they are building there will be cost over runs that will create tax breaks. Once running the company will claim they can't deliver because of some tech issue. While running they will create a huge environmental problem with products they were to recycle but didn't. The plant will close but the mess will be cleaned up using tax payer funding. I know how jaded this sounds.

Bill

 

[Ralph Sir Edward]

If it were not for the 226 million tax payer funds being diverted to this project I doubt that this project would be a project. What I expect is this company will take the tax payer funds and pay the people that approved the funds back through proxy construction and research costs. As they are building there will be cost over runs that will create tax breaks. Once running the company will claim they can't deliver because of some tech issue. While running they will create a huge environmental problem with products they were to recycle but didn't. The plant will close but the mess will be cleaned up using tax payer funding. I know how jaded this sounds.

Bill

BAU (Business As Usual)

 

[Ralph Sir Edward]

World's largest battery maker announces major breakthrough in energy density

"A new era of universal electrification of sea, land and air transportation." CATL announces new battery that doubles energy intensity.

thedriven.io

I'd like to see a couple of years of real world experience with them, before jumping in.

On the other hand, an Aptera with 2000 mile range would be a beast indeed.

 

[HitchHiker71]

If it were not for the 226 million tax payer funds being diverted to this project I doubt that this project would be a project. What I expect is this company will take the tax payer funds and pay the people that approved the funds back through proxy construction and research costs. As they are building there will be cost over runs that will create tax breaks. Once running the company will claim they can't deliver because of some tech issue. While running they will create a huge environmental problem with products they were to recycle but didn't. The plant will close but the mess will be cleaned up using tax payer funding. I know how jaded this sounds.

Bill

JB Straubel has a lengthy track record of being a technology innovator and actually bringing products to market that challenge the status quo. He was with Tesla since 2004 - as a co-founder and CTO - until 2019 when he left to lead Redwood Materials. He was instrumental in bringing the Model 3 to market - the first truly mass market BEV here in the US. I'd say that's a pretty impressive accomplishment. He's applying the same ingenuity to battery recycling at present. The costs of Redwood Materials and it's focus on battery recycling have largely been funded by Tesla itself - the 226mm is a drop in the bucket - considering the plant being built in NC is 3.5bb alone - and that doesn't include the costs of the plant in Nevada that's been in place for years now that Tesla built. JB Straubel is also being voted back onto the Tesla board this year - assuming the stockholders approve of course. I think there's a real likelihood that JB is the CEO in waiting to replace Musk at Tesla that Musk has alluded to when asked about succession planning.

 

[tk25]

Has significant man made “climate change” really been proven? If so how, by who, when and where.

What is really wrong with CO2? Don’t plants thrive on it?

Is it better to have a colder or warmer planet? Will animal life be better with warmer or colder planet?

i have been watching geological shows which seem to show/prove that over time earth has had many major climate changes (cold & hot) without man being around. Have these “natural” fluctuations stopped?

The earth is several billion years old and in just a few hundreds of thousands to millions of years even the continents change a lot and will be nothing like today.

Who is to say that more CO2 may not be ultimately beneficial?

We should all want cleaner air and water. I do.

For the current so called climate anctivists anren’t India, China, third world, and Africa the big future problems?

This all seems to be going to massive government regulation. Big Government good or bad? Could significant man made climate change be the contemporary version of the “earth is flat”?

I am old enough to remember in the 1970s. It started off as overpopulation and then global cooling with massive ice age. Then it changed to global warming and Venus type changes. Now it’s just climate change.

I would like to figure this out objectively. I’m guardly skeptical.

 

[wilma]

Has significant man made “climate change” really been proven? If so how, by who, when and where.

What is really wrong with CO2? Don’t plants thrive on it?

Is it better to have a colder or warmer planet? Will animal life be better with warmer or colder planet?

i have been watching geological shows which seem to show/prove that over time earth has had many major climate changes (cold & hot) without man being around. Have these “natural” fluctuations stopped?

The earth is several billion years old and in just a few hundreds of thousands to millions of years even the continents change a lot and will be nothing like today.

Who is to say that more CO2 may not be ultimately beneficial?

We should all want cleaner air and water. I do.

For the current so called climate anctivists anren’t India, China, third world, and Africa the big future problems?

This all seems to be going to massive government regulation. Big Government good or bad? Could significant man made climate change be the contemporary version of the “earth is flat”?

I am old enough to remember in the 1970s. It started off as overpopulation and then global cooling with massive ice age. Then it changed to global warming and Venus type changes. Now it’s just climate change.

I would like to figure this out objectively. I’m guardly skeptical.

Look it up, you‘ll find the answers.

 

[tk25]

So the earth is flat?

 

[Passepartout]

So the earth is flat?

Of course. It has believers around the world.

 

[billymach4]

Don't you know we staged the Moon Landings!

 

[Ralph Sir Edward]

Don't you know we staged the Moon Landings!

Of course we did! Three stages on the Saturn 5, a stage on the command module and 2 stages on the Lunar Excursion Module. . . .

 

[easyrider]

JB Straubel has a lengthy track record of being a technology innovator and actually bringing products to market that challenge the status quo. He was with Tesla since 2004 - as a co-founder and CTO - until 2019 when he left to lead Redwood Materials. He was instrumental in bringing the Model 3 to market - the first truly mass market BEV here in the US. I'd say that's a pretty impressive accomplishment. He's applying the same ingenuity to battery recycling at present. The costs of Redwood Materials and it's focus on battery recycling have largely been funded by Tesla itself - the 226mm is a drop in the bucket - considering the plant being built in NC is 3.5bb alone - and that doesn't include the costs of the plant in Nevada that's been in place for years now that Tesla built. JB Straubel is also being voted back onto the Tesla board this year - assuming the stockholders approve of course. I think there's a real likelihood that JB is the CEO in waiting to replace Musk at Tesla that Musk has alluded to when asked about succession planning.

If I was Elon I would want my good ole buddy on the board too, lol. I'm kind of wondering how the other board members and stock holders feel about this.

Bill

 

[Passepartout]

If I was Elon I would want my good ole buddy on the board too, lol. I'm kind of wondering how the other board members and stock holders feel about this.

Bill

If you were Elon, why the <bleep> are you hanging out in a timeshare site???

 

[easyrider]

If you were Elon, why the <bleep> are you hanging out in a timeshare site???

Maybe because he needs information on how to form and protect his Space X timeshare projects in Space and soon on Mars. The Mars timeshare property will be adult only and called the Space XXX. He probably decided on a point system maybe called the Astro-point which will launch soon after the release of his digital currency called the Astro-coin, lol.

The funding will be in part by taxpayers that will never be able to afford an Astro-point let alone an Astro-coin, lol, as that is how it works.

Bill

 

[Passepartout]

Maybe because he needs information on how to form and protect his Space X timeshare projects in Space and soon on Mars. The Mars timeshare property will be adult only and called the Space XXX. He probably decided on a point system maybe called the Astro-point which will launch soon after the release of his digital currency called the Astro-coin, lol.

The funding will be in part by taxpayers that will never be able to afford an Astro-point let alone an Astro-coin, lol, as that is how it works.

Bill

At least you didn't mention an 'intimate lubricant' called 'Astro Glide'!

 

[Brett]

new plug-in hybrids are competing with EV's

WSJ 4/25/2023

https://www.wsj.com/articles/toyota...plug-in-hybrids-battle-evs-for-share-31785660

"Toyota Motor Corp. is getting ready to bring its latest plug-in hybrid model to American showrooms next month, a part of the company’s bet that plug-ins can be the bridge between traditional cars and electric vehicles. Toyota, Ford Motor Co. and Hyundai Motor Co. are among global brands rolling out new plug-in hybrid gas-electric cars. While most hybrids on the road today combine gas engines with electric motors to save fuel, plug-in hybrids can drive primarily on batteries — with the engine as a backup—making them the closest thing to a full EV on the road.


Toyota is rebranding its plug-ins as “practical electric vehicles” that work for average American commuters who want to drive mostly on electric power but worry about range on longer trips

that will increase the range of plug-in hybrid vehicles so that the resemblance to full EVs grows closer. The company said earlier this month that it planned to develop plug-in models capable of driving
more than 200 kilometers, or about 124 miles, in EV mode.

More plug-in hybrids are hitting showrooms, including Ford’s Escape sport-utility vehicle and Hyundai’s Tucson crossover.

 

[Superchief]

new plug-in hybrids are competing with EV's

WSJ 4/25/2023

https://www.wsj.com/articles/toyota...plug-in-hybrids-battle-evs-for-share-31785660

"Toyota Motor Corp. is getting ready to bring its latest plug-in hybrid model to American showrooms next month, a part of the company’s bet that plug-ins can be the bridge between traditional cars and electric vehicles. Toyota, Ford Motor Co. and Hyundai Motor Co. are among global brands rolling out new plug-in hybrid gas-electric cars. While most hybrids on the road today combine gas engines with electric motors to save fuel, plug-in hybrids can drive primarily on batteries — with the engine as a backup—making them the closest thing to a full EV on the road.


Toyota is rebranding its plug-ins as “practical electric vehicles” that work for average American commuters who want to drive mostly on electric power but worry about range on longer trips

that will increase the range of plug-in hybrid vehicles so that the resemblance to full EVs grows closer. The company said earlier this month that it planned to develop plug-in models capable of driving
more than 200 kilometers, or about 124 miles, in EV mode.

More plug-in hybrids are hitting showrooms, including Ford’s Escape sport-utility vehicle and Hyundai’s Tucson crossover.

What are the advantages and disadvantages of plug-in hybrids compared to traditional hybrids?

 

[HitchHiker71]

What are the advantages and disadvantages of plug-in hybrids compared to traditional hybrids?

Here's a decent article comparing BEVs, PHEVs and HEVs: https://www.pcmag.com/how-to/ev-vs-hev-vs-phev-what-are-the-types-of-electric-vehicles

Basically hybrids use a smaller battery that is complementary to the gas engine in some form (think Prius of days past), PHEVs use a slightly larger battery pack but still have a gas engine for propulsion after the battery runs dry. Both platforms typically use regenerative braking to help recover power into their battery packs - like BEVs do. PHEVs carry the advantage of an actual plug-in option, so you can charge your PHEV at home or at a public charging station. PHEVs typically have a large enough battery to offer up 25-50 miles of electric only travel before switching over to the gas engine. This is a good compromise for folks who want to avoid going to an outright BEV for whatever reason - such as range anxiety - but would still like to get their feet wet with battery propulsion that would likely cover the majority of their "local" daily driving requirements. There are quite a few PHEVs already on the market today to choose from. Toyota still offers their Prius HEV, along with a newer Prius Prime PHEV model - that offers up to 44 miles of battery only propulsion. On average people drive at about 80% efficiency so figure that 44 miles is more like 35 miles real world driving on average. I think PHEVs are a great option for many folks who may want to dip their feet into the EV world, without giving up a gas engine in the process.