Urgent help needed - Marriott resale week through presentation [OceanWatch Ultimate Occupancy]

[Dean]

The deed guarantees the view type! The last line of the quoted information from my "oceanside/gardenview" UO-affected deed, info that I just asked you to look at, GUARANTEES my placement into Oceanside units! "Accordingly, Grantee's occupancy rights shall be limited to said Oceanside Unit Type." My deed includes a unit number in a building that's designated Gardenview, but that same deed states unequivocally that upon build-out of the resort my placement will always be Oceanside. Every other individual deed affected by Ultimate Occupancy contains similar details specific to the ownership conveyed by those deeds. What else is necessary?!?!

Nothing else if the DEED guarantees it and leaves zero area for interpretation. If it's the POS that guarantees it, then the subject would still be open. Thanks for the discussion. For the OP, I'd still want it in writing either as a letter signed by an official employee or the deed itself.

 

[TheTimeTraveler]

Just curious how did you find a resort to sell you a resale week as a hybrid. Also, remind me of the benefits of a hybrid again? Please and thanks.

Any of the Marriott Resorts will sell you a hybrid week "IF" you are willing to reach deep into your pockets.




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[Dean]

Just curious how did you find a resort to sell you a resale week as a hybrid. Also, remind me of the benefits of a hybrid again? Please and thanks.

They call them bundles. I don't think the OP gave the details but it's normally 3000 points plus the MVC "resale" price for the week. I think everyone can sell this type of option. You can also buy a week at places where weeks are still sold (Aruba, Spain, St. Kitt's, Costa Rica) and the resale week. Inventory comes and goes but should be the same for all locations at given moment. There are minimum spends to do so. While still more expensive, it can be a reasonable way to get into the MVC points game if one is starting from scratch. IMO there are 2 variables, the retail portion component and the resale week. It's probably more important to get a top resale week in the deal than getting the better deal on the retail side though both are important. You'll overpay for the resale week compared to buying independently but it will be enrolled. IMO it's much better to just buy the week you want resale then enroll it later but it does delay the process somewhat. For those that want to go the direct route anyway, I'd look at the weeks over points to do so as it should be modestly cheaper up front but also cheaper yearly with lower fees. So if doing so, I'd say buy a good retail week and a good resale week looking at what one will actually use, paying attention to the quality of both weeks including fees to points ratio. I'd like to keep the fees for each week down to points down around 40¢ per point or very close. As noted, not cheap. Maybe a minimum of $65K for say a Grande Ocean Platinum week and a good St. Kitt's or Aruba week. Might be able to get by a little less for Spain if they can do the same.

I think some go this route them try to cheap out on it. IMO that's a poor move. Basically they'll buy a poor week for either or even both. I this scenario a poor week might not be a bad week for other situations. For example on the retail side they'll look at something like Grande Vista as the resale week and then maybe 2 Gold instead of one Platinum for the retail portion. I believe paying attention to the fees per point will keep you on track for this situation.

 

[timtax]

I purchased pre-construction at OceanWatch. It is a Plat Plus week with UO gardenview which was not yet built at the time of purchase so my deed is for Oceanside. I believe the word "when available" simply means when the Gardenview buildings are completed. I don't think there should be any further possible confusion now that construction is complete. I always received GV.

 

[dioxide45]

They call them bundles. I don't think the OP gave the details but it's normally 3000 points plus the MVC "resale" price for the week.

I seem to recall in the past that the number of points purchased has to be equal to or greater than the allocation of Club Points to the deeded resale week you were buying? So if the deeded week in the bundle was worth 4,050 you would need to buy 4,250 Club Points to make it a bundle. I think one of the only exceptions were white DSV weeks which they would let you buy only 1,000 Club Points with the bundle.

 

[dioxide45]

I purchased pre-construction at OceanWatch. It is a Plat Plus week with UO gardenview which was not yet built at the time of purchase so my deed is for Oceanside. I believe the word "when available" simply means when the Gardenview buildings are completed. I don't think there should be any further possible confusion now that construction is complete. I always received GV.

I think the confusion comes in when you buy the unit in Gardenview that has Oceanside Ultimate Occupancy. Those all seem to contain the same "when available" language, but by the time they got around to building the gardenview at these resorts those oceanfront and oceanside were already built. So "when available" wasn't even applicable.

 

[Dean]

I seem to recall in the past that the number of points purchased has to be equal to or greater than the allocation of Club Points to the deeded resale week you were buying? So if the deeded week in the bundle was worth 4,050 you would need to buy 4,250 Club Points to make it a bundle. I think one of the only exceptions were white DSV weeks which they would let you buy only 1,000 Club Points with the bundle.

There have been lots of exceptions and variability in this requirement and I considered that issue when I posted but didn't want get too much into the weeds unless further info was requested. My experience is it hasn't been an issue unless the disparity were too great, esp for the weeks that would qualify to enroll.

 

[vail]

I think some things are worth parsing to death despite some people not finding the subject interesting, especially if what's being discussed is something with the potential to further devalue my timeshare ownership beyond what's warranted.

No one is forced to be reading what proves my apparent lack of worthy endeavors. <eyeroll>

I think most timeshares have zero or very little value, as the maintenance fees have escalated to the point where most weeks can be rented for less than the annual maintenance fee or very close to it.
The only value if it is already owned is the convenience of having the week.

 

[Red elephant]

I think most timeshares have zero or very little value, as the maintenance fees have escalated to the point where most weeks can be rented for less than the annual maintenance fee or very close to it.
The only value if it is already owned is the convenience of having the week.

Agree with this and those that rent above maintenance fees are pretty costly to buy in. The break even point is not for a while . So the value is in using them.

 

[timtax]

I think the confusion comes in when you buy the unit in Gardenview that has Oceanside Ultimate Occupancy. Those all seem to contain the same "when available" language, but by the time they got around to building the gardenview at these resorts those oceanfront and oceanside were already built. So "when available" wasn't even applicable.

True. I guess they left the language to be consistent with the other docs. But I agree that "when available" was no longer applicable.

 

[DRH90277]

I think most timeshares have zero or very little value, as the maintenance fees have escalated to the point where most weeks can be rented for less than the annual maintenance fee or very close to it.
The only value if it is already owned is the convenience of having the week.

I can only speak about Marriott owned timeshares and rental returns in relation to maintenance fees (initial purchase cost is ignored). - My experience with Marriott owned weeks does not support Vail's generalization. At the buy, it's pretty easy to determine the rental market by resort & season by simply looking at rental listings (by season) and maintenance fees. Some are worth owning for use and the rents are fine. Look at Newport Coast platinum season weeks as a pretty good property. I will not mention some I consider dogs but it's not hard to isolate them. Of course, no one should buy an owned week strictly for the rental income but should buy the property because they like to go there.

Purchased points are an entirely different animal and I have not experienced even reasonable returns compared to the $.70 maintenance fees. Mere recovery of the maintenance fees is the more likely outcome. Good reservations for use or rental are just too hard to get - lots of points are pointed at the best reservations. I have difficulty with MVC's efforts to stop rentals as I think they are likely exaggerating the impacts and hurting those stuck with small numbers of near un-spendable points. I wish they would share some specifics of one of these culprits so I could see if these activities are as dumb as I suspect.

It might be that MVC's real target is those who exchange their enrolled weeks for points, make point reservations, and then rent them out. The maintenance fees on these points are much lower than those for purchased points. I suspect MVC is even surprised by some of the outcomes and challenges of this points program.

Only my view.....

 

[Avulasai]

Just curious how did you find a resort to sell you a resale week as a hybrid. Also, remind me of the benefits of a hybrid again? Please and thanks.

They offered. The only benefit is you can convert the week into points

 

[DRH90277]

They offered. The only benefit is you can convert the week into points

All "enrolled" weeks can be converted into points; and, you were just adding a week to a points purchase. Is there something else? If converted to points, how many points would the week yield and what week did you get by resort, season, and view? This all sounds like a pretty normal everyday deal from MVC.

 

[jmhpsu93]

Purchased points are an entirely different animal and I have not experienced even reasonable returns compared to the $.70 maintenance fees.

Only my view.....

You have to really do your research to get exceptional value out of the points system, that's for sure. One way discussed here quite often is the 5-day rental from Sunday-Friday which sometimes costs fewer points than just the Friday/Saturday. There are also certain weeks at some resorts that have very attractive pricing in points vs. renting on Redweek or Marriott.com, and then that have attractive points costs vs. rental potential (mostly the same weeks, though my preference of when to go differs from most people so they don't align in my personal value prop).

Those stuck to school calendars, who want to book 3-6 months in advance, and want the full week vs. just 5 days (or 12 for a longer stay) are the ones who will have a hard time getting bargains out of it.

We use a mix of Interval trades through resale weeks coupled with points reservations and get tremendous value out of the system, and that's even accounting for retail purchasing of points.

 

[SueDonJ]

All "enrolled" weeks can be converted into points; and, you were just adding a week to a points purchase. Is there something else? If converted to points, how many points would the week yield and what week did you get by resort, season, and view? This all sounds like a pretty normal everyday deal from MVC.

You're responding to the OP of this thread. S/he purchased an OceanWatch oceanfront Week as part of a Bundle Package. I don't think the season or the Club Points allotment was mentioned?

 

[DRH90277]

You're responding to the OP of this thread. S/he purchased an OceanWatch oceanfront Week as part of a Bundle Package. I don't think the season or the Club Points allotment was mentioned?

I'm aware of what was mentioned. However, I just inquired about the point yield on the week received and the season of this particular week.

By the way what is an OP. A bunch of us don't know what these abbreviations mean.

 

[SueDonJ]

I'm aware of what was mentioned. However, I just inquired about the point yield on the week received and the season of this particular week.

By the way what is an OP. A bunch of us don't know what these abbreviations mean.

Ah. Original Poster or Original Post.

 

[incantata]

We bought a resale week at Marriott directly through their sales presentation as part of hybrid bundle of points plus week. We are told guaranteed ocean front but when contract papers came they read ocean view but ocean front as ultimate occupancy when available. Is that normal?

I want to rescind . But I might be getting close to the 10 day window… can I rescind online ? How do they count the 10 day mark? When they receive my letter or by the posting date of when I mailed ? Can someone advise on how to rescind Marriott contract ?

Moderator Note: [Edited to remove attachment containing personal info, at OP's request.] <--SueDonJ

I don't know about other Marriott resorts but I can tell you that 'ocean view' usually means that some units overlook pools and have a side view of the ocean from the terrace of the apt. For example, all units at the Marriott Marbella beach resort in Marbella, Spain have an ocean view but some have a side view from the terrace. Because of the construction design, some affront a pool with an ocean side view.

 

[Dean]

I don't know about other Marriott resorts but I can tell you that 'ocean view' usually means that some units overlook pools and have a side view of the ocean from the terrace of the apt. For example, all units at the Marriott Marbella beach resort in Marbella, Spain have an ocean view but some have a side view from the terrace. Because of the construction design, some affront a pool with an ocean side view.

To Add, Oceanside is a higher view category than Oceanview though at some resorts, they were the same price (like Surf Club).

 

[DanCali]

You're responding to the OP of this thread. S/he purchased an OceanWatch oceanfront Week as part of a Bundle Package. I don't think the season or the Club Points allotment was mentioned?

It might have been included on the screenshot that was removed in post #1.

 

[SueDonJ]

To Add, Oceanside is a higher view category than Oceanview though at some resorts, they were the same price (like Surf Club).

I thought the direct-sales prices of OV and OS at Aruba Surf Club were different when sold direct at the resort's introduction, but when the Destination Club was introduced they were allotted the same amount of Club Points if enrolled? I have a vague recollection of agreeing with Marilyn and others about the unfair allocations at Aruba Surf Club in all the thousands of complaint posts during late-2010/2011. (I didn't think many of the complaints were legitimately unfair so that's why this one stood out.)

 

[Dean]

I thought the direct-sales prices of OV and OS at Aruba Surf Club were different when sold direct at the resort's introduction, but when the Destination Club was introduced they were allotted the same amount of Club Points if enrolled? I have a vague recollection of agreeing with Marilyn and others about the unfair allocations at Aruba Surf Club in all the thousands of complaint posts during late-2010/2011. (I didn't think many of the complaints were legitimately unfair so that's why this one stood out.)

No, the prices were the same, still are, is my understanding. I'm reviewing a price list from a few months ago and all versions are the same price and same points. Seems weird to me though. I may have an early price list at home to agree but I've had a good 8 or 9 data points over the past 3 years that back up the info. I wonder if the issue is that OS owners felt they should have gotten more.

 

[SueDonJ]

No, the prices were the same, still are, is my understanding. I'm reviewing a price list from a few months ago and all versions are the same price and same points. Seems weird to me though. I may have an early price list at home to agree but I've had a good 8 or 9 data points over the past 3 years that back up the info. I wonder if the issue is that OS owners felt they should have gotten more.

This link is to one post among many, many others in the monster threads that followed the DC introduction; it's @joyzilli and @m61376 talking about the direct-purchase price for Aruba Surf Club oceanside being higher than for oceanview but the Club Points allocations are the same. It could be that the purchase prices have been equalized sometime since the 2010 rollout?

 

[Dean]

This link is to one post among many, many others in the monster threads that followed the DC introduction; it's @joyzilli and @m61376 talking about the direct-purchase price for Aruba Surf Club oceanside being higher than for oceanview but the Club Points allocations are the same. It could be that the purchase prices have been equalized sometime since the 2010 rollout?

Thanks, I couldn't find my price sheet but found about everything else but I reached to my contact and he said early on the OS was more. They have certainly been the same for some time both points and price. Seems strange to me they would be but I'd suspect they raised the prices of OV rather than lower OS.

 

[m61376]

Dean- Sue’s definitely right. Before the DC program OS weeks at the Surf Club were I believe around 4K more than OV, and all are in the front building by the beach. OS weeks still consistently are more expensive on the resale market.
That’s one of the reasons the point allocation was a slap in the face of owners there. On the flip side Aruba point reservations are relatively a better value.


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