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Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana and Marriott Ownerships

Luvtoride

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When Hyatt sold/spun off Hyatt timeshare, there was a 50-year licensing where Hyatt timeshare will continue to use the Hyatt name and pay to Hyatt, the hotel company, license fees to continue to use the name. This arrangement cannot be terminated unless Marriott Vacation Worldwide wants to go into negotiation and likely would cost MVW hundreds of millions of dollars to do so.

I don’t think that would be an issue to prevent the properties from being included in the program. As long as they don’t intend to rename the properties (as they aren’t renaming the Westin or Vistana properties either).


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dioxide45

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The new date I heard today at a Westin presentation for the cutover of the program is August 7th.
 

ndang3

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When Hyatt sold/spun off Hyatt timeshare, there was a 50-year licensing where Hyatt timeshare will continue to use the Hyatt name and pay to Hyatt, the hotel company, license fees to continue to use the name. This arrangement cannot be terminated unless Marriott Vacation Worldwide wants to go into negotiation and likely would cost MVW hundreds of millions of dollars to do so.
How many years left to the 50 year term?
 

jabberwocky

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I don’t think that would be an issue to prevent the properties from being included in the program. As long as they don’t intend to rename the properties (as they aren’t renaming the Westin or Vistana properties either).


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If I were the CEO of HYATT there is no way I would want anything with my company’s name on it within a MARRIOTT Vacation Club. It would cause confusion and may lead people to think that Hyatt is a Marriott brand.

The only way they get included is if Marriott buys out the contract from Hyatt and gets to put their name on the properties. Or they Hyatt TS owners could always vote to change management company brands. :)
 

dioxide45

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If I were the CEO of HYATT there is no way I would want anything with my company’s name on it within a MARRIOTT Vacation Club. It would cause confusion and may lead people to think that Hyatt is a Marriott brand.

The only way they get included is if Marriott buys out the contract from Hyatt and gets to put their name on the properties. Or they Hyatt TS owners could always vote to change management company brands. :)
That is a big sticking point. The license agreement gives HRC access to the World of Hyatt members to market to them the Hyatt timeshare product. Hyatt isn't going to want to have MVC folks marketing to World of Hyatt members to buy Marriott Abound points while at a Marriott timeshare property. Unless Marriott International (hotel company) somehow buys Hyatt, we won't see any integration between Hyatt and MVC.
 

TravelTime

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I can tell you that. They gave me a book of Westin point charts when I bought my 1K trust points last month. 2700 studio, 3900 1 Bed, 5900 2 Bed.

Can you post the point charts somewhere if you haven’t already?

Oops…I kept reading the thread and I see that you have posted it. That is amazing that you scanned it all and shared it here on TUG! Thank you so very much! :love:
 
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TravelTime

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I can tell you that. They gave me a book of Westin point charts when I bought my 1K trust points last month. 2700 studio, 3900 1 Bed, 5900 2 Bed.

The 2BR is valued at a lot of points. It is in the same range as some of the MVC Hawaii resorts in Oahu/Ko Olina and Kauai. It is surprising they valued it at so many points. Maybe they expect Cancun to be extremely popular so they can use it as a selling point in sales presentations.
 

dioxide45

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Can you post the point charts somewhere if you haven’t already?

Oops…I kept reading the thread and I see that you have posted it. That is amazing that you scanned it all and shared it here on TUG! Thank you so very much! :love:
See this post;
 

TravelTime

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I’d say that the Mexico resorts that Vistana has are infinitely better than anything currently in the MVC Mexico portfolio.

I agree since MVC does not have any Mexico resorts in its portfolio! ;)
 

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As promised, here are the Westin and Harborside 2023 charts for using DP as of when I made my purchase on June 11th (likely still the same but who knows). I had to significantly compress the file to meet upload size limits so it turned a bit fuzzy but still legible. Happy to share it because there is no language in it prohibiting such and they are handing them out to buyers with no disclaimers about use.

The last page has all the disclaimers about point levels and the bit about Harborside and Riverfront not being included until at least 2024, including their owners not able to enroll/elect points for those ownerships until then.
This is fantastic -- thanks for posting this!!! Post #621 if someone wants to see the Westin points booklet posted by Kozykritter.

Best,

Greg
 

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It is interesting reading the Westin points chart that Kozykritter posted. My limited understanding prior to this chart was that the Westin points were modestly higher than the points required to stay in a "comparable" Marriott property. I no longer think this is the case, and see some interesting differences.

I have often thought that Westin Kaanapali and Maui Ocean Club are very comparable properties (with sentimental value being the tie break -- MOC for me :) )

Using Presidents Week as a comparator, for WKORV vs. MM1:

2BR OF: 9,975 versus 9,050
2BR OV: 7,400 versus 8,025

It's interesting to me that the 2BR OV is consistently lower at WKORV than MM1, with summer being 7,050 points versus 7,625 to stay in Lahaina Villas. The 2BR OF at WKORV is consistently higher. This must be ascribed to perceived demand as their is a limited number of 2BR OV's at Maui Ocean Club but there is much more supply at WKORV.

I don't know their Palm Desert properties but Marriott ascribes greater value to Westin Desert Willow, with Q1 pricing at 4,725 points for a 2BR from late January - April. Shadow Ridge Enclaves is 4,500 points for the same period, Shadow Ridge is 4,000 -- and Westin Mission Hills is also 4,000.

Interesting. I will be very curious to track the inventory availability with DC points (and when the reservation is available) if we ever get a new reservation system.

Best,

Greg
 

VacationForever

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It is interesting reading the Westin points chart that Kozykritter posted. My limited understanding prior to this chart was that the Westin points were modestly higher than the points required to stay in a "comparable" Marriott property. I no longer think this is the case, and see some interesting differences.

I have often thought that Westin Kaanapali and Maui Ocean Club are very comparable properties (with sentimental value being the tie break -- MOC for me :) )

Using Presidents Week as a comparator, for WKORV vs. MM1:

2BR OF: 9,975 versus 9,050
2BR OV: 7,400 versus 8,025

It's interesting to me that the 2BR OV is consistently lower at WKORV than MM1, with summer being 7,050 points versus 7,625 to stay in Lahaina Villas. The 2BR OF at WKORV is consistently higher. This must be ascribed to perceived demand as their is a limited number of 2BR OV's at Maui Ocean Club but there is much more supply at WKORV.

I don't know their Palm Desert properties but Marriott ascribes greater value to Westin Desert Willow, with Q1 pricing at 4,725 points for a 2BR from late January - April. Shadow Ridge Enclaves is 4,500 points for the same period, Shadow Ridge is 4,000 -- and Westin Mission Hills is also 4,000.

Interesting. I will be very curious to track the inventory availability with DC points (and when the reservation is available) if we ever get a new reservation system.

Best,

Greg
Similarly, I compared Westin Desert Willow, Westin Mission Hills and Marriott's Desert Springs Villas 1. We have stayed at all Westin and Marriott's properties and strongly prefer Desert Springs Villas I. Based on this chart, Desert Willow is more expensive to stay compared to Desert Springs Villas I, and Desert Springs Villas 1 is more expensive than Mission Hills.
 

GregT

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Thanks @kozykritter for the document. As I have suspected, from this charts I will stick to using VSN for SOs bookings.

I agree -- and I think alot of people will want to stay with their StarOptions -- but I do think this introduces new booking strategies. For me, TUGgers know that I think WPORV is a fantastic property.

I could see the situation where I book WPORV 12 months out using Marriott DC Points. And then wait to see if WPORV is available with StarOptions 8 months out.

If it is, I book with SOs and cancel my WPORV reservation and get my DC points back. Someone else will pick up my original WPORV dates with DC Points -- 8 months out..

I don't see this happening alot because it ties up those DC points, but it can definitely be helpful if I'm confident I want to go to WPORV and need specific dates.

Interesting.

Best,

Greg
 

CalGalTraveler

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Does Abound differentiate the Westins from the North/South and Nanea? Are the points the same?

North has better IV because no units face parking lots. The other two Westin properties run the risk of a parking lot/ or backing shuttle beep view.
 

dioxide45

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Does Abound differentiate the Westins from the North/South and Nanea? Are the points the same?

North has better IV because no units face parking lots. The other two Westin properties run the risk of a parking lot/ or backing shuttle beep view.
North and South are different pages in the charts, but after a quick glance, the points all look to be the same between the two.
 

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No separate category. Yes they hand out a booklet that has point charts for all the Westin properties plus Harborside. I asked if there was one for Sheraton and they told me they don't have one but I heard from another purchaser that they received one.

Wow that's crazy. I own Westin Flex and if you convert my options to MVC that's roughly 2800, which is the cost to stay in a 1 br for 7 days during spring break, vs 3900. Seems definitely more expensive to convert to the other side than to stick with your own properties. I wonder if it will be the same for me to convert to MVC points and stay at a Marriott location.
 

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Is it just me or is anyone else less than impressed by the new inventory?
 

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As I stated earlier for us the only benefit would be the additIonal resorts in Mexico and Harborside.
 

dioxide45

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Is it just me or is anyone else less than impressed by the new inventory?
Not sure what anyone was expecting. The big timeshare companies all have resorts in most of the same places. So there is a lot of overlap. However, for some locations it will provide more options. Can't book into Maui Ocean Club, you have three more resorts to try for.
 

ocdb8r

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As I stated earlier for us the only benefit would be the additional resorts in Mexico and Harborside.
Also St John’s
Agree that these are likely the main resorts of value to MVC owners. I also think the Vistana Colorado locations add some good diversity of options for skiers (the Ritz Vail is outrageously priced in points and hard to get into from what I have heard...and the Streamside properties are quite dated - Mountain Valley lodge is the most decent and available MVC option in CO).

However, don't discount the "small 1 bedroom" at most of the continental US Vistana locations. To me this is big plus over a studio at a comparable MVC location (for just a bit more in points). You get a unit with a true separate bedroom and living room, full fridge, cooktop and full washer/dryer and a microwave (sometimes with convection feature). Also valuable for bigger families as when you book a 2-bedroom lockoff at these locations you're getting a large 1 bedroom + a small 1 bedroom, giving you that extra living room to dump the kids in!

Finally, I personally think nothing in the MVC portfolio in AZ beats the Westin Kierland Villas. (edited to add...I guess MVC agrees as looking at the points charts, the sm 1-bed here is often the same price as a full 1-bed at MVC Canyon Villas! That said, for other continental US locations, the sm 1-bed at Vistana resorts is normally priced just a bit more than a studio at nearby MVC locations).

CA, HI, FL and SC are a toss up, likely down to personal preference or the better unit configuration I mention above.
 
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kozykritter

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Wow that's crazy. I own Westin Flex and if you convert my options to MVC that's roughly 2800, which is the cost to stay in a 1 br for 7 days during spring break, vs 3900. Seems definitely more expensive to convert to the other side than to stick with your own properties. I wonder if it will be the same for me to convert to MVC points and stay at a Marriott location.
I think the philosophy that's been adopted here in regards to this integration is the best benefits will come when you use ownership in one system to stay at properties in another. If you want to stay at Westins, use your Flex. If you want to stay at Marriott properties, convert to DP in Abound or use your Flex options in Interval to exchange. Converting to DP and then booking backwards to Vistana seems like the least desirable option, perhaps one only used in desperation if you can't find inventory you need elsewhere.
 
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