Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana and Marriott Ownerships

[kozykritter]

Based on what I was told this week, Vistana election will start in October, and end by 12/31 this year to accommodate the launch of the new program. No changes for MVC club deadlines. Not sure how it would impact the cross program booking, I assume Vistana weeks would be available for MVC members as late as October.

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On Facebook a nice couple were told in a virtual presentation today that it will launch in about 90 days which adds to the evidence that a summer launch has been aborted. If MVC doesn't think they can do a successful launch right now, in the end we'll all be happier if they wait until a time when they can pull it off without too many hitches. Otherwise, imagine the website outage frustration and anger times a hundred! No thanks

 

[vacationtime1]

On Facebook a nice couple were told in a virtual presentation today that it will launch in about 90 days which adds to the evidence that a summer launch has been aborted. If MVC doesn't think they can do a successful launch right now, in the end we'll all be happier if they wait until a time when they can pull it off without too many hitches. Otherwise, imagine the website outage frustration and anger times a hundred! No thanks

Worse than that -- until Marriott gets its IT act together, they don't have a product to sell.

 

[JIMinNC]

On Facebook a nice couple were told in a virtual presentation today that it will launch in about 90 days which adds to the evidence that a summer launch has been aborted. If MVC doesn't think they can do a successful launch right now, in the end we'll all be happier if they wait until a time when they can pull it off without too many hitches. Otherwise, imagine the website outage frustration and anger times a hundred! No thanks

If the launch has, in fact, been delayed due to the technology issues, there may be some reference to that when Marriott Vacations Worldwide releases their 2Q 2022 earnings early next week. In their June Investor Day presentation at the New York Stock Exchange, executive management quoted a "summer" launch for Abound. If that has moved to fall, they may have an obligation to disclose that material change in their comments next week. The earnings release is scheduled for Monday after the market closes, and the Analyst Conference Call is at 8:30am EDT on Tuesday August 9. We may hear something more definitive then.

 

[fbast]

I met with a MVC sales rep to explore the new Abound program on 08/4. I purchased a Vistana Fountains II two bedroom unit on the resale market over 20 years ago. The rep informed me the deadline to join Abound was August 12. The cost to join didn't seem attractive to me. Has anybody joined or met with a rep?
I would appreciate any feedback or advice from my fellow owners. Thanks in advance.

 

[VacationForever]

I met with a MVC sales rep to explore the new Abound program on 08/4. I purchased a Vistana Fountains II two bedroom unit on the resale market over 20 years ago. The rep informed me the deadline to join Abound was August 12. The cost to join didn't seem attractive to me. Has anybody joined or met with a rep?
I would appreciate any feedback or advice from my fellow owners. Thanks in advance.

There is no deadline. Sales will continue to sell you developer points or international weeks to qualify your resale. Their only goal is to make a sale now.

Since you bought your resale > 20 years ago, back in 2007/2008 when SVR imposed a special assessment, there was an offer that went out to resale SVR owners, except Cascades and Lakes phases, to join SVN back then. Did you join? If you had joined, then your week is already in the internal network.

 

[marciaheitz]

I'm confused so someone please enlighten me. I'm a Marriott owner and this is (from what I'm reading here) going to be a Vistana/Marriott merger so owners can trade into either system (again my understanding so far). But earlier in the thread it was referred to as a Marriott/Westin/Sheraton system now. I try to learn the rules so I can use them to my advantage so please someone explain this piece to me. Thanks in advance!

 

[VacationForever]

I'm confused so someone please enlighten me. I'm a Marriott owner and this is (from what I'm reading here) going to be a Vistana/Marriott merger so owners can trade into either system (again my understanding so far). But earlier in the thread it was referred to as a Marriott/Westin/Sheraton system now. I try to learn the rules so I can use them to my advantage so please someone explain this piece to me. Thanks in advance!

Vistana is the "company" for Westin and Sheraton timeshare system. It was re-branded from Starwood for the timeshare side, when that got sold off to ILG. Marriott (timeshare business) bought ILG. The merged system has not yet been implemented. Interval Leisure Group (ILG) also includes Interval International, a timeshare exchange company, and Hyatt timeshare business. Marriott recently acquired Welk resorts and those are being merged into the Hyatt brand. They are kept separate for now - Hyatt Residence Club and Hyatt Vacation Club (Welk),

 

[fbast]

There is no deadline. Sales will continue to sell you developer points or international weeks to qualify your resale. Their only goal is to make a sale now.

Since you bought your resale > 20 years ago, back in 2007/2008 when SVR imposed a special assessment, there was an offer that went out to resale SVR owners, except Cascades and Lakes phases, to join SVN back then. Did you join? If you had joined, then your week is already in the internal network.

I did join the SVN network and was able to exchange my Vistana unit for the Westin St. John resort and Harborside-Paradise Island, Bahamas. I also was a member of RCI for many years and cancelled my membership. I just joined Interval International and I'm hoping for better luck with exchange availability at Marriott resorts.

 

[daviator]

I'm confused so someone please enlighten me. I'm a Marriott owner and this is (from what I'm reading here) going to be a Vistana/Marriott merger so owners can trade into either system (again my understanding so far). But earlier in the thread it was referred to as a Marriott/Westin/Sheraton system now. I try to learn the rules so I can use them to my advantage so please someone explain this piece to me. Thanks in advance!

Also, it's not really a merger of the systems, more like an overlay, where Vistana owners will have the option every year to assign their ownership to the Destination Club system (now being renamed Abound.) Ownerships which are assigned to Abound will be available for all Abound/DC members to reserve. But Vistana owners who don't need or want to access Marriott Vacation Club resorts can just continue to use their ownerships as they do today, within the Vistana network, and not participate in Abound.

 

[VacationForever]

I did join the SVN network and was able to exchange my Vistana unit for the Westin St. John resort and Harborside-Paradise Island, Bahamas. I also was a member of RCI for many years and cancelled my membership. I just joined Interval International and I'm hoping for better luck with exchange availability at Marriott resorts.

In this case, there should be no cost to join the Abound program. No need to buy anything.

 

[fbast]

In this case, there should be no cost to join the Abound program. No need to buy anything.

Not true - there is a $15 - 20,000 cost to join Abound according to the MVC rep that I met with last week. I'm confused now.
Does anyone know when SVN dissolved and internal exchanges were discontinued?

 

[Eric B]

Not true - there is a $15 - 20,000 cost to join Abound according to the MVC rep that I met with last week. I'm confused now.
Does anyone know when SVN dissolved and internal exchanges were discontinued?

The VSN (formerly SVN) is still active and available and it is still possible to book stays through it using StarOptions. Rumors of its demise are greatly exaggerated.

 

[VacationForever]

Not true - there is a $15 - 20,000 cost to join Abound according to the MVC rep that I met with last week. I'm confused now.
Does anyone know when SVN dissolved and internal exchanges were discontinued?

VSN is not being dissolved. Since your timeshare was enrolled, i.e. made to perform like a developer-bought timeshare, you will be part of Abound. Owners like you will have options to continue to use the week, trade in II, book through VSN using SOs, or elect to convert to Abound points each year and book through Abound. Ask yourself - do you trust a salesperson whose goal is to transfer money from your pocket to theirs, or the collective knowledge of TUG?

 

[daviator]

Not true - there is a $15 - 20,000 cost to join Abound according to the MVC rep that I met with last week. I'm confused now.
Does anyone know when SVN dissolved and internal exchanges were discontinued?

SVN was not dissolved (it was renamed to VSN when Starwood Vacation Ownership became Vistana) nor is it going to dissolve. It continues to be the primary way that Vistana owners access other Vistana properties outside of their home resort(s). Even with the new Abound overlay, VSN will continue to exist and many Vistana owners will continue to use it.

 

[dougp26364]

Not true - there is a $15 - 20,000 cost to join Abound according to the MVC rep that I met with last week. I'm confused now.
Does anyone know when SVN dissolved and internal exchanges were discontinued?

timeshare salesmen lie and you’ve been lied too.

 

[Grandma2016]

Our 2BR WKORV/N OF week get us 8325 points in the new Abound program. Of course it takes a lot more points to book the same unit at that time, which is why I’ve booked via Vistana and may try renting out our July 4th reservation, we’ll see.

I own OF as well at KOR. Where did you see how many points it takes with Marriott to book same weeks we own?

 

[dioxide45]

I own OF as well at KOR. Where did you see how many points it takes with Marriott to book same weeks we own?

Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana and Marriott Ownerships

I did reach out and the current start date is still 1 August but until it actually happens, we'll have to see. My guess is it'll come down to whether things actually work when they flip the switch on the computer change over. Even if they can't flip the switch on on August 1st, it would be...

tugbbs.com

 

[Grandma2016]

Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana and Marriott Ownerships

I did reach out and the current start date is still 1 August but until it actually happens, we'll have to see. My guess is it'll come down to whether things actually work when they flip the switch on the computer change over. Even if they can't flip the switch on on August 1st, it would be...

tugbbs.com

If my calculations are right.....i have 33125 MVC points not counting my week 52s. This divided by 5500 which is a 1 BR OF at KOR (our preferred room type) would give me 6 weeks. With my SO value on what I own not counting week 52 i have 769100 SO divided by 95100 (cost of 1 BR OF) gets me 8 weeks in 1 BR OF. So Im losing 2 weeks if I transfer my weeks to MVC. But doing this gives me 13 month booking window????? Thoughts????

 

[ocdb8r]

If my calculations are right.....i have 33125 MVC points not counting my week 52s. This divided by 5500 which is a 1 BR OF at KOR (our preferred room type) would give me 6 weeks. With my SO value on what I own not counting week 52 i have 769100 SO divided by 95100 (cost of 1 BR OF) gets me 8 weeks in 1 BR OF. So Im losing 2 weeks if I transfer my weeks to MVC. But doing this gives me 13 month booking window????? Thoughts????

As a general rule it will almost certainly never make sense to elect MVC DPs in order to use them at Vistana resorts; StarOptions will always give you more nights at Vistana resorts EXCEPT in a few instances where the specific nights you want are in a season MVC DP charts have defined as a substantially lower season than the VSN StarOption Chart has (I have looked at the Charts and these instances are few and far between but they do exist at MVC DP has a much more detailed set of "season" charts). As a result, you should likely not elect/convert MVC DPs (and keep in mind, if you are eligible at all, this is a decision you can make each year; it is not permanently "transferring" your weeks).

As to the 13 month reservation window; First, it is unclear if this will apply to Vistana resorts at all - no one has been able to articulate how MVC could allow this for Vistana resorts given how the legal docs for the resorts are written; Second, even if it is possible for Vistana resorts, the only available inventory will be those weeks OTHER owners have elected to convert to MVC DPs. That is likely to be very little inventor at most resorts (and miniscule at the Hawaii resorts). Even if this is permissible at 12 months out (as has been speculated) you will encounter the same inventory issues. Bottom line, again, you're likely to see very little reservation window benefit for Vistana resorts by using MVC DPs (this could change over time as more Vistana owners participate and choose to elect/convert....but I suspect it will be a long time).

 

[Grandma2016]

As a general rule it will almost certainly never make sense to elect MVC DPs in order to use them at Vistana resorts; StarOptions will always give you more nights at Vistana resorts EXCEPT in a few instances where the specific nights you want are in a season MVC DP charts have defined as a substantially lower season than the VSN StarOption Chart has (I have looked at the Charts and these instances are few and far between but they do exist at MVC DP has a much more detailed set of "season" charts). As a result, you should likely not elect/convert MVC DPs (and keep in mind, if you are eligible at all, this is a decision you can make each year; it is not permanently "transferring" your weeks).

As to the 13 month reservation window; First, it is unclear if this will apply to Vistana resorts at all - no one has been able to articulate how MVC could allow this for Vistana resorts given how the legal docs for the resorts are written; Second, even if it is possible for Vistana resorts, the only available inventory will be those weeks OTHER owners have elected to convert to MVC DPs. That is likely to be very little inventor at most resorts (and miniscule at the Hawaii resorts). Even if this is permissible at 12 months out (as has been speculated) you will encounter the same inventory issues. Bottom line, again, you're likely to see very little reservation window benefit for Vistana resorts by using MVC DPs (this could change over time as more Vistana owners participate and choose to elect/convert....but I suspect it will be a long time).

My thoughts exactly.

 

[rcv82]

As a general rule it will almost certainly never make sense to elect MVC DPs in order to use them at Vistana resorts; StarOptions will always give you more nights at Vistana resorts EXCEPT in a few instances where the specific nights you want are in a season MVC DP charts have defined as a substantially lower season than the VSN StarOption Chart has (I have looked at the Charts and these instances are few and far between but they do exist at MVC DP has a much more detailed set of "season" charts). As a result, you should likely not elect/convert MVC DPs (and keep in mind, if you are eligible at all, this is a decision you can make each year; it is not permanently "transferring" your weeks).

As to the 13 month reservation window; First, it is unclear if this will apply to Vistana resorts at all - no one has been able to articulate how MVC could allow this for Vistana resorts given how the legal docs for the resorts are written; Second, even if it is possible for Vistana resorts, the only available inventory will be those weeks OTHER owners have elected to convert to MVC DPs. That is likely to be very little inventor at most resorts (and miniscule at the Hawaii resorts). Even if this is permissible at 12 months out (as has been speculated) you will encounter the same inventory issues. Bottom line, again, you're likely to see very little reservation window benefit for Vistana resorts by using MVC DPs (this could change over time as more Vistana owners participate and choose to elect/convert....but I suspect it will be a long time).

While I agree with your general rule, it appears that for Westin Maui owners, the DPs will get you far more nights than the StarOptions to go anywhere other than Maui. I have to believe this will make Maui much tougher to get into with StarOptions.


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[Grandma2016]

While I agree with your general rule, it appears that for Westin Maui owners, the DPs will get you far more nights than the StarOptions to go anywhere other than Maui. I have to believe this will make Maui much tougher to get into with StarOptions.


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Are you thinking for ppl booking outside of home booking period?

 

[jabberwocky]

While I agree with your general rule, it appears that for Westin Maui owners, the DPs will get you far more nights than the StarOptions to go anywhere other than Maui. I have to believe this will make Maui much tougher to get into with StarOptions.


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How do you figure? Remember the election has to be done by September 30 of the prior year in many cases. If the election isn’t done and you just have an owner who is lazy and doesn’t book at least 8 months in advance, the week now becomes available via SO.

 

[rcv82]

How do you figure? Remember the election has to be done by September 30 of the prior year in many cases. If the election isn’t done and you just have an owner who is lazy and doesn’t book at least 8 months in advance, the week now becomes available via SO.

You do have to plan ahead, so yes lazy people (or those with a change of plans) may default to StarOptions. But if you know you want to not use it a year, the 8300 or so DPs for an OF week is worth far more than the 176,700 StarOptions to travel outside Maui. With 3 OF weeks, I will never plan to use those as StarOptions. (My Sheraton Mountain Vista worth 148,100 StarOptions, however, will mostly get used as StarOptions.


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[DanCali]

You do have to plan ahead, so yes lazy people (or those with a change of plans) may default to StarOptions. But if you know you want to not use it a year, the 8300 or so DPs for an OF week is worth far more than the 176,700 StarOptions to travel outside Maui. With 3 OF weeks, I will never plan to use those as StarOptions. (My Sheraton Mountain Vista worth 148,100 StarOptions, however, will mostly get used as StarOptions.


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I agree that 8300 DPs will generally get you farther than 176,700 SOs. WKORV was either undervalued in SVN or is overvalued in the DC exchange, and most owners who plan in advance and who do not use their home resort will choose DPs over SOs.

But if you think of cash as the ultimate equalizer, the difference is not always as vast which causes some weird incentives for non-Maui owners. If you ascribe values of $0.68/DP (approximate actual rental value) and 3 cents per Staroption (approximately what it's worth to me as a rental at WKV) the difference favors 8300 DP, but it's only by a small margin (certainly not "far more"). I imagine your 2BR OF can rent for $5000-$5500 so the value I use for SOs probably also applies to you as well, give or take a bit.

One can argue that this makes WKV Platinum and Maui more or less equivalent (which they were in SVN) but they certainly are not equivalent in the DC exchange. Everything, with the possible exception of Lagunamar, got very undervalued relative to Maui. Therefore, I suspect many of the savvier WKV owners will either stay in the SO world or, using cash as the equalizer, will rent out their week for $4500-$5000 and use that cash to rent 6400-7100 DPs from the WKORV/N owners