Speculation About Marriott's New Timeshare Structure [merged]

[m61376]

m,

Along the lines of your writing, in my opinion it does not appear that the Asia Pacific program is very successful either. I know Marriott had a huge write down on their last earnings report for Asia. The resort that was really built to host the AP program, Mai Khao Beach VC, appears to have plenty of vacancy. It is a beautiful property, but it is not beachfront like the brand new Renaissance just down the street is. Instead of ocean, you overlook the Anatara Phuket resort which is a 50/50 venture Marriott has itself in (very interesting property if you have time to look at it online). Marriott Vacation Club actually has their offices in the hotel building of Mai Khao Beach. The MVC Bangkok Empire Place is also barren (before the conflicts here). The Empire Place is a points or II only destination - no deeds sold on it. When we visited Empire Place a while back, it was a ghost town.

Another point which can gauge the success of the AP program is resales. Resales are very few (many timeshare brokers have never heard or seen of the program), which either tells me:
1. They just have not sold that many programs.
2. People who buy, like them and do not sell.
3. People who buy, do not want to lose face by selling it for a big discount.

I just have a feeling that compared to deeded weeks, the sales are quite soft. It could be a different story in a more "spend happy" environment like the USA. However, Americans will be more apt to compare the program to buying a deeded week on Ebay. Maybe Marriott will go back to exercising the FROR?

Thanks Asia. Actually, you confirmed what I thought would be the case but since I hadn't heard any real info. on it I didn't want to speculate. I know that looking at the system and the point value assignments, with the large disparities, I couldn't imagine trading my weeks into it for free, let alone paying 5K a pop.

The HGVC program outlined above seems like a user friendly program, and their MF structure would carry-over nicely into a transformed Marriott program, but I think there would be a lot of very angry owners at higher end resorts who would balk at getting the same or similar point allotment as a Plat. Orlando owner, for example. Of course, their extra cost would be to ensure home resort priority, like it always was.

I have to agree with Pete, though, that the HGVC program has some very nice features, and I could foresee it being an easy transition in many respects. What I am not so sure of is that it will help Marriott sell its overpriced weeks at Marco, for example, which purely a points system with no home resort would. I understand they made a misjudgment there and took a hit, but I hope wanting to sell those weeks at a profit doesn't cloud their judgment as they develop an overall system.

The more I mull over the HGVC system, the more akin to the concept of Platinum weeks trading for other Plat. weeks (as Marriott was mostly sold) it seems, and gives the advantage of more time if trading Plat. for lower seasons, for example. It stabilizes the equity of trades for like seasons across the board, and gives respective value up or down for trading across seasons, but mostly doesn't distinguish between different properties. I am not sure how owners of the high end weeks would view this.

I am intrigued, though, that HGVC, like DVC, is a user friendly program and retains resale value, despite not denigrating resale buyers to second class status. I think that alone says a lot for their program.

 

[m61376]

I've heard this concern before and the reason I don't buy into it is because how is it any different than when a sales guy in Orlando says buy Orlando and trade to Hawaii or rent it for rack rate. Sales guys are always coming up with some BS, so the promise of Aruba New Years is't much different.

I think the difference is that currently only unscrupulous salespeople make such claims and most paint a picture of being able to trade into other weeks, but the buyers recognize that they are trades subject to availability (at least that's what I came away with from our first tour, before Tug). In a points based system people are told they can book that New Year's week in Aruba or ski week, etc.; being able to directly book a week takes away the "trading" factor and seems much more certain. I think only the very savvy buyer would be concerned with availability- they will just think it terms of booking a week like they do now for a hotel.

 

[Dean]

The best part, is they could build anywhere and sell the promise of Aruba and Hawaii at New Years to every prospective owner. Don't ever underestimate the fact that getting rid of deeds allows them to sell week 52 at every resort to every owner forever.

If they roll out a pure points based system, it will be extremely easy for us to see what their plan is. It just seems unrealistic for them not to take the easiest most profitable path?

If there's no home resort priority it really wouldn't matter where you owned. Other timeshares without a home resort priority certainly do this. However, that's not necessarily a problem unto itself other than the discussion of the plusses and minuses of whether to have a home resort priority or even a season or unit size/view priority within a given resort.

Marriott can't get away from the idea they'll have to run two systems side by side but they can design ways to make them as seamless and fair as possible (nothing is perfect). They do have to differentiate how to manage the maint fees and how to balance the points given for different seasons and different resorts. From a fees standpoint for existing resorts they likely will have to do the maint fees based on the underlying week rather than the points but for new resorts they could do either. I doubt they'll give everyone almost the same points for a given week as was suggested as a possibility but they should have some consistency related to location, quality, unit size and demand. I think HGVG has a group of older resorts that are below the standards of the Marriott system and that has affected their decisions on their points structure to a degree not that much different than the old Fairfield system or Bluegreen.

 

[PerryM]

>20 means Weasels at work!

If there's no home resort priority it really wouldn't matter where you owned. Other timeshares without a home resort priority certainly do this. However, that's not necessarily a problem unto itself other than the discussion of the plusses and minuses of whether to have a home resort priority or even a season or unit size/view priority within a given resort.

Marriott can't get away from the idea they'll have to run two systems side by side but they can design ways to make them as seamless and fair as possible (nothing is perfect). They do have to differentiate how to manage the maint fees and how to balance the points given for different seasons and different resorts. From a fees standpoint for existing resorts they likely will have to do the maint fees based on the underlying week rather than the points but for new resorts they could do either. I doubt they'll give everyone almost the same points for a given week as was suggested as a possibility but they should have some consistency related to location, quality, unit size and demand. I think HGVG has a group of older resorts that are below the standards of the Marriott system and that has affected their decisions on their points structure to a degree not that much different than the old Fairfield system or Bluegreen.

If Marriott doesn't want a lynch mob outside their corporate HQ they had better adopt the following seasons:

1. Holiday
2. High demand
3. Medium demand
4. Low demand

4, count 'em 4, point levels per villa SYSTEM WIDE.

To get an example of a well run Point exchange system which deals with unbelievable differences in villas, click the following:

• Resort2Resort.com
• Points Calendar for a typical villa
• Here's a Maui resort

That's it, for their entire system which is as large as Marriott in total villas.

Each villa size, Studio, 1BR,2BR,3BR uses the same Point structure - system wide. System wide there are just 16 numbers to memorize. (4 seasons each with 4 size configurations)

Simple to memorize and understand and it handles tens of thousands of condo owners.

Marriott now has 5 seasons Bronze, Silver, Gold, Platinum, Platinum Plus (Holiday) so I can see 5 seasons times 4 villa sizes, or 20 numbers SYSTEM WIDE at the max.

The more Marriott diverges from those 20 numbers the more the sales weasels are involved....

 

[mtnpilot]

What does the new Marriott resort say about points?

So, I see that Marriott is rolling out another resort, Kauai Lagoons. Looks like a prime property, and looking at the promotional materials, the exchange options are exactly as today.

So that begs the question... Why would Marriott introduce a brand new resort (with the "old" exchange system) just a month before rolling out a radically new points-based exchange system? Would it not make sense to delay the introduction of a new resort and align it with points?

This new resort leads me to believe that June will come and go with no change at all....

Mike

 

[BocaBum99]

So, I see that Marriott is rolling out another resort, Kauai Lagoons. Looks like a prime property, and looking at the promotional materials, the exchange options are exactly as today.

So that begs the question... Why would Marriott introduce a brand new resort (with the "old" exchange system) just a month before rolling out a radically new points-based exchange system? Would it not make sense to delay the introduction of a new resort and align it with points?

This new resort leads me to believe that June will come and go with no change at all....

Mike

What it tells you is something that most of us knew. That the old system and the new system will have to co-exist.

Right now, we are just anxiously awaiting the new program details so that we can pounce on the new opportunities that manifest themselves with the new system.

 

[Ann in CA]

Have read some of this threads posts over the months, but don't have time to read the rest now, so sorry if this repeats any info posted. We were at Desert Springs Villas I from May 3-10. We did attend an owner presentation at Shadow Ridge, which I said we were attending only to learn about the rumored points program to be introduced in June, and unless I could learn something concrete about it, I would not consider buying anything.

Of course the big push was to buy a points trader, but our sales rep, who was actually quite personable and not pushy, knew nothing about the points program. When he realized we really would not consider anything without more info, he called in a supervisor. She could not tell us much "without the risk of being fired", and she had worked for Marriott for 16 years or so. She did tell us that they were closing down the sales area for a week this month to train in the new system, and that she was buying two more properties before June as she was excited about the program. It was really hard to pass up the bonus of almost 400,000 points, but we had made a pact not to buy another Marriott right now, especially developer price, so we regretfully passed up the super duper extras they offered.

I do not think she was blowing smoke. And if there really were not a points program in the future, she could have assured us of that, and theoretically have sold us another Marriott.

Not happpy about it, but I think a change really is coming. We do have developer weeks, but when Shell talked us into "upgrading" from our week ownership to their points program, we made a big mistake. Would never do that again. Ann

 

[puckmanfl]

Perry...

If MVCI gives the same point value for a 2 bedroom plat. Orlando and a 2 bedroom plat ski week at Park City, then you will see the lynch mob....

The owners at SW or Mountainside paid twice as much for the unit than their Orlando counterpart (retail). The difference is probably greater (resale) as the ski plat weeks have kept some value, while the Orlando resale values resale prices have really bottomed-out...

p.s. welcome back...

 

[DanCali]

It was really hard to pass up the bonus of almost 400,000 points, but we had made a pact not to buy another Marriott right now, especially developer price, so we regretfully passed up the super duper extras they offered.

Good for you! No regrets...

I'm sure you would not have gotten the same price your salesperson got on her two additional units with the employe discount.

When Shell talked us into "upgrading" from our week ownership to their points program, we made a big mistake. Would never do that again. Ann

I hope others read this and learn from your mistake. How did Shell "talk you into it". Was it the incentives that sealed the deal or did the product genuinely seem good at first?

 

[puckmanfl]

Ann...

If your sales rep is going to by two more units because "she is thrilled" about the program, should he/she just wait until the program comes out then buy??? What would be the benefit of buying two units today and then being asked to pay a conversion fee next month???


p.s. Just how much extra "coin" to these sales reps have?? They all seem to own 4-5 developer units and are looking to buy more!!!!

Everyone seems concerned that "points" will not allow the "UPTRADE" OF WEAKER UNITS!!! I am concerned that this system will make it harder to do "like for like" exchanges. Using DVC as an example, I am sure every point holder will be on the "net" 7 mos. and one second before occupancy of ski weeks...

 

[Dean]

If Marriott doesn't want a lynch mob outside their corporate HQ they had better adopt the following seasons:

1. Holiday
2. High demand
3. Medium demand
4. Low demand

4, count 'em 4, point levels per villa SYSTEM WIDE.

To get an example of a well run Point exchange system which deals with unbelievable differences in villas, click the following:

• Resort2Resort.com
• Points Calendar for a typical villa
• Here's a Maui resort

That's it, for their entire system which is as large as Marriott in total villas.

Each villa size, Studio, 1BR,2BR,3BR uses the same Point structure - system wide. System wide there are just 16 numbers to memorize. (4 seasons each with 4 size configurations)

Simple to memorize and understand and it handles tens of thousands of condo owners.

Marriott now has 5 seasons Bronze, Silver, Gold, Platinum, Platinum Plus (Holiday) so I can see 5 seasons times 4 villa sizes, or 20 numbers SYSTEM WIDE at the max.

The more Marriott diverges from those 20 numbers the more the sales weasels are involved....

Overall Perry, I agree with you as your post reflects what I was alluding to. However, I've seen other systems with changes or potential changes that involved upset people or the threat of the same. I don't think whether current members being upset per se will carry much weight. I do agree that there needs to be some differentiation in terms of unit size, resort quality, area demand, season as to how many points are involved. From posts on this thread they already have that in the existing Asia points options. I sincerely doubt that we'll see a change to the existing resorts that alters the basic maint fee principles but I do think we will see a fee schedule based on points for a resort new out of the box in points. However I will predict that not everyone will be happy and some will be VERY upset. I also predict that any points differences will be an approximation and therefore that some situations will be a far better deal than others even ignoring the maint fee issue.

Perry...

If MVCI gives the same point value for a 2 bedroom plat. Orlando and a 2 bedroom plat ski week at Park City, then you will see the lynch mob....

The owners at SW or Mountainside paid twice as much for the unit than their Orlando counterpart (retail). The difference is probably greater (resale) as the ski plat weeks have kept some value, while the Orlando resale values resale prices have really bottomed-out...

p.s. welcome back...

Better get the torches ready I'd say. While the points may not be the same I would predict they would not be different enough to use the price paid (even retail) as a guide to the number of points received for a given week.

Everyone seems concerned that "points" will not allow the "UPTRADE" OF WEAKER UNITS!!! I am concerned that this system will make it harder to do "like for like" exchanges. Using DVC as an example, I am sure every point holder will be on the "net" 7 mos. and one second before occupancy of ski weeks...

And that assumes that there is a home resort priority, something that not every points system has. It also assumes that there are high demand weeks in the system, something not very likely for the present resorts.

 

[PerryM]

It's war!!!

Perry...

If MVCI gives the same point value for a 2 bedroom plat. Orlando and a 2 bedroom plat ski week at Park City, then you will see the lynch mob....

The owners at SW or Mountainside paid twice as much for the unit than their Orlando counterpart (retail). The difference is probably greater (resale) as the ski plat weeks have kept some value, while the Orlando resale values resale prices have really bottomed-out...

p.s. welcome back...

Marriott has a HUGE problem with the new system - it's 20 years late to the party!

I buy a 2BR Platinum Holiday week 52 at Summit Watch 15 years ago for $18,900 (pre construction) and today it sells for $85,000 - do I get less Points than the newest Marriott owner?

How does my $18,900 unit compare to a new Orlando Platinum 2BR selling for $39,900?

Since Marriott's excuse for this new program is "Internal Marriott Exchanges" then there is going to have to be a lot of accounting for 20 year old purchases - is it "fair" for my $18,900 to exchange for a 2BR new towers unit at Maui for 4th of July, and that fixed week selling for $90,000?

How does II handle all of this?

My guess is that they have LESS than 20 different levels that currently handle ALL Marriott exchanges. My Gold Summit Watch gets Platinum Plus Holiday weeks in II now with Marriott's blessing. Just the simple matrix I propose would stop that instantly - why make it even more complex?

Also, if Marriott isn't careful it will have a full fledged war on its hands of resort fighting against resort, owner fighting against owner, and salesrep fighting against salesrep (as to what they push).

Better to start off making ALL Platinum owners equal to all other Platinum owners of unit size. Same with all the other seasons.

After all, remember all those salesreps pushing their product as superior to other similar units at different Marriott resorts? Well if it turns out that Platinum is not Platinum system wide then Marriott has a lot of explaining to do.

No matter what, I'm guessing the first lawsuits morphing into class-action lawsuits will be filed the first day and there will be lots of them. This will be fun to watch....

 

[puckmanfl]

Dean...

I find you to be a voice of reason in all of this...

Please follow my logic. I currently own 3 EOY Hawaii (2 waiohai/1 Koolina) and 2 (3 bedroom plat GV weeks/Orlando). If my 3 bedroom Orlando plat will get me as many points as a 3 bedroom Koolina, then I will get those resorts converted to points asap!!! I would not even consider converting my eoy hawaii's to points as I would not get equal value if a 2 bedroom plat Branson or Orlando has equal value to these....

The interesting side effect of all this is resale value for highly desired "deeded" weeks might actually rise. The best way to go skiing would be to buy a "resale" ski deeded week for 40% of retail rather than wait on the net at 7 mos and one second!!!

Why would any "high end" week owner even consider converting, especially if they occupy 80% of the time!!! The system can't work without the high end units!!!

 

[jin]

I think HGVG has a group of older resorts that are below the standards of the Marriott system and that has affected their decisions on their points structure to a degree not that much different than the old Fairfield system or Bluegreen.

Dean,
I totally disagree with this statement aside from some of the HGVC Affiliates. The HGVC built resorts are consistently VERY nice and most quite new, and are highly ranked on trip adviser and Tug. Take a look at HGVC Kingsland on the Big Island, HGVC Waikoloa, Grand Waikikian, HGVC Parc Soleil, HGVC on International Drive, Breckenridge HGVC, Portugal HGVC, HGVC Flamingo or Strip location just to name a few great properties. I would say Kingsland is probably the 2'nd nicest timeshare I have stayed at (Residence at the Crane in Barbados #1 which cost me only a bit more than 50% worth of my HGVC week worth of points to trade for on RCI). I have stayed at the KoOlina Marriott, Grand Vista, Grand Chateau which are all very nice, but certainly not superior to HGVC! I have also stayed at several nice Westin Properties (Kierland in Scottsdale, Westin Princeville) and some Wyndom properties. My ranking as a whole in terms of the actual property (not system) is Westin = or >than HGVC = or > Marriott and ALL 3 are superior to Wyndom , Blue-Green, etc. Hilton's biggest problem is they are too focussed on Hawaii, Vegas, and Orlando, but any of the HGVC built resorts are every bit as nice, and in some cases nicer than Marriott.... Pete

 

[jin]

Why would any "high end" week owner even consider converting, especially if they occupy 80% of the time!!! The system can't work without the high end units!!!

Not every "high end week owner wants to go to the same place 80% of the time. Maybe, premium properties will have no buy in fee, or be lured with other Incentives such as additonal "Bonus Points". Also don't sell short the flexibilty that a points system gives you. And with a home resort preference, Hawaiiian owners can still get their Hawaii week when they want it, but will have added flexibilty in the form of longer or shorter stays, and numerous other resorts to trade into and often times use less points. Pete

 

[Ann in CA]

Good for you! No regrets...

I'm sure you would not have gotten the same price your salesperson got on her two additional units with the employe discount.



I hope others read this and learn from your mistake. How did Shell "talk you into it". Was it the incentives that sealed the deal or did the product genuinely seem good at first?

It was our first timeshare in the late 1990s. We had bought a week to trade, a novel idea to us then. But in the first few years, my husband could often not get away for the entire week, so they pitched us the idea that with points, we could go for just 3 days, or however long he had available. It ONLY cost $10,000 more. So we bit. However, the cost of a week in points has gone up in the years, and the one week to trade would have remained the same. In addition, the annual fees are more because we upgraded. Of course on our first trade to Summit Watch, we discovered Marriott, and bought at Mountainside. Now we prefer Marriotts, and have lots of Shell points to use for air fare--not a good use for those points as we can buy our own airfare for much less than the value of the points used. (value just in annual fees)

 

[Ann in CA]

Ann...

If your sales rep is going to by two more units because "she is thrilled" about the program, should he/she just wait until the program comes out then buy??? What would be the benefit of buying two units today and then being asked to pay a conversion fee next month???


p.s. Just how much extra "coin" to these sales reps have?? They all seem to own 4-5 developer units and are looking to buy more!!!!

Everyone seems concerned that "points" will not allow the "UPTRADE" OF WEAKER UNITS!!! I am concerned that this system will make it harder to do "like for like" exchanges. Using DVC as an example, I am sure every point holder will be on the "net" 7 mos. and one second before occupancy of ski weeks...

Apparently current owners will not have any or as much expense in switching over. I was kind of tuning out by then, but don't think she gave the details, as she was not supposed to tell us anything. She may or may not have really been purchasing more, but she was a long time employee and some sort of supervisor, not the actual sales rep.

 

[puckmanfl]

Pete....

I agree 100% with the fact that many owners don't occupy at home resort 80% of time. I am a 80% exchanger (see previous posts) I am just quoting the "sales dribble" from every resort that states " This (fill in blank) resort has the highest owner occupancy in the system" and "The only way to get in at (Blank) resort is to own here"...

I believe there are more exchangers out there than will admit it!!! I was at Surf Club during a Plat Plus spring break week this past March. While on the check in line I inquired loudly "who here is an exchanger????". The 8 customers in front of me all waved their II certificates...

I do like flexibility of longer/shorter stays but logic tells me like for like "high end" exchanges will be more difficult. In the current system there are only certain units that can access others. In the new system, everyone with enough points has access. Please remember, it only takes one "Tues-Thurs" stay to completely wipe out a week for occupancy by another customer...

puckman

 

[Dean]

Dean...

I find you to be a voice of reason in all of this...

Please follow my logic. I currently own 3 EOY Hawaii (2 waiohai/1 Koolina) and 2 (3 bedroom plat GV weeks/Orlando). If my 3 bedroom Orlando plat will get me as many points as a 3 bedroom Koolina, then I will get those resorts converted to points asap!!! I would not even consider converting my eoy hawaii's to points as I would not get equal value if a 2 bedroom plat Branson or Orlando has equal value to these....

The interesting side effect of all this is resale value for highly desired "deeded" weeks might actually rise. The best way to go skiing would be to buy a "resale" ski deeded week for 40% of retail rather than wait on the net at 7 mos and one second!!!

Why would any "high end" week owner even consider converting, especially if they occupy 80% of the time!!! The system can't work without the high end units!!!

They do have a dilemma and I agree with Perry that they are late to the party. I would agree that those weaker trading resorts for higher season will likely be the best options to get into the system, the question to me is really how does one get from her to there. As I said earlier in this thread, Gold and possibly Silver and Platinum as lessor demand resorts are likely to be the best to covert. Why would I want to give up my HH summer weeks unless Marriott really forced me or made me an offer I couldn't refuse. No only might top weeks at top resorts come out ahead not converted (at least for a few years) but it's likely that trade power might actually increase for some options.

My guess is that they have LESS than 20 different levels that currently handle ALL Marriott exchanges. My Gold Summit Watch gets Platinum Plus Holiday weeks in II now with Marriott's blessing. Just the simple matrix I propose would stop that instantly - why make it even more complex?

There is really NO reason for II to change anything internally. They currently have a way to rate (and adjust) the demand and ratings of each week and resort. Other than the interface to get the weeks from Marriott points to a full week inside II and the costs associated, they really don't need to change anything. Their current system will account for differences between weeks (they don't deal with Marriott seasons) and resort quality/demand.

Dean,
I totally disagree with this statement aside from some of the HGVC Affiliates. The HGVC built resorts are consistently VERY nice and most quite new, and are highly ranked on trip adviser and Tug. Take a look at HGVC Kingsland on the Big Island, HGVC Waikoloa, Grand Waikikian, HGVC Parc Soleil, HGVC on International Drive, Breckenridge HGVC, Portugal HGVC, HGVC Flamingo or Strip location just to name a few great properties. I would say Kingsland is probably the 2'nd nicest timeshare I have stayed at (Residence at the Crane in Barbados #1 which cost me only a bit more than 50% worth of my HGVC week worth of points to trade for on RCI). I have stayed at the KoOlina Marriott, Grand Vista, Grand Chateau which are all very nice, but certainly not superior to HGVC! I have also stayed at several nice Westin Properties (Kierland in Scottsdale, Westin Princeville) and some Wyndom properties. My ranking as a whole in terms of the actual property (not system) is Westin = or >than HGVC = or > Marriott and ALL 3 are superior to Wyndom , Blue-Green, etc. Hilton's biggest problem is they are too focussed on Hawaii, Vegas, and Orlando, but any of the HGVC built resorts are every bit as nice, and in some cases nicer than Marriott.... Pete

It was the affiliates I was referring to. No doubt that many of their resorts are top notch.

 

[Dean]

Pete....

I agree 100% with the fact that many owners don't occupy at home resort 80% of time. I am a 80% exchanger (see previous posts) I am just quoting the "sales dribble" from every resort that states " This (fill in blank) resort has the highest owner occupancy in the system" and "The only way to get in at (Blank) resort is to own here"...

I believe there are more exchangers out there than will admit it!!! I was at Surf Club during a Plat Plus spring break week this past March. While on the check in line I inquired loudly "who here is an exchanger????". The 8 customers in front of me all waved their II certificates...

I do like flexibility of longer/shorter stays but logic tells me like for like "high end" exchanges will be more difficult. In the current system there are only certain units that can access others. In the new system, everyone with enough points has access. Please remember, it only takes one "Tues-Thurs" stay to completely wipe out a week for occupancy by another customer...

puckman

I have my trading resorts and my usage resorts which I rent out when I don't use them. I don't trade my HH summer weeks at all unless I get stuck with a week I don't need short notice. Theoretically I would love to have 4 (possibly 5) of my resorts in a good Marriott points system and would be hard pressed to convert 4 (? 5) of my weeks without retaining the underlying resort and season preference. But then the devil is in the details so we'll see what system (if any) actually roles out and the specifics as it applies to my situation.

 

[jin]

"I believe there are more exchangers out there than will admit it!!! I was at Surf Club during a Plat Plus spring break week this past March. While on the check in line I inquired loudly "who here is an exchanger????". The 8 customers in front of me all waved their II certificates..."

Precisely!

"I do like flexibility of longer/shorter stays but logic tells me like for like "high end" exchanges will be more difficult. In the current system there are only certain units that can access others. In the new system, everyone with enough points has access. Please remember, it only takes one "Tues-Thurs" stay to completely wipe out a week for occupancy by another customer..."

This is true, but keep in mind it is all about Flexibilty. With a point system you may only want to stay 4 days in Oahu, 4 days in Maui, and 3 days in Kuaii. Pete

 

[puckmanfl]

Pete

Keep in mind that under the current system you are guaranteed a "summer" week no matter when you make your reservation. It may not be July 4th but you are guaranteed a week in your season.

With a new points system, there will be a time (7 mos at DVC) where everything is open, you can lose your home resort as it becomes available to the masses. thus you better know by november which summer week you want...

puckman

 

[jin]

They do have a dilemma and I agree with Perry that they are late to the party. I would agree that those weaker trading resorts for higher season will likely be the best options to get into the system, the question to me is really how does one get from her to there. As I said earlier in this thread, Gold and possibly Silver and Platinum as lessor demand resorts are likely to be the best to covert. Why would I want to give up my HH summer weeks unless Marriott really forced me or made me an offer I couldn't refuse. No only might top weeks at top resorts come out ahead not converted (at least for a few years) but it's likely that trade power might actually increase for some options.

There is really NO reason for II to change anything internally. They currently have a way to rate (and adjust) the demand and ratings of each week and resort. Other than the interface to get the weeks from Marriott points to a full week inside II and the costs associated, they really don't need to change anything. Their current system will account for differences between weeks (they don't deal with Marriott seasons) and resort quality/demand.

It was the affiliates I was referring to. No doubt that many of their resorts are top notch.

The truth is, Marriott is a much bigger system than Hilton, and like some of the Hilton affiliates, has their share of older resorts, but like Hilton even these resorts are kept to a certain standard, and still have a lot of desirability because of location, or other attributes.

 

[jin]

Pete

Keep in mind that under the current system you are guaranteed a "summer" week no matter when you make your reservation. It may not be July 4th but you are guaranteed a week in your season.

With a new points system, there will be a time (7 mos at DVC) where everything is open, you can lose your home resort as it becomes available to the masses. thus you better know by november which summer week you want...

puckman

I agree, but it also takes good planning to get the week you want in your season, and often times Marriotts platinum season is too long, meaning some owners in the top season are going to get much less desired weeks if not planning ahead. As we all know, the secret to a successful timeshare experience is to plan ahead! Pete

 

[sdgaskill1]

Marriott Owners

We attended Marriott Ko Olina presentation yesterday. According to the sales representative, Marriott will be releasing new ownership use rules in June. The new rules will likely change the priority of bookings for any owners that did not buy directly from Marriott. If so, I believe the net effect would be to de-value the timeshare resale price.

Accordingly, "they are trying to protect owners that purchased directly from Marriott". Of course, "external sales owners would still retain title, but may end up on the first floor at a time they do not wish to visit."

I have no idea if it is just a sales pitch, "telling it like it is" as the rep said, or what.

Has anyone heard this presentation?

Hello, As a former Marriott owner, what I know about their changes are 2 large ones. 1. They no longer buy back weeks, but will trade you points if you want to rent your unit. No guarantee on the rental. When I called about selling mine, their response was "try the resale market". I did that, paid a RE agent about 40% commission, and got back about 30% of my original price.We still have their charge card and get reward points to use. Now the points can be used at some timeshares, not just hotels.
2. American Airlines, starting June 2010, no longer accepts Marriott points for travel. We don't know about the other airlines.
I would ask to see, in writing, anything you are told in a sales presentation. This is the way to find out if it is valid. We were notified by American Airlines, not Marriott, about the change in points.
Good luck, Sandra Gaskill