• The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 26 years!

    Join tens of thousands of other owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered!
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $14,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $14 Million dollars
  • Follow the TUG Member Banner as it travels the world on vacation with Timeshare owners! Also sign up to get the banner sent to you so you can submit a photo of your vacation with the banner to share with TUG! Banner Thread
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free! Join tens of thousands of other owners who get this every week! Latest resort reviews and the most important topics discussed by owners during the week!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    Read more Here
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

Recorded Trust Documents

l0410z

TUG Member
Joined
Jul 20, 2005
Messages
841
Reaction score
150
Points
253
Location
Long Island, NY
Resorts Owned
Monarch Summer x 2, one enrolled. Grand Chateau 2 br EOY
A -Marriott can pull deposits from II to fulfill DC Points reservation requests. HHI Weeks are strong traders in II so that inventory bucket is already decent.

B - Plus Marriott can exercise ROFR on most HHI inventory when it's resold, resulting in them acquiring inventory at comparatively lower prices and then conveying it to the DC Trust (rather than Marriott needing to offer enrollment of them to the resale buyers.)

C - It won't be a surprise if we continue to see various creative enrollment offers from Marriott, but I don't think that the future success of the DC is going to require that enrollment of post-2010 resales be made available.
B - I didn't mean to make this an HHI discussion. I was just using this as an example. I have never traded my legacy week for points but I have read enough to think that point access during prime time at many resorts is a big issue. Are you suggesting that the inventory through II or legacy week for point exchanges are sufficient to cover most requests? If the answer yes, my post was based on wrong information. If the answer is no, if MVCI had a ROFR strategy for adding prime weeks into inventory, wouldn't the point total for many of the pre 2010 locations be higher in total point value driven by prime time acquisitions?

A - I own Monarch Summer. If I have a trade request in II to trade my Monarch for YY and the YY becomes available, Marriott can jump ahead of me to get that YY. I was not aware of this. I thought they have to get in the queue and be treated like everyone else in the queue.

C - I would guess that the majority of high point value customers are legacy owners with some adding points to achieve various levels. If I am wrong, stop here. If this is true, this would suggest an age element to both legacy and new customers. New customers tend to to be younger and have less money, not until the profile of many of us when we purchased years ago. As the cost per point goes up, I wonder what will drive the future success of point ownership for younger customers.
 

Hobee

TUG Member
Joined
May 30, 2011
Messages
88
Reaction score
7
Points
118
Location
Ohio
Resorts Owned
Marriott: Barony Beach, OceanWatch, SurfWatch, MountainSide
Breakdown by Property

Resort.....................................Points
Grand Chateau..........................52,703,750
Ko'Olina...............................30,045,750
Newport Coast..........................29,394,500
Oceana Palms...........................23,391,250
Grande Vista...........................19,272,750
Kalanipu'u.............................18,293,500
Timber Lodge...........................17,677,250
Shadow Ridge II........................13,429,500
Maui Ocean Club........................11,981,250
Ritz Carlton Club - Vail...............11,813,500
The Mayflower..........................10,748,750
Crystal Shores..........................9,598,250
Cypress Harbour.........................9,156,000
Maui Ocean Club Sequel..................8,773,500
Ocean Pointe............................8,588,000
Harbour Lake............................8,506,500
Shadow Ridge............................8,053,750
Desert Springs II.......................7,686,750
Canyon Villas...........................5,820,500
Kauai Beach Club........................5,204,250
Ocean Watch.............................4,656,250
Willow Ridge Lodge......................4,552,000
Waiohai.................................4,446,000
Grand Residence Lake Tahoe..............4,322,250
Desert Springs I........................4,299,000
BeachPlace Towers.......................3,734,000
Barony Beach Club.......................3,339,750
Grande Ocean............................3,159,250
Fairway Villas..........................2,827,750
Ritz Carlton Club - San Francisco.......2,678,000
Frenchman's Cove........................2,553,750
Surfwatch...............................2,532,500
Villas at Doral.........................2,423,750
Mountain Side...........................2,249,250
Royal Palms.............................2,134,750
Lakeshore Reserve.......................2,021,000
Summit Watch............................1,996,000
Ritz Carlton Club - St Thomas...........1,841,250
Legends Edge............................1,588,500
Manor Club..............................1,558,500
Sabal Palms.............................1,545,500
Ritz Carlton Club - Lake Tahoe..........1,462,750
Mountain Valley Lodge...................1,248,750
Manor Club Sequel.......................1,083,000
Streamside..............................1,007,500
Monarch at Sea Pines......................995,750
Imperial Palms............................714,500
Harbour Pointe............................665,000
Harbour Club..............................303,750
Heritage Club.............................267,500
Ritz Carlton Club - St Thomas Suites......243,250
Sunset Pointe.............................159,500
Grand Total...........................378,749,500
This very interesting. Kind of suspected Grand Chateau and Ko’Olina at the top and some of the smaller (but nice) HHI resorts with less Trust ownership. I was surprised that Newport Coast was near the top. How is this information obtained?
 

Fasttr

TUG Review Crew
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2013
Messages
4,312
Reaction score
1,252
Points
298
Location
Connecticut
Resorts Owned
Marriott's Grande Ocean
MVC Trust Points
This very interesting. Kind of suspected Grand Chateau and Ko’Olina at the top and some of the smaller (but nice) HHI resorts with less Trust ownership. I was surprised that Newport Coast was near the top. How is this information obtained?
Hopefully @dioxide45 will chime in, but I believe he tracked conveyances to the trust via recordings in Orange County FL.
 

GregT

TUG Member
TUG Member
Joined
Jul 19, 2007
Messages
6,544
Reaction score
961
Points
399
Location
Carlsbad, CA
Resorts Owned
Marriott: Maui Ocean Club Lahaina Villas (3BRx5), Ko Olina, Shadow Ridge II, Willow Ridge, DC Points HGVC: HHV Lagoon, Flamingo, Sea World, I-Drive, Starwood Bella (x4), SDO, Aulani, Worldmark
Steven is correct. @dioxide45 figured out how to find the filings showing the weeks that were assigned/deposited to the trust. He built a system that read the PDF files and converted them to a spreadsheet. He shared the master spreadsheet with me because he is a good guy.

It was time consuming but interesting and we would debate what it was showing us. We would see huge deposits when a property opened a new building and significant points were deposited.

But it was inconclusive.

At the end of the day, Marriott had found ways to get access to the vital inventory needed (Trust/enrolled weeks/II trades) to make the point system work - Bravo Marriott!

I think a lot about this stuff - and I finally decided the inventory will be there - Ko Olina is highly accessible, plus a few other properties I really like (Ritz STT - especially with Trust point) and I stopped analyzing.

I do not know if Jeremy continues to update the spreadsheet, but it was interesting in the early days.

Best,

Greg
 

dioxide45

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
May 20, 2006
Messages
29,919
Reaction score
4,146
Points
699
Location
NE Florida
Resorts Owned
Marriott's Grande Vista
Marriott's Harbour Lake
SVV - Bella
SVV - Key West
Everyone here is correct. Each conveyance of points is recorded in Orange County Florida as a Notice. This was done at the resort level, usually twice a year. It was a lot of work, but with some help from @GregT I was able to use OCR to capture much of the data. Even with that, it required a lot of manual effort to convert all the conveyances in to the spreadsheet and it has been a number of years since I have updated the list.
 

Hobee

TUG Member
Joined
May 30, 2011
Messages
88
Reaction score
7
Points
118
Location
Ohio
Resorts Owned
Marriott: Barony Beach, OceanWatch, SurfWatch, MountainSide
Thank you for that explanation and your previous efforts. Seems then that it not part of MVCI’s annual reports or disclosures.
 

Fasttr

TUG Review Crew
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2013
Messages
4,312
Reaction score
1,252
Points
298
Location
Connecticut
Resorts Owned
Marriott's Grande Ocean
MVC Trust Points
Seems then that it not part of MVCI’s annual reports or disclosures.
The disclosures I have seen from MVC only list the resorts where they have Trust inventory. So it could be one unit week and it gets listed the same as if they owned the entire resort. Not of much help.
 
Last edited:

Hobee

TUG Member
Joined
May 30, 2011
Messages
88
Reaction score
7
Points
118
Location
Ohio
Resorts Owned
Marriott: Barony Beach, OceanWatch, SurfWatch, MountainSide
The disclosures I have seen from MVC only list the resorts where they have Trust inventory. So it could be one unit week and it gets listed the same as if they owned the entire resort. Not of much help.
Thanks Fasttr
 
Top