Owner Update and HGV Max

[GT75]

Seriously though...my concern is what happens to a newly built property by Hilton? Does that property go under the New Max Program and only Max Owners will have access? Or does that go into the HGVC Program? Basically...are CURRENT HGVC Members stuck forever with only the current properties as of today? Or will they continue to add properties? Is Max just an added benefit similar to the Elite Benefits or is this a totally new program and the "Legacy HGVC Members" are being phased out?

Good question, but we don't know what happens moving forward. First I would wait until we see how the dust here. Secondly, per the current new rules this HGV Max doesn't transfer to new owners.

 

[brp]

They showed me the before and after and they are close but not exact

Is it more than the difference between 32 and 50/1.6 (31.25) or 16 and 25/1.6 (15.625)? My understanding was that this amount of rounding error was all we were supposed to see. Not that I would ever exchange

Cheers.

 

[HuskerATL]

Who is this Max guy everyone is talking about?

Seriously though...my concern is what happens to a newly built property by Hilton? Does that property go under the New Max Program and only Max Owners will have access? Or does that go into the HGVC Program? Basically...are CURRENT HGVC Members stuck forever with only the current properties as of today? Or will they continue to add properties? Is Max just an added benefit similar to the Elite Benefits or is this a totally new program and the "Legacy HGVC Members" are being phased out?

I can't answer all of that but it sounded like you only need to join Max if you want access to DRI. The salesperson also commented that they aren't going to build many new facilities any longer because it is cheaper and quicker to acquire existing but new purchases would move to points instead of deeds and the Elite program is independent from Max since you can be in it whether you are in Max or not. They are restructuring the Elite program though and it won't be called that. It will be premium, premium plus, etc. and the point structures are changing with more categories and with a pre-elite and a 100,000 point category.

 

[NiteMaire]

This. There is a small subset of places we'd really want, and they are in the same collection, so this should work for us.

Yep. Unless grandfathered and/or included in a purchase from developer, I don't see a rush of HGVC owners opting to pay it. I would imagine the same if the buy-in is similar for DRI owners.

We own a retail unit and may be inclined to upgrade for $10k for another deed if they could throw the Max fee into the deal and we could get Elite designation plus bonus points.

I can't remember where I read it, but I recall reading that if you opt-in/pay the initiation, your entire portfolio is converted to HGV Max. This could be a bad thing depending on the initial inventory in HGV Max (unless you still have the normal access within HGVC). @HuskerATL any mention of having to convert entire ownership to Max if owners join?

 

[HuskerATL]

Is it more than the difference between 32 and 50/1.6 (31.25) or 16 and 25/1.6 (15.625)? My understanding was that this amount of rounding error was all we were supposed to see. Not that I would ever exchange

Cheers.

I didn't do the math but just saw the overall numbers. He asked me if I wanted any of those "demo" papers and I should have taken them but I was ready to get out of there. The numbers were close though and he commented that they were actually better for us.... Take that for what it is...

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Yep. Unless grandfathered and/or included in a purchase from developer, I don't see a rush of HGVC owners opting to pay it. I would imagine the same if the buy-in is similar for DRI owners.

I can't remember where I read it, but I recall reading that if you opt-in/pay the initiation, your entire portfolio is converted to HGV Max. This could be a bad thing depending on the initial inventory in HGV Max. @HuskerATL any mention of having to convert entire ownership to Max if owners join?

Oh no! My impression is that you would have access to the same inventory as everyone else. I hope this isn't another separate trust inventory mess like MVC DP or Sheraton Flex where you only have access to "HGV Max enrolled trust inventory." If true, this could be a deal killer because it will take years to build and you will only see limited inventory.

 

[NiteMaire]

Oh no! My impression is that you would have access to the same inventory as everyone else. I hope this isn't another separate trust inventory mess like MVC DP or Sheraton Flex where you only have access to "HGV Max enrolled inventory." If true, this could be a deal killer because it will take years to build and you will only see limited inventory.

I don't know and updated my post to reflect "unless you still have the normal access within HGVC" (apparently at the same time you were typing this). I wonder if it's spelled out in the new rules.
I promise I'm not trying to spread fear, uncertainty, and doubt.

 

[HuskerATL]

Yep. Unless grandfathered and/or included in a purchase from developer, I don't see a rush of HGVC owners opting to pay it. I would imagine the same if the buy-in is similar for DRI owners.

I can't remember where I read it, but I recall reading that if you opt-in/pay the initiation, your entire portfolio is converted to HGV Max. This could be a bad thing depending on the initial inventory in HGV Max (unless you still have the normal access within HGVC). @HuskerATL any mention of having to convert entire ownership to Max if owners join?

My assumption when talking to him is that all your points would be in Max but I didn't ask that question. I did think it was interesting that they are pushing us away from resales but, they told us that once you are in Max, you can buy resales to add to the point total.

 

[HuskerATL]

Oh no! My impression is that you would have access to the same inventory as everyone else. I hope this isn't another separate trust inventory mess like MVC DP or Sheraton Flex where you only have access to "HGV Max enrolled trust inventory." If true, this could be a deal killer because it will take years to build and you will only see limited inventory.

He drew three circles on a piece of paper with a small circle representing HGVC and another circle representing DRI with arrows for both pointing to a circle representing Max. If you are in Max, you get access to all of HGVC and DRI but if you choose not to, you stay within the smaller circles. He said that DRI has 75% of the total inventory of Max so the benefit for HGVC members is more inventory at lowered costs.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

He drew three circles on a piece of paper with a small circle representing HGVC and another circle representing DRI with arrows for both pointing to a circle representing Max. If you are in Max, you get access to all of HGVC and DRI but if you choose not to, you stay within the smaller circles. He said that DRI has 75% of the total inventory of Max so the benefit for HGVC members is more inventory at lowered costs.

That is an interesting comment. Was he saying:

1) you needed to relinquish your weeks deeds and get land trust points to own instead (similar to MVC Dest points or Sheraton Flex)

Or

2) you keep your deeds but at some date you opt to convert your HGVC to Max points for the use year. Similar to MVC weeks enrollment

Or

3) something different?

Sorry to pepper you with questions. If you don't know that's fine. You've shared a lot of info. We may need a few more people to attend presentations "for the team" to fully understand this program!

 

[HuskerATL]

That is an interesting comment. Was he saying:

1) you needed to relinquish your weeks deeds and get land trust points to own instead (similar to MVC Dest points or Sheraton Flex)

Or

2) you keep your deeds but at some date you opt to convert your HGVC to Max points for the use year. Similar to MVC weeks enrollment

Or

3) something different?

Sorry to pepper you with questions. If you don't know that's fine. You've shared a lot of info. We may need a few more people to attend presentations "for the team" to fully understand this program!

He told me that we do not lose our deeds. He commented that he also has deeds but after Max is started, they will move to points (UBI) for new members. I don't know what would happen if a person joined Max later, with only points, and then bought a resale. We decided to do the "upgrade" from the 2 resale gold Blvds to the platinum Kahola and will have a deed for it and will be in Max plus Elite. He told me that they will send me a Max packet so I can update everyone when I get it. I did email him some more questions and can add more updates when he responds.

 

[NiteMaire]

He drew three circles on a piece of paper with a small circle representing HGVC and another circle representing DRI with arrows for both pointing to a circle representing Max. If you are in Max, you get access to all of HGVC and DRI but if you choose not to, you stay within the smaller circles.

I have a question outside of those @CalGalTraveler has asked.
As expected and drawn for you, Max get access to HGVC and DRI. We now know access to DRI access comes at the 6-month point before checkin. I presume you maintain ability to reserve at your home resort (those with deeds), but how many months prior to checkin are you allowed to reserve at (non-home) HGVC resorts? Same question for owners that will only own points.

 

[dougp26364]

HGV Max members total club dues will be $281 which includes AI is how I read it. Having AI would be a nice benefit.

View attachment 50874

yes it would, but not with that $7,000 up front fee. They’ll here me laughing in every corner of the sales room if they think I’m paying $7,000 up front for an AI membership fee

 

[HuskerATL]

I have a question outside of those @CalGalTraveler has asked.
As expected and drawn for you, Max get access to HGVC and DRI. We now know access to DRI access comes at the 6-month point before checkin. I presume you maintain ability to reserve at your home resort (those with deeds), but how many months prior to checkin are you allowed to reserve at (non-home) HGVC resorts? Same question for owners that will only own points.

According to the presentation yesterday, 9 months but 10 months if you are Elite.

 

[NiteMaire]

According to the presentation yesterday, 9 months but 10 months if you are Elite.

Thanks. I was just coming back to post that I found some info on another thread. That's in line with this post (granted it's not for all HGVC) https://tugbbs.com/forums/threads/hgv-max-in-the-club-reference-guide.336677/post-2762722
To summarize: If you join HGV Max, it appears your reservation window is shorter than HGVC owners (as expected). Yes, you gain access to DRI, but you lose part of your reservation window (outside of your home resort).

 

[GMan82]

yes it would, but not with that $7,000 up front fee. They’ll here me laughing in every corner of the sales room if they think I’m paying $7,000 up front for an AI membership fee

At $7000, and $59 saved per reservation (assuming no change in fee for simplicity), it would take 119 reservations to break even. At 3 reservations per year, you’re just shy of 40 years to recoup that cost just on the AI alone. So I think the AI is just a carrot to entice people into the program who eschew fees. A selling point. So really you’re paying for access to the DRI resorts at the 6 month mark.

Now, if it’s true as implied in a post above mine that by joining HGV Max, you move from the Club 9-month window to the Max 6-month window even for your home program (assuming HGV here), that to me might be a red flag. I hope that’s not true.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

According to the presentation yesterday, 9 months but 10 months if you are Elite.

Whoa - This is a new twist. So are they saying that if you are Elite (aka developer purchase) you get club access at 10 months instead of 9? Did you see this in writing?

FWIW, I am not sure how this would even work because it would conflict with home resort reservations. Could be the sales rep talking...

 

[brp]

Now, if it’s true as implied in a post above mine that by joining HGV Max, you move from the Club 9-month window to the Max 6-month window even for your home program (assuming HGV here), that to me might be a red flag. I hope that’s not true.

Hadn't contemplated that with all this info. Pretty sure that they can't (in terms of uproar) do that. I'd guess that some notion of "home program" has top exist. Well, at least for existing contracts. Wonder if new ones would be bought without a "home program" designation. That would be bad.

Cheers.

 

[GT75]

Whoa - This is a new twist. So are they saying that if you are Elite (aka developer purchase) you get club access at 10 months instead of 9? Did you see this in writing?

Yes, I would want to see that in writing. I don't see it in the updated rules for elite benefits, unless this applies.

 

[GT75]

I presume you maintain ability to reserve at your home resort (those with deeds), but how many months prior to checkin are you allowed to reserve at (non-home) HGVC resorts? Same question for owners that will only own points.

Currently, it is 9-month for MOST HGVC resorts (there are exceptions and this doesn't apply to HC resorts). Currently, HGVC is deeded (no trust points). I expect that to remain with DRI being trust points. Now, I know that in post #64, the poster stated what was heard on the sales presentation. I would want to see that in writing.

To summarize: If you join HGV Max, it appears your reservation window is shorter than HGVC owners (as expected). Yes, you gain access to DRI, but you lose part of your reservation window (outside of your home resort).

No, I don't see it that way. I believe HGVC members will still have the same booking windows in HGVC if they join HGV Max (but I see how you have come to that conclusion.) Refer to the new rules:

 

[letsgobobby]

Yeah opening at 10 months to anyone else (elite, max, etc) seriously devalues my existing deeds. Would make it very hard at nine months to get into high demand weeks/locations.

 

[frank808]

yes it would, but not with that $7,000 up front fee. They’ll here me laughing in every corner of the sales room if they think I’m paying $7,000 up front for an AI membership fee

It is not full AI. Just the club reservation fee. Still have to pay to bank points, guest certificates (after the free ones), trade for HH points, etc. I needed AI, so just bought a bHC deed. Cheaper than $7K and you get some points to use.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

 

[HuskerATL]

Whoa - This is a new twist. So are they saying that if you are Elite (aka developer purchase) you get club access at 10 months instead of 9? Did you see this in writing?

FWIW, I am not sure how this would even work because it would conflict with home resort reservations. Could be the sales rep talking...

We asked him multiple times and he said that is one of the new perks coming up to the program and a selling point for getting to elite. You would have a month longer than others for reservations. That is one change and another is no reservation fees at all. Currently, it is 7 day reservations that have a no reservation fee for elite but that is changing to no fees for any reservation length.

 

[dougp26364]

It is not full AI. Just the club reservation fee. Still have to pay to bank points, guest certificates (after the free ones), trade for HH points, etc. I needed AI, so just bought a bHC deed. Cheaper than $7K and you get some points to use.

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I’ll just say that I’m VERY happy that we made the decision to increase our Marriott ownership and leave our Hilton ownership with just the one week we have. For that matter it’s now debatable if the decision we made to upgrade our EOY Karen Ave deed to an EY LV Strip deed was the right move.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

I’ll just say that I’m VERY happy that we made the decision to increase our Marriott ownership and leave our Hilton ownership with just the one week we have. For that matter it’s now debatable if the decision we made to upgrade our EOY Karen Ave deed to an EY LV Strip deed was the right move.

Huh? MVC invented the 13 month reservation advantage for multiple properties and Elite and they are requiring a $20 - 30k buy in with very expensive DP points. They require $3 /pt for resale and are further stripping mandatory resales from participating in latest program. MF are much more expensive than HGVC for similar quality.

YMMV perhaps if you are already heavily invested and grandfathered it makes sense. For us, we are leaning more toward HGVC bc we are less than 2k old points from elite. Will use HGVC for trading and just use or rent out our Westin week.