Marriott Aruba Ocean Club Owners Being Ripped Off By Marriott - READ IF AN OWNER

[luvmypt]

If I figured right, from the above letter, then we owe 2954.64 in January and 1131.50 in April for a grand total of 4085.23. If things weren't bad enough already, this certainly makes things worse.

 

[marksue]

OK here is my take in Frank’s letter and I can tell you the lack of truth in the letter astonishes me given the information that is out there today.

IT states that the board will communicate to owners through the website. How can that be when you have removed all communications from the website? How about sending a copy of all meeting minutes to all owners or posting them on the web, and not just the parts of the meeting you want to have read. Where are the minutes from the Owners meeting in October? When you say relevant information, is that what you consider relevant or do we decide what is relevant. Instead of just posting at the Ocean Club upcoming board meetings post it on the website so anyone can join in. If you represent the owners why are you hiding everything from us?

You say you are owners as well and have the same impact. This is not completely true, we don’t get a flight and a room in Aruba for no cost, you do.

Roof Replacement: He says the roof was not defective and the harsh weather caused it to need replacing. FRANK please explain why the roof leaked from day 1 if it was not defective. I bet you can’t, but you and Marriott want us to believe it was not defective. Why are you not addressing owners concerns with the roof? Why are we not going after Marriott to pay for the roof and

Windows: He says the caulking and rubber has aged, once again I say why have we had problems since day 1. He says it is being covered under warranty, then why are we paying $750,000 to waterproof the building?

Renovation: Marriott recommend a renovation @5 million less than we are paying for a renovation. If you are saying everything else Marriott wants you to and doing what Marriott wants you to, why then are we spending more money than Marriott recommended. (I got this information from my conversation with David Babich, Dirk and Troy). Following there recommendation would have saved a great deal of money for owners.

You say owners will be simply amazed at the new Marriott’s Aruba Ocean Club, that may be so for those that can afford the outrageous MF. No matter what is done it is now cheaper to rent a unit from an owner than to own a unit. And what happens when owners walk away and can no longer pay the fees? My fees for a 1 bedroom are more than my 2 bedroom in the surf club.

Financials: He states July 2008 the CPI increased to 10.2%. Why are we looking at July when this is December and the fees are for 2009. I verified that the annualized inflation rate for Aruba was 9.1%. Why did we not factor in a minimum wage increase? 3.1% does not seem out of line.

In the owners meeting it was stated that the 1 bedroom MF were going to be 1198 now it is 1257. Two bedrooms were going to be 1616 and now they are 1697. So instead of being aware of the economy and the pressure on owners they raise the fees even further. You have to wonder what these people are thinking. These fees include a 1 time charge for deficit recovery for the utility storm and utility cost over run. The storm cost us 200k. Why is Marriott not paying for that since the building was not up to par. The Hotel never had a problem like this, so don’t tell us it was because it was refurbished. The surf club is 5 years old. The ocean club had these same problems when it was 5 years old. Oh wait at 5 years old it was a rusted shell. SO at 6 years old it had the same problem as it did in Oct.

The board has also gone back on their word for billing of Assessment fees. It was supposed to be June or July of each year and now it is April this year and with your MF in 2010.

We do not need spectacular lobby’s and villas, we need well maintained and good looking lobby’s and villas. This board needs to become fiscally responsible. Currently they are not at all. Many of the owners that are going to pay for this work will not be able to enjoy it as they can not continue to pay these costs.

The wording around financials also makes you think they are preparing us for more big increases next year.

This board has operated with blinders on. They do not care about owners or they would be fighting for us. They also think we owners are not very smart by using a lot of words to make it seem like we should be paying for Marriott’s responsibility

Bottom line is this letter from Frank and the board sounds just like how Marriott spoke at the owners meeting.

ANYONE WHO DECIDES TO BUY A TIMESHARE FROM MARRIOTT BETTER DO A GOOD JOB OF DUE DILLIGENCE. Things may be good for a few years then watch out.

 

[lovearuba]

I'm not confusing Eric

Hi
I read his other posts and if hes not Marriott then he must be looking for a job there.

 

[Zac495]

I received an email with a link to a letter from Marriott board. I clicked and it said the link was inactive. ???

 

[nanceetom]

Shocked, what to do!!

I'm reading all the tug comments. Besides writing, discussiong with each other, thinking about an attorney, what should we all be doing, or is the situation just MOOT.

 

[rarena]

How about trying to get the 1100 votes for a special meeting?

 

[Eric]

!!! rewrote below

Hi
I read his other posts and if hes not Marriott then he must be looking for a job there.

 

[Eric]

You don't have to work for Marriott to understand your post had no basis of truth. Please don't try and mislead newbies to thinking yearly fees go to the company and therefore when the company wants more money, they increses fees.

 

[modoaruba]

Not saying any money is going to Marriott. OK?

But due to these financially critical times who is deciding to spend our money on refurbishing with high end items instead of just maintaining what we have?

This should be finalized by a vote of owners.

We for one do not come here to have stainless steel appliances.
We have well running kitchens and living quarters.

An occasional calking and new paint OK but I did not come here to watch an LCD TV if that is coming.

The board must think out clearly what is more important to owners.

At this rate we outprice ourselves from owning and reselling.

The more expensive the refurbishment items are the more the upkeep costs.
The more liability.

It's great to live in a mansion but remember it costs more to maintain.

Ever hear of taxation without representation?
This is spending our money with disregard to the owners.

WE NEED A VOTE!!!

The board MUST send each owner a plan with costs of what is intended to be done and the final plan should be by popular vote.

How is that for a solution?

 

[vincenzi]

Spoke with a Marriott Representative

Today, I called and spoke with a Marriott representative. He could only give me my maintenance fee for my 2 bedroom unit at Grande Ocean in Hilton Head. The fee is $1,027.66. I already knew it because it is posted on the Vacation Club website. He said the amount for the fees for Aruba Ocean Club had not be released. So, he could not give me a figure. I own two (2) two bedroom units at Aruba Ocean Club. So next year, am I going to be charged $4,672 for the maintenance fees and assessment for those two units??? It looks like I am going to have to sell some stock to pay for my Marriott fees. Oh that's right, I forgot...my portfolio has crashed!!! The timing of these unreasonable and unrealistic fees could not be worse!

 

[Dave M]

WE NEED A VOTE!!!

The board MUST send each owner a plan with costs of what is intended to be done and the final plan should be by popular vote.

How is that for a solution?

Possibly a good idea, but not one that will ever fly in the Marriott system. As clearly described in the CC&Rs, the Board of Directors has the authority to approve the budget and establish the level of MFs and any special assessments. Changing that aspect of those legal documents is, for all practicality, impossible.

 

[lovearuba]

In response to Erics quote below:

You don't have to work for Marriott to understand your post had no basis of truth. Please don't try and mislead newbies to thinking yearly fees go to the company and therefore when the company wants more money, they increses fees.


My response: You dont have to be a rocket scientist to see you work for Marriott or are closely aligned. For those of you that Eric calls newbies, take a look at his previous posts. Your allegiances are clear Eric.

 

[vincenzi]

Why Did the Board Approve Such an Unfair Budget?

Possibly a good idea, but not one that will ever fly in the Marriott system. As clearly described in the CC&Rs, the Board of Directors has the authority to approve the budget and establish the level of MFs and any special assessments. Changing that aspect of those legal documents is, for all practicality, impossible.

Dave,

Thanks for the information. If that is the case, why on earth did our Board approve a budget that is so unfair to the owners? Also, why did the Board remove Allan Cohen, our past President, who was an honest and ethical man? There are too many questions. And, no one is stepping up to give us the answers. Why???

 

[Dave M]

In my capacity as a BBS moderator....

Those who wish to continue to have the privilege of posting should stop making accusations regarding other posters. If you question the reason for my warning, please read the "Be Courteous" section of the Posting Rules, accessible from the blue bar near the top of this page.

 

[Dave M]

Dave,

Thanks for the information. If that is the case, why on earth did our Board approve a budget that is so unfair to the owners? Also, why did the Board remove Allan Cohen, our past President, who was an honest and ethical man? There are too many questions.

Beats me. Even though I'm not an owner at Ocean Club, there are a lot of things in that letter that leave me perplexed. Whether or not the fees and the 43% allocation for the roof are fair, I can't judge.

For the overwhelming majority of owners who don't have access to the type of information discussed in this thread, my guess is that most of them will read the letter, shrug their shoulders, grumble that they don't like it, pay the fees and move on.

But for those who have been paying attention here, the letter raises more questions than it answers. I think Marriott dropped the ball on communication, even if the MF and assessment are fair.

 

[Kelly&Sean]

Increase in Percentage

I own 2 one-bedroom units and 1 two-bedoom unit. My maintenance fees last year were $2,784. My maintenance fees this year are $4,212. That is an increase of $1,428. That represents an increase of 51 PERCENT FROM LAST YEAR.

With the assessment of $1,624, I will be paying $5,836 this year. That is $3,052 more then last year. That is a increase of 110 PERCENT over last years payment.

These numbers are scary. It is just wrong that they can just increase our payments by these amounts of money without our say. I did not even vote for these people. My President has been removed from his position.

 

[ecwinch]

President removed?

Sorry for question - I do not own at the Ocean Club, own at HarbourPoint in HHI.

But how was the previous president "removed"?

Also, is not their not a owner elected board? Based on the age of the Ocean Club, I assume that the board is not developer controlled.

I am currently looking at the Ocean Club as I am staying at the Surf club, and my unit faces the Ocean Club.

 

[Eric]

You are clearly in the minority. Most Marriott owners want the resorts to be nicer than their homes. As far as votes, the rules were clear when you bought.

Not saying any money is going to Marriott. OK?

But due to these financially critical times who is deciding to spend our money on refurbishing with high end items instead of just maintaining what we have?

This should be finalized by a vote of owners.

We for one do not come here to have stainless steel appliances.
We have well running kitchens and living quarters.

An occasional calking and new paint OK but I did not come here to watch an LCD TV if that is coming.

The board must think out clearly what is more important to owners.

At this rate we outprice ourselves from owning and reselling.

The more expensive the refurbishment items are the more the upkeep costs.
The more liability.

It's great to live in a mansion but remember it costs more to maintain.

Ever hear of taxation without representation?
This is spending our money with disregard to the owners.

WE NEED A VOTE!!!

The board MUST send each owner a plan with costs of what is intended to be done and the final plan should be by popular vote.

How is that for a solution?

 

[modoaruba]

Eric

Are you talking to people here at the OC or to Marriott.
Until now I had my doubts about you but you just showed your colors.

We have been at the OC 2weeks and found that the majority of discussions that we had resulted in the majority of those we spoke to share OUR
concerns.

Ironically, speaking to manager staff, they all responded with the same script.
I have yet to find someone here, ESPECIALLY owning multiple weeks,to agree with your point of view.

As for the Rules when we bought, that is a different story.
Does the word DECEPTIVE ring a bell?

 

[marksue]

Eric,

I do not believe you are correct that the majority want units nicer than thier homes. I for one don't need all the glitz, if i did I would have bought at the Ritz Carlton. I want a place at a reasonable cost that I can enjoy a vacation. Without the proper information how can owners make any decisions. The board operates in a non transparent way. They are not performing thier fiduciary duties as elected board members. If I did not go through Marriott Corproate I would never have gotten to David Babich and found out about the unnecessary expenses the board has approved. WHen Allan was president there as a great deal of communiations. Even though Allan is still part of the board, I do believe they have prevented him from continuing to speak to owners. Tell us Frank, why are you keeping Allan from being an owners advocate? Oh i forgot Frank wants us to go through Corey. Corey, please ask Frank why he has muzzled Allan and are keeping him from being an Owners Advocate. He is the only one on the board who has ever supported the owners.

We need to get to 1100 units so we can call a special meeting per the Governing Documents. In this meeting we will present bylaws for greater transparency as well as removal of board members.

Allan was forced out as president by the board and Marriott because he was open with the owners and was willing to speak with whoever wanted to speak. The current board wants nothing to do with the owners. That is why they put Corey in thier. SO corey is becoming an expensive secretary. I did not think we the owners approved a paid secretary for the board. Did anyone vote for that?

So the board approves unnecessary expenses and then doesn't hold Marriott responsible for thier defective building. And they want to know why the owners are angry.

 

[Luckybee]

But how was the previous president "removed"?

Also, is not their not a owner elected board? Based on the age of the Ocean Club, I assume that the board is not developer controlled.
QUOTE]

Funny you should say that about it not being "developer controlled" . It isnt supposed to be. What is of great concern to many of the owners is that that Mr Cohen duly elected to the board by the owners, was a president who communicated with the owners for the many years that he was on the board as president. When he spoke of the upcoming assesments he explained why they were being levied and most accepted. It was only after he began investigating exactly what went on vis a vie the building and the non disclosure by Marriott of a number of things did he get "removed" as president, when strangely before he started asking the tough questions the board and Marriott seemed to be quite happy with him.
My understanding is that they would have used this section of the bylaws :

7.4 Term - The officers of the Association shall hold office until their successors are chosen and qualify in their steed. Any officer elected or appointed by the Board of Directors may be removed at any time, with or without cause, by the Board, provided however, that no officer shall be removed except by the affirmative vote for removal by a majority of the whole Board of Directors, irrespective of whether the Directors are A-members or B-members (e.g. if the Board of Directors is composed of five (5) persons, then three (3) of said Directors must vote for the removal). If the office of any officer becomes vacant for any reason, the vacancy shall be filled by the Board of Directors

Keep in mind that the B member is in fact a Marriott employee. It took 2 other board members, 1 being the current president who seems to think the owners need not be communicated with, and the other an apparent Marriott cheerleader. Not ""developer controlled"...hmmmm...I think that remains to be seen. The end result certainly makes no sense at all. If the board was acting in the best interests of the owners taking into account their fiduciary obligations why would they have removed the one individual who was attempting to get to the bottom of things, communicating with the owners, and making certain that the owners interest were looked after. Instead we now have a president who by his own acc't will adamantly refuses to respond to any owners query, has provided no info on what has gone on at the last meeting, who will not provide any reports, etc(see Marks posts). Can anyone who has been following this truly wonder whose interest is being looked after here, and in whose control the board appears to be in. I go back to what I said in an earlier post. Something is definitely out of line here.
Emphasis on the word owners is to draw attention to who is supposed to be represented here

 

[Zac495]

Eric,
I did not buy Ocean Club for fancy TV's. I don't even watch TV in Aruba! I'm certainly not saying keep TV's out of the units - other people may watch TV. People touring the units now see TV's (I'm just using this as an example) - not upgraded ones - so why should they think they'll be upgraded at their expense if they buy?

You know why? Because a year later, the people on tour will see even fancier ones - and they were purchased on the backs of those who already owned. Little do they know they go to the bottom of the pile after purchase.

What about all my points? That changed! Devaluation! Points for financing - gone. Huge increase in fees.

I do understand some increase, the need for KEEPING THE UNITS UP AS SHOWN in the first place, upkeeping the pool, etc. A storm hit - special assessment - okay - don't like it, but understand it.

I am not blaming the lowly timeshare salespeople. MOST of them are just that - lowly. They aren't raising our fees. They want to sell timeshares, and many of them really believe in the product (which is still a good product - but getting unaffordable).

I blame the people on top - and the top people certainly aren't the owners. I OWN my house. Only I (and my husband) decide if we can afford a new, fancy TV.

Help me understand how it's fair that we have no say. Help me understand how it's okay to make such drastic increases (not including the special assessment) in one year in such a bleak economy. I didn't do anything ridiculous like buy a house with an interest only loan - I bought a timeshare with reasonable fees which I knew would increase with the cost of living over my lifetime. Help me understand.

 

[Eric]

Again, you knew the HOA would make decesion for you and you agreed to that. The issue seems to be HOA is not being upfront with the owners which makes no sense. I agree, if they don't represent the masses, kick them out and get people who do.

Eric,
I did not buy Ocean Club for fancy TV's. I don't even watch TV in Aruba! I'm certainly not saying keep TV's out of the units - other people may watch TV. People touring the units now see TV's (I'm just using this as an example) - not upgraded ones - so why should they think they'll be upgraded at their expense if they buy?

You know why? Because a year later, the people on tour will see even fancier ones - and they were purchased on the backs of those who already owned. Little do they know they go to the bottom of the pile after purchase.

What about all my points? That changed! Devaluation! Points for financing - gone. Huge increase in fees.

I do understand some increase, the need for KEEPING THE UNITS UP AS SHOWN in the first place, upkeeping the pool, etc. A storm hit - special assessment - okay - don't like it, but understand it.

I am not blaming the lowly timeshare salespeople. MOST of them are just that - lowly. They aren't raising our fees. They want to sell timeshares, and many of them really believe in the product (which is still a good product - but getting unaffordable).

I blame the people on top - and the top people certainly aren't the owners. I OWN my house. Only I (and my husband) decide if we can afford a new, fancy TV.

Help me understand how it's fair that we have no say. Help me understand how it's okay to make such drastic increases (not including the special assessment) in one year in such a bleak economy. I didn't do anything ridiculous like buy a house with an interest only loan - I bought a timeshare with reasonable fees which I knew would increase with the cost of living over my lifetime. Help me understand.

 

[marksue]

[Message deleted. Please see my "In my capacity as a BBS Moderator" post above for the reason. Please follow that guidance or don't post. Dave M, BBS Moderator]

 

[marksue]

Eric, yes we all knew that, but the decisions they have made are fiscal responsible or are they performing their fiduciary duties to the owners. The leaders of Enron where supposed to be operating in the interest of the company and shareholders and look what happened.

Certainly not putting the board at that level, but representatives do not always represent those that have put them there. Why did Marriott deceive us when they sold us the units by not telling us of the building status.

Dave, hopefully you are ok with this