HGV Max in the Club Reference Guide

[youppi]

Are resorts only bookable by the week? I see weekly point totals, but not anything for days. HGVC, for example, allows a 3-day minimum and has point values for weekend and weekday days.

I'd still have to wrap my head around "points" and "deeds" and "The Club" and "DeX."

What I'd want to do is own somewhere where I could use P@P and KBC, ideally in smaller increments, but a week is OK. It sounds like one could own at Sedona for lower MFs and still get these. This works well in HGVC where I own Las Vegas and use in Kona.

Also, I see comments about short-term availability being greater than medium-term. But longer term is more what we would do...9 months or so if that can be done.

Cheers.

In THE Club, DRI resorts can be booked per night with a minimum of 2 nights.
Sunday to Thursday nights are 10% of weekly points per night. Friday-Saturday nights are at 30% of weekly points.
If you book 7 nights with a checkin not from a normal checkin (normally Friday, Saturday or Sunday), the system revert to per night booking and as you can see, the total is 110% (5x10% + 2x30%).
Same thing if you book 10 nights with a Sunday checkin, you will not pay a week + 3 nights (100% + 3x10% = 130%) but you will pay 10 nights (5x10%+2x30%+3x10% = 140%).

 

[CalGalTraveler]

So if I read the points reports correctly 1 week in a Hawaii Oceanfront 2 bdrm will run between 18,000 and 21,000 points. A one bedroom OF or less than peak season about 15500 points.

Backing out the club fee that's approx $3248 to $3845/week for a 2 bdrm for 1 week peak. And sbout $2906 for a 1 bdrm 15,500 points or 2 bdrm high season (not peak).

If I calculated this correctly, that's more expensive than our Westin Kaanapali OF on Maui which is $2800/week MF (and I thought that was expensive!). However, the Westin can be locked off for $1400/week (1Bdrm/Studio) for a 2 week stay.

Lots to think about!

Do the new HGV 1.6x points now translate to Diamond points 1:1? If so, our HGV points from two different deeds, will barely get a 2 bdrm OF at P@P for a week at 21,000 points. Yet within HGVC we can get a 2 bdrm on BI or Oahu with only one of those deeds points (old 9600 points).

 

[nobodyhasthisname2]

Do the new HGV 1.6x points now translate to Diamond points 1:1? If so, our HGV points from two different deeds, will barely get a 2 bdrm OF at P@P for a week at 21,000 points. Yet within HGVC we can get a 2 bdrm on BI or Oahu with only one of those deeds points (old 9600 points).

And does that mean DRI Max members are going to fill up the HGVC Hawaii resorts because it’s less points than the resorts in their own system?

 

[NiteMaire]

And does that mean DRI Max members are going to fill up the HGVC Hawaii resorts because it’s less points than the resorts in their own system?

Depending on points, possibly. However, presuming the same timeline applies, they won't be able to reserve until 6 months out which is well after HGVC owners have had ample opportunity.

 

[Nowaker]

Backing out the club fee that's approx $3248 to $3845/week for a 2 bdrm for 1 week peak.

If you own there, sure. Most Hawaiian deeds have a terrible MFpp. Making reservations using ClubPoints from Vegas deeds is how it's very cost effective.

 

[Cewood]

As an owner at West 57th, I just don't see the value in paying $7000 for a limited access to what seem to me to be inferior resorts. Correct me if I am wrong, but the Diamond properties do not seem to be at the same level of quality as the HGVC resorts. So why would I pay anything at all to have access to an inferior system of resorts? No need to answer that rhetorical question!

 

[1Kflyerguy]

Yeah, that was something that I, and others, posed in one of these threads previously. My case involved a couple of specific, certainly popular, resorts (P@P, KBC), but not necessarily at popular times. That could well be the deal breaker for us as well. But I just don't know.

Cheers.

We have similar thoughts. There are a few resorts that interest me, but i would need to really understand what kind of access this will provide and what the actual availability is. Our current needs are reasonably covered with HGV and MVC, but have more choices is always fun.

 

[GMan82]

As an owner at West 57th, I just don't see the value in paying $7000 for a limited access to what seem to me to be inferior resorts. Correct me if I am wrong, but the Diamond properties do not seem to be at the same level of quality as the HGVC resorts. So why would I pay anything at all to have access to an inferior system of resorts? No need to answer that rhetorical question!

I think there might be a few resorts in the DRI system that might be worth visiting, but there’s a reason that HGV is re-branding Diamond as HVC without the “Grand,” in that a lot of the resorts might not be up to par with HGVC in their opinion. $7000 is steep. It might be worth staying “Legacy” and renting at those places. I also would want to see how this program looks 6-12 months after implementation and gather some opinions, mostly from TUG posters. Buying in now seems like it would be a bit of a rushed decision with inadequate information. For the AI, I’m still awaiting word on my W 57th purchase on ROFR.

 

[natarajanv]

New rule for converting to Hilton Honors:

HGVClub Legacy Members and HGV Max Legacy
Members and select HGV Max Members may
convert ClubPoints (including borrowed Points)
into Hilton Honors Points on an annual basis. All
other Members may convert ClubPoints into Hilton
Honors Points on an every other year basis.

Based on their documentation, there are only 3 types of Members. Not sure how to interpret "all other members".

 

[brp]

New rule for converting to Hilton Honors:

HGVClub Legacy Members and HGV Max Legacy
Members and select HGV Max Members may
convert ClubPoints (including borrowed Points)
into Hilton Honors Points on an annual basis. All
other Members may convert ClubPoints into Hilton
Honors Points on an every other year basis.

Based on their documentation, there are only 3 types of Members. Not sure how to interpret "all other members".

There are Members (I think that's the term) for folks who are not Legacy, i.e. buy in after the "deadline" and have no Max affiliation. These would presumably be the ones impacted.

Cheers.

 

[natarajanv]

There are Members (I think that's the term) for folks who are not Legacy, i.e. buy in after the "deadline" and have no Max affiliation. These would presumably be the ones impacted.

Cheers.

But the document says those are called HGVClub Legacy members though....

Members who do not qualify for HGV Max benefits may be referred to as “HGVClub Legacy Members.”
HGV Max Members, HGV Max Legacy Members and HGVClub Legacy Members are all “Members.”

 

[WORLD TRAVELER]

There is further explanation in the Member Guide that General Members are those who purchase resale HGVC after Max Program announcement (April 4, 2022). Legacy Members are those members who were recorded owners of HGVC contracts prior to Max Program Announcement (April 4, 2022). Legacy Grandfathered Benefits are lost upon transfer of ownership to new purchasers except in the case of transfer to immediate family members.

 

[WORLD TRAVELER]

Grandfathered Benefits currently revolve around Hilton Honors points conversion. Grandfathered Legacy members may convert every year. New Members may only convert Every Other Year. There is mention in the Guide about limits on Open Season Usage but the limits are not explicitly listed as they are with Hilton Honors points conversion.

 

[brp]

There is further explanation in the Member Guide that General Members are those who purchase resale HGVC after Max Program announcement (April 4, 2022). Legacy Members are those members who were recorded owners of HGVC contracts prior to Max Program Announcement (April 4, 2022). Legacy Grandfathered Benefits are lost upon transfer of ownership to new purchasers except in the case of transfer to immediate family members.

Yup. That makes the fourth category, as noted.

Cheers.

 

[geist1223]

Somebody asked if DRI had discounted stays. Here is a partial list. Of course to see the whole list you have to be able to sign on to DRI.

Las Vegas up to 75% off thru July
South Lake Tahoe up to 60% off thru April.
Cabo Azul up to 55% off thru May.
Powhaten up to 60% off thru May.
Sedona up to 55% off thru April and a $50 Dining Card.
Cancun up to 50% off thru May.
Modern Honolulu up to 35% off thru May.

This is only about 1/4 of the Deals listed. Resorts can be added daily.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Grandfathered Benefits currently revolve around Hilton Honors points conversion. Grandfathered Legacy members may convert every year. New Members may only convert Every Other Year. There is mention in the Guide about limits on Open Season Usage but the limits are not explicitly listed as they are with Hilton Honors points conversion.

I believe the bHC (NYC, DC) property 50:1 annual Hilton conversion is baked into the deed just as AI. However I haven't read the find print in a long time.

They sure are making this complicated for IT. First they separated bHC points from Club creating a 2 x 3 year set of buckets. Now this???? I expect more calls to Customer Service to correct buckets. We already must do this today with bHC/Club to ensure we are putting the right points years into a reservation.

 

[nobodyhasthisname2]

Depending on points, possibly. However, presuming the same timeline applies, they won't be able to reserve until 6 months out which is well after HGVC owners have had ample opportunity.

Except in the case of the Grand Islander and Hokulani, where we will all get access at the same time....

 

[brp]

They sure are making this complicated for IT. First they separated bHC points from Club creating a 2 x 3 year set of buckets. Now this???? I expect more calls to Customer Service to correct buckets. We already must do this today with bHC/Club to ensure we are putting the right points years into a reservation.

Maybe. It depends upon how they implemented it. Going from 1 bucket to >1 bucket can (and should) be done in a general way such that adding more buckets is straightforward from a backend architecture. Now, display on the website is a different issue and that may suffer some growing pains.

Cheers.

 

[SmithOp]

I don't care about HHonors conversion, no great loss there as a resale owner.

I did it once with expiring bonus points years ago. I have since sold that original developer purchase that netted the bonus points. I wonder if they will still consider me a retail owner and offer the $7k Max sign up?


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[GMan82]

I wonder when HGV will send an official email out to explain the quirks of the new program

 

[Cewood]

Is there any indication of whether the DRI resorts will still be available for RCI trade if you are not an HGVC Max member? I don't see any mention of Max-related changes in RCI rules.

 

[1Kflyerguy]

I wonder when HGV will send an official email out to explain the quirks of the new program

I have been wondering that as well.. Right now everyone here on TUG and the various FB groups is parsing out the new program based on what's published. There may be a slight difference in how HGV interprets some of this..

I am hoping they do actually roll out a general communication with information, and not just expect everyone to attend an update for details...

 

[dayooper]

I wonder when HGV will send an official email out to explain the quirks of the new program

I have been wondering that as well.. Right now everyone here on TUG and the various FB groups is parsing out the new program based on what's published. There may be a slight difference in how HGV interprets some of this..

I am hoping they do actually roll out a general communication with information, and not just expect everyone to attend an update for details...

I have heard April 15 being the day the the website is launched. Maybe that's the day we will see more info.

The issue I would have is the 10 month booking date for Elite members. That would eliminate several properties as options for us regulars. I understand why they would do that (don't agree with it), but that would be the biggest limitation to the legacy program. I'm sure we can find way, buy that makes hard to book resorts even harder for us. Even new resorts not being available isn't that big of an issue but to pay more for what we already had is a serious steaming pile.

HGV Max is why I would have a very hard time paying developer prices. All the money some families spent on their deeds and now they have to pay more to be part of the new program? I would not be happy one bit. I'm pretty disappointed with how this was rolled out but they really don't care about someone like me. It's fine, I'll enjoy what I have and use my money on other trips. Maybe I'll even take a dab into Marriott with a resale in Hilton Head.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

It appears that the trend for developers is:

1) Convince owners to buy more: upgrade, new programs etc. Sticking with a deeded week will not hurt you unless you have a low value week.
2) Limiting resale capability - to date HGV has been generous with resale relative to competitors. They are now catching up to MVC and Wyndham limitations.
3) Closing loopholes
4) Beefing up elite programs to make it worthwhile to buy from the developer.
5) Selling fear that you won't have access to inventory (reality: at $20 - $30k program buy-in to reach elite it will take years to affect inventory). Fear is a big MVC message with Vistana right now. Don't believe it.

I was disappointed to see that there was little benefit to buying our first unit retail -we watched the value of what we purchased plummet. Making retail buyers feel stupid is not a good strategy. This is now coming back to roost with these new rules and we may now see some benefit from our original retail purchase.

Just as points trading programs change, resales strategies need to change. Nothing is forever. Buying deeds where you want to go and trade in RCI/DEX is still a viable strategy if you don't want to invest in the new program. You can simply use what you own.

It appears that HGV are grandfathering resales - something they don't have to do. We should feel good that we will get many years of enjoyment at resale bargain basement prices. Nothing is forever. When it doesn't work anymore, move on or change your strategy. Smile because you have saved thousands and will continue to do so for the foreseeable future.

 

[iiderman]

It appears that the trend for developers is:

1) Convince owners to buy more: upgrade, new programs etc. Sticking with a deeded week will not hurt you unless you have a low value week.
2) Limiting resale capability - to date HGV has been generous with resale relative to competitors. They are now catching up to MVC and Wyndham limitations.
3) Closing loopholes
4) Beefing up elite programs to make it worthwhile to buy from the developer.
5) Selling fear that you won't have access to inventory (reality: at $20 - $30k program buy-in to reach elite it will take years to affect inventory). Fear is a big MVC message with Vistana right now. Don't believe it.

I was disappointed to see that there was little benefit to buying our first unit retail -we watched the value of what we purchased plummet. Making retail buyers feel stupid is not a good strategy. This is now coming back to roost with these new rules and we may now see some benefit from our original retail purchase.

Just as points trading programs change, resales strategies need to change. Nothing is forever. Buying deeds where you want to go and trade in RCI/DEX is still a viable strategy if you don't want to invest in the new program. You can simply use what you own.

It appears that HGV are grandfathering resales - something they don't have to do. We should feel good that we will get many years of enjoyment at resale bargain basement prices. Nothing is forever. When it doesn't work anymore, move on or change your strategy. Smile because you have saved thousands and will continue to do so for the foreseeable future.

One of the “loopholes” they just closed; resale purchases in Scotland and Southwest Florida that used to count towards elite.. NO LONGER allowed effective April 4