HELP! Just bought more Wyndham points...

[Ford1]

My Mom has owned a timeshare for more around 20 years. She started in Fairfield and was grandfathered into Wyndham. We just spent 6 hours today with a representative discussing how to reduce her maintenance fees and get her out of a fixed week in Fairfield Bay Arkansas. She has 670,000 total points and 105,000 in the Bay. We don't mind having the deeded property so much but the maintenance fees are high (almost the same per month for the Bay as they are for the 500+ CWA points). Wyndham offered us 2 solutions. One was to go Platinum which is not affordable at all, the second was to convert the 105,000 to CWA points but we have to purchase an additional 130,000 to do the deal. The purchase price is $28,000. My Mom is desperate to get this straightened out so we agreed, but after coming home I have crunched some numbers and found that even with the reduced maintenance for the deeded points the monthly payments will still go up from about $500 to $1,000 plus they put the down payment on a new Wyndham credit card that has an interest rate of 16-27% after 6mo and an annual fee of $75 (we did not know about the fee). I think we need to stop the purchase of the additional points, any thoughts?

Also, any suggestions on what we should do about the deeded week? Any other way to get rid of it? We can't do Ovation because there is a remaining balance on it (I haven't called them I just read a few articles about it online). In a perfect world we would like for it all to be gone but we are in so deep and still owe on them.

Any advice or suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[hensongroup1]

Use Wyndham Cares division and see which of the contracts are eligible for Ovation. If not then consider picking up a WorldMark Club ownership and take the time to research the product and all the benefits. Considering there was no cost, if you vacation you might enjoy keeping them.
You kind find the info for Wyndham cares on the Wyndham Destinations website.
Hope this helps


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Lisa P]

...We don't mind having the deeded property so much but the maintenance fees are high (almost the same per month for the Bay as they are for the 500+ CWA points).....
...we have to purchase an additional 130,000 to do the deal. The purchase price is $28,000... they put the down payment on a new Wyndham credit card that has an interest rate of 16-27% after 6mo and an annual fee of $75.... any thoughts?
...We can't do Ovation because there is a remaining balance on it.

STOP! RESCIND NOW!
You're concerned about maint fee and loan payments and now you're adding a $28K purchase at 16-27% interest. NOT a good plan!

You spoke to sales. It is the salesperson's job to sell you more product. Period. He or she is NOT there to help you with what is already owned.

Use Wyndham Cares division and see which of the contracts are eligible for Ovation. If not then consider picking up a WorldMark Club ownership and take the time to research the product and all the benefits. Considering there was no cost, if you vacation you might enjoy keeping them.

Agree about contacting Wyndham Cares or Owner Care. Disagree about the OP's $28K purchase being "no cost" or any suggestion to take on another ownership while paying off a purchase.

OP, your mother is paying almost the same per month on 105K converted fixed week as on 500K+ CWA. Her problem with the Bay payment is NOT the maint fee, it's the remaining developer loan payment. The solution offered by Wyndham SALES is to substitute another loan for a larger amount!

Don't throw good money after bad. Sorry she still has a developer loan to pay off but this is NO SOLUTION. Rescind the purchase while you can. Follow the directions in the contract to the letter. Do not phone sales. Do it in writing by U.S. Mail, postmarked ASAP!

 

[Lisa P]

By the way, if you want more points to vacation once the loan is paid off, a resale purchase may be added to your account for a small fraction of the developer cost. Unless you need VIP levels, stay away from timeshare SALESpeople. Sometimes, they'll just make a bad idea (spending another $28K you don't need to spend) look good and sometimes they'll flat-out lie.

Hopefully, more Tuggers here will chime in shortly. It sounds like you need to rescind pronto!

 

[Jan M.]

Is it the 105,000 deed at Fairfield Bay that she owes on or the CWA contract. I'm guessing it is probably the CWA contract because it wasn't around 20 years ago and Fairfield Bay was.

What is her VIP level? If it is silver there is nothing to worry about but if it is gold then you don't want to lose being grandfathered in on that. If she bought the CWA points or had a large number of other points she traded in to buy her CWA points before October of 2012 she might possibly be gold. Since it was only 500,000 points to be gold back before they raised the level requirements then she might even be able to just get rid of the Fairfield Bay deed and still keep that grandfathered gold VIP status.

If she isn't gold or getting rid of the Fairfield Bay deed won't hurt her gold status if she does have it then no worries. But if is gold and getting rid of it will hurt her status then what you and she could do to protect it is buy a comparable number of points through Wyndham corporate telesales. It would cost far, far less than what this sales person sold you. When the new points are in her account then she can get rid of the Fairfield Glade deed.

Have you actually contacted Ovations and been told they won't take it? If Wyndham Cares isn't any help you can trying giving it away here on TUG.

 

[grab]

I suggest do first things first.
Rescind your new purchase today.
There are instructions to do this and follow the instructions. Mail the letter even if you are at the resort.
I agree with others on next steps but the clock is ticking on your option to rescind.

 

[Ford1]

So I spoke with my Mom this morning. She says the Bay is actually paid for but when she last met with a Wyndham person they told her that she couldn't get rid of it. To the best of my knowledge she hasn't spoken with Ovation. I just learned about a lot of this stuff yesterday but it looks suspicious to me. The didn't give us the contract yesterday they gave us some papers we need to have notarized and mail back to them. I told her we should cancel the contract today but she is worried the maintenance fees for the Bay will double or triple in the next years because of the resorts age and she will be paying more than she would be with these new points. I am working on explaining it to her so that she sees there are options for getting rid of the Bay deed that she is worried about.

 

[Passepartout]

Buying more will NEVER make the payments go down! Rescind TODAY!

Jim

 

[Egret1986]

As has been already stated, RESCIND now!!!

In a perfect world we would like for it all to be gone but we are in so deep and still owe on them.

Any advice or suggestions would be appreciated.

Spending $28,000 more is not the answer! You want to be out of this mess. You stated so. Why dig in deeper?

I am not familiar with Wyndham. I hope once this new contract is rescinded that you will work on the issues of owning and still owing, and how your Mom might best work through this part of the problem. In no way should spending $28,000 be the choice. That $28,000 could go a long way on paying off any loans and rise in maintenance fees. Sales folks are not your friends and they are not looking out for your best interests.

 

[Ford1]

I'm looking more into my Mom's timeshare now. It seems they really lied to her a lot. She had another deeded set of points they convinced her to switch to CWA, with the purchase of additional points of course. That's how she got into the high payments for her "loan." She had everything paid for under Fairfield and didn't need those points (especially at that price) just like she doesn't need these. I have no idea why the deed for the Bay wasn't included then. We don't have the contract to find instructions for rescinding, she says they told her they would mail it. I will call them as soon as I figure out what's going on. I also have to cancel this new credit card they signed her up for. It adds a whole new level to the scam.

 

[jwalk03]

You cannot rescind by calling. You have to rescind in writing according to the terms of the contract. The contract may have been provided on a disc instead of on paper?

 

[Passepartout]

Absent instructions, I lifted this from another TUGger in another thread. Don't cancel the credit card if it was used for a down payment UNTIL AFTER the payment has been credited to it. Then cancel it.

Wyndham Vacation Resorts Inc
Attention: Account Servicing Operations Department
PO Box 94443
Las Vegas, Nevada 89193

Or
10750 West Charleston Boulavard
Suite 130
Las Vegas, Nevada 89135

Make sure everyone that signed the contract also has to sign the rescission letter.

Keep the rescission letter simple

Date

We/I are canceling contract number ——————-
Purchased at the Wyndham Resort———
On the date of————-

All sign and date
Print name

Send USPS certified with no signature required or return receipt. Track the letter and print off the tracking ounce the letter has been delivered as your proof of rescission.
Don’t worry about the date of delivery as your rescission date is the date of the postmark

Jim

 

[grab]

Absent instructions, I lifted this from another TUGger in another thread. Don't cancel the credit card if it was used for a down payment UNTIL AFTER the payment has been credited to it. Then cancel it.

Wyndham Vacation Resorts Inc
Attention: Account Servicing Operations Department
PO Box 94443
Las Vegas, Nevada 89193

Or
10750 West Charleston Boulavard
Suite 130
Las Vegas, Nevada 89135

Make sure everyone that signed the contract also has to sign the rescission letter.

Keep the rescission letter simple

Date

We/I are canceling contract number ——————-
Purchased at the Wyndham Resort———
On the date of————-

All sign and date
Print name

Send USPS certified with no signature required or return receipt. Track the letter and print off the tracking ounce the letter has been delivered as your proof of rescission.
Don’t worry about the date of delivery as your rescission date is the date of the postmark

Jim

Sounds like OP didn’t sign the contract since there was no notary present (stupid Wyndham). Even so I would send Rescission letter today as noted above, adding that you “want a full refund applied to the credit card and then for the credit card to be cancelled”.

 

[Ford1]

Thank you everyone for the advice. My Mom is the sole owner of the contract(s) but because my Dad was with her and signed the contract for the Bay (even though he is no longer an owner) they need his signature as well, hence the notary. They said it was a formality for the deal. But just out of curiosity I called Wyndham and that property is eligible for pathways (grandfathered in during 2014) so she can get rid of it and will get 20%, so they lied about that. It's good advice about the credit card, we were just discussing how we should handle that. My Mom is worried she will still be responsible for paying the down payment even if she rescinds the contract, but as someone else pointed out I don't think the contract is official yet since there is still the "formality" of my Dads signature.

We bought these new points in Nashville should we send the letter there or to the addresses in Nevada as listed above?

I'm tempted to ask for an emailed copy of the contract just so I can see what it says but I'm not sure about talking with the people who tried to sell us the points. There were two sales people and the contract specialist.

 

[Ford1]

Is it the 105,000 deed at Fairfield Bay that she owes on or the CWA contract. I'm guessing it is probably the CWA contract because it wasn't around 20 years ago and Fairfield Bay was.

What is her VIP level? If it is silver there is nothing to worry about but if it is gold then you don't want to lose being grandfathered in on that. If she bought the CWA points or had a large number of other points she traded in to buy her CWA points before October of 2012 she might possibly be gold. Since it was only 500,000 points to be gold back before they raised the level requirements then she might even be able to just get rid of the Fairfield Bay deed and still keep that grandfathered gold VIP status.

If she isn't gold or getting rid of the Fairfield Bay deed won't hurt her gold status if she does have it then no worries. But if is gold and getting rid of it will hurt her status then what you and she could do to protect it is buy a comparable number of points through Wyndham corporate telesales. It would cost far, far less than what this sales person sold you. When the new points are in her account then she can get rid of the Fairfield Glade deed.

Have you actually contacted Ovations and been told they won't take it? If Wyndham Cares isn't any help you can trying giving it away here on TUG.

I called Ovations today. The Bay is paid for, the CWA is not. She traded in a lot of points for the CWA but she still owes quite a bit for it. She is currently Gold with 670 points but ovations said if we get rid of either we will loose the status. The 500+ is eligible for pathways next year (Mom said that was the reason she bought the points and consolidated, they told her it was the only way to get rid of the time share). Ovation recommended using Extra Holidays to rent out our points until it's paid for to help with her costs, does anyone know anything about the program?

I know Mom enjoys the resorts, the ease of booking (she does it over the phone), and the convenience but she hates meeting with the "people" account managers, sales people, update presentations, etc. I don't know if the best thing for her would be to do pathways and get rid of it all, to rent out a significant portion to help with costs, or to retain only one of the two to have some points but not the burden of all of it.

I have seen that she can purchase resale points for almost nothing can we get rid of what she has and buy new points with lower maintenance fees? Any advice?

 

[grab]

Thank you everyone for the advice. My Mom is the sole owner of the contract(s) but because my Dad was with her and signed the contract for the Bay (even though he is no longer an owner) they need his signature as well, hence the notary. They said it was a formality for the deal. But just out of curiosity I called Wyndham and that property is eligible for pathways (grandfathered in during 2014) so she can get rid of it and will get 20%, so they lied about that. It's good advice about the credit card, we were just discussing how we should handle that. My Mom is worried she will still be responsible for paying the down payment even if she rescinds the contract, but as someone else pointed out I don't think the contract is official yet since there is still the "formality" of my Dads signature.

We bought these new points in Nashville should we send the letter there or to the addresses in Nevada as listed above?

I'm tempted to ask for an emailed copy of the contract just so I can see what it says but I'm not sure about talking with the people who tried to sell us the points. There were two sales people and the contract specialist.

If you feel more comfortable sending the recision letter to Las Vegas AND Nashville then an extra stamp is all it takes. Better save than sorry.

But don’t forget to send to Vegas as I’m almost certain that is all you have to do and you must do that.

I also would not ask for the contract or talk to anyone about it.

Rescind, breathe, research.

 

[grab]

And get the rescind letter in the mail ASAP as there is a deadline potentially (even though you lucked out not having dad there).

 

[Larry M]

My Mom has owned a timeshare for more around 20 years. She started in Fairfield and was grandfathered into Wyndham. We just spent 6 hours today with a representative discussing how to reduce her maintenance fees and get her out of a fixed week in Fairfield Bay Arkansas. She has 670,000 total points and 105,000 in the Bay. We don't mind having the deeded property so much but the maintenance fees are high (almost the same per month for the Bay as they are for the 500+ CWA points). Wyndham offered us 2 solutions. One was to go Platinum which is not affordable at all, the second was to convert the 105,000 to CWA points but we have to purchase an additional 130,000 to do the deal. The purchase price is $28,000. My Mom is desperate to get this straightened out so we agreed, but after coming home I have crunched some numbers and found that even with the reduced maintenance for the deeded points the monthly payments will still go up from about $500 to $1,000 plus they put the down payment on a new Wyndham credit card that has an interest rate of 16-27% after 6mo and an annual fee of $75 (we did not know about the fee). I think we need to stop the purchase of the additional points, any thoughts?

Also, any suggestions on what we should do about the deeded week? Any other way to get rid of it? We can't do Ovation because there is a remaining balance on it (I haven't called them I just read a few articles about it online). In a perfect world we would like for it all to be gone but we are in so deep and still owe on them.

Any advice or suggestions would be appreciated.

Here is exactly how to get rid of a fixed-week Wyndham timeshare at Fairfield Bay, Arkansas which was originally sold in the 1990s as a Fairfield timeshare. It will cost a measly $150 and a few postal mails back and forth. Every step is true, although the story (in 2012) was so unusual that many TUG subscribers initially refused to believe it.

(The link above is https://www.tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/is-this-a-reasonable-offer.187107/ )

Larry

 

[Ford1]

UPDATE: I spoke with Wyndham Owner Care yesterday and they could find no record in their system of the contract. This is good news for us since it means without my Dads signature the contract isn't valid. They told me we didn't have to do anything else, but to be on the safe side we will still send a letter to rescind the contract. The instructions given to me by owner care were to send the letter stating we not longer wanted the contract by certified mail to 10750 West Charleston Boulavard Suite 130 Las Vegas, Nevada 89135 and/or by fax to 702-227-3145. These are the same instructions as given by many people above.

For anyone interested I also discovered to move points from Wyndham Timeshares to Wyndham Hotel Rewards costs $90 and has an exchange rate of 4,000 rewards points for every 10,000 timeshare points. It is not at all an efficient way to use your points.

 

[Egret1986]

I'm glad to read that the contract is invalid without Dad's signature and that you did follow up with a rescind letter. My gosh! Good job on being involved and helping your parent's out!