Hawaii. Go or No Go?

[bbodb1]

...Remember, it’s a great privilege to live in this country and have the personal freedoms we do. With that privilege comes great responsibility to make the choices that not only benefit us, but don’t needlessly endanger others in the process.

And that is a lesson lost on far too many people these days.
Sigh.

 

[Panina]

Yes they are free to make their own choices. What does that say about the person who makes choices that endanger others? Whether or not a person thinks that Covid-19 is dangerous or not, the choices some people are making are going against what their government (both sides of the political aisle now) is advising them to do. Maybe you don’t have a friend or relative with a decreased lung function, auto-immune disease or that are elderly, but most of us do. I don’t want to lose someone because somebody makes a choice that endangers others just because they want to express their freedom of choice.

Remember, it’s a great privilege to live in this country and have the personal freedoms we do. With that privilege comes great responsibility to make the choices that not only benefit us, but don’t needlessly endanger others in the process.

Well said. We all do have a responsibility to help in the process.

 

[HGVC Lover]

We lived in Kona for many years and just moved to the mainland to have access to better health care because we felt it was very limited on the outer islands. My concern would be that if you get sick from COVID-19 chances are you would have very few medical options or maybe none if the Kona, Waimea and Hilo hospitals are overwhelmed with patients which really would not take very many to do that. If COVID-19 keeps expanding on the islands like it is on the mainland then it is only a matter of time before thousands are infected in Hawaii. Our local friends say pretty much everything is shutting down anyway.

 

[1Kflyerguy]

For us, as mundane as it may sound, a good bit of our travel is based on maintaining status, so we'd need these flights. And this is for 3 airlines, although the third will be mostly done with one trip in December/January). Of course, I do expect accommodations for status to come rolling out soon, so it may not matter as much.

Cheers.

I also use my vacation travel to help maintain my airline and hotel status, so i understand that completely.

I had a number long haul business trips planned and approved, but my employer but a hold on all travel the same day i planned to book. I will need to travel quite a bit in the 2nd half of the year if i have hope of keeping my 1K status with United. A lot may depend on how fast the virus threat clears up, and how bad the economy gets.

 

[pedro47]

This is a very hard decision about traveling to Hawaii.
College and Universities are closed in Virginia. Students are taking classes online at home. My granddaughter was going to be commission an ensign in the Coast Guard in May 2020. We were going to Hawaii to celebrate her graduation and her commission as an officer. This Coronavirus has drawn a change in our objectives about traveling to Hawaii. We have secured a resort for our family vacation of ten (10) and airfare.

 

[brp]

I also use my vacation travel to help maintain my airline and hotel status, so i understand that completely.

I had a number long haul business trips planned and approved, but my employer but a hold on all travel the same day i planned to book. I will need to travel quite a bit in the 2nd half of the year if i have hope of keeping my 1K status with United. A lot may depend on how fast the virus threat clears up, and how bad the economy gets.

Our status travel is all personal. Qantas and someone else (forgot who) gave 12-month status extensions. I expect others to follow suit.

Cheers.

 

[bbodb1]

This is a very hard decision about traveling to Hawaii.
College and Universities are closed in Virginia. Students are taking classes online at home. My granddaughter was going to be commission an ensign in the Coast Guard in May 2020. We were going to Hawaii to celebrate her graduation and her commission as an officer. This Coronavirus has drawn a change in our objectives about traveling to Hawaii. We have secured a resort for our family vacation of ten (10) and airfare.

Semper Paratus to your GD, Pedro!
Our daughter is in the Coast Guard right now.

 

[Panina]

This is a very hard decision about traveling to Hawaii.
College and Universities are closed in Virginia. Students are taking classes online at home. My granddaughter was going to be commission an ensign in the Coast Guard in May 2020. We were going to Hawaii to celebrate her graduation and her commission as an officer. This Coronavirus has drawn a change in our objectives about traveling to Hawaii. We have secured a resort for our family vacation of ten (10) and airfare.

If Hawaii at that times says do not come, you shouldn’t. The last thing you want is someone in the family dies from it and your granddaughter will feel responsible. There will be many other times to celebrate. This is the time to follow what we are being asked to do, to make sure fewer people get sick.

 

[alwysonvac]

We lived in Kona for many years and just moved to the mainland to have access to better health care because we felt it was very limited on the outer islands. My concern would be that if you get sick from COVID-19 chances are you would have very few medical options or maybe none if the Kona, Waimea and Hilo hospitals are overwhelmed with patients which really would not take very many to do that. If COVID-19 keeps expanding on the islands like it is on the mainland then it is only a matter of time before thousands are infected in Hawaii. Our local friends say pretty much everything is shutting down anyway.

To support what HGVC Lover shared....

From https://www.westhawaiitoday.com/202...t-gov-concerned-about-patient-surge-capacity/

....“(ICU) beds in our regional hospitals, like Kona and Hilo, are somewhat limited, especially during the flu season and they are nonexistent in the critical access hospitals,” said Green.​

​

Kona Community Hospital, Hilo Medical Center and North Hawaii Community Hospital are acute care hospitals with intensive care units. Critical care access hospitals on Hawaii Island include Ka‘u Hospital, Hale Hoola Hamakua in Honokaa and Kohala Hospital.​

​

“We do have enough resources right now to manage our own health concerns, but if there’s a large surge, I would be worried that we couldn’t keep all of our people safe and alive,” Green said.​

​

Green, providing a “ballpark” figure, estimated the number of ICU beds on Hawaii Island at somewhere between 25 and 40 with eight to 10 in Kona, 10 to 12 in Hilo and six to eight in North Hawaii.​

​

But, they are not always open, ready and waiting for patients.​

​

“With the need to care for everybody who already needs them for their cancers, their heart failures, renal failures and so on, there may only be, at any given time, a surge capacity of five to 10 beds,” he explained. “So, if we have 85 people infected, and they all got sick, we are in deep trouble. Or, if a cruise ship landed and we had — God help us — 200 people.”​

​

From https://www.staradvertiser.com/2020...rge-of-patients-could-cripple-isle-hospitals/

...Over 12 months Honolulu hospitals could get an estimated 93,700 coronavirus patients, requiring 3,120 beds, nearly four times the number of available beds, based on moderate estimates. That would overwhelm intensive care units that have an average 73 available beds, 9.3 times times fewer than what is needed, the data shows.​

​

The state currently has 340 intensive care unit beds and 561 ventilators — machines that provide oxygen for patients unable to breathe on their own in severe respiratory distress, according to the Healthcare Association of Hawaii.​

​

State officials are urging the public to distance themselves from one another to stop the rapid spread of COVID-19, warning that the health care system will collapse if too many people get sick at once. Hospitals statewide have a total of 3,069 beds, including 166 isolation rooms currently in use, and routinely run at or near capacity.​

​

“Many of the hospitals are basically full right now, and there’s very little capacity right this minute so if you add even 50 more patients, you overwhelm the system,” said Dr. James Ireland, a community physician. “If you add 200 more patients in the system, there’s nowhere for them to go, and if you add more than that, they may have to decide who gets lifesaving treatment and who doesn’t.”​

 

[pedro47]

If Hawaii at that times says do not come, you shouldn’t. The last thing you want is someone in the family dies from it and your granddaughter will feel responsible. There will be many other times to celebrate. This is the time to follow what we are being asked to do, to make sure fewer people get sick.

You sound just liked my Commander-in-Chief. She wants to cancel everything and I do not.

 

[Panina]

You sound just liked my Commander-in-Chief. She wants to cancel everything and I do not.

Smart commander-in-chief. You need to take the emotion out of it.

 

[tombanjo]

Wouldn't it be amusing to ignore the governor's warning and just show up ? That would really show them who's boss. Of course, he could make a mandatory shut down of all hotels and resorts and you could spend 3 days sleeping in an airport with no food or services until you could get a flight home. That's the freedom to do as you please.

 

[chellej]

This is a very hard decision about traveling to Hawaii.
College and Universities are closed in Virginia. Students are taking classes online at home. My granddaughter was going to be commission an ensign in the Coast Guard in May 2020. We were going to Hawaii to celebrate her graduation and her commission as an officer. This Coronavirus has drawn a change in our objectives about traveling to Hawaii. We have secured a resort for our family vacation of ten (10) and airfare.

Semper Paratus to your GD, Pedro!
Our daughter is in the Coast Guard right now.

Glad to see other Coastie families here. DD graduated from OCS 2 years ago. She is here with us now and waiting for her PCS....was supposed to have it by the 18th now they say 20th...she is anxious and also worried about getting back when her leave is up.

 

[brp]

Wouldn't it be amusing to ignore the governor's warning and just show up ? That would really show them who's boss. Of course, he could make a mandatory shut down of all hotels and resorts and you could spend 3 days sleeping in an airport with no food or services until you could get a flight home. That's the freedom to do as you please.

OK, so I'm not going in the next 30 days, so this is more of an academic argument. I've seen a lot of knee-jerk reaction about the pandemic and this seems to be in that realm.

What it is saying is that he doesn't want people coming from a place that has the virus to a place that already has the virus. Now, I could personally bring it in myself, true.

But I'm on shelter-in-place for another 2.5 weeks, so won;t be traveling anywhere. I do leave my hour to walk about, but am not near enough to people or things to contract the virus. When I come back, I wash my hands. So, the likelihood that I bring it in is vanishingly small. And we already know that the virus does not do well in heat and humidity. So, while I believe that I've read of one cause of community transmission in Hawaii, it's a pretty low probability even for an infected person.

So, yeah, I'm not going but, as I said, I see this request as one of a number of knee-jerk responses.

And, yeah, I know that this will not be a popular opinion here

Cheers.

 

[bbodb1]

Glad to see other Coastie families here. DD graduated from OCS 2 years ago. She is here with us now and waiting for her PCS....was supposed to have it by the 18th now they say 20th...she is anxious and also worried about getting back when her leave is up.

Best of luck to your daughter on wherever her next assignment(s) take her, Chelle! Where is DD's next duty assignment?
@pedro47 ... same question to you too...
Our daughter is currently assigned to Atlantic City.

 

[elaine]

No go. Lost $,lost vacation, whatever. We have to flatten the curve. It won’t be gone in 30 days. Please do you part. No one thinks they’re a carrier or that their little cough is C-19. New study from chjna says 4 out of 5 got it from someone who didn’t know they had it.
This is something no one has seen like 1918 Spanish flu. We’re all in it together. Everyone’s actions affect others.

 

[HGVC Lover]

And we already know that the virus does not do well in heat and humidity. So, while I believe that I've read of one cause of community transmission in Hawaii, it's a pretty low probability even for an infected person.

There is no confirmed research to support the above statement. Seasonality does not constrain pandemic viruses the way it does old ones.

 

[bbodb1]

No go. Lost $,lost vacation, whatever. We have to flatten the curve. It won’t be gone in 30 days. Please do you part. No one thinks they’re a carrier or that their little cough is C-19.
This is something no one has seen like 1918 Spanish flu. We’re all in it together. Everyone’s actions affect others.

We are still holding on for end of May, but.....we are getting closer to canceling as the news continues to worsen.

 

[brp]

There is no confirmed research to support the above statement. Seasonality does not constrain pandemic viruses the way it does old ones.

This is one of many references showing exactly this:

Impact of Temperature and Relative Humidity on the Transmission of COVID-19: A Modeling Study in China and the United States

We aim to assess the impact of temperature and relative humidity on the transmission of COVID-19 across communities after accounting for community-level factors

papers.ssrn.com

You can find a lot of others. In the end, this follows the characteristics of a coronavirus, which have been around for a long time, While the infection characteristics of COVID-19 are not well understood, the transmission characteristics should, and seem to,conform to other coronavirus strains.

Cheers.

 

[elaine]

I also have a prime reservation for end of May. Id love to keep it, but am fully prepared to cancel if there’s any chance of continued infection, which I think will Be the case. My family vacation is about the lowest priority in my life. And that’s from a travel junkie.

 

[HGVC Lover]

This is one of many references showing exactly this:

Impact of Temperature and Relative Humidity on the Transmission of COVID-19: A Modeling Study in China and the United States

We aim to assess the impact of temperature and relative humidity on the transmission of COVID-19 across communities after accounting for community-level factors

papers.ssrn.com

You can find a lot of others. In the end, this follows the characteristics of a coronavirus, which have been around for a long time, While the infection characteristics of COVID-19 are not well understood, the transmission characteristics should, and seem to,conform to other coronavirus strains.

Cheers.

I am aware of those studies but they are not regarding COVID - 19.

I also do not read right wing websites. Aloha

 

[Tamaradarann]

I also have a prime reservation for end of May. Id love to keep it, but am fully prepared to cancel if there’s any chance of continued infection, which I think will Be the case. My family vacation is about the lowest priority in my life. And that’s from a travel junkie.

We are in Hawaii right now. It isn't the same here as it was a month ago. Everything is shutdown including bars and restaurants with little to do. The beach is still there and the weather is in the 70's. It is nice just being outside, but with little to do it is not the same.

 

[brp]

I am aware of those studies but they are not regarding COVID - 19.

I also do not read right wing websites. Aloha

They are about COVID-19 and other coronavirus strains. This is just a new form of a coronavirus.. And you can choose to read what you choose, That doesn't change the science.

But maybe some of these are more palatable?

Coronavirus Could Very Well Slow by the Summer

Evidence is emerging that warmer temperatures and higher humidity can indeed affect the disease’s spread.

www.bloomberg.com

Warmer weather could slow the spread of coronavirus—but not by much

Several initial analyses of transmission data suggest the pandemic could ease up in summer. But that doesn’t reduce the need for measures like social distancing.

www.technologyreview.com

Europe PMC

Europe PMC is an archive of life sciences journal literature.

europepmc.org

Effects of Air Temperature and Relative Humidity on Coronavirus Survival on Surfaces

Assessment of the risks posed by severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) coronavirus (SARS-CoV) on surfaces requires data on survival of this virus on environmental surfaces and on how survival is affected by environmental variables, such as air temperature (AT) and relative humidity (RH). The...

aem.asm.org

https://www.accuweather.com/en/weather-blogs/weathermatrix/analysis-of-new-research-paper-tying-coronavirus-to-weather/703270

Cheers.

 

[MrockStar]

Dayooper, i totally agree with what you have said. My wife who is a teacher is up at our lake cottage sheltering in place for 2.5 weeks. i will visit on the weekends. We are limiting visits to our kids as she is pregnant with our 3rd grandchild due in May. So we all have to make sacrifices for our families and our country & fellow Americans. AL

 

[pacman]

No one should be travelling right now