Expert report predicts up to two more years of pandemic misery

[Pathways]

Even though I am personally in a good position financially and am healthy, "having fun" is not the driving reason I advocate to start loosening the restrictions. I am truly concerned that so many of our fellow Americans are out of a job and will be facing unsurmountable financial hurdles if the economy does not start opening up soon. That is why I advocate for reasonable steps to start the economy back up.

Amen!! My timeshare stuff may have taken a permanent bath, but so what. I will be dead and gone (no matter the cause) before some of the bills come due for what we are doing to this country. Our kids and grand kids will pay dearly for this in ways they simply cannot comprehend.

 

[Pathways]

I am truly concerned that so many of our fellow Americans are out of a job

My parents generation was sent by their leaders into battle knowing over 50% would be killed. For our freedom. Today our leaders are sending millions into unemployment and taking away our freedom. For what? My dad (CBI Vet from WWII) must be turning in his grave that we are willingly giving up our freedom.

And please, don't take my attitude as one size fits all, as NY and select other areas absolutely needed to take some drastic actions. But for most of the country, after two weeks it was time to get rolling.

 

[Cornell]

My parents generation was sent by their leaders into battle knowing over 50% would be killed. For our freedom. Today our leaders are sending millions into unemployment and taking away our freedom. For what? My dad (CBI Vet from WWII) must be turning in his grave that we are willingly giving up our freedom.

And please, don't take my attitude as one size fits all, as NY and select other areas absolutely needed to take some drastic actions. But for most of the country, after two weeks it was time to get rolling.

Seriously -- AMEN. If my dad were alive, he would be fit to be tied.

 

[SteelerGal]

IMHO, the working poor shouldn’t have to be the guinea pigs because many States do not want to update their Unemployment Systems. Yes, if you are furloughed you are struggling, however for others to ignore that the working poor now have to go back to work and be
burdened w/ the possibility of contracting Covid-19 ia short sighted.(Yes, I have family in several hotspots throughout the US and AA)

 

[Brett]

Expert report predicts up to two more years of pandemic misery | CNN

Covid-19 is not going away, a new report on the coronavirus pandemic says. The report from CIDRAP predicts 18 months to two more years of Covid-19 cases and deaths.

www.cnn.com

Two more years !

I'm glad the COVID 19 vaccine is just around the corner and no one has to worry about this

 

[massachu]

@isisdave -- thank you for your response. You raised some great questions and I agree that there are still many unknowns out there.

I just wanted to comment on one thing you mentioned:


I'm probably overracting, but that wording kind of struck a nerve with me. I get the feeling that many who think we need to keep the SIP orders in place for an extended time believe that the reason those of us who are in favor of starting to relax those orders is because we want to get back to "having fun". Even though I am personally in a good position financially and am healthy, "having fun" is not the driving reason I advocate to start loosening the restrictions. I am truly concerned that so many of our fellow Americans are out of a job and will be facing unsurmountable financial hurdles if the economy does not start opening up soon. That is why I advocate for reasonable steps to start the economy back up.

Kurt

Can we really save timesharing in hopes of supporting its services staff? What is the global projection for the timeshare industry? I’m apprehensive. Another forum contributor remarked that driving to a remote cabin in rural Michigan seemed relatively inviting. Owning a timeshare today has new hidden expenses. My timeshare is closed indefinitely, projects unestimated expenses, has fired service staff, closed indefinitely, anticipates some unplanned sanitization protocols and equipment when it opens, and will lose supporting revenue from rental of units, all of which projects to higher maintenance fees. If I am typical, I have enough concerns at home about how to get groceries safely in an area I know, and the prospects of taking an airplane trip to a timeshare exchange location with spotty services today is almost as unappealing as a cruise ship getaway. Charity begins closer to home. I’m grateful to be able to work from home and for the postman who brings my mail through rain and snow and pandemic. I gave my USPS postman a grocery-store gift card. Zoom stock is going up for a reason and Netflix offers virtual escapes.

 

[geekette]

Interesting. That's the paper we get and I don't remember seeing anything. They're still talking about additional restaurants that are opening for take out.

I'm trying to find any reference to any statement about restaurants opening up in a few weeks and can't find anything.

Listen to your governor, that's the official source.

My mayor has different restrictions for us, so check on that official also. It seems that even states that are not opening, have put a plan out.

 

[Luanne]

Listen to your governor, that's the official source.

My mayor has different restrictions for us, so check on that official also. It seems that even states that are not opening, have put a plan out.

What our governor has said is that more businesses "might" open in a few weeks. That depends on what happens now. I usually listen to her briefings, but missed the last one. Basically that is what the newspaper said. Not that restaurants WILL open, but depending on how things go they MIGHT.

 

[Pathways]

What our governor has said is that more businesses "might" open in a few weeks. That depends on what happens now. I usually listen to her briefings, but missed the last one. Basically that is what the newspaper said. Not that restaurants WILL open, but depending on how things go they MIGHT.

When a politician says 'might', that means 'let's see how many people protest my idea so I can change it if need be.' And if there is not a lot of blow-back, then 'let's go ahead and do this'. It might not even have been mentioned during the presser, her staff may have 'leaked' the quote just to get the reaction later.

Even with the 'opening' plan of our state, the governor did not tip his hand until minutes before the news conference.

Georgia's governor jumped out on his own and took all the heat. Now everybody else's plan looks tame compared to his.

 

[TravelTime]

I think California may end up with the longest shelter in place order in the country. We started before everyone else in mid March and we are now extended until the end of May. That is about 2.5 months with no change or very little change in the restrictions. Our state has had some protests and some people have found workarounds to keep their businesses open in person (like hairdressers) but, for the most part, I think Californians are complying. The big tech companies in California are going to be very careful and slow about re-opening offices.

 

[Luanne]

When a politician says 'might', that means 'let's see how many people protest my idea so I can change it if need be.' And if there is not a lot of blow-back, then 'let's go ahead and do this'. It might not even have been mentioned during the presser, her staff may have 'leaked' the quote just to get the reaction later.

Even with the 'opening' plan of our state, the governor did not tip his hand until minutes before the news conference.

Georgia's governor jumped out on his own and took all the heat. Now everybody else's plan looks tame compared to his.

But what you did was take a "might" statement and turn it into this, which was not what was said:

And New Mexico newspapers say restaurants with restrictions there within two weeks.

 

[Pathways]

I just look at the numerous sites that have national charts comparing the different states. Seldom do I drill down to find where they got their info. In this case I did, since I got the feeling from you (someone who is actually there) that your state was a long way from opening. While we can parse the actual words, I agree that the chart I looked at took some liberties with the statement. (shocker there!)

It appears there are some regions in NM that are really struggling. I would guess they will see even more restrictions. But get ready, with TX and CO reopening my money says NM will not be far behind. (again, certain areas excepted)

Same here. While the state is opening we have a couple of counties where things are bad. One rural county that employs thousands at a pork packing plant has over 1200 cases. The living arrangements of many of the workers there just does not help slow the spread. Thankfully, most are young, - only 2 deaths, and very few need hospital care.

 

[WVBaker]

New Mexico takes more drastic measures against virus hotspot

Invoking provisions of the state Riot Control Act, New Mexico Gov. Michelle Lujan Grisham ordered residents of Gallup to remain home except for emergencies and blocked roads leading in and out of town to nonessential travel and any vehicles carrying more than two people.

New Mexico takes more drastic measures against virus hotspot

Invoking provisions of the state Riot Control Act, New Mexico Gov. Michelle Lujan Grisham ordered residents of Gallup to remain home except for emergencies.

www.aol.com

If you have AOL you can read the article.

O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave?

 

[MrockStar]

Remember 1967 Detriot? Sounds familiar.

 

["Roger"]

...It appears there are some regions in NM that are really struggling....

I have a friend making gowns and masks for people in the Navaho nation. Their infection rate is higher than NYC.

 

[Luanne]

New Mexico takes more drastic measures against virus hotspot

Invoking provisions of the state Riot Control Act, New Mexico Gov. Michelle Lujan Grisham ordered residents of Gallup to remain home except for emergencies and blocked roads leading in and out of town to nonessential travel and any vehicles carrying more than two people.

New Mexico takes more drastic measures against virus hotspot

Invoking provisions of the state Riot Control Act, New Mexico Gov. Michelle Lujan Grisham ordered residents of Gallup to remain home except for emergencies.

www.aol.com

If you have AOL you can read the article.

O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave?

When you read this article please note that it was the former mayor, and current mayor of Gallup that asked, or really begged, the governor to issue the shut down. They have been hit extremely hard.

I was able to read this article even though I don't have an aol account. But if you can't get to it, here is the article in the Santa Fe New Mexican.

https://www.santafenewmexican.com/n...cle_44fe5b78-8bd5-11ea-9238-ab1671f854dc.html

 

[Luanne]

I have a friend making gowns and masks for people in the Navaho nation. Their infection rate is higher than NYC.

I have a friend who is making masks as well. I wondered if it might be the same person, but my friend isn't making gowns. She is also selling masks and is using that money to buy more supplies. She and her mom have a table covering business and are using the napkins to make the masks.

 

[isisdave]

@isisdave -- thank you for your response. You raised some great questions and I agree that there are still many unknowns out there.

I just wanted to comment on one thing you mentioned:


I'm probably overeracting, but that wording kind of struck a nerve with me. I get the feeling that many who think we need to keep the SIP orders in place for an extended time believe that the reason those of us who are in favor of starting to relax those orders is because we want to get back to "having fun". Even though I am personally in a good position financially and am healthy, "having fun" is not the driving reason I advocate to start loosening the restrictions. I am truly concerned that so many of our fellow Americans are out of a job and will be facing unsurmountable financial hurdles if the economy does not start opening up soon. That is why I advocate for reasonable steps to start the economy back up.

Kurt

Oh, I agree with you too Kurt. But I'm retired, and our "normal" life is travel and discovery, not employment, so I was just personalizing my desire. Our son works at Lowe's and I can't believe he hasn't caught it yet; his spouse is in hospitality and currently on furlough. They were about to buy a house, so we all hope things get back to stability asap.

 

[Rjbeach2003]

There is a lot of talk about approaches to confronting virus. Someone earlier is thankful that a vaccine is just around the corner. I guess I think 12-18 months isn't just around the corner.

Anyway I decided to look at stats from two similarly sized countries with different approaches and see how the numbers compare.

Sweden, whose citizens are only encouraged to distance and Portugal where stay at home orders have been in place.

Starting from February 15 to March 15 Sweden had 1050 cases, Portugal 448 cases. March 15-April 15 Sweden 11927, Portugal 18841, April 15-April 30, Sweden 21,092, Portugal 24987.

So in the beginning Sweden had a lower growth rate than Portugal, but with the advent of controls in Portugal and few in Sweden the gap has closed dramatically, with Sweden's curve continuing to rise and Portugals flattening. Since April 15 Portugal's increase in cases is about 6,000 and Sweden's 9,000.

Additionally Portugal has probably found more cases because they have tested nearly 42,000/million and Sweden about 12,000/million. BTW Portugal's testing per million is over twice as much as here in the US.

South Korea though looks the best as they closed down everything with under 11,000 cased and 215 deaths, total.

 

[WVBaker]

Our public health officials have long been using fear and calculation. The individuals we elect, write intrusive laws that sit on the books, waiting to be invoked by the next microorganism to catch the public's attention. Those laws include a nearly unlimited power to quarantine people suspected of exposure to infectious diseases and then bill them for the confinement.

Keep in mind though, they are subject to fear also. The fear of being voted out of office by panic-stricken constituents looking for officials to do something. They have the an instinct to exploit a crisis and soothe the fearful by making efforts, even counterproductive ones, to assure the public that everything will be just fine.

We have faced many a crises before and the COVID-19 pandemic panic will also pass, hopefully with a minimum of illness and death. It will however, leave behind a residue of laws, spending, and precedents for future government actions that won't depart in its wake.

 

[Brett]

Our public health officials have long been using fear and calculation. The individuals we elect, write intrusive laws that sit on the books, waiting to be invoked by the next microorganism to catch the public's attention. Those laws include a nearly unlimited power to quarantine people suspected of exposure to infectious diseases and then bill them for the confinement.

Keep in mind though, they are subject to fear also. The fear of being voted out of office by panic-stricken constituents looking for officials to do something. They have the an instinct to exploit a crisis and soothe the fearful by making efforts, even counterproductive ones, to assure the public that everything will be just fine.

We have faced many a crises before and the COVID-19 pandemic panic will also pass, hopefully with a minimum of illness and death. It will however, leave behind a residue of laws, spending, and precedents for future government actions that won't depart in its wake.

I'm not so sure health officials are using "fear" - most seem to be just stating the medical facts.
but "panic-stricken" constituents may vote politicians that "exploit a crisis" out of office !
and it's certainly true that the pandemic is leaving a residue of government spending

 

[Luanne]

Seriously -- AMEN. If my dad were alive, he would be fit to be tied.

I think if my father, who fought in WWII was alive today he'd want his family safe and protected.

We all have our own bias on this.

 

[cman]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Texas open up their restaurants and retail already today? (With some restrictions, of course).

And New Mexico newspapers say restaurants with restrictions there within two weeks.

You are correct. Texas did ease some restrictions this past Friday. But there are so many caveats, that you wouldn't notice this from a full lock-down. Restaurants can open at 50% capacity, but few can make a profit at that level so most have remained closed. Barber shop, salons and gyms are still closed. Retail stores are only allowed to provide curbside service, but they lack customers. So, not much has changed in Texas.

The good news is that our governor, is listening to the experts, realizes what needs to be in place before moving forward with reopening, and is taking active steps to ensure everything is in place before we open things up. Testing capacity and contact tracing ability are the things we need before we open the floodgates. As of now, our testing capacity is one of the worst in the nation, but we're working on improving it.

 

[Cornell]

I think if my father, who fought in WWII was alive today he'd want his family safe and protected.

We all have our own bias on this.

Yes we do and that’s what makes the world interesting

 

[cman]

My parents generation was sent by their leaders into battle knowing over 50% would be killed. For our freedom.

Dude, that's a little over dramatic. Nobody's asking us to send our children into battle. They're just asking that we shelter in place, and only travel when it's essential. Our parents would not be whining about this the way that some of you are. Given the choice between going to war, and sheltering in place, it would be an easy decision for them.

This thing is not close to being over. I'd advise you to man up, prepare for this to last a while, and get used to your new reality.