CLOSED: Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana & Marriott Ownerships (Marriott Link + Vistana Discussion)

[VacationForever]

If you can split the 2BR in a Staroption exchange or an II deposit, it stands to reason you can do so here as well.

Even when I book it as a 2BR lockoff, it shows up as 2 separate 1BR reservations on marriott.com

I own at both Vistana (2BR LO) and MVC and know what you are saying. We will have to see if DC treats 2 sides as individual units.

 

[Bill R]

It is all speculation so until there are facts in writing, no need to move to a new thread.

Maybe if there is a more narrow question to discuss about the potential Vistana/MVC integration, that could be a new thread. But it will still be speculation.

An interesting thread might be a new one with a survey question of choices of people prefer. Some answers could be.

-Stay the same (no MVC integration)
-Allow only qualified Vistana owners to elect DPs
-Allow all Vistana resale owners to elect DPs with no fee or low fee
-Other

Then people could post why they chose their answer and related comments to this question.

The answers to this question would interest me.

This is a hard thread to sort through, but if "someone" goes to the effort to boil some of these things down, I sure would appreciate it if things are defined and explained more clearly. As a long-time owner of Sheraton, then and now Westin locations, I am familiar with how the Westin/Vistana things work (although we keep learning new things!), but all this Marriott stuff with all the acronyms being used is very unfamiliar to me - DC vs DP, etc etc. We have never used Interval International, mostly because you can't really see what you want to make a direct trade for, and frankly, most of the properties other than Marriott Vacation Club properties don't look nearly as nice as the Westin properties. There, I said it! And since we own on Maui and St. John, we have rarely used our Star Options for anything else - although we have been to Cabo twice in the last year because it was so easy and more open than Hawaii, which has essentially been all but shut down, than overrun and totally understaffed, over the last 2 years. I think the manager of the Westin Ka'anapali villas properties should be fired; their services compared to Marriott hotels on the island have been unacceptable.

Maybe it's because of the complexity of trying to sort all of this points to Star Options equivalency, fees conversions/changes, and reservation periods that Marriott is taking so long to roll this out. From reading all the comments on this thread, explaining how this will all work will take quite some effort! Probably easy to say A=X, but then the ifs, ands and buts - all the exceptions - is where things go awry! Oh, and as we Vistana owners know, they have to sort through the website issues first, AND as we ALL know, Marriott has also just moved to "dynamic points pricing" for the hotels, so I imagine they are trying to manage all the changes, internally and externally! There probably is also some effort in this "soft rollout" of the vacation clubs merger a bit of a trial balloon; what will entice folks, do they understand what we are saying and selling, etc.

I know this is a forum of "experts", but sometimes I read these and just marvel at all the acronyms. It saves typing I guess, but leaves a lot to be desired from an easy to read, clarity point of view.
One person's opinion...

 

[dioxide45]

Another question is, will we ever see full 2BR units available at resorts where all the 2BR units lock off. I know that II never gets full 2BR units at Vistana properties and when you search on Marriott.com there is never a 2BR unit available at a resort with all 2BR LO units. Try searching WKV, I can only ever find 1BR units available to book on Marriott.com.

 

[VacationForever]

Another question is, will we ever see full 2BR units available at resorts where all the 2BR units lock off. I know that II never gets full 2BR units at Vistana properties and when you search on Marriott.com there is never a 2BR unit available at a resort with all 2BR LO units. Try searching WKV, I can only ever find 1BR units available to book on Marriott.com.

There was a significant 2BR deposit at Westin Desert Willow and Westin Mission Hills for Nov and Dec 2022, and some units are still there in II. This is the first 2BR deposits at resorts where 2BR locks off we have seen in the past 5 years.

 

[TravelTime]

I think 8 month reservations in WSJ and HRA may not be so difficult at first. Most of that inventory will still probably reside in the VSN for a bit. We know HRA will have at least a year delay in joining the DCE and who knows about WSJ. I hear it’s difficult enough to get into WSJ for owners and the VSN in general. With that being said, I have been able to book WSJ at the 8 month mark and hope that it continues.

My point was it is difficult to book into WSJ and Harbourside now at 8 months. I think it will be easier to book with MVC at 13 months.

 

[TravelTime]

I just found it interesting that a sales rep would call their owners snobs. They were saying it boastfully and when i said it, I’m being facetious. with that being said, there are plenty of resorts I wouldn’t stay in because they are lesser quality than a Marriott or vistana unit. I’m am looking forward to more choices, heck, I’ve been looking for a Marriott legacy week to use in II.

Most on here own low fee Vistana ownerships for the purposes of using the VSN (a sound strategy that has been kicked around of TUG for a long time). So of course there will be concerns about availability diminishing in the VSN going forward. Geez, we haven’t even been able to book this last year with all of the website issues. The fear that things will only get worse is real, especially if you own resales and cannot participate in converting. We all have our favorite VSN resorts and some of them are difficult to get into as it is, so yes there is a level un uncertainty that will come along with these changes. Let’s have a bit of compassion for those who may be left holding a few ownerships with less ways to use them going forward lol.

If there is a way for me to convert my resale WKOVRN OF to DPs, and it is not too expensive to qualify my week, then I will love the new program.

 

[DanCali]

If there is a way for me to convert my resale WKOVRN OF to DPs, and it is not too expensive to qualify my week, then I will love the new program.

Historically, qualifying resale weeks was a $30K+ spend with Marriott, generally forcing you to buy an expensive points product or an Aruba week you might not need.

Those who had an opportunity to requalify with Vistana for $10K + $5K per additional VOI may regret not doing that.

 

[TravelTime]

People keep saying Vistana properties are nicer than Marriott properties. I am not sure that is true.

Comparing MOC Napili/Lahaina in Maui to Westin Maui, I thought MOC was nicer. I stayed in the best unit at WKOVR south in center OF on the top floor. This is considered the best in all of WKOVR south or north. I liked the oceanfront view and the large balcony but I liked the actual unit at MOC better as well as walking distance to the mall with restaurants and shopping. I thought there were pros and cons of each and neither is better or worse. I got oceanfront in both resorts.

In 2023, I am staying one week in WKOVRN OF and the following week at MOC Napili/Lahaina OF so I can do another back to back comparison using north as the comparison point.

 

[DanCali]

People keep saying Vistana properties are nicer than Marriott properties. I am not sure that is true.

Comparing MOC Napili/Lahaina in Maui to Westin Maui, I thought MOC was nicer. I stayed in the best unit at WKOVR south in center OF on the top floor. This is considered the best in all of WKOVR south or north. I liked the oceanfront view and the large balcony but I liked the actual unit at MOC better as well as walking distance to the mall with restaurants and shopping. I thought there were pros and cons of each and neither is better or worse. I got oceanfront in both resorts.

In 2023, I am staying one week in WKOVRN OF and the following week at MOC Napili/Lahaina OF so I can do another back to back comparison using north as the comparison point.

Both me and my wife agree that in terms of "feel" the Westins are a step above the Marriotts. Hard to explain, but they just have a more luxurious feel. However, as others have pointed out, Marriott kitchens are generally better stocked when it comes to practical things like tupperware etc and that can also make a difference.

You are right that location also matters. We've had a couple of Kauai vacations combining the Westin Princeville with Marriott's Waiohai in Poipu. The Westin is a fantastic property but the proximity of the Poipu resort to the ocean and restaurants/shopping makes it a the more enjoyable part of that vacation for us.

 

[Ken555]

People keep saying Vistana properties are nicer than Marriott properties. I am not sure that is true.

Comparing MOC Napili/Lahaina in Maui to Westin Maui, I thought MOC was nicer. I stayed in the best unit at WKOVR south in center OF on the top floor. This is considered the best in all of WKOVR south or north. I liked the oceanfront view and the large balcony but I liked the actual unit at MOC better as well as walking distance to the mall with restaurants and shopping. I thought there were pros and cons of each and neither is better or worse. I got oceanfront in both resorts.

In 2023, I am staying one week in WKOVRN OF and the following week at MOC Napili/Lahaina OF so I can do another back to back comparison using north as the comparison point.

South view front corner at WKORV is the best unit, not the center. The corner units have side windows which - at least in my opinion - makes it much more desirable. The center is only best when considering MF.

In my experience, Westin is much better than most Marriotts…at least the ~10 Marriotts I’ve seen. Given what I’ve read so far, I don’t see any reason to even have a meeting to discuss the new program.


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[Ken555]

I think this is something that a salesperson put together. WKV doesn't even have a silver season. The lowest season is Gold.

It used to have silver until they arbitrarily changed the names and added Platinum Plus, so all the seasons bumped up to the next level. Even then there was absolutely no change in use - it was just a name change.


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[dioxide45]

It used to have silver until they arbitrarily changed the names and added Platinum Plus, so all the seasons bumped up to the next level. Even then there was absolutely no change in use - it was just a name change.


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So perhaps this is the difference between "Home Season" and "VSN Season"?

 

[Eric B]

So perhaps this is the difference between "Home Season" and "VSN Season"?

That kind of makes sense. The chart posted in post #970 lists platinum, gold, and silver as seasons rather than platinum+, gold+, and gold. Similar to how the SVV seasons are High and Peak rather than platinum and gold+, but less confusing because the resort seasons don't use any of the same names as the VSN seasons there.

 

[jabberwocky]

@TravelTime The inventory must be in the DP system. 8 Mo SO and 13 mo DP doesn't matter because inventory is in two separate systems. If an SO owner has not deposited it will stay in SO inventory.

I know it is unlikely given how deposited units will be snapped up within MVC, but as a thought experiment what would happen if a DC deposited unit at a mandatory resort was still available at the 8 month mark?

Could the unit still be booked within VSN if it was available?

 

[CPNY]

If there is a way for me to convert my resale WKOVRN OF to DPs, and it is not too expensive to qualify my week, then I will love the new program.

That unit converted to DC points is an excellent value. Others with one or multiple low point values won’t find much value. I hope it works out for most if not all.

 

[jabberwocky]

This sounds great if it ends up being true that WKOVRN OF 2BR ends up getting 8325 DPs. This is more than it costs for a week in DPs for peak weeks like Easter week. That sounds very high. What got you to assume this conversion?

This is the value that was given to me in our owners update last Tuesday for our WKORVN OF week. I also saw it listed on our owner profile sheet as the conversion value. There might be some tweaks or variations for different weeks, but I believe it is pretty close to what the final value will come in at.

 

[CPNY]

My point was it is difficult to book into WSJ and Harbourside now at 8 months. I think it will be easier to book with MVC at 13 months.

It all depends on how the units are valued. We really have to wait and see how the charts look for those two resorts. Summer weeks for those two properties are very attainable in the VSN when there is availability

 

[CPNY]

As I already mentioned, Westin St. John is not easy to get into, unless high hurricane season, and you need to know that St. John - after being battered by 2 hurricanes the same year a few years ago - has still not come all the way "back" (the island, not the resort, it's all rebuilt but has staffing issues, like many places), and that many businesses and restaurants are closed during August and September, including or especially sailing and snorkeling charters, etc. I can now see some Westin St. John inventory for August and September, but note my comment above about that time frame.

Good points, I have a reservation in august for a 3 bedroom pool villa. The island is so amazing that I don’t need much in terms of restaurants or charters. I personally enjoy the Caribbean during hurricane season. I enjoy the water waters and temps.

 

[DavidnRobin]

I know this is a forum of "experts", but sometimes I read these and just marvel at all the acronyms. It saves typing I guess, but leaves a lot to be desired from an easy to read, clarity point of view.
One person's opinion...

There is a reason I created an acronym post for SVO (Starwood Vacation Ownership) many years ago - because it is (for example) a PIA to type Westin Ka’anapali Ocean Resort Villas North - instead of WKORVN. There are many examples of this and now many more with Marriott.

My suggestion is to limit the number of words that can be used in a post (like Twitter does with characters) - because to many people use too many words to relay their ideas and opinions, and it makes reading threads like this almost unbearable.

aka TL;DR

This is a lesson I learned in the corporate world.


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[DavidnRobin]

People keep saying Vistana properties are nicer than Marriott properties. I am not sure that is true.

Comparing MOC Napili/Lahaina in Maui to Westin Maui, I thought MOC was nicer. I stayed in the best unit at WKOVR south in center OF on the top floor. This is considered the best in all of WKOVR south or north. I liked the oceanfront view and the large balcony but I liked the actual unit at MOC better as well as walking distance to the mall with restaurants and shopping. I thought there were pros and cons of each and neither is better or worse. I got oceanfront in both resorts.

In 2023, I am staying one week in WKOVRN OF and the following week at MOC Napili/Lahaina OF so I can do another back to back comparison using north as the comparison point.

WKORV OFD > OFC (w/o considering MFs) for many reasons (I’ve been in both) that have been discussed here before.

And the B2 South corner villa being the best in VSE IMO

The reef outside WKORV/N makes the location a premium.
I actually saw a sea snake in front of B2 for the 1st time (in 16 years) last week - amazing. Wish I had my GoPro with me.

But too each his own. I can go to a mall and restaurants here at home.


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[DavidnRobin]

South view front corner at WKORV is the best unit, not the center. The corner units have side windows which - at least in my opinion - makes it much more desirable. The center is only best when considering MF.

In my experience, Westin is much better than most Marriotts…at least the ~10 Marriotts I’ve seen. Given what I’ve read so far, I don’t see any reason to even have a meeting to discuss the new program.


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Ken beat me too it…


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[TravelTime]

South view front corner at WKORV is the best unit, not the center. The corner units have side windows which - at least in my opinion - makes it much more desirable. The center is only best when considering MF.

In my experience, Westin is much better than most Marriotts…at least the ~10 Marriotts I’ve seen. Given what I’ve read so far, I don’t see any reason to even have a meeting to discuss the new program.


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Actually then I think we had a corner bc it had side windows. The view was as good as it gets. The interior was bland. It was different tones of beige and no art on the walls.

 

[TravelTime]

This is the value that was given to me in our owners update last Tuesday for our WKORVN OF week. I also saw it listed on our owner profile sheet as the conversion value. There might be some tweaks or variations for different weeks, but I believe it is pretty close to what the final value will come in at.

Maybe the sales guy wrote down what a holiday week is worth in points. Why was he telling you a conversion value? Was there an ulterior motive?

 

[TravelTime]

WKORV OFD > OFC (w/o considering MFs) for many reasons (I’ve been in both) that have been discussed here before.

And the B2 South corner villa being the best in VSE IMO

The reef outside WKORV/N makes the location a premium.
I actually saw a sea snake in front of B2 for the 1st time (in 16 years) last week - amazing. Wish I had my GoPro with me.

But too each his own. I can go to a mall and restaurants here at home.


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I think it might have been a corner unit bc I recall side windows. I recall how sunny it was and I had to close the blinds.

 

[jabberwocky]

Maybe the sales guy wrote down what a holiday week is worth in points. Why was he telling you a conversion value? Was there an ulterior motive?

All salespeople want to sell something. I’ve documented earlier in this thread how I received the information and what I’ve been told - he didn’t just pull the number from thin air.

He didn’t try to tell me that I needed to buy more flex to bring our resale mandatory into the system - which I was surprised by given other TUG reports.