CLOSED: Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana & Marriott Ownerships (Marriott Link + Vistana Discussion)

[sharr7]

Got the following from our sales rep at Kierland. I am surprised that the conversion rates are different based on unit size.

Thanks for sharing this. By my estimation, this is the summary with DC points calculated. Looks like this is in line with prior reports for Plat+ 2BR. I also compared to the MVC chart for Canyon Villas. Looks like they devalue the premium/higher BR weeks most. Although the 81k 2BR is relatively valuable. Maybe the shoulder season and smaller units would be more likely to exchange here.

WKV	SO	Conv	DC	Max Cost to Reserve Canyon Villas
2BR LO	148,100	36.57	4,050	4,175
2BR LO	81,000	23.42	3,459	2,725
2BR LO	56,300	25.59	2,200	1,950
1BR Prem	81,000	31.15	2,600	2,900
1BR Prem	44,000	23.78	1,850	1,950
1BR Prem	30,500	21.03	1,450	1,400
1BR	67,100	31.21	2,150	1,725
1BR	37,000	24.67	1,500	1,225
1BR	25,800	21.5	1,200	900

 

[TravelTime]

Let me start to compile what we know so far about the SO/DC ratio:

WKV 2br Plat+: 36.57 = 148100/4050
WLR 2br Plat+: 29.1 = 148100/4950
WKORVN OF 2br Plat+: 21.22 = 176700/8325
SVV 2br Plat: 30.86 = 81000/2625

Can someone please confirm above are correct?

This sounds great if it ends up being true that WKOVRN OF 2BR ends up getting 8325 DPs. This is more than it costs for a week in DPs for peak weeks like Easter week. That sounds very high. What got you to assume this conversion?

 

[grgs]

Got the following from our sales rep at Kierland. I am surprised that the conversion rates are different based on unit size.

Thanks for sharing this! I just need to find out about SDO now.

 

[TravelTime]

Its going to take more than just points to get people to deposit their high end week. I wouldn't mind trading our WKORVN OF with Ko Olina OF or Kauai or Newport on occasion, however without knowing inventory availability in DP when depositing, and only being able to trade at 12 mos. vs. 13 as a non-elite, I am inclined not to risk it and would stick with trading SOs during the use year, or rent + cash.

This is really complicated. To compare, with the SO (and HGV) systems, there is no depositing your week in advance of the use year, Your week is worth a certain amount of points and if you see availability for a stay in your resort or another resort upon the opening for the trading window- you simply book it. No skim in SO or HGV systems either. Very simple.

I certainly wouldn't pay for DP points for the opportunity do so given the complexity and risk of trades. Of course YMMV there are likely use cases where this makes sense, but not for us from what I can see thus far.

I would be inclined to convert my SOs to DPs because I can only exchange into another Vistana resort at 8 months and there are only a few I would be interested in exchanging into. With MVC, I can reserve at 13 months and there are many more locations than with Vistana alone. I own WKOVRN OF EOY but I have little interest in going to Maui EOY. I am not even sure why I bought. It was when I was on the resale purchase binge. Since that binge, I have sold 9 of my previous timeshares. I was going to sell WKOVRN but only held it because I am hoping I can convert it into DPs after the merger. What is the risk you mention about converting to DPs? I have had no risk and gotten everything I want.

 

[dioxide45]

Got the following from our sales rep at Kierland. I am surprised that the conversion rates are different based on unit size.

I can figure out SFX, WFX and I think WNV is Nanea, but what is WAC?

 

[dioxide45]

That part of the bottom is also weird pertaining to elite levels conversions. Why would they list 3* also under presidential and chairman?

Who knows. I wonder if this wasn't created by a salesperson based on information they gleaned from training? It seems very odd with these conversion rates. I suspect Marriott is giving them a fixed number and they are converting it based on the number of StarOptions.

 

[dioxide45]

What is the risk you mention about converting to DPs? I have had no risk and gotten everything I want.

Electing DC points is final. If you convert and the inventory isn't there, you can't get your home resort back and likely can't go back to VSN.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

@TravelTime The inventory must be in the DP system. 8 Mo SO and 13 mo DP doesn't matter because inventory is in two separate systems. If an SO owner has not deposited it will stay in SO inventory.

We are more inclined to trade into Vistana St. John, Westin Kauai, or Lagunamar. SOs sound like the best chances of trading into there and I don't need to deposit in advance without seeing inventory availability. The Ritz properties sound interesting but not sure of the chances of availability since we are not elite.

 

[kozykritter]

I can figure out SFX, WFX and I think WNV is Nanea, but what is WAC?

Westin Aventuras Club, perhaps.

 

[Lansdowne]

This purchase gets us to 4*, which will be Presidential in Marriott, even though it only converts to 9,935 DC points.

Make sure this was in writing in the contract and that they won't make you buy more later to get to Presidential which starts at 10K...

 

[regatta333]

Make sure this was in writing in the contract and that they won't make you buy more later to get to Presidential which starts at 10K...

Actually, I was using the conversion rate for the 2BD platinum on the small 1BD. Didn't realize it would be a different conversion factor, so this will put out total DC points at 10.250. Still not sure why the conversion rates are more favorable to the separate 1BDs. Too bad the Lockout units must be converted in their entirety. If we could do them separately, it would result in 700 more DC points per 2BD unit.

 

[CPNY]

Instead of criticizing others, what I do is be proud of what I have.

I am proud of what I have, Vistana units.

 

[TravelTime]

Electing DC points is final. If you convert and the inventory isn't there, you can't get your home resort back and likely can't go back to VSN.

What about if you do not reserve your home resort within 12 months, like if it is taken or you wait? Then your home resort preference is lost and you probably can’t exchange into something desirable like Westin St John or Harborside at 8 months. I own Maui so I would not exchange into anything else. I ended up losing a 1 bedroom half because I could not use it with SOs. I think there is much less risk with DPs.

 

[TravelTime]

I am proud of what I have, Vistana units. Maybe Marriott owners are snobbish in some way, but I have never said they were, Marriotts own employees did, on more than one occasion. I guess it’s the same way Marriott vacation club owners refer to Vistana owners as “The Vistana people”. When things like “The Vistana people should have to pay to access Marriott resorts, after all “WE” acquired “THEM” are said, it sounds a bit “snobbish” to me.

This is all so silly. I would not pay attention to what a salesperson said. Maybe on TUG, some people say dumb things like this but I have actually never heard this until you said it. I have heard Vistana owners unhappy with the MVC merger but I really do not understand why having more options is a bad thing. Oh I guess they are scared that all the Vistana inventory will get taken up with more DP owners. However it is not all that easy to book with SOs at a resort where you are not an owner at the 8 month mark. I lost many SOs for this reason. Maybe I am a snob because I own in Maui and would not want to exchange into the majority of Vistana resorts because they are worth less to me.

 

[TravelTime]

@TravelTime The inventory must be in the DP system. 8 Mo SO and 13 mo DP doesn't matter because inventory is in two separate systems. If an SO owner has not deposited it will stay in SO inventory.

We are more inclined to trade into Vistana St. John, Westin Kauai, or Lagunamar. SOs sound like the best chances of trading into there and I don't need to deposit in advance without seeing inventory availability. The Ritz properties sound interesting but not sure of the chances of availability since we are not elite.

I am Presidential with MVC and, as you know, I also own WKOVRN OF. To me, the MVC system offers more exchange opportunities and you can book at 13 months to get the best inventory. I lost 81,000 SOs last year so I do not think the SO system is better. I have not lost much value in MVC. Maybe $40 worth of value vs thousands of lost value with Vistana.

 

[CPNY]

What about if you do not reserve your home resort within 12 months, like if it is taken or you wait? Then your home resort preference is lost and you probably can’t exchange into something desirable like Westin St John or Harborside at 8 months. I own Maui so I would not exchange into anything else. I ended up losing a 1 bedroom half because I could not use it with SOs. I think there is much less risk with DPs.

I think 8 month reservations in WSJ and HRA may not be so difficult at first. Most of that inventory will still probably reside in the VSN for a bit. We know HRA will have at least a year delay in joining the DCE and who knows about WSJ. I hear it’s difficult enough to get into WSJ for owners and the VSN in general. With that being said, I have been able to book WSJ at the 8 month mark and hope that it continues.

 

[Nick66]

What owner level do you need to be at in MVC to get access to 13 month booking ?

 

[CPNY]

This is all so silly. I would not pay attention to what a salesperson said. Maybe on TUG, some people say dumb things like this but I have actually never heard this until you said it. I have heard Vistana owners unhappy with the MVC merger but I really do not understand why having more options is a bad thing. Oh I guess they are scared that all the Vistana inventory will get taken up with more DP owners. However it is not all that easy to book with SOs at a resort where you are not an owner at the 8 month mark. I lost many SOs for this reason. Maybe I am a snob because I own in Maui and would not want to exchange into the majority of Vistana resorts because they are worth less to me.

I just found it interesting that a sales rep would call their owners snobs. They were saying it boastfully and when i said it, I’m being facetious. with that being said, there are plenty of resorts I wouldn’t stay in because they are lesser quality than a Marriott or vistana unit. I’m am looking forward to more choices, heck, I’ve been looking for a Marriott legacy week to use in II.

Most on here own low fee Vistana ownerships for the purposes of using the VSN (a sound strategy that has been kicked around of TUG for a long time). So of course there will be concerns about availability diminishing in the VSN going forward. Geez, we haven’t even been able to book this last year with all of the website issues. The fear that things will only get worse is real, especially if you own resales and cannot participate in converting. We all have our favorite VSN resorts and some of them are difficult to get into as it is, so yes there is a level un uncertainty that will come along with these changes. Let’s have a bit of compassion for those who may be left holding a few ownerships with less ways to use them going forward lol.

 

[Bill R]

@TravelTime The inventory must be in the DP system. 8 Mo SO and 13 mo DP doesn't matter because inventory is in two separate systems. If an SO owner has not deposited it will stay in SO inventory.

We are more inclined to trade into Vistana St. John, Westin Kauai, or Lagunamar. SOs sound like the best chances of trading into there and I don't need to deposit in advance without seeing inventory availability. The Ritz properties sound interesting but not sure of the chances of availability since we are not elite.

Good luck getting in to St. John; we own there and it's very hard to get in... We've been told at various times that it's the hardest Westin/Vistana resort to get into, and that most owners don't trade. I don't know about the latter, but the former is true!

 

[Bill R]

I think 8 month reservations in WSJ and HRA may not be so difficult at first. Most of that inventory will still probably reside in the VSN for a bit. We know HRA will have at least a year delay in joining the DCE and who knows about WSJ. I hear it’s difficult enough to get into WSJ for owners and the VSN in general. With that being said, I have been able to book WSJ at the 8 month mark and hope that it continues.

As I already mentioned, Westin St. John is not easy to get into, unless high hurricane season, and you need to know that St. John - after being battered by 2 hurricanes the same year a few years ago - has still not come all the way "back" (the island, not the resort, it's all rebuilt but has staffing issues, like many places), and that many businesses and restaurants are closed during August and September, including or especially sailing and snorkeling charters, etc. I can now see some Westin St. John inventory for August and September, but note my comment above about that time frame.

 

[DanCali]

Got the following from our sales rep at Kierland. I am surprised that the conversion rates are different based on unit size.

So, if you own a 2BR lockoff can you convert the small 1BR and then the large 1BR separately and get about 4750 points instead of 4050 (1:31 instead of 1:37)? That doesn't sound right, unless you are forced to convert the entire 2BR.

 

[VacationForever]

So, can you convert the small 1BR and then the large 1BR and get about 4770 points instead of 4050 (1:31 instead of 1:37)?

That doesn't sound right.

You cannot convert individual sides in the DC system. You have to elect the entire villa.

 

[dioxide45]

So, can you convert the small 1BR and then the large 1BR and get about 4770 points instead of 4050 (1:31 instead of 1:37)?

That doesn't sound right.

I think this is something that a salesperson put together. WKV doesn't even have a silver season. The lowest season is Gold.

You cannot convert individual sides in the DC system. You have to elect the entire villa.

I think this may work differently with Vistana though, as each side is technically a separate VOI.

 

[needvaca]

Good luck getting in to St. John; we own there and it's very hard to get in... We've been told at various times that it's the hardest Westin/Vistana resort to get into, and that most owners don't trade. I don't know about the latter, but the former is true!

I’ve booked into Westin St. John 3 times so far with Staroptions. It’s been at exactly the 8 month mark, but I’ve had no problem getting a 2BR. The 3 BR pool villas are gone then, but there are still 1 and 2 BRs available. The next day they are gone, so it is important to book right at 8 months.
I’ve also gotten Maui right at 8 months too.
I LOVE my Staroptions and will keep them as is. No thanks Marriott.

 

[DanCali]

You cannot convert individual sides in the DC system. You have to elect the entire villa.

If you can split the 2BR in a Staroption exchange or an II deposit, it stands to reason you can do so here as well.

Even when I book it as a 2BR lockoff, it shows up as 2 separate 1BR reservations on marriott.com