[ 2012 ] Fairmont / Sunchaser / Northwynd official thread with lawsuit info!

[Ultimate_Betrayal]

I've already discussed that exact point with him. I was satisfied that KW/NM were serious about 162% had MG walked away without signing. Thanks to court decisions, they held the power. Should MG have played chicken on our behalf? Would we have a better deal today had he walked away? Certainly at least a few people think so and I don't blame them for that. There is nothing black and white about this matter. I know I have wrestled at length numerous times in 5 years over what was the right thing to do.
Note too that the Release Agreement includes the same definition of "Claims" as David Wotherspoon detailed in his letter. The Release Agreement also defines "Related Parties" as "current and former directors, officers, employees, agents, principals, representatives, partners, insurers, administrators, shareholders, members, subsidiaries, affiliates, related corporations, predecessors, successors and assigns."

Unfortunately we didn't know we were playing chicken with MG when we signed the SIF and got totally splattered all over the road as a result.

 

[Scammed!]

Ok So I called Lawyers Insurance Fund in B.C. just now. Yes they protect the lawyers, but after hearing what has happened to all of us this persons comment was we have to protect ourselves. This person helped me so much and I've found a lawyer which I already called and waiting for a call back. I mentioned the gag order, and that we were forced to make a decision in a matter of hours just to mention a few. This person stated this is not how they operate! This person said there are issues with this settlement! Also mentioned that it sounds like all these people are in duress, and should not sign anything until you speak to a lawyer. This person informed me that our lawyer should have explained everything to all of us as we don't know what were signing for sure, or if its concrete and now we don't trust him which is a big problem. I thanked him/her for their kindness its been so long I forgot how good it felt.

 

[FairSun]

Unfortunately we didn't know we were playing chicken with MG when we signed the SIF and got totally splattered all over the road as a result.

That I agree with.

 

[Bewildered]

Yes it directly relates to a claim NM would have over me - Resort Villa Management is it's own entity and their is no mention of subsidiaries of NM being part of the release so my obligations to them related to "claims, proceedings, liabilities, obligations, demands, costs, and expenses" have not been absolved based on this clause.

It's pretty easy to fix if parties agree to it and add it to the settlement agreement.

Again exactly what I was told, didn’t talk about subsidiaries and is one of the holes in this release. There are others as already mentioned. Wake-up Michael!!

 

[FairSun]

Yes it directly relates to a claim NM would have over me - Resort Villa Management is it's own entity and their is no mention of subsidiaries of NM being part of the release so my obligations to them related to "claims, proceedings, liabilities, obligations, demands, costs, and expenses" have not been absolved based on this clause.

It's pretty easy to fix if parties agree to it and add it to the settlement agreement.

"Subsidiaries" is included in the definition of "Related Parties" in the Release Agreement.

 

[FairSun]

Sorry to completely disagree with you , had an opinion from both a lawyer and a experienced contract negotiator. Both say it’s less than stellar and in fact possibly leaves us open to future issues

Gawd, how are we non-legal types supposed to be able to determine the right action when lawyers can't even agree???!

 

[Tanny13]

Per Northmont’s Dec 2016 financial statements, this is what has been paid to related companies. Check it out. $3.5 MILLION! In 2 years...

 

[FairSun]

Again exactly what I was told, didn’t talk about subsidiaries and is one of the holes in this release. There are others as already mentioned. Wake-up Michael!!

The Release Agreement does include "subsidiaries"

 

[Scammed!]

Does it or doesn't it? Well I have a lawyer looking at it so hopefully we'll find out how safe we really are.

 

[FairSun]

Per Northmont’s Dec 2016 financial statements, this is what has been paid to related companies. Check it out. $3.5 MILLION! In 2 years...

What struck me when I first saw this was the line for litigation charges. Are we being double billed? We have to pay outstanding maintenance fees which include legal cost AND contribute to NM's court costs.

 

[Tanny13]

What struck me when I first saw this was the line for litigation charges. Are we being double billed? We have to pay outstanding maintenance fees which include legal cost AND contribute to NM's court costs.

At least double billed! Maintenance fees have included over $2.4 million in the last 2 years AND KW collected a 15% management fee on those charges, ALSO included in our maintenance fees.

 

[Tanny13]

At least double billed! Maintenance fees have included over $2.4 million in the last 2 years AND KW collected a 15% management fee on those charges, ALSO included in our maintenance fees.

Check out the financial statements. The charges in my post are only those charges that have been billed by a related company (think KW). This does NOT include actual legal fees, as I mentioned above.

 

[FairSun]

Check out the financial statements. The charges in my post are only those charges that have been billed by a related company (think KW). This does NOT include actual legal fees, as I mentioned above.

"Screwed, blewed and tattooed!" Nice gig

 

[JeffinWA]

Question for any Option 1 people living in the States who plan to pay the settlement. How are you paying to ensure that you send sufficient funds? I inquired with MG and he told me that a bank check drawn on US funds was fine, but if I estimated wrong and there weren't sufficient funds then I would not have satisfied the settlement and I would be in default and subject to the 162%. Even told me not to trust the bank to estimate it for me. Any ideas on what others are doing would be appreciated.

 

[Petus@18]

Some people have questioned whether our lawyer has confirmed in writing that Option 1 secures for us a full release. Perhaps rereading the letter dated December 19, 2017 from lawyer David Wotherspoon of MLT Aikins law firm in Vancouver to "Geldert Group Member", which was included as an attachment to the email from Michael Geldert sent on Dec. 19th, may provide further reassurance. The stated purpose of the letter was to explain the rationale for settlement that our lawyers, David Wotherspoon and Michael Geldert, negotiated on behalf of Geldert Group members who committed to Option 1. At least three times in that letter Mr. Wotherspoon confirms payment of the settlement "includes all retroactive fees, registry update fee, interest and costs;" "[relinquishes] you from your VIA(s), including all associated fees and costs;" "will be released from their VIA in return for the payment described above, with payment due February 15, 2018."

Forgive me for my honesty, but you sound so much like Geldert in all your posts, are you related to him by any chance? If you do, that explains why you are 100% certain that he is an honest lawyer and that this settlement is 100% guaranteed! Though, if you re-read all of Geldert's communications you will see that 99.9%of his messages are untrue.

 

[Bewildered]

Ok So I called Lawyers Insurance Fund in B.C. just now. Yes they protect the lawyers, but after hearing what has happened to all of us this persons comment was we have to protect ourselves. This person helped me so much and I've found a lawyer which I already called and waiting for a call back. I mentioned the gag order, and that we were forced to make a decision in a matter of hours just to mention a few. This person stated this is not how they operate! This person said there are issues with this settlement! Also mentioned that it sounds like all these people are in duress, and should not sign anything until you speak to a lawyer. This person informed me that our lawyer should have explained everything to all of us as we don't know what were signing for sure, or if its concrete and now we don't trust him which is a big problem. I thanked him/her for her kindness its been so long I forgot how good it felt.

Interesting, but maybe they should be calling MG and tell him that there are issues with the release as it stands, I am fearful that you talking to another lawyer will only verify what I have already been told by a lawyer that I actually trust. He said it is a weak release. Unless MG gets enough pressure to go back and eat some crow, that even now he is being out lawyered, this nightmare may not end. He needs to tell Norton Rose that his clients cannot accept this release because it does not guarantee an end.

 

[MarcieL]

Sorry to completely disagree with you , had an opinion from both a lawyer and a experienced contract negotiator. Both say it’s less than stellar and in fact possibly leaves us open to future issues

So what solution do you suggest?

 

[Petus@18]

Ok So I called Lawyers Insurance Fund in B.C. just now. Yes they protect the lawyers, but after hearing what has happened to all of us this persons comment was we have to protect ourselves. This person helped me so much and I've found a lawyer which I already called and waiting for a call back. I mentioned the gag order, and that we were forced to make a decision in a matter of hours just to mention a few. This person stated this is not how they operate! This person said there are issues with this settlement! Also mentioned that it sounds like all these people are in duress, and should not sign anything until you speak to a lawyer. This person informed me that our lawyer should have explained everything to all of us as we don't know what were signing for sure, or if its concrete and now we don't trust him which is a big problem. I thanked him/her for kindness its been so long I forgot how good it felt.

Could you please share with us their contact details so that we can call them as well? Thanks so much

 

[Petus@18]

Yes it directly relates to a claim NM would have over me - Resort Villa Management is it's own entity and their is no mention of subsidiaries of NM being part of the release so my obligations to them related to "claims, proceedings, liabilities, obligations, demands, costs, and expenses" have not been absolved based on this clause.

It's pretty easy to fix if parties agree to it and add it to the settlement agreement.

If they need to fix this, wouldn't we want them to discuss and fix the interest rate as well? Or better, why not fix the entire settlement instead?

 

[Scammed!]

Could you please share with us their contact details so that we can call them as well? Thanks so much

They protect the lawyers not us, nothing they can do for us. But I kept talking and I told her my personal issues of concern then mentioned the 1300 out there in the same situation and we're giving this kind of money and she was kind enough to tell me to find a lawyer IMMEDIATELY! Which I did as I haven't talked to one yet. But she cleared a few issues of how things should be done and we should not feel forced to make a decision or pressured. I've been overwhelmed. We should understand what we're signing and what it means, and know what the outcome will be after we sign.......and that I don't know and neither do any of you which made me realize I had to do something. I don't have this kind of money and I want this to END!

 

[MarcieL]

Question for any Option 1 people living in the States who plan to pay the settlement. How are you paying to ensure that you send sufficient funds? I inquired with MG and he told me that a bank check drawn on US funds was fine, but if I estimated wrong and there weren't sufficient funds then I would not have satisfied the settlement and I would be in default and subject to the 162%. Even told me not to trust the bank to estimate it for me. Any ideas on what others are doing would be appreciated.

 

[MarcieL]

A person on our Facebook site said she was able to get a Canadian draft at her U.S. bank which makes sense as our Cad. Banks sell U. S. Drsfts.

 

[dalindy]

Question for any Option 1 people living in the States who plan to pay the settlement. How are you paying to ensure that you send sufficient funds? I inquired with MG and he told me that a bank check drawn on US funds was fine, but if I estimated wrong and there weren't sufficient funds then I would not have satisfied the settlement and I would be in default and subject to the 162%. Even told me not to trust the bank to estimate it for me. Any ideas on what others are doing would be appreciated.

Ask your bank to do a Foreign Draft. It will get you a check made in Canadian funds. It can take several days for them to get it made for you, so you'll want to check with your bank on how long it will take.

 

[FairSun]

Forgive me for my honesty, but you sound so much like Geldert in all your posts, are you related to him by any chance? If you do, that explains wdhy you are 100% certain that he is an honest lawyer and that this settlement is 100% guaranteed! Though, if you re-read all of Geldert's communications you will see that 99.9%of his messages are untrue.

Oh Lord, NO! Honest! I'm in the same boat as you are here.
I am just someone who tries to see all sides of an issue. Just trying to be honest, fact-focussed, and bring perspective. I don't want to see any of us mired deeper in this horrific quicksand.
I am not afraid to challenge, to ask hard questions, or to admit I'm wrong. I try to carefully read all the info we're sent - including from Wankel over the years. Sadly, my emotions too often overrule my gut instincts. I knew we should have gotten out in March, and even before that. The early court decisions against us shocked me. I refused to believe our unjust circumstance could be supported by Canadian law. Then I was further motivated to challenge this obvious (to me) travesty of justice by the loud rallying cry of like-minded TS peeps "Strength in numbers! Stay strong! Keep fighting!" David vs Goliath! We WILL win! Someone, somewhere will make this right!
I'm an optimist, but also pragmatic and a realist. Time's up, is how I read the tea leaves today in terms of getting what I think is fair. It's time to cut our losses and run! I will, however, still advocate for stronger contract and consumer protection laws!!

 

[CleoB]

Yes, I have written responses to two emails with several questions each that I sent MG.

Wonderful. I hope you have filed a complaint against him with the BC Law Society and included those emails.