You're Being Lied to About Electric Cars

[buzglyd]

Good examples of how good FSD has become even when it comes to edge cases and accident avoidance:

https://twitter.com/x/status/2080090452724744559

Pretty interesting. I like it especially at night.

 

[Elan]

I guess I missed that Polestar has been forced out of the US market.

 

[emeryjre]

Several hours ago
My 18-year-old nephew was a passenger in the front seat of a work pickup
He and the driver were headed from one yard maintenance job to another

A car pulled out in front of them while they were on a main road in town
They were doing the speed limit of 45 MPH
The driver braked and did everything he could to avoid the car that pulled out

Fortunately, nobody was seriously hurt in the ensuring accident

The pickup ended up hitting a light pole in the median and the driver side is beyond repair

The point of the story

If the car that pulled out would have been on any of the current AV systems in testing
The odds are excellent that there would have been NO accident

If it had been a Tesla in FSD mode
No accident

These are the situations that never see headlines

Never a headline
"Accident Avoided because AV system didn't pull out into traffic"

This is the power of FSD today
This is the power of Autonomous driving in the future

 

[buzglyd]

I guess I missed that Polestar has been forced out of the US market.

I had one as a rental once. Just a boring, forgettable car.

 

[Makai Guy]

 

[buzglyd]

There is a lot near my house adjacent to San Marcos high school. It was a derelict gas station for years. The pumps didn’t work and the only thing they did were smog checks and such. One day I noticed the lot scraped and shortly after, a new building went up and they are selling used EVs. Interesting switch from smog checks to EVs.

 

[divenski]

Hybrids are having a moment and are now outselling EVs in even California, see plot below. Their percentage probably could have been even higher, but their availability seems somewhat limited.

Lots of details here

https://www.cncda.org/wp-content/uploads/Cal-Covering-2Q-26.pdf

 

[Elan]

Cybertruck sales dropped 48% in 2025.

TSLA stock at 11 month low.

Cybertruck Called the Biggest Flop in Automotive History, as Tesla Shares Plummet

Tesla investors endured the worst week for the stock since 2022, while a damning new report compared the Cybertruck to one of the most notorious failures in automotive history. The numbers behind that comparison are harder to dismiss than Elon Musk's defenders might hope.

finance.yahoo.com

Sent from my Pixel 9a using Tapatalk

 

[youppi]

As per a Bloomberg article based on 2 years sales data and Musk forecast, the Tesla Cybertruck is becoming the Ford Edsel of the EV era https://www.bloomberg.com/news/feat...k-risks-becoming-the-ford-edsel-of-the-ev-era
If you don't have access to the Bloomberg article like me (paywall), many other web sites reported the news and mentioned that it is from the Bloomberg article.
From a Google search with "cybertruck vs edsel":

• https://finance.yahoo.com/markets/s...called-biggest-flop-automotive-100137347.html
• https://www.aol.com/articles/cybertruck-called-biggest-flop-automotive-100137000.html
• https://supercarblondie.com/tesla-cybertruck-ford-edsel-biggest-flop/
• ...

A year ago, based on 1 year sale data, Forbes said the same think https://www.forbes.com/sites/alanoh...s-the-auto-industrys-biggest-flop-in-decades/

 

[HitchHiker71]

Cybertruck sales dropped 48% in 2025. TSLA stock at 11 month low.

Cybertruck Called the Biggest Flop in Automotive History, as Tesla Shares Plummet

Tesla investors endured the worst week for the stock since 2022, while a damning new report compared the Cybertruck to one of the most notorious failures in automotive history. The numbers behind that comparison are harder to dismiss than Elon Musk's defenders might hope.

finance.yahoo.com

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In fairness, the recent stock testing lows has much more to do with the 2-3x capex expenditures and near negative cashflow that was clearly outlined ahead of time in the Q1 2026 investors call for the remaining 2026 quarters, and possibly well into 2027 - as Tesla ramps Cybercab production, Semi production, and Optimus production, along with Terafab (which likely dwarfs all the other capex expenditures in reality). You could literally watch the stock drop in after hours trading during the Q2 investors call last Wednesday evening. It had exactly nothing to do with Cybertruck sales. I love how articles like this falsely conflate two things for clickbait purposes, at least in so far as the titling of the article is concerned. That said, it's obvious that the CT is a flop by any real standards - even though it's outselling all other EV pickups in reality - that's not exactly hard to do given EV pickups in general are a flop from a sales volume perspective, which is why the F150L is no longer in production for example.

 

[Elan]

In fairness, the recent stock testing lows has much more to do with the 2-3x capex expenditures and near negative cashflow that was clearly outlined ahead of time in the Q1 2026 investors call for the remaining 2026 quarters, and possibly well into 2027 - as Tesla ramps Cybercab production, Semi production, and Optimus production, along with Terafab (which likely dwarfs all the other capex expenditures in reality). You could literally watch the stock drop in after hours trading during the Q2 investors call last Wednesday evening. It had exactly nothing to do with Cybertruck sales. I love how articles like this falsely conflate two things for clickbait purposes, at least in so far as the titling of the article is concerned. That said, it's obvious that the CT is a flop by any real standards - even though it's outselling all other EV pickups in reality - that's not exactly hard to do given EV pickups in general are a flop from a sales volume perspective, which is why the F150L is no longer in production for example.

Yes, I intended to just highlight the 2 main points of the article, not to imply they were cause/effect. Should have separated better.
In general, I find Yahoo Finance articles to be far from the pinnacle of journalism, but they're ok for headline worthy news.

 

[easyrider]

It had exactly nothing to do with Cybertruck sales.

No one I know wants a Cyber Truck. Most of the truck buying people I know are buying older v powered 3/4 ton trucks priced at $40,000 and under.

Bill

 

[HitchHiker71]

No one I know wants a Cyber Truck. Most of the truck buying people I know are buying older v powered 3/4 ton trucks priced at $40,000 and under.

Bill

Plenty of people I know would love to own a CT, just not at the current price levels. This is why when the updated base CT at $59.9k was announced at the beginning of this year up through end of Feb 2026 it quickly had reservations with estimated delivery dates well into 2027 (and this is still the case). That same model is now $69.9k base price, a $10k increase effective 3/1/2026, which indicates that the limited demand is mostly due to buyers being priced out. I would consider a CT myself, but it’s too expensive for us as well. Most people cannot afford to spend $70k+ on a vehicle. As you said, most guys you know are looking at used pickups well under $40k.


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[easyrider]

Most people cannot afford to spend $70k+ on a vehicle.

I think you are confusing business and pleasure. For business purposes no one wants an EV truck. They want a reliable truck for others to drive so the $40k cap makes sense. A new work truck costing over $70k only makes sense to me if it is used to reduce a tax load. I've seen many of my contemporaries buying new large suv's and trucks recently as they are now retired.

Bill

 

[davidvel]

I think you are confusing business and pleasure. For business purposes no one wants an EV truck. They want a reliable truck for others to drive so the $40k cap makes sense. A new work truck costing over $70k only makes sense to me if it is used to reduce a tax load. I've seen many of my contemporaries buying new large suv's and trucks recently as they are now retired.

Bill

How does spending $70K vs $40K reduce (your taxes and) overall expenditure?

 

[HitchHiker71]

Yes, I intended to just highlight the 2 main points of the article, not to imply they were cause/effect. Should have separated better.
In general, I find Yahoo Finance articles to be far from the pinnacle of journalism, but they're ok for headline worthy news.

Agreed - the title might be clickbaitish but the content is often worth reading, if a bit slanted at times. I use Yahoo Finance and have for a long time now, so I'm familiar with what you're saying here.

Moving on, another good example of why FSD has seniors buying Tesla EVs:

https://twitter.com/x/status/2081977918000140362

 

[emeryjre]

Agreed - the title might be clickbaitish but the content is often worth reading, if a bit slanted at times. I use Yahoo Finance and have for a long time now, so I'm familiar with what you're saying here.

Moving on, another good example of why FSD has seniors buying Tesla EVs:

https://twitter.com/x/status/2081977918000140362

People are catching on to a very large market
I do coffee at the Senior Center these days
Couple of times a week
Keeps me off of social media

I answered somebody's question about a Tesla and FSD about a month ago
Now I am inundated with requests to sit at a table and explain how it all works

I may do a slide show in the fall as a general presentation

Still the biggest issue is with Tesla is battery life in freezing weather
Lack of dealer support is another
Hang out at the service drive of any of the majors in town
Lots of Seniors with questions for the service writers

The Self Driving Market will be huge with Seniors
Remember
At some point, it will be all vehicles with Autonomous Driving
Tesla is probably going to be the first
But other Manufacturers will be in the game at some point

 

[easyrider]

How does spending $70K vs $40K reduce (your taxes and) overall expenditure?

Obviously by the $30k difference.

Bill

 

[easyrider]

The Self Driving Market will be huge with Seniors

I doubt it. Seniors on a fixed income for the most part don't buy new ev's as much as they do cheap used cars. I bet many seniors would struggle with the software. The main demographic that buys ev's are white males under 50 earning over $100k.

Bill

 

[Brett]

I doubt it. Seniors on a fixed income for the most part don't buy new ev's as much as they do cheap used cars. I bet many seniors would struggle with the software. The main demographic that buys ev's are white males under 50 earning over $100k.

Bill

But what about seniors riding in self-driving golf carts?

.

 

[Elan]

One would think that as Waymo, Zoox and others expand their robotaxi footprints, presumably while becoming more efficient, cost effective and ubiquitous, that many older urban seniors will choose hailing a ride for a large percentage of their trips. There won't be a lot of incentive to own a relatively expensive depreciating asset (that requires insurance and upkeep) just for weekly runs to the grocery store, pharmacy, etc.

 

[Travelingman1]

But what about seniors riding in self-driving golf carts?


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"Welcome to the future of autonomous low-speed vehicles"

It looks like the company https://carteav.com/product/ is looking more at a model where these golf carts act sort of like self driving trams around senior communities. There are other use cases too. It is really interesting. It may allow for a fix to what @easyrider said about seniors not buying new cars, if the community had them. Very interesting.

 

[Ralph Sir Edward]

Self driving is a side issue. A self driving ICE could be made as easily as a self driving EV.

Consider the following - could you put the same activation and communication system in a Tesla Optimus robot. The robot could then be transferred from car to car, EV or ICE, negating the need to repetitively putting in the control automation in each car.

 

[emeryjre]

Self driving is a side issue. A self driving ICE could be made as easily as a self driving EV.

Consider the following - could you put the same activation and communication system in a Tesla Optimus robot. The robot could then be transferred from car to car, EV or ICE, negating the need to repetitively putting in the control automation in each car.

It can and will be done
The steps are the
Ability to gather information
Robots will need the ability to see the road as well as a current human driver
Process the information
A series of processors as good as the human brain
Evaluate the information
The information is gathered, processed
Make decisions based the prior two steps
Train the processors on what decisions to make

This is what is currently being done as the drive to develop Autonomous Driving is evolving

Tesla has a development path
GM has a development path
Waymo has a development path
Nvidia has a development path
Other Manufacturers around the world have a development path
China has multiple manufacturers on their own development paths

ICE manufacturers are in this process all the way
It is just not touted as much as Tesla

I think we are a long way from having robots handle the process
But someday it will happen

 

[easyrider]

But what about seniors riding in self-driving golf carts?


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I like driving carts at golf courses. Especially after a few beverages, lol. A high tech cart would be ok in my book if it only counted 8 strokes. I play snowman golf.

Bill