Vistana rep refused to add a guest name for 10/5 on SBR deeded week, sent me a form to fill out.

[rickandcindy23]

Take a quick look at this ridiculous form the Vistana rep sent me after she REFUSED to allow me to add a guest. I have been trying to add a guest for several days. Now I am 3 days to checking in. I did rent my DEEDED weeks. How dare Marriott make me sign this form and basically say I am not renting my DEEDED week:

 

[Ken555]

Something is very wrong at Marriott.

 

[rickandcindy23]

This posted twice, and I am sorry about that.

At least I made $0 dollars, even lost money on the week, just to get it rented.

I am so angry, I could spit.

I was also advised that I needed to call the resort to make sure they will allow a guest in my place because they could refuse on their end.

 

[rickandcindy23]

This is probably why the website was down for days, both Marriott's and Vistana's.

Every time I talk to someone, I feel like they are not trained, and it's their first day on the job. Baptism by fire.
She acted like this was such an imposition to change a name, and she read the rules ALOUD to me, like I am a moron. The website wasn't working for days. How could I add a guest name yesterday or the day before. WE all know what a train wreck the website has been of late.

Such insincerity and blatant disregard of owners' rights to do as we please with our deeded weeks. I am tired of these policies. I was tempted to cancel the week and re-book it, but I was afraid the week would go into Staroptions and not allow me to book it again.

 

[SteveinHNL]

So frustrating, sorry you have to get put through that!!!!

 

[rickandcindy23]

So frustrating, sorry you have to get put through that!!!!

After waiting for a live person for almost an hour!

Terrible customer service. The form asked for my ID without giving me more information, so I put my Marriott hotel # on that line.

Customer ID on existing reservation:

I will be calling the front desk today to see what this is about.

The woman asked me if this is an EXCHANGE. I said no, it's a deeded week that I own. I gave you the Vistana and the Marriott numbers. Two numbers is ridiculous. I was polite the entire time, and to be treated like I am a rule breaker, I cannot get over the veracity of the woman. Did I get her name? Nope. I wish I had.

 

[EnglishmanAbroad]

It's the same form I had to complete when I made an Abound reservation for my daughter but in that case it wasn't for my deeded week or even at any of my 'home' properties so in my case I wasn't offended. I can see why you are upset with yours being a deeded week.

 

[dioxide45]

It seems they need you to use this form once you can no longer change it through the Vistana dashboard. The won't do these changes on the phone anymore. This is the same form used by Marriott owners changing guest names on Marriott reservations.

 

[rickandcindy23]

It seems they need you to use this form once you can no longer change it through the Vistana dashboard. The won't do these changes on the phone anymore. This is the same form used by Marriott owners changing guest names on Marriott reservations.

The website was down over the last few days, so I couldn't add the name.

 

[jp10558]

So I can't tell - is Marriott trying to pull a Wyndham here regarding renting or not?

 

[vacationtime1]

So I can't tell - is Marriott trying to pull a Wyndham here regarding renting or not?

Hard to tell. Sometimes the level of incompetence can rise to the level of malevolence.

 

[Ski-Dad]

And yet the sales weasels continue to tell people they can make money or subsidize MF by renting

 

[dioxide45]

And yet the sales weasels continue to tell people they can make money or subsidize MF by renting

Yup. I even overheard it at a presentation at Newport Coast Villas. Book Sundance weeks in Utah or Coachella weeks in Palm Desert. They were even telling the person to look on Marriott.com. Those are the prices you are competing against. They didn't mention that you are actually competing against everyone else doing the same thing renting on Redweek. Just about everyone I have spoke to has said these weeks simply don't rent well. Someone I was talking to at Newport Coast said people want four days, max, for these things. They don't want to rent a while week.

 

[LeslieDet]

Take a quick look at this ridiculous form the Vistana rep sent me after she REFUSED to allow me to add a guest. I have been trying to add a guest for several days. Now I am 3 days to checking in. I did rent my DEEDED weeks. How dare Marriott make me sign this form and basically say I am not renting my DEEDED week:

View attachment 100212

The form isn't making you say you are not renting your deeded week; it is making you aware that commercial activity is prohibited. You cannot be in the business of owning weeks and renting them. You can rent your ownership out if it isn't your business plan. Everything on there is legitimate. This is also to combat the problems that were created by owners who did rent out their weeks and then still sought BonVoy ENC for the nights, despite the fact that they weren't occupying the unit. It is also to comply with various laws put in place that apply to the management. It is important to know who is in the unit. It is important to let whoever will be staying in the unit that they need to present ID and have a valid credit card. It is also a summary of how it has always been vis-a-vis the owner's continued liability for damages caused by the owner's guests.

 

[VacationForever]

So every year, someone whom I know would ask me to rent her my weeks. I don't advertise because I usually drop those weeks into II for exchange. Sometimes she would ask me to rent in a different season, so I would use my points to book for her. So is this commercial activity or not? The form is asking me to declare that it is not for commercial renting purpose. But it is and it isn't. I don't care whether I rent them out or not. I don't actively pursue to rent them out - I don't advertise. I also don't make a profit and simply rent to her at my MF, maybe that's why she would contact me every year.

 

[LeslieDet]

So every year, someone whom I know would ask me to rent her my weeks. I don't advertise because I usually drop those weeks into II for exchange. Sometimes she would ask me to rent in a different season, so I would use my points to book for her. So is this commercial activity or not? The form is asking me to declare that it is not for commercial renting purpose. But it is and it isn't. I don't care whether I rent them out or not. I don't actively puruse to rent them out - I don't advertise. I also don't make a profit and simply rent to her at my MF, maybe that's why she would contact me every year.

That sounds like you helping a friend out. Commercial activity, while not defined by MVW in any of the T&C, IMHO the term connotes a regular and routine business activity. Folks who routinely rent out all of their ownership for the purpose of making money on it, and who never use their timeshares for themselves. The terminology is used in various industries. Commercial insurance lines vs your homeowner's policy. Rental of commercial space to house a business vs your home. Contexts like that.

Now, if you had 50 weeks that the only thing you ever did with them was rent each and every one out, you'd be using the timeshare for commercial activity.

 

[dioxide45]

Now, if you had 50 weeks that the only thing you ever did with them was rent each and every one out, you'd be using the timeshare for commercial activity.

What about owning 50 and renting 30 out and using the other 20? Owning 50 and renting 49? I would still think that could constitute commercial activity. Having to rent each and every week owned in order for it to constitute commercial activity seems to be rather arbitrary.

 

[LeslieDet]

What about owning 50 and renting 30 out and using the other 20? Owning 50 and renting 49? I would still think that could constitute commercial activity. Having to rent each and every week owned in order for it to constitute commercial activity seems to be rather arbitrary.

You're putting words in my mouth. I'm giving an example of extremes. I did not say that one would have to rent each and every week in order for it to constitute commercial activity. The point is that there is no definitive definition of what MVW deems to be "commercial activity." It is a scale, and what tips it in favor of MVW classifying it as "commercial" is not known. If you actually own 50 and rent out 30, and use 20, what is the reason you are renting the 30? Is it to generate income to live off of? Or is it because you had some personal reason why you could not stay in more? If you own 50 and year after year rent out 49 of them, my guess is MVW would classify that as commercial activity, especially if it is year after year.

 

[dioxide45]

You're putting words in my mouth. I'm giving an example of extremes. I did not say that one would have to rent each and every week in order for it to constitute commercial activity.

I'm not putting words in your mouth because you actually did say "if you had 50 weeks that the only thing you ever did with them was rent each and every one out, you'd be using the timeshare for commercial activity." I simply asked a followup question with additional examples for clarity. I understand you have a general distain for TUG, but there is no need to lash out at me for it.

 

[LeslieDet]

I'm not putting words in your mouth because you actually did say "if you had 50 weeks that the only thing you ever did with them was rent each and every one out, you'd be using the timeshare for commercial activity." I simply asked a followup question with additional examples for clarity. I understand you have a general distain for TUG, but there is no need to lash out at me for it.

I’m not lashing out at you. I gave an extreme example in reply to someone else to help her understand that by helping a friend out from time to time is not the equivalent of commercial activity and you turned it into “Having to rent each and every week owned in order for it to constitute commercial activity.” That simply wasn’t what I said, nor is it what I believe. But if someone were doing that, IMO, it’s not a question. Yes, that would be commercial activity.

 

[EnglishmanAbroad]

What about owning 50 and renting 30 out and using the other 20? Owning 50 and renting 49? I would still think that could constitute commercial activity. Having to rent each and every week owned in order for it to constitute commercial activity seems to be rather arbitrary.

Looking at the long list of properties owned by the OP and having seen their posts over the years it's pretty clear that they both use their ownerships and rent them out as a commercial activity, possibly as part of their retirement planning. Having at various times over the past 20 years rented out just our two ownerships with varying degrees of success with (and sometimes without) varying degrees of stress all I can say is they have more fortitude and patience than me and good luck to them.

 

[rickandcindy23]

Renting deeded weeks should not be prohibited. It doesn't matter how many a person owns. Is it a commercial enterprise, yes, but I am not using SO's to book something that I do not own and rent it out. That is against the rules.

I made no money on my week that I rented for this Saturday. I am out the Paypal fees. She used a credit card. I told her it was fine. She did use four of the two bedrooms I didn't get rented for summer. I don't need a bunch of deposits.

Redweek would go out of business, if Marriott/ Sheraton/ Westin made a stand that owners cannot rent deeded weeks.

 

[bizaro86]

You cannot be in the business of owning weeks and renting them.

Can you substantiate that for Vistana deeded weeks? It seems to me that since those prohibitions aren't in the original docs the management company doesn't have the ability to add them later.

The OP here owns tons of vistana deeded weeks and rents them. If these were SO or DC points reservations then sure, their ball game their rules. But deeded weeks are different, imo.

 

[LeslieDet]

Renting deeded weeks should not be prohibited. It doesn't matter how many a person owns. Is it a commercial enterprise, yes, but I am not using SO's to book something that I do not own and rent it out. That is against the rules.

I made no money on my week that I rented for this Saturday. I am out the Paypal fees. She used a credit card. I told her it was fine. She did use four of the two bedrooms I didn't get rented for summer. I don't need a bunch of deposits.

Redweek would go out of business, if Marriott/ Sheraton/ Westin made a stand that owners cannot rent deeded weeks.

You might want to read the T&C of the contracts you signed when you purchased your Westin, Sheraton or MVC timeshares. I simply pulled this wording from a Westin contract:

"8.1 Personal Use; Commercial Purposes. Use of the Units and facilities associated with the Network is limited solely to the personal use of Network Members, their guests, invitees, exchangers, and lessees of Home Resort Vacation Periods, and for recreational use by corporations or other similar business entities owning VOIs. Purchase of a VOI or use of Units and facilities associated with the Network for commercial purposes including without limitation rental purposes, for contribution to or use in a different vacation ownership plan or vacation club (except as expressly permitted in the Network Documents), or for any purpose other than the personal use described above is prohibited. Violations of this Section may result in the suspension of a Network Member’s reservation, cancellation of reservations for third parties made by Network Member, and/or suspension of a Network Member’s ability to make future reservations except for reservations of Member’s Home Resort Vacation Periods."

 

[dioxide45]

Can you substantiate that for Vistana deeded weeks? It seems to me that since those prohibitions aren't in the original docs the management company doesn't have the ability to add them later.

The OP here owns tons of vistana deeded weeks and rents them. If these were SO or DC points reservations then sure, their ball game their rules. But deeded weeks are different, imo.

I don't know specifically about SBR or any other Vistana resorts, but many resort CC&Rs do have commercial activity restrictions. Marriott has them in most of their resort CC&R documents. No different than a homeowner's HOA limiting the number of rentals in a community or other limitations or restrictions on rental properties.