GibbyCA
TUG Member
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2018
- Messages
- 13
- Reaction score
- 5
- Resorts Owned
-
Wyndham Royal Garden Waikiki
Wyndham Oceanside Pier
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Hi there everyone,
Loooooong time lurker, first time poster. I just had a two hour experience with the “owner update” team at Wyndham Oceanside Pier. I’ll try to make this as brief as possible.
First, thank you in advance to all of you who share so much wisdom, experience, and insight on these boards. Because of you I was able to learn so much before buying both my contracts resale on eBay and I was able to get really great deals on both. I currently own a resale Royal Garden Waikiki (annual) and a resale Oceanside Pier (Even EOY).
We just checked in for a weekend stay at Oceanside Pier and upon check-in the concierge offered for us to go to an owner meeting. I was already educated from all of you here that I am not obligated to go to any Owner Update meetings and that they are sales pitches to sell you more points — so I was already prepared to politely decline those. However, the concierge said a few things:
Then he gave me a list of topics / questions I could ask about in the meeting. Sounded great. All of you already know where this went I’m sure…
We started out with our dedicated Wyndham person (the sales guy) who asked a few questions. I told him I’m just looking to get a few specific questions answered and learn how to use Wyndham better. He said that sounded great and he’d answer any questions that weren't answered in the presentation.
Next up: The Presentation.
There were a total of four of us in the room. The couple next to us have been Wyndham timeshare owners since 1994. The presenter began her talk and the takeaway points:
Here I asked… “Wait… where is Club Wyndham Plus? Is that supposed to be Club Wyndham Select now?” She replied, “Club Wyndham Select means Deed Ownership.” And moved on with her talk.
At one point the presenter asked us the four of us what contracts we own and how many points. When I mentioned my Oceanside contract, she said, "How did you even get an EOY Oceanside contract? They don’t even offer those anymore." Made a face and said, "Ew, that’s going to be a pain point for you in the future because of the changes we’re making. There are going to be negative effects for EOY contracts.” I never did tell her I was a resale owner.
Next up: The supposed “we’re going to help you learn how to use our system so you get the most out of it” meeting. JUST KIDDING we’re going to try to pressure and guilt you into buying more points because your resale contracts are worthless and you won’t really be able to do anything with them unless you upgrade to developer points today.
Salesperson 1 was friendly and more respectful and said several times buying my contracts resale was really smart. He said Wyndham would be mad at him for saying so, but that I got two really great contracts and it was a really great way to go.
Later, Salesperson 2 comes over to sit with us. He was manipulative, tried to use scare tactics, and lied to us several times.
Takeaway points from that interaction:
Those are the highlights. After the 60 minutes was turning into over two hours I finally said, “Okay now I’m tired and I’m getting really irritated. Here’s the bottom line, if you are telling me that my resale contracts are completely worthless and I’m not going to be able to book at most resorts and that I’m going to have to pay huge fees on top of what I’m already paying then I will just get rid of my contracts altogether and walk away. If this becomes too much of a hassle I don’t need any of it.”
That pretty much shut down the conversation. Salesperson 2 got up and huffed away and Salesperson 1 pulled me aside and said, “No, no. Don’t get rid of your contracts. You have a great deal here. I would just add though that you should consider the least amount of developer points (84k) for ~ $15,000 because once you buy the 84K points ALL your points will be treated as developer points.”
I thanked him and said no thank you, I’d like our gift for attending and I’d like to be on our way. And that was the end of it.
There were a few more shenanigans and lies Salesperson 2 told but I tried to relay the main points.
I did research later yesterday afternoon and saw that this scare tactic of resale points no longer being worth anything has been a schtick since at least 2008. However, I’m wondering with this latest merger if Wyndham is going to crack down harder on resale owners and limit access to the number of rooms available at resorts as well as limiting resorts. That was the take-home story from the presenter and the sales people.
For the record, if someone paid full retail price for developer points they SHOULD have extra perks I don’t have as a resale buyer. I’m okay with that. But I don't’ think my contracts / points should be so limited I barely even use the Wyndham resort system.
Questions:
Thank you for taking time to read and respond.
Hi there everyone,
Loooooong time lurker, first time poster. I just had a two hour experience with the “owner update” team at Wyndham Oceanside Pier. I’ll try to make this as brief as possible.
First, thank you in advance to all of you who share so much wisdom, experience, and insight on these boards. Because of you I was able to learn so much before buying both my contracts resale on eBay and I was able to get really great deals on both. I currently own a resale Royal Garden Waikiki (annual) and a resale Oceanside Pier (Even EOY).
We just checked in for a weekend stay at Oceanside Pier and upon check-in the concierge offered for us to go to an owner meeting. I was already educated from all of you here that I am not obligated to go to any Owner Update meetings and that they are sales pitches to sell you more points — so I was already prepared to politely decline those. However, the concierge said a few things:
- We have received a lot of feedback from owners that they are tired of the high-pressure sales tactics, so we promise that is not what this is. We are a designated service location and we are here to help owners learn how to use their points and our system to get the most out of it. We also understand that a lot of owners already have a lot of points and don’t need anymore. So we just want to make sure we answer any questions you have and help you learn to use Wyndham to your advantage.
- We promise it will only be 60 minutes. We know you want to enjoy your vacation time and we don’t want to keep you too long.
Then he gave me a list of topics / questions I could ask about in the meeting. Sounded great. All of you already know where this went I’m sure…
We started out with our dedicated Wyndham person (the sales guy) who asked a few questions. I told him I’m just looking to get a few specific questions answered and learn how to use Wyndham better. He said that sounded great and he’d answer any questions that weren't answered in the presentation.
Next up: The Presentation.
There were a total of four of us in the room. The couple next to us have been Wyndham timeshare owners since 1994. The presenter began her talk and the takeaway points:
- Worldmark and Wyndham are merging — even on the website. So right now if you want to book WorldMark you have to call a number, but soon you’ll be able to book WorldMark through the website just like you do for regular Club Wyndham and affiliate resorts. However all those WorldMark people that will be “flooding the Wyndham website will have priority over existing Club Wyndham owners” so they will be able to book properties before you can and that’s not fair.” The solution? Upgrade your VIP status now to Presidential Reserve status which gives you 14 month APR at 82 resorts.
- She said the rebranding Wyndham is currently doing is as follows: Club Wyndham, Club Wyndham Brasil, Club Wyndham Asia, Margaritaville Vacation Club, Shell Vacations Club, and WorldMark by Wyndham dual-branded properties. The ‘levels' are now Club Wyndham Select, Club Wyndham Access, and Presidential Reserve.
Here I asked… “Wait… where is Club Wyndham Plus? Is that supposed to be Club Wyndham Select now?” She replied, “Club Wyndham Select means Deed Ownership.” And moved on with her talk.
- The other couple asked about all these people buying on the secondary market. The presenter said, “Oh you are referring to the resale market. Yes, up to as late as a month ago, you could probably sneak into Wyndham’s system and maybe even keep some VIP status because the website wasn’t able to differentiate enough, but that is all changing. Resale contracts will be flagged in the Wyndham system and will not have the same rights and advantages as developer contracts. Resale owners are the ‘red-headed step-child’ of the Wyndham system.” *Side note here: The presenter is speaking to four of us right in front of her. At this point she had no idea I am a resale owner, BUT I VERY clearly have red hair!!!! She just used red-headed stepchild (which I was) in a derogatory manner and I’m sitting right in front of her!
At one point the presenter asked us the four of us what contracts we own and how many points. When I mentioned my Oceanside contract, she said, "How did you even get an EOY Oceanside contract? They don’t even offer those anymore." Made a face and said, "Ew, that’s going to be a pain point for you in the future because of the changes we’re making. There are going to be negative effects for EOY contracts.” I never did tell her I was a resale owner.
Next up: The supposed “we’re going to help you learn how to use our system so you get the most out of it” meeting. JUST KIDDING we’re going to try to pressure and guilt you into buying more points because your resale contracts are worthless and you won’t really be able to do anything with them unless you upgrade to developer points today.
Salesperson 1 was friendly and more respectful and said several times buying my contracts resale was really smart. He said Wyndham would be mad at him for saying so, but that I got two really great contracts and it was a really great way to go.
Later, Salesperson 2 comes over to sit with us. He was manipulative, tried to use scare tactics, and lied to us several times.
Takeaway points from that interaction:
- Salesperson 1 said all we had to do was buy the minimum developer points and then all the existing resale points I own would be counted toward VIP and treated as developer points. Salesperson 2 later contradicted that by saying we would have to buy a minimum of 400K developer points for ~ $70,000 today to buy Silver VIP status.
- Salesperson 2 said I have so many resale points and they are pretty much useless because we don’t have access to all the resorts, and they even limit rooms at resorts for resale owners. “When you try to book at resorts and it says no availability it’s because you’re a resale owner and there may only be four rooms in the entire resort set aside for resale owners. The website won’t tell you that, but that’s why."
- Salesperson 2 said we only have access to a total of four resorts in California: San Diego Harbor Lights, Oceanside Pier, Indio, and Anaheim. But availability will be very limited.
- He said I am not a Wyndham Club Plus member because I bought resale. He said, “You bought a deed not our program. So you don’t have access to any VIP benefits, no housekeeping credits, and you will have very limited access to resorts and even rooms at those resorts," basically relegated to RCI status. (I want to note here that I was able to snap a photo of the paperwork he had printed out and right at the top it said ‘CWP ASSESSMENT DETAIL’ with my name and member number. I thought CWP means Club Wyndham Plus. But he said I bought a deed not the program so I am not Club Wyndham Plus.
- Salesperson 2 said we also cannot book at any affiliate resorts such as Mazatlan. He said, “You can only book at Club Wyndham, the red dots. You can’t book at any Club Plus, Club Pass, affiliate, or WorldMark resorts.” Again I asked about the Club Plus thing and got some vague answer about changes being made and the best thing to do would be to buy Club Access points to make sure I have access to every resort as well as VIP status.
- Salesperson 2 said that I’m going to have to pay at least $2000 more in fees every year for housekeeping credits on top of the maintenance fees I’m already paying because I bought resale, so why not spend that money getting developer points and having VIP status?
Those are the highlights. After the 60 minutes was turning into over two hours I finally said, “Okay now I’m tired and I’m getting really irritated. Here’s the bottom line, if you are telling me that my resale contracts are completely worthless and I’m not going to be able to book at most resorts and that I’m going to have to pay huge fees on top of what I’m already paying then I will just get rid of my contracts altogether and walk away. If this becomes too much of a hassle I don’t need any of it.”
That pretty much shut down the conversation. Salesperson 2 got up and huffed away and Salesperson 1 pulled me aside and said, “No, no. Don’t get rid of your contracts. You have a great deal here. I would just add though that you should consider the least amount of developer points (84k) for ~ $15,000 because once you buy the 84K points ALL your points will be treated as developer points.”
I thanked him and said no thank you, I’d like our gift for attending and I’d like to be on our way. And that was the end of it.
There were a few more shenanigans and lies Salesperson 2 told but I tried to relay the main points.
I did research later yesterday afternoon and saw that this scare tactic of resale points no longer being worth anything has been a schtick since at least 2008. However, I’m wondering with this latest merger if Wyndham is going to crack down harder on resale owners and limit access to the number of rooms available at resorts as well as limiting resorts. That was the take-home story from the presenter and the sales people.
For the record, if someone paid full retail price for developer points they SHOULD have extra perks I don’t have as a resale buyer. I’m okay with that. But I don't’ think my contracts / points should be so limited I barely even use the Wyndham resort system.
Questions:
- Have you seasoned owners heard about these latest steps Wyndham is taking to “crack down” on resale owners? Supposedly according to the presenter and sales people Wyndham is taking steps to separate and flag resale owners vs developer owners in their system and give resale owners a lesser status in the system.
- Would it be worth buying a small WorldMark contract on eBay in order to have access to WorldMark properties in addition to Club Wyndham properties?
- Any other advice is always welcome.
Thank you for taking time to read and respond.
