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Trust vs. Deed

Eric B

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If you have a developer account with resale points also in it you will pay the two cents more for the program fees on your resale points also.

Nice to know as we haven’t added any resale points to our account yet. Can you use the resale points for plus partners, though? I thought the limit on that was the number of PIC & developer points you have, though I guess that would be tough to do considering you can also borrow and PDF points.
 

SNA27

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PDF? Is there a glossary for these acronyms?
 

Eric B

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MF fees pay for the benefit of upkeeping your TS! No?;)

VIP benefits only apply during the 60-day discount window! I have to learn about other benefits that accrue to a VIP.

Apparently, I belong to some exclusive club called Outriggers! I haven't been able to learn the details. I have yet to earn any benefits from it. But, I guess, I must first learn before I can earn!;)

View attachment 15502

VIP benefits apply when they apply depending on which one you’re talking about; for example, the reciprocal ARP applies between 10 & 11 months prior to check in and the midweek cleaning service applies a half week after check in.

Outrigger club is due to ownership at one of the Hawaiian resorts (e.g., Bali Hai). It allows you ARP at the other ones and some access to associated Outrigger hotels/resorts. Details are in the directory.


Why is there an EXPIRE DATE?

View attachment 15500

That’s a new one for me - doesn’t show up on my account. Maybe there adjusting things in the system for Privileges starting at the new year, but that’s just speculation.
 

Eric B

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PDF? Is there a glossary for these acronyms?

It’s actually an initialism rather than an acronym since it’s not pronounceable as a word. It refers to the points deposit feature. It’s in the directory. Definitely worth the reading to figure things out; TUG helps a lot but the directory is written by Wyndham and details how they act. If you read it, you will likely know more about the system than most in Wyndham sales or many you get on the phone.
 

cbyrne1174

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100% resale!!
Right now, your VIP level applies to all of your points (retail and resale). I can see Wyndham changing that where you only get developer benefits on your developer points. Club Pass only applies to developer points, plus partners is all points I think.
 

Eric B

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That’s what I thought, @cbyrne1174. I guess that means I can use resale points for Plus Partners, though I’m not sure why I’d want to. Kind of a moot point at present in any case.
 

Jan M.

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Nice to know as we haven’t added any resale points to our account yet. Can you use the resale points for plus partners, though? I thought the limit on that was the number of PIC & developer points you have, though I guess that would be tough to do considering you can also borrow and PDF points.

From what I know once resale points go into a developer account the system doesn't distinguish between developer and resale.
 

bogey21

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I consider myself reasonably intelligent but all this makes my head spin. I'm sure if I owned Wyndham, I would eventually figure it out. But Wow!!!

George
 

dgalati

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I consider myself reasonably intelligent but all this makes my head spin. I'm sure if I owned Wyndham, I would eventually figure it out. But Wow!!!

George
Wyndham has made this confusion with multiple programs by design. Its what I call daze and confuse. It starts the day you buy developer during a presentation. Many dont ever figure it out but a few do learn the system and take what Wyndham is giving. Good examples are Vip owners buying millions resale points and using with their VIP 50% discount or buying into VIP with a PIC at a substantial $ discount. These are a few of the loopholes Wyndham has created for anyone to take advantage of.
 

dgalati

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From what I know once resale points go into a developer account the system doesn't distinguish between developer and resale.
Correct once VIP all resale points can Be used as VIP points. Most importantly when booking in th 50% discount window or as other VIP points benifits apply.
 

dgalati

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Here's an idea! They charge me a nebulous processing fee of $395! Charge resale buyers an additional 'extreme-vetting' fee to root out strip-and-dump gamers of the system! Put every resale through a rigorous escrow process that extracts the unpaid MF! If I am a game for you to hunt, then so are you!:mad: Beware!:mad:
VIP owners are one of the largest buyers of resale points. If you try to eliminate resale buyers there would be many deeds that would become delinquent on maintenance fees causing current owners to pay more over time. Be thankful for the resale buyers they are a important part of the finacial burden of paying maintenance fees .
 

Sandi Bo

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MF fees pay for the benefit of upkeeping your TS! No?;)

VIP benefits only apply during the 60-day discount window! I have to learn about other benefits that accrue to a VIP.

Apparently, I belong to some exclusive club called Outriggers! I haven't been able to learn the details. I have yet to earn any benefits from it. But, I guess, I must first learn before I can earn!;)

View attachment 15502
Outrigger resorts are available to you if you own some Hawaii contracts. I do not, nor do I have any pics:

upload_2019-12-15_6-0-41.png


I should have been more clear (on my opinion) on resale owners paying maintenance fees. They are necessary for Wyndham. No idea how many there are, but Wyndham needs them. Can you imagine the maintenance fees they are covering? If Wyndham didn't need them, things would not work the way they do today.
 

Sandi Bo

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I do not have an expire date. Maybe something to do with your pics? I really don't know.
Sorry I messed up and editing didn't allow a screen shot. Here's my Ownership Details tab:
upload_2019-12-15_6-10-28.png
 

MoPops

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VIP owners are one of the largest buyers of resale points. If you try to eliminate resale buyers there would be many deeds that would become delinquent on maintenance fees causing current owners to pay more over time. Be thankful for the resale buyers they are a important part of the finacial burden of paying maintenance fees .

Mostly a lurker here, just trying to learn Wyndham. But I do have a question.
We are presently silver VIP with CWA points and a PIC. I was thinking of buying more points to get to gold. Telesales wants $147 per 1000 points (I need 49,000 points) or $7,200.
Would I come out ahead just buying resale Wyndham points? I guess it all boils down to maintenance fees. We don’t travel that much, and have a travel trailer for some trips.
I don’t want to end up with points I can’t use, and MFs I’m stuck with. Paying for gold or just adding resale? I still haven’t figured out what I need to know to even decide..


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

dgalati

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Mostly a lurker here, just trying to learn Wyndham. But I do have a question.
We are presently silver VIP with CWA points and a PIC. I was thinking of buying more points to get to gold. Telesales wants $147 per 1000 points (I need 49,000 points) or $7,200.
Would I come out ahead just buying resale Wyndham points? I guess it all boils down to maintenance fees. We don’t travel that much, and have a travel trailer for some trips.
I don’t want to end up with points I can’t use, and MFs I’m stuck with. Paying for gold or just adding resale? I still haven’t figured out what I need to know to even decide..


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I believe You can PIC to Gold at a lower cost. Many here can explain it. @Richelle or @HitchHiker71
 

Cyrus24

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Why is there an EXPIRE DATE?

View attachment 15500
I actually have a VIPP account with an Expire Date that shows up from time to time on my home page. AND, I asked Owner Care about it just this morning. I was told that my account has enough points for VIPP, so the specialist had no idea. She did offer up that it may be related to the expire date I have on some bonus points.

So, I'll ask you, did you have bonus points with an expire date of 12/30/19? If not this, I'm very curious to learn about what happens to your account on 12/31/19. Will the odd expire data just disappear? Or will your ownership get all messed up.
 

SNA27

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I do have a bonus contract use-year 2018-2019 but all 145k points in were used up long ago!
I do have two new contracts for 84k each at WBC and Smoky Mountain kicking in Jan 2020. Smoky Mountain still doesn't show even though the piggyback transaction complete.
Wyndham moves mysteriously like a snake. Only a snake knows about its legs!;)
 

Cyrus24

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I do have a bonus contract use-year 2018-2019 but all 145k points in were used up long ago!
The bonus point line should still show up on your points list with a balance of zero. Was the expiration date on those points 12/30/19? If so, this might explain the expire date you are seeing on your account. And, that would be consistent with what owner care suggested to me as the reason for this inaccurate message.
 

SNA27

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The bonus point line should still show up on your points list with a balance of zero. Was the expiration date on those points 12/30/19? If so, this might explain the expire date you are seeing on your account. And, that would be consistent with what owner care suggested to me as the reason for this inaccurate message.

I have two other bonus contracts 2019-2020 and 2020-2021. So, if the expiry date changes to 12/31/2020 on the 1st of January, we can understand a little more of this mysterious 'black box'. That would be OK in the case of Temporary Platinum but it makes no sense in my case since I have enough points for permanent VIPP.

That leads me to draw some more conclusions about this 'black box'. They have made an Independent variable out of a dependent variable. Smh!

If y = f(x), you must always calculate y as a function of x and not MANUALLY assign a value to y.
That is, if VIP status is a function of points owned during the year, the VIP Status can be easily programmatically assigned so the functional relationship is always consistent.
I suspect, they run some kind of exception process at yearend and review and reassign VIP status appropriately.
Or VIP Status has some kind of effective-dating based on bonus contracts that forces yearend review. Professional curiosity!:)

Still, they should be able to differentiate between permanent and temporary status and avoid unnecessary calls to Owner Care.
Not that I would call them but I bet they get calls on this and Owner Care is forced to guess and offer a plausible explanation.

I only hope this assignment is not done manually by a human operator. It would be error-prone and open to abuse.
 

SNA27

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Is VIP status effective-dated?

A temporary VIPP in 2019, books in December for January 2020? What benefits apply, Platinum or Gold?:ponder:

What if the reservation is for 12/27/2019 to 1/3/2020? I would say platinum for the whole duration or else, it becomes a nightmare code!
 
Last edited:

Eric B

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The way it is implemented, the points come out of your account when you make a reservation and any discounts are given based on your status then. So a temporary VIPP making a January reservation in December would get the 50% discount, assuming a 12/31 expiration of the bonus contract getting them the temporary status. If they changed there mind later and canceled the reservation, then waffled and rebooked it in January they’d just get the VIPG or VIPS discount based on their then current status.
 

SNA27

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So, no effective dating? Even though 2020 reservations can only be made with 2020 points, you get the benefits that accrue to your current status.

Is this documented in the directory or can only be discerned by empirical evidence gathered via experimentation? Wyndham is so mysterious!;)
 

Jan M.

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Mostly a lurker here, just trying to learn Wyndham. But I do have a question.
We are presently silver VIP with CWA points and a PIC. I was thinking of buying more points to get to gold. Telesales wants $147 per 1000 points (I need 49,000 points) or $7,200.
Would I come out ahead just buying resale Wyndham points? I guess it all boils down to maintenance fees. We don’t travel that much, and have a travel trailer for some trips.
I don’t want to end up with points I can’t use, and MFs I’m stuck with. Paying for gold or just adding resale? I still haven’t figured out what I need to know to even decide..


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I would do the telesales deal for the 49,000 points and add another PIC Plus week in a three or four bedroom unit. That would be worth 254,000 points. It would make you platinum.

Log into your Wyndham account. Click on Owner 101, then Knowledge Base and under My Membership click on VIP Booking Benefits. The difference in the silver and gold benefits are significant. Platinum are even better.

I don't know your ages but you may find staying at the resorts more appealing as you age. My husband finally retired last year and we are staying at our timeshares more than we are home now. In our travels we've done some mountain driving, driving in heavy rain or winds and snow too. We are both good drivers and like driving but there is no way either one of us would want to be driving a motor home or pulling a travel trailer in the less than ideal driving conditions we've sometimes experienced. We flat out don't want to have the work and headaches of a motor home or travel trailer. As platinum VIP we get a mid week trash and tidy at the Wyndham resorts if we want it and if we stay more than a week they do a full clean. If there are any problems/issues we call to have maintenance or housekeeping take care of it.

There are a few things of our own that we like having and they are easy enough to pack in the car and bring with us. There is a thread in the TUG Lounge about the things people who stay in their timeshares a lot bring with them/keep packed for their stays.
 

Eric B

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They are fairly explicitly described as benefits that apply when you book a reservation. For better or worse they don’t go into excruciating detail on status change implications, probably because it could open the possibility of having to revise point costs for people that upgrade and become eligible for a larger discount after they’ve made a reservation. They do describe all of the benefits in terms that bound the times when they apply; the other possible change would be a temporary VIP making a reservation and getting an upgrade, then transitioning to non-VIP and checking in without being able to do so early and not getting a mid week cleaning, etc.
 
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