Timeshare Traveler Episode 113... Marriott Abound Dec 22 Owner Update

[Clifbell]

With all the travel I am doing staying in timeshares full time, I get a lot of opportunities for Owner Updates. This is especially important with regards to Marriott ABOUND as the only real way to get information is to attend a sales presentation. In this update, there were a lot of significant changes. In fact, it is fair to say that the merger of Vistana into Marriott is mostly complete after four and a half years.

The big news is now you can choose to opt in to ABOUND if you are a Vistana owner and you can now also book Vistana properties from your ABOUND account. I have shown demos of both of these choices since many Vistana owners are new to ABOUND.

I had a very good owner update. A good salesperson in the sense that they were focused on me an how I could use my timeshares. The push was to rent out my timeshares and buy more thus ending up with "free" vacations. I have not been as successful renting out timeshares as the presentation suggested I could be. I might upgrade if I can improve my returns... But that is another thing to manage. But the meeting itself was very informative. I hope you enjoy the video.

Timeshare Traveler Episode 113... Marriott Abound Dec 22 Owner Update

Map of all my timeshare reviews

 

[DanCali]

I had a very good owner update. A good salesperson in the sense that they were focused on me an how I could use my timeshares. The push was to rent out my timeshares and buy more thus ending up with "free" vacations. I have not been as successful renting out timeshares as the presentation suggested I could be. I might upgrade if I can improve my returns... But that is another thing to manage. But the meeting itself was very informative. I hope you enjoy the video.

Timeshare Traveler Episode 113... Marriott Abound Dec 22 Owner Update

Map of all my timeshare reviews

I think the "free vacations" part ignores the high cost of "buy more", especially when "buy more" is more Abound points. Those Abound points are worth about 20%-25% of what you'd pay Marriott (75%-80% capital loss) and you could indeed try to rent those out but only at about the cost of maintenance fees, so they never pay back for your initial cash outlay.

There may be merit to such a transaction in cases where they allow you to enroll (multiple) resale weeks in Abound. But buying for "free vacations" works only with very "fuzzy math" that ignores some major things like the $30K-$50K you spend upfront.

 

[dioxide45]

The "free vacations" also comes with work and risk. YOu have to put in time to make reservations, list them and field offers, sign contracts and hope the renter doesn't back out or try to chargeback. There is also the possiblity of additional point transfer restrictions in the future and possibly other restrictions on rentals. Timeshare is a moving target. I have been to several presentations where they have pitched the "free vacations" by renting and other presentation where I was told they are to never pitch renting timeshare as a usage option...

I think the only real way to get into renting is to buy resale weeks, reserve and rent those weeks instead.

I am not sure it is ever "free vacations". You could easily spend the money you earn from rentals on other things or spend the money you earn on other things for these vacations.

 

[SueDonJ]

All of the Marriott governing doc have some version of language that prohibits using units for "commercial activity," and, at least two of the big players (DVC and Wyndham) have implemented restrictions on owner rentals supported by their interpretation of similar language in their docs. With that in mind, I wouldn't purchase Marriott timeshares with the intent to "cover MF's fees" by renting unless/until it's written into the purchase docs that Marriott guarantees that will be the case for the life of my ownership. We all know they're NEVER going to agree to that stipulation, ergo anybody who buys expecting that the rental metrics will never change is taking a huge risk IMO.

 

[DRH90277]

All of the Marriott governing doc have some version of language that prohibits using units for "commercial activity," and, at least two of the big players (DVC and Wyndham) have implemented restrictions on owner rentals supported by their interpretation of similar language in their docs. With that in mind, I wouldn't purchase Marriott timeshares with the intent to "cover MF's fees" by renting unless/until it's written into the purchase docs that Marriott guarantees that will be the case for the life of my ownership. We all know they're NEVER going to agree to that stipulation, ergo anybody who buys expecting that the rental metrics will never change is taking a huge risk IMO.

Heck, the sales guys are using the line of "buying to rent out to pay maintenance fees" all the time to sell to existing owners and are touting their personal success with this. Half their pitch would disappear without this and they could cut the pitch to 30 minutes.

 

[DanCali]

Heck, the sales guys are using the line of "buying to rent out to pay maintenance fees" all the time to sell to existing owners and are touting their personal success with this. Half their pitch would disappear without this and they could cut the pitch to 30 minutes.

I just got that pitch myself in the last 2-3 weeks via text from a salesperson I'm in touch with.

 

[geist1223]

I do not trust Sales Person's talking about new or amended Programs unless they put it in writing. Look at all the so called "true" info that Sales Peop,e were talking about with HGVC and the buying of DRI.

 

[NJMOM2]

I got the pitch once to lock off a unit and exchange both halves in Interval then rent out one or both the exchanges using the money to pay maintenance fees. (or something like that)
When he left the room I picked up the Interval book and showed by husband where it said you can't rent an Interval exchange. Took our gift and went on to enjoying our vacation.

 

[Clifbell]

The "free vacations" also comes with work and risk. YOu have to put in time to make reservations, list them and field offers, sign contracts and hope the renter doesn't back out or try to chargeback. There is also the possiblity of additional point transfer restrictions in the future and possibly other restrictions on rentals. Timeshare is a moving target. I have been to several presentations where they have pitched the "free vacations" by renting and other presentation where I was told they are to never pitch renting timeshare as a usage option...

I think the only real way to get into renting is to buy resale weeks, reserve and rent those weeks instead.

I am not sure it is ever "free vacations". You could easily spend the money you earn from rentals on other things or spend the money you earn on other things for these vacations.

The "extra work" is why I said no. The idea is interesting... And useful for years I won't be traveling as much.... Just to cover my maintenance in 2023. But making a business out of it is a lot of work.

 

[Clifbell]

I think the "free vacations" part ignores the high cost of "buy more", especially when "buy more" is more Abound points. Those Abound points are worth about 20%-25% of what you'd pay Marriott (75%-80% capital loss) and you could indeed try to rent those out but only at about the cost of maintenance fees, so they never pay back for your initial cash outlay.

There may be merit to such a transaction in cases where they allow you to enroll (multiple) resale weeks in Abound. But buying for "free vacations" works only with very "fuzzy math" that ignores some major things like the $30K-$50K you spend upfront.

That is also what stopped me from upgrading... The high cost to buy more and then the work to rent them. But at least the sales person had a spreadsheet on how it worked... Even if the fuzzy logic for the high rental rates was included. At least the person did the work to build a personal presentation.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Great conversation on renting. I agree! Why pay more to work for my vacations?

The recent rise in interest rates have changed my perspective on incremental TS purchases from the developer:

Take $100k that you would put into a developer timeshare, invest into a 4% CD (very doable right now). Use the 4% ($4000/year) to buy your vacation ANYWHERE. Effort? minimal no headaches. And best of all - no obligation for MF or effort to exit when you cannot travel. PLUS you receive 100% of your investment back guaranteed.

FWIW...I love my timeshare portfolio for family reunions and personal trips but there is diminishing returns in buying more. There are places we want to travel where timeshares don't exist e.g. International travel.

 

[Clifbell]

Great conversation on renting. I agree! Why pay more to work for my vacations?

The recent rise in interest rates have changed my perspective on incremental TS purchases from the developer:

Take $100k that you would put into a developer timeshare, invest into a 4% CD (very doable right now). Use the 4% ($4000/year) to buy your vacation ANYWHERE. Effort? minimal no headaches. And best of all - no obligation for MF or effort to exit when you cannot travel. PLUS you receive 100% of your investment back guaranteed.

FWIW...I love my timeshare portfolio for family reunions and personal trips but there is diminishing returns in buying more. There are places we want to travel where timeshares don't exist e.g. International travel.

There is a diminishing return for sure.... And it is also taking education for my kids to learn to use them.... It takes awhile for them to understand it. Hopefully, they will eventually understand and part of my reason I like timeshares is they can be a legacy.... They technically never wear out like an RV would.