The $99.00 ripoff. [MERGED]

[johnwward]

I received an email today from Marriott Vacation Club stating that we are to receive a Certificate allowing us to do an exchange through Interval International for $99.00. This is due to the cancellation of our deeded week as an owner at Custom House in Boston.

This makes no sense to me as an owner that was using my week. As I see it, my week has been stolen and is now being held hostage in Interval International and the ransom is $99.00.

In my opinion, my owners week should have been returned to me to use as I see fit or at least offered as points returned to my account.

Another option could have been transfer to Interval International with no use or transfer charge to me.

 

[GregT]

Hello John,

I’m sorry to make it worse, but I’ve not been impressed with the trade Power of the certificate that I received. I had one from my April Waiohai week that was canceled and now I have three more from lost Maui weeks.

The April week wasn’t very impressive so I’m not expecting much for the Maui certificates.

But it is better than nothing and I will find a way to use it. I’m actually pretty impressed with the efforts Marriott is going through to try and salvage any value for their owners. If they hadn’t bought II, I think we would be in even worse shape. I think the trading experience for 2021 is going to be different because more competition coming from these orphaned 2020 reservations. Strange times....

Best,

Greg

 

[bogey21]

I think the problem is that those Corporate types making decisions for Marriott (and others) are not Owners and thus not Users...

George

 

[Mroze]

Did you use weeks or Points to make the reservation?

We used points and received "Restricted" points that can be used to search 120-Days [better than 60-Days] out until Dec-31-2021 [better than Dec-31-2020].
Had we used a week to make the exchange we would have been referred to interval.

We understand the restrictions but are happy with they way Marriott is trying to accommodate us despite us canceling late.

 

[pedro47]

I think the problem is that those Corporate types making decisions for Marriott (and others) are not Owners and thus not Users...

George

Now that I can agree with 100%.

 

[dioxide45]

I think the problem is that those Corporate types making decisions for Marriott (and others) are not Owners and thus not Users...

George

If someone owned a small independant, they are likely to end up with nothing, nada, zero. Big corporate types have more ability to absorb these things and provide something.

 

[csalter2]

Considering some timeshare companies did nothing, I’d say you’re fortunate. I guess it depends on one’s perspective.

 

[SueDonJ]

I think the problem is that those Corporate types making decisions for Marriott (and others) are not Owners and thus not Users...

George

I think the problem is that people expect "the Corporate types" to come up with inventory out of thin air that can be given to the thousands, if not millions, of owners/guests who unfortunately have lost booked intervals because of an unforeseen event over which "the Corporate types" have zero control. Then when confronted with the realities of how inventory is appropriated and why a successful company like Marriott simply doesn't have enough excess inventory to cover every affected owner/guest AND why/how giving replacement intervals that can be used in future years will wrongly - possibly in violation of the governing documents - impact inventory in those years, the expectation turns to indignation that "the Corporate types" would dare to impose fees on owners that arise out of "the Corporate types" seeking out-of-the-box remedies that present unique demands and costs related to the systems and the corporate staff who process them.

Sometimes you lose usage one year because a hurricane comes through - if you've been a Hilton Head owner for the last six or seven years you may have actually lost usage two of those years. Sometimes things happen in the world that restricts travel - if you were an owner back when 9/11 occurred, you may have lost usage. Things happen! This time it's a worldwide pandemic wreaking havoc on timeshare owners.

I get being angry, frustrated, disappointed ... all that and more. And I'm not one of the people saying that there are more important things to focus on - timeshare ownership is no small thing and it's okay to focus on it at the same time you're focusing on everything else. But I don't understand the first instinct to badmouth every company who can't replace every single thing you've lost because of the pandemic, including timeshare usage.

The governing docs of Marriott timeshares state very clearly that MVW is not responsible for usage losses caused by events out of their control, that MVW is in no way charged with compensating owners for such losses. They are trying to give more than they are required to give while every single day "the Corporate types" AND the employees are being subjected to vitriol. Every single rep that I've spoken with during the last month-and-a-half has been professional, kind and concerned. I don't know how they do it, honestly, considering that TUG attracts only a very small percentage of owners and the criticism here has been fast, furious and unfair - and if you can believe it, somewhat measured compared to what I'm reading on other social media sites.

One last thing - there are Weeks/Points owners among the ranks of MVW employees at all levels. In fact over the years on TUG there have been numerous posts from those among our ranks who take great pride in knowing that members of the Marriott family and corporate staff are fellow owners at the timeshares. If we're going to criticize them, can we at least be truthful in our criticism?

 

[normab]

Well said Susan. What can the resorts do when they have limited WEEKS per season? Marriott is at least offering something to replace it, it’s a last minute exchange basically, the kind you might get in the 60 day window, which means either it is off season or someone has canceled late.

Those who have been made an “undesirable offer” can decline it if they like. They do have a choice. Have they never had a loss of anything material in their life?

I am not a fan of the whining here. Not just this thread...there have been others...No one asked for the coronavirus. People are losing a week of vacation, but many people have lost lives or loved ones. People have lost businesses and jobs... Get some perspective, really....

In other words.....Shut up already. I don’t want to read more whining...


.....Marriott is not perfect but they are not the worst either.....................

 

[Steve Fatula]

Well, I think the disconnect is some think it's a club where you pay a membership, and get mostly "free" vacations, really prepaid vacations. So, you pay in advance, and you get to travel. Mvci owes you for the fee they think. They don't get it's an ownership of real property with all the liabilities involved, including loss of use. They don't get there are a finite number of weeks in a year. The way it's often sold makes you think it's a travel club of sorts. Most don't understand what they are buying. It's ok when things are good, but when not good, that's when the learning happens. I suspect many were at best mildly satisfied, more likely already feeling like they made a bad investment. This puts them over the top. It's definitely a lousy situation.

Heck, I still have my weeks and points but still lost out on several trips, needed surgery (though not for long), family visits, a bunch of movies, several other entertainment venues, on and on it goes. Will I use my AA flight credit by year end? Doubtful, another loss. Life goes on, And I look forward to better times. At least I am in Branson at Willow Ridge Lodge since it's within driving range for me. Not at home for once. And though many things are closed, very happy to be somewhere!!

 

[darius]

I agree with the comments above that this is a positive thing for Marriott to offer, as other systems have done nothing nor does Marriott owe the OP anything. It's unfortunate you can't use your week, but this is the risk of owning any real property (anywhere in the world).

We are looking at losing a week in the coming weeks, but due to Covid and now these Riots - it isn't a big deal in the big scheme of things.

Hope everyone stays healthy and we can resume some kind of normal travel soon!
Darius

 

[jmhpsu93]

I was one of the ones who loudly critized MVCI's initial response to the COVID-19 crisis, not necessarily because of what they were or weren't doing, but rather the tone deaf approach of their communications. Over time, MVCI stepped up and leveraged their ownership of II and by tweaking holding points rules, gave as many owners SOMETHING instead of nothing.

While I still blame MVCI for their undertrained and totally overwhelmed staff (whom I really feel for and tell them whenver I speak or chat with them), IT issues, and very unclear status of different resorts, I feel their efforts to make all owners as whole as possible while minimizing the future availablility of resorts has been great.

 

[bogey21]

If someone owned a small independant, they are likely to end up with nothing, nada, zero. Big corporate types have more ability to absorb these things and provide something.

True. I once owned Weeks at 6 HOA Controlled Independents and twice lost Weeks due to hurricane damage. But the big difference is that my 6 Weeks cost me less than $8,000 total and their MFs were substantially less than Marriott's, HGVC's and the like...

George

 

[elked12]

I agree with how MVC handled my lost Aruba Surf Club week in May but what I don't understand is why the $99 fee in II???

 

[jont]

I am happy Marriott at least made an effort an provided us a certificate for future use, however limited it may be. As I see it, the loss of my OW week for one year is minor with the reality that thousands and thousands have lost their jobs or far worse, their lives or the lives of loved ones. In MHO I have nothing to complain about.

 

[SueDonJ]

I am happy Marriott at least made an effort an provided us a certificate for future use, however limited it may be. As I see it, the loss of my OW week for one year is minor with the reality that thousands and thousands have lost their jobs or far worse, their lives or the lives of loved ones. In MHO I have nothing to complain about.

You know, I didn't want to turn this into how I'm personally affected or into a competition about who is losing the most. But after my post above I've gotten private criticisms that all say the same thing, "it's easy to criticize others if you're not the one losing" and now I'm angry.

I have three impacted reservations comprising 14,800 DC Points, some of which are going into a Holding Account and may be lost forever.

Be careful slinging mud if you don't want to get dirty.

 

[Steve Fatula]

I have three impacted reservations comprising 14,800 DC Points, some of which are going into a Holding Account and may be lost

You don’t think you’ll be able to use them before end of 2021? Genuinely curious. I only had 3 or 4 thousand but as a retired guy, will be easy.

 

[Dean]

I'm going to agree with those above that state the reality, we own at resorts that may be affected and I'd look at it as an owned condo and the resort was closed.

I agree with how MVC handled my lost Aruba Surf Club week in May but what I don't understand is why the $99 fee in II???

We'd have to ask MVC but my guess is it was what II was willing to do and they got what they could for the owners.

Susan, IMO the personal effect is not applicable as this should be evaluated with one's brain and not the heart. I understand the emotions and can't blame anyone for being upset their losing out on vacation and dues but MVC is only a manager for the owners and we are the owners. They can't manufacture inventory and they have to balance the help they give to those affected with the overall affect on the system. IMO they've done beyond what I could have expected them to do.

 

[SueDonJ]

You don’t think you’ll be able to use them before end of 2021? Genuinely curious. I only had 3 or 4 thousand but as a retired guy, will be easy.

The Holding Account points, almost certainly not for the same resort/time frame next year because of the 120-day Reservation Window and what I expect will be fierce competition. I'm trying to work the calendar to get something sooner rather than later but so far, no luck.

The others, I'm fortunate to have a 13-mos Reservation Window to work with and will be jumping on it immediately, but again I expect to be up against fierce competition with others in the same boat AND owners trying to use next year's allotment at the same time. (And if all else fails, banking into the following two-year usage period is an option.)

Note, I'm not complaining. I know I'm still in a more-fortunate situation than others. Like I said I've been on the phone/in ChatNow with reps that are doing their best to help, and I recognize the limitations I'm up against. Marriott's mitigating attempts are well-appreciated here.

 

[SueDonJ]

I agree with how MVC handled my lost Aruba Surf Club week in May but what I don't understand is why the $99 fee in II???

... We'd have to ask MVC but my guess is it was what II was willing to do and they got what they could for the owners.
...

The governing docs give Marriott the rights to all inventory that's unbooked within X-number-of-days (X usually being 75) which they normally offer for rentals and reap the profit. I think Marriott's instead making that inventory available as last-minute intervals for those with DC Holding Account points and the COVID-related II certs. There's probably some consternation that Marriott is likely still reaping some profit over and above whatever the II processing fees are for these $99 exchanges, but it's certainly a whole lot less than they could be making from this particular inventory pool.

 

[Bunk]

When we buy into the timeshare concept, we actually become owners and not guests. The last few years have shown us that sometimes that is not a blessing but a curse. Remember Hurricanes Irma and Dorian of recent years as well as the Covid pandemic. Unlike a guest at a hotel, the timeshare owner is governed by rules that may not allow too much flexibility. Think of the Sorcerer's Apprentice in Fantasia, where the brooms carrying pails of water just keep coming. When the timeshare can't be occupied for several months in 2020, the timeshare company may not be allowed to push those 2020 reservations forward into 2021 and tell the people that are entitled to occupy 2021 that their rights are being restricted.

I appreciate the fact that Marriott is allowing us to extend the use of 2020 points to the end of 2021.

 

[Steve Fatula]

The Holding Account points, almost certainly not for the same resort/time frame next year because of the 120-day Reservation Window and what I expect will be fierce competition. I'm trying to work the calendar to get something sooner rather than later but so far, no luck.

The others, I'm fortunate to have a 13-mos Reservation Window to work with and will be jumping on it immediately, but again I expect to be up against fierce competition with others in the same boat AND owners trying to use next year's allotment at the same time. (And if all else fails, banking into the following two-year usage period is an option.)

Note, I'm not complaining. I know I'm still in a more-fortunate situation than others. Like I said I've been on the phone/in ChatNow with reps that are doing their best to help, and I recognize the limitations I'm up against. Marriott's mitigating attempts are well-appreciated here.

Yes, 2021 going to be very interesting. As little as some believe they have done, we'll see if it actually wasn't too much!

 

[Dean]

Yes, 2021 going to be very interesting. As little as some believe they have done, we'll see if it actually wasn't too much!

I think reservations over the next 3-4 years will be more difficult because of this but it will be a decreasing affect after next year.

 

[Steve Fatula]

I think reservations over the next 3-4 years will be more difficult because of this but it will be a decreasing affect after next year.

Me too. I like many pushed points out and likely will again next year. I'll have a few "banked" deposits as well by end of 2021.

 

[Dean]

Me too. I like many pushed points out and likely will again next year. I'll have a few "banked" deposits as well by end of 2021.

I don't think the holding account points will have a large effect other than short notice situations but I do think the canceled & delayed trips and decisions to take points over weeks will have a large effect. I also think a large % of those holding account points won't be able to be used. Wait for the thread's starting about late next summer with those upset they can't use those points and again blaming MVC.