Sticky - Hilton Vacation Club / DRI now accepting deedbacks - Give back your HGV/Diamond Resorts Timeshare

[Fried_shrimp]

If you've paid maint for this year, you should travel on your points. We were accepted Nov 1, 2020, but saw no notary paperwork and other documents until April. I did the 11,500 point contract first on purpose, and it closed out last month. Just today I got the paperwork and partial payment check back on the 3000 point contract, telling me they needed a check for the full $1000, not $500 and a note telling them they already hit us for $500 in autopay maintenance in Jan and Feb. We were instructed to work with the autopay dept ourselves. What we'll do is try to get the CC to hit them with a chargeback to get our money credited before paying them for Transitions. F**kers.

At this point I would get the CEO's office involved at CEO@ diamondresorts.com

 

[Arusso]

If you've paid maint for this year, you should travel on your points. We were accepted Nov 1, 2020, but saw no notary paperwork and other documents until April. I did the 11,500 point contract first on purpose, and it closed out last month. Just today I got the paperwork and partial payment check back on the 3000 point contract, telling me they needed a check for the full $1000, not $500 and a note telling them they already hit us for $500 in autopay maintenance in Jan and Feb. We were instructed to work with the autopay dept ourselves. What we'll do is try to get the CC to hit them with a chargeback to get our money credited before paying them for Transitions. F**kers.

WoW.........So, if I understand your post; 1) DR does not supply a document that the applicant for the Transitions program can refer to that describes the process. 2) before being approved for the process, any points and reservation(s) an applicant has can be used. However, once approved, any points and / or reservations an applicant has are forfeited. 3) any maintenance fees an applicant has paid toward the current year would NOT be credited toward the application fee? In other words, no refund.

Please feel free to correct any of the three statements I made. It is particularly disturbing that once your application is in the pipeline (accepted) you forfeit any points and vacations in your account - before any transfer of ownership actually takes place ! This is patently unfair because any points or vacation reservation was paid for in the past without any disclaimer that they could be forfeited by application to the Transitions program. I can imagine how such transactions in other business dealings would be considered illegal.

It is also inconceivable how a transaction like this could proceed without DR posting or disclosing the rules. Each one of us has a contract or two (some have several) that delineates rights and responsibilities. My understanding (not being an attorney ) has always been that the seller / developer must issue a contract which is required by law because the underlying product conferring benefits to a buyer is real estate regardless of whether the buyer is given permanent ownership (deed) or the contract is time-limited as in a RTU. Even a company that just sells a membership in a vacation club not tied to real estate at all is subject to rules that protect consumers against consumer fraud by disclosing terms of membership i.e. how someone buys-in and what happens if you do not renew.

 

[clifffaith]

WoW.........So, if I understand your post; 1) DR does not supply a document that the applicant for the Transitions program can refer to that describes the process. 2) before being approved for the process, any points and reservation(s) an applicant has can be used. However, once approved, any points and / or reservations an applicant has are forfeited. 3) any maintenance fees an applicant has paid toward the current year would NOT be credited toward

1. The process seems to be a combination of word of mouth from other Transitioners, and trial and error as DR rejects applications and paperwork for whatever reasons.
2. Not only do any existing reservations have to be used, you can't be in the midst of your last booked vacation and apply. We applied online about October 28 or so at the end of a week in Carlsbad that had us checking out on the 31st. Rejected and had to apply again Nov 1st.
3. Auto pay not necessarily being forfeited, but Transitions won't lift a finger to research the payments. We debated allowing autopays to proceed while in Transitions because easier to have them take $250/month than coming up with $1000 each for two contracts. But after the second autopay I decided we may have exactly the problem we are now having, and we called CC to disallow further payments.

They had our $1000 in the form of $500 autopay and $500 check. They returned our check instead of coordinating with the department that collects the autopays.

 

[Fried_shrimp]

WoW.........So, if I understand your post; 1) DR does not supply a document that the applicant for the Transitions program can refer to that describes the process. 2) before being approved for the process, any points and reservation(s) an applicant has can be used. However, once approved, any points and / or reservations an applicant has are forfeited. 3) any maintenance fees an applicant has paid toward the current year would NOT be credited toward the application fee? In other words, no refund.

Please feel free to correct any of the three statements I made. It is particularly disturbing that once your application is in the pipeline (accepted) you forfeit any points and vacations in your account - before any transfer of ownership actually takes place ! This is patently unfair because any points or vacation reservation was paid for in the past without any disclaimer that they could be forfeited by application to the Transitions program. I can imagine how such transactions in other business dealings would be considered illegal.

It is also inconceivable how a transaction like this could proceed without DR posting or disclosing the rules. Each one of us has a contract or two (some have several) that delineates rights and responsibilities. My understanding (not being an attorney ) has always been that the seller / developer must issue a contract which is required by law because the underlying product conferring benefits to a buyer is real estate regardless of whether the buyer is given permanent ownership (deed) or the contract is time-limited as in a RTU. Even a company that just sells a membership in a vacation club not tied to real estate at all is subject to rules that protect consumers against consumer fraud by disclosing terms of membership i.e. how someone buys-in and what happens if you do not renew.

Not once approved. All reservations are cancelled once applied for. You have to have all reservations completed once you apply for Transitions (assuming you are transitioning all contracts).

 

[Arusso]

Not once approved. All reservations are cancelled once applied for. You have to have all reservations completed once you apply for Transitions (assuming you are transitioning all contracts).

Thanks for the clarification.

 

[clifffaith]

I called in to the "autopay department" because I wanted to be able to tell people how the process worked, rather than just doing a cc chargeback first on the maintenance payments we made. I got into one financial department who put me on hold and then came back and said "they will credit your two autopays, you'll see that in 3-4 days". After a week of no credit on the part of DR, we called and told Amex that we were disputing the charges. The timing went like this: Our check to give back the contract, minus the autopay, was returned with a letter dated June 8, 2021 stating they needed a payment of the full $1000. The call to DR about reversing the auto pay was made about June 15, the call to the Amex about a chargeback was made about June 22, we received mail from Amex that the credit had been made while we were gone the last week of June, and on July 1st I called the Transitions department with my $1000 payment on a different credit card. Yesterday, July 13 we were unable to access our DR account. DONE WITH THEM AND GOOD RIDDANCE.

 

[Heymarch]

DRI's member forum states the following quoted info. Seems like mileage has varied. Upfront fees (ad fees) of $100-150 and waiting lots of waiting were normal. Don't mean to get anyone's hopes up... but potential option.

"The Founder Member is pleased to announce the appointment of The Travel & Leisure Group as an authorized third party reseller for member points.

The Travel & Leisure Group will be happy to assist you in selling your points and have authority to arrange sales on your behalf to other EU Collection members and non members.

Should you wish to sell your points using their services, you may contact them on 0800 988 7168 or submit an enquiry form on their website at www.travelandleisure.co.uk. The Travel & Leisure Group will discuss points resale options with you directly and will be able to assist you throughout the process.

Please note in order to start this process all maintenance fees must be up to date. Also, we must advise that at this time, in accordance with the Articles, The Travel & Leisure Group is the only authorized reseller for members of the European Collection.

U.K. Moderator | Diamond Resorts International® | Tel: +44 (0)845 359 0010 (Mon - Thu 9:00 AM to 5:30 PM, Fri 9:00 AM to 5:00 PM)"

 

[Trustee for Diamond]

We have been trying to get rid of the two Diamond Timeshare resorts that have been owned by our parents.

No one wants them, there is no debt or loan against them, and they are not in our name (we have the ability to sell them as the estate trustee).

The Transitions program will work for one of the time shares - and it has been accepted and we should get the paperwork in about 30-60 days.

However, the other property was purchased via a '3rd party'. It was for the Sedona Summit Resort via a Resort broker in 1996. They have told that this makes it ineligible for the transitions. We tried the route of just letting it go into default, but after two years it never happened and we still get the bills. I understand we are not liable, but we just wanted to button everything up. Is there a place or forum we can go to people recommend to 'sell' the property we can't give back to transitions? Or will people think we are trying to scam them ? We just basically want it out of the name of the estate.

 

[dioxide45]

However, the other property was purchased via a '3rd party'. It was for the Sedona Summit Resort via a Resort broker in 1996. They have told that this makes it ineligible for the transitions. We tried the route of just letting it go into default, but after two years it never happened and we still get the bills. I understand we are not liable, but we just wanted to button everything up. Is there a place or forum we can go to people recommend to 'sell' the property we can't give back to transitions? Or will people think we are trying to scam them ? We just basically want it out of the name of the estate.

With it in default, any money owned on it is far more than the week is worth. So anyone saying they can help get out of it is just out there to scam money from you/them. If they are already in default, I say just leave it alone. At some point the HOA will foreclose. If it isn't gone by the time they pass, it will likely cost the HOA even more to foreclose.

 

[TUGBrian]

100% if you havent made payments in 2 years, that decision is already made!

 

[scuba1999]

For those people who Transitions worked for:

1 - I have three contracts - 1 of them was purchased resale and converted to Diamond at the resort. The other 2 were purchased at resorts. Is it correct that the resale/converted one would not be eligable for Transitions?

2 - What is the cost people have had to pay per contract for Transitions?

3 - How long did the process take? Were there monthly fees until the process was complete?

I have looked into what attorney's would cost or other scams to get out of the timeshare, but never proceeded with any of those options.
I am nervous to start this process - any additional advice from people going through this would be helpful.

 

[tschwa2]

1.If you paid to convert the resale to points it may qualify you have to ask.
2. The cost is $1000 per contract unless you bought in Arizona in that case it is $250 for each of those contracts.
3. The process can take several months. You can't have any reservations active and you have to have the current years MF's paid. If you apply late in the year the following years MF's also have to be paid.

 

[scuba1999]

1.If you paid to convert the resale to points it may qualify you have to ask.
2. The cost is $1000 per contract unless you bought in Arizona in that case it is $250 for each of those contracts.
3. The process can take several months. You can't have any reservations active and you have to have the current years MF's paid. If you apply late in the year the following years MF's also have to be paid.

1 - Yes, paid to convert the resale
2 - One was purchased in Arizona - hooray
3 - Checking with Judy first, then will be starting this process.

Thank you for the response!!

 

[dioxide45]

2. The cost is $1000 per contract unless you bought in Arizona in that case it is $250 for each of those contracts.

Isn't it if you bought in Arizona, the property is in Arizona (can you buy AZ while not in AZ?) or you live in Arizona?

 

[pedro47]

Is Transitions a valid option since Hilton have purchased DRI?

 

[dioxide45]

Is Transitions a valid option since Hilton have purchased DRI?

I beleive it is. But does Hilton Grand Vacations even have a similar program as Transitions? Looking at their information through responsibleexit.com, I can't find any kind of deedback program. Just help using or perhaps what options there are to sell your week.

 

[dayooper]

I beleive it is. But does Hilton Grand Vacations even have a similar program as Transitions? Looking at their information through responsibleexit.com, I can't find any kind of feedback program. Just help using or perhaps what options there are to sell your week.

No, they don’t have an official program. They will purchase your deed back if they see value in it. They also have a resale program, but you sell through an out of company broker. Diane Nadeau and maybe Judi Kozlowski work with HGVC. It’s never guaranteed like the DRI program is.

 

[pedro47]

No, they don’t have an official program. They will purchase your deed back if they see value in it. They also have a resale program, but you sell through an out of company broker. Diane Nadeau and maybe Judi Kozlowski work with HGVC. It’s never guaranteed like the DRI program is.

Sound liked now they may have to offer a Transitions program because of their purchased of DRI.

Only time will tell.

 

[dioxide45]

Sound liked now they may have to offer a Transitions program because of their purchased of DRI.

Only time will tell.

I think it will depend if Hilton sets up a trust based product for their HGV product. When a company sells individual weeks, like HGV does, they have to be picky with what they take back. When they sell a points based product, they can be a little more forgiving what they take back because points are points and easier to sell than an off season week somewhere.

 

[dayooper]

I think it will depend if Hilton sets up a trust based product for their HGV product. When a company sells individual weeks, like HGV does, they have to be picky with what they take back. When they sell a points based product, they can be a little more forgiving what they take back because points are points and easier to sell than an off season week somewhere.

I don't believe HGV will set up a trust product for the current HGVC. They make too much money off of their high end deeds. There are some Hawaii deeds that list for ~$150,000 and there was a report that the 3 bedroom penthouse at one of the new NYC properties (The Quin or Central on 5th) was $500,000 (just someone's report, not verified). Many customers from outside of the US are very cautious of a trust product and won't buy them. They prefer the deeded week and use their home week instead of the points.

From the sound of it, the current divisions (DRI/HVC and HGVC) will keep their current systems in place with DRI being a trust product with some legacy deeds thrown in while HGVC will remain a deed based system. The big question will be if a trust based system like Embarc, which is rumored to become part of HGVC (within the realm of possibility), how would that play out? I'm not even sure if the trust based Embarc system has a buyback program.

 

[dioxide45]

I don't believe HGV will set up a trust product for the current HGVC. They make too much money off of their high end deeds. There are some Hawaii deeds that list for ~$150,000 and there was a report that the 3 bedroom penthouse at one of the new NYC properties (The Quin or Central on 5th) was $500,000 (just someone's report, not verified). Many customers from outside of the US are very cautious of a trust product and won't buy them. They prefer the deeded week and use their home week instead of the points.

From the sound of it, the current divisions (DRI/HVC and HGVC) will keep their current systems in place with DRI being a trust product with some legacy deeds thrown in while HGVC will remain a deed based system. The big question will be if a trust based system like Embarc, which is rumored to become part of HGVC (within the realm of possibility), how would that play out? I'm not even sure if the trust based Embarc system has a buyback program.

Hilton could still sell high end deeds. Vistana does this. They have several flex product, but to date haven't put oceanfront Maui weeks in the trust. Wyndham does similar and still sells certain inventory as weeks. I beleive Marriott may still sell some deeded weeks in Hawaii for the Japanese market. International properties can't be placed in the same trusts as domestic US weeks and Marriott still sells deeded weeks everywhere outside the USA (except Thailand).

A buyback program really becomes more necessary when they run low on inventory and how successful they are at selling low season weeks. If they end up with a lot of unsold low season inventory, then setting up a trust makes sense since a point is a point. It might make sense to lose a little on the high season weeks to make sure the company isn't sitting on a bunch of dog weeks.

 

[dayooper]

Hilton could still sell high end deeds. Vistana does this. They have several flex product, but to date haven't put oceanfront Maui weeks in the trust. Wyndham does similar and still sells certain inventory as weeks. I beleive Marriott may still sell some deeded weeks in Hawaii for the Japanese market. International properties can't be placed in the same trusts as domestic US weeks and Marriott still sells deeded weeks everywhere outside the USA (except Thailand).

They absolutely could create a trust for the majority of their weeks, but all the indicators say they are not going to. HGVC CEO Mark Wang has said in the 2 investor call since the merger was announced on March 10 (Q2 and Q3) that they like having the 2 different systems (deeded and trust). I know you can't bank on info from investor calls, but those 2 calls have been pretty spot on with what has been announced so far. Even the sales teams haven't mentioned HGVC turning into a trust program (not that they are to be trusted at all).

A buyback program really becomes more necessary when they run low on inventory and how successful they are at selling low season weeks. If they end up with a lot of unsold low season inventory, then setting up a trust makes sense since a point is a point. It might make sense to lose a little on the high season weeks to make sure the company isn't sitting on a bunch of dog weeks.

HGVC really only has 2 seasons for properties they have developed (platinum and gold). A couple of the older resorts like Flamingo do have lower seasons, but the majority only have the 2. In fact, the only newer property that has a silver season is Chicago and I believe that was due to Hilton Honors conversion in the winter months . Since there are very few fixed weeks (the SW Florida affiliates not withstanding) and those that are fixed tend to be platinum holiday weeks sold at a premium.

HGVC really uses the trade in to trap owners. They sell them a lower priced lousy deed and in later sales meetings convince the owners to trade in their old deed to a better one. They give them what the full cost of the deed was to put toward the new one. Constant rotation of lesser deeds into greater ones. I actually hate that method as it traps unsuspecting owners. I guess the trade off is that the resale deeds still retain their booking rights.

Note - Properties like the South Carolina resorts were developed by a 3rd party (Strand Capitol) and they hold all of the ROFR and selling rights to the properties. Many of the properties that have more than 2 seasons are either affiliates, international or both.

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

I think the above discussions about the direction of HGVC should transition to a different thread. Let this thread remain focused on the DRI deedback program.

 

[nomoretslt]

A quick question about transitions. I was lucky enough to find this thread back in 2017 and was able to do a deedback on a timeshare a friend had given me....after three years I knew it wasn’t a good thing.
Today a different friend mentioned she had a few timeshares. She mentioned Diamond, said she doesn’t use it, pays her fees. I told her about transitions and deedbacks, but she said she has points. Can you do transitions on points or just fixed weeks? I told her I’d look into it. Or can she give away her points? I was doing some poking around and thought I saw mentioned that you can’t. Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[TUGBrian]

would urge your friend to call and ask, its completely free!