StayPC/Vacation Candy Demanding Repayment for Rental

[grupp]

Did they reach out to you again?
I received the threatening email and just received a request to update regarding the refund.

Yes, I have receive a couple apologetic emails asking to see if we could work out some kind of resolution. I just stopped responding.

 

[SteelerGal]

I may have missed it, but which resort? Are they closed to owners? If closed they are asking for refunds. If open, but with limited amenities, they are asking for rebooking or refund, but technically recognize it's up to the owner as to whether they can offer any alternatives, e.g., other weeks, refund or nada.

Palm Desert so it is closed. I was working w/ the team and then out of the blue got the emails.

 

[djyamyam]

Palm Desert so it is closed. I was working w/ the team and then out of the blue got the emails.

I would say that earlier reservations (like mid-March), VC didn't have a leg to stand on about asking for refunds especially with the resorts being open. The issue then was the renter didn't want to travel or couldn't travel. Now, with a lot of resorts closing in the last week and a half or closing all amenities including pools, then the validity of the refund request shifts to VC because there has been a material change in the reservation (ie. resort not what it used to be) and less about the renter being able to get to the resort.

 

[bobpark56]

I believe they wait until a client asks for a particular week, and they rent the week from an owner on behalf of their client. I'm sure they make a good profit doing this (or had).

They do not buy your week. They just add $500 to your asking price and advertise it through their normal channels. For an additional fee, they will advertise it also on channels like HomeAway and VRBO. Except for how they advertise outside their normal channels for rentals not exactly 1 week in length, they are an ethical company.

 

[TXTortoise]

"Except for how they advertise outside their normal channels for rentals not exactly 1 week in length, they are an ethical company."

Not sure I understand, can you elaborate?

 

[bobpark56]

I, too, have received the "refund" email referenced here for a stay at Kierland (check-in is 3/28).

• Like others here, I have sent a message requesting that they indicate where in the rental agreement there is reference to impossibility/impracticability of performance and/or frustration of purpose (of course there is none).
• I have pointed out that their website says, "Reservations are non-refundable. There are no refunds for travel or weather related occurrences" (https://vacationcandy.com/cancellation).
• I've asked them to confirm that they are not only refunding the rental fee I received, but also the listing fee they charge the renter...I could imagine they might refund what I return, but not the fee they collected.
• Finally, I offered to reschedule the rental or consider a partial refund - options I'm offering to other renters with whom I have direct rental agreements (no 3rd party).

No response yet, and not planning to issue a refund at this time...need to hear more from them than the message we've all received.

Vacation Candy asked us to refund when hurricanes forced Westin St John to close. We complied, as the request seemed reasonable. Vistana then refunded the StarOptions we had used for that week and gave us more than 2 years to use them. So all worked well. Do not look for it to work as well in the future, as MVCI (who now owns Vistana) is nowhere near as owner-friendly. They did no such thing for their Frenchman's Cove owners.

 

[DanCali]

They do not buy your week. They just add $500 to your asking price and advertise it through their normal channels. For an additional fee, they will advertise it also on channels like HomeAway and VRBO. Except for how they advertise outside their normal channels for rentals not exactly 1 week in length, they are an ethical company.

They may very well be an ethical company. But the contract is between you and VacationCandy, not between you and a renter. So to me this is a material difference from the RedWeek process where, in that case, they charge relatively modest fees on both sides but the contact is between you and the renter directly. With VC they are effectively renting the week from you and you agree for them to sublease it and make the corresponding change to the reservation on their behalf.

They can add $500, $300, $700, or $1 - it's their risk... basically a "buy low, sell high" model. They mitigate that risk by actually renting the week from you only when they have a guest so it's a great business model when you can get $500 a pop - until there is a pandemic... But if the contract is with them, it's hard for them to argue that they had an intention to use the pools. A renter can have that issue vis-a-vis VC but them trying to pass the buck when you have no direct dealing or contract with the renter seems iffy to me.

 

[RedwoodRunner]

First of all, thank you to all the timeshare owners! I have rented owner's weeks for years off of Redweek and other direct sources with zero problems. I have only had positive experiences and will continue to rent from owners, but not from Vacation Candy. I'd like to give a renters perspective. We rented a few nights in Palm Desert and the Marriott property was closed during the period of time our stay was to happen. We did not cancel the reservation. Vacation Candy promised access to the resort and all the amenities but they could not fulfill that promise. Although we are healthy, we looked at insuring the trip for Covid-19 issues but all 5 insurance companies I spoke with would not insure it for Covid since the reservation was made after a late January date (can't recall the magic number). The reservation was made February 27th. As a renter, Vacation Candy is offering me nothing, not even 10% of the $500 commission they made on my reservation. I'd love to work with the owner and see if I could reschedule for another date, but VC will not supply me with their information, nor will they help facilitate this. I just wanted to give another perspective as they have offered me no solutions. I'm also afraid if the owner refunds them they will keep the money and their commission and head to the hills. I have put the charge into dispute with my CC company. It's not the option I'd prefer as I'd hope an ethical company could come to a middle ground solution. Anyway, no hard feelings to owners and I will continue to rent from you, but directly.

 

[TXTortoise]

Resort officially closed or just no amenities?

 

[dioxide45]

Resort officially closed or just no amenities?

Depending on when travel was, the resorts were closed. They are still closed.

Marriott’s Desert Springs Villas
Palm Desert, California, USA
Resort Status: Temporarily closed to new arrivals (tentatively reopening Thursday, May 14th – subject to change).

Timeshare Resort Updates | Marriott Vacations Worldwide

View property and destination updates for Marriott Vacation Club, Sheraton Vacation Club, Westin Vacation Club timeshare resorts and luxury properties. Learn more about current status of resort amenities and services.

hub.vacationclub.com

 

[RedwoodRunner]

Yes, Marriott Desert Springs.....officially closed.

 

[grupp]

First of all, thank you to all the timeshare owners! I have rented owner's weeks for years off of Redweek and other direct sources with zero problems. I have only had positive experiences and will continue to rent from owners, but not from Vacation Candy. I'd like to give a renters perspective. We rented a few nights in Palm Desert and the Marriott property was closed during the period of time our stay was to happen. We did not cancel the reservation. Vacation Candy promised access to the resort and all the amenities but they could not fulfill that promise. Although we are healthy, we looked at insuring the trip for Covid-19 issues but all 5 insurance companies I spoke with would not insure it for Covid since the reservation was made after a late January date (can't recall the magic number). The reservation was made February 27th. As a renter, Vacation Candy is offering me nothing, not even 10% of the $500 commission they made on my reservation. I'd love to work with the owner and see if I could reschedule for another date, but VC will not supply me with their information, nor will they help facilitate this. I just wanted to give another perspective as they have offered me no solutions. I'm also afraid if the owner refunds them they will keep the money and their commission and head to the hills. I have put the charge into dispute with my CC company. It's not the option I'd prefer as I'd hope an ethical company could come to a middle ground solution. Anyway, no hard feelings to owners and I will continue to rent from you, but directly.

Thank you for your perspective. What really bothers me, in addition to the original threatening email, is the fact they want the owners to refund the money. But they are not doing anything to assist the renter and keeping their $500.

 

[bobpark56]

"Except for how they advertise outside their normal channels for rentals not exactly 1 week in length, they are an ethical company."

Not sure I understand, can you elaborate?

We offered a 13-night rental and paid the fee for VC to use extra outside advertising (VRBO, HomeAway, maybe etc. too). When I checked the ad on VRBO and HomeAway. it mentioned only 7 nights, yet they were pricing it for the cost of the full 13 nights. No one in their right mind would bite on that advertising. I raised the unfairness of what they were doing, and VC refused to budge.
Other than that, I have liked VacationCandy.

 

[TXTortoise]

We offered a 13-night rental and paid the fee for VC to use extra outside advertising (VRBO, HomeAway, maybe etc. too). When I checked the ad on VRBO and HomeAway. it mentioned only 7 nights, yet they were pricing it for the cost of the full 13 nights. No one in their right mind would bite on that advertising. I raised the unfairness of what they were doing, and VC refused to budge.
Other than that, I have liked VacationCandy.

Strange. The owner controls the date range/number of days through the owner portal, along with rent amount and option to use VRBO, etc.

 

[pacman777]

Thank you for your perspective. What really bothers me, in addition to the original threatening email, is the fact they want the owners to refund the money. But they are not doing anything to assist the renter and keeping their $500.

Sounds like they’re a bunch of crooks screwing renters and then trying to profit of trying to get refunds from owners. I would just ignore their requests for paying back anything

 

[SuperTrooper00]

I found this website and thread when I was googling the name of the company the thread is named after. Just thought it might be helpful to know what VC is doing from a renters perspective.
We are renters and have a reservation in August in Maui.
We booked and paid our first payment (half of the total fee) in January, well before the current crisis.
We had contacted VC about the August reservation when everything started getting bad and got no response from them. Our final payment was due last week and the day before it was due they sent an email saying we needed to make final payment. We asked them what happened if the resort was closed and/or if travel was restricted in August. Their response was bizarre (to say the least). They sent a page with two options. Both options had all of this legalize saying it resolved the issue and the renter would not be seeking remittance from “courts, credit card companies, etc” and that VC was now legally free etc etc.
Basically, the options were pull out now and lose your deposit. Or pay in full and keep reservation.
I emailed and said I just wanted to change my dates as I understood the owner of the week needed to keep their money. And asked about a partial refund. Both emails were ignored.
After several more emails and attempted phone calls they emailed me and said they had contacted the owner and the owner refused a refund and that if I didn’t make full payment that day the owner would be canceling the reservation and I would lose my first payment completely. They then sent me a paypal link for final payment.
I have used VC before with no problems. I have NEVER been sent a paypal link to pay anything. It’s always been done direct through them.
If you read their BBB page you will see renters are getting the shaft from them.
Even if owners refund the money I highly doubt renters are going to see a dime.
I would love nothing more than to work with the owner directly at this point as we could easily find a solution.
Unfortunately, our “broker” (VC) in the deal is no longer brokering. They are simply trying to cover themselves for what they know will be a litany of lawsuits.
My best guess is they are trying to get whatever money they can for now through sketchy paypal links (that is likely not tied to their business) and will file bankruptcy soon (only to open with a new name).
It’s a shame for everyone involved. We would consider keeping our August reservation as things seem likely to be better but are scared to death to send any more money to them as the owner will likely never get their money and we will likely lose our reservation Either way.
Lastly, all of our emails have different names on the bottom now. But I am 99% sure they are all from the same person (just a strong educated guess). The sentence structure and verbiage is very very similar in all. I’m guessing the owner laid off what little staff they had.

 

[TXTortoise]

FWIW, they use PayPal extensively. They do have a very small staff, they aren't Redweek, and you will see the same names responding to their email queue. The team is also working from home, so email is the only way they are able to communicate, with their call center suspended for safety.

As you know, it's not a hotel reservation, so the owner may not have another alternative, i.e., it could easily be a fixed week and no way to rebook another week for you. Technically the owner controls the reservation, subject to the contract, and apparently the owner is enforcing the contract.

If the resort is closed, then you get a full refund per the contract.

August is still a ways out, but I would expect resorts to start opening by then, to some extent. One of the Facebook pages noted that Kaanapali Beach Hotel is planning for a July 1st opening. Life there will be different going forward, and you'll be on the leading edge, but you will be on Maui. ;-)

I expect the bigger risk is your flight being cancelled or rerouted via HNL trying to get to Maui as all direct flights are being suspended.

 

[SuperTrooper00]

FWIW, they use PayPal extensively. They do have a very small staff, they aren't Redweek, and you will see the same names responding to their email queue.

As you know, it's not a hotel reservation, so the owner may not have another alternative, i.e., it could easily be a fixed week and no way to rebook another week for you. Technically the owner controls the reservation, subject to the contract, and apparently the owner is enforcing the contract.

If the resort is closed, then you get a full refund per the contract.

August is still a ways out, but I would expect resorts to start opening by then, to some extent. One of the Facebook pages noted that Kaanapali Beach Hotel is planning for a July 1st opening. Life there will be different going forward, and you'll be on the leading edge, but you will be on Maui. ;-)

I expect the bigger risk is your flight being cancelled or rerouted via HNL trying to get to Maui as all direct flights are being suspended.

It just seems there is no way to insure the owner will even see the money at this point. Based on their responses we have lost a lot of confidence in them and have used them many many times in the past.
We are scared to death we will make the final payment and then the reservation gets cancelled anyways.

 

[TXTortoise]

I understand the anxiety....and probably appropriate in general, given the unknowns.

I can tell you the owners get the money immediately after the renter pays, less VC commission and any VRBO fees if applicable. 50% for both parties at each payment. So that's not a big risk for the owners. VCs only investment is primarily in their IT infrastructure and people cost, so cash flow could be a concern there, but guessing they have less exposure than most businesses.

I don't know which resort you have booked, but timeshares are owned properties so barring a complete closure of the resort you should be good. Technically a resort has to let an owner reside there, as they own their week, but lots of logistics can keep that from happening easily, e.g., quarantine, limited air access, etc.

You should have your name on the reservation at this point so the only real risk is air access, government lockdown or resort formally closing. The last one will get you a refund.

That said, I don't know how refunds like that would be structured and whether VC is liable if owner refuses to refund, and then they pursue action against the owner, or something else.

For my rentals for next February, my MFs are fully funded and all the rental deposits are going into a holding account, just in case...but every case is different. Heck, I hope to be there for two weeks and more worried about how the whale trips will be structured.

No easy answers, but August much better than July. Hawaii can't survive very well without tourism, so something will have to give.

 

[SuperTrooper00]

I really appreciate the response and help. I honestly am not sure what we will do.

 

[RedwoodRunner]

Personally, I would not give VC or Sundance Concierge or whatever other names they are going by another cent. Cut your loss and dispute the charges. As above, in our case the resort was entirely closed and VC refused to refund anything. It was a Marriott property so the owner had to get their week back and VC got to keep their $500 commission and we got zilch. They have gone silent after we put it in dispute with our CC. I would print all the information, complaints, reviews, etc. off of the BBB page, here and other sources and use it in your case for dispute. Why would you throw more money after bad money? If you give them more money, and the resort is closed, you will not see that money. That is a guarantee!

 

[SteelerGal]

I am an owner and currently in dispute w/ VC. I tried to work w/ VC to no avail.(No guarantee that renter will actually get their refund if I refun VC). I’m sticking w/ RedWeek or handling the rental myself.

 

[bobpark56]

They may very well be an ethical company. But the contract is between you and VacationCandy, not between you and a renter. <snip>

Not sure where you get this "contract" idea. When I have used Vacation Candy, there was never a contract until after someone said they wanted to rent our unit. The contract was then between them and me. Vacation Candy was not a party to the contract...they were just a broker.

 

[ocdb8r]

Not sure where you get this "contract" idea. When I have used Vacation Candy, there was never a contract until after someone said they wanted to rent our unit. The contract was then between them and me. Vacation Candy was not a party to the contract...they were just a broker.

Your experience is unique to mine (and based on the posts, most others on this board). For the week I rented with them, the contract was between me and VacationCandy, specifically giving VCthe right to assign the week to anyone they chose. YES, they sent the contract after they already had a renter (and I suspect, after the renter signed a contract with them), but I have no direct contract with the renter and in fact the renter information is not even in the contract itself...after I signed VC just emailed me the name they were requesting to be put on the reservation.

 

[SteelerGal]

Your experience is unique to mine (and based on the posts, most others on this board). For the week I rented with them, the contract was between me and VacationCandy, specifically giving VCthe right to assign the week to anyone they chose. YES, they sent the contract after they already had a renter (and I suspect, after the renter signed a contract with them), but I have no direct contract with the renter and in fact the renter information is not even in the contract itself...after I signed VC just emailed me the name they were requesting to be put on the reservation.

Yes, they are a broker. So I find it interesting that they are telling owners that an refund will be given to renter but renters are being told they will not be refunded.