Recent Owner Updates With Tales of Vistana/MVC Merger

[daviator]

I just finished an owner update presentation at WDW. I am an owner here, but am here on an Encore Package purchased a year ago.

It was relatively painless this time, they were trying to get me to trade in my EOY Westin Flex for EY, claiming that once the merger occurs, they will no longer allow trade-ins of existing ownerships, so this might be my last chance. Marriott doesn't do trade-ins, they said. This was not a persuasive argument, since I have relatives who own in Marriott's program and I know they have traded stuff in with them in the past. They also told me that trade-ins were 90% of their business, and it doesn't make any sense that MVI would kill 90% of their business.

They also wanted me to get to 5* elite (I'm 4*) because that will make me Chairman's Club in the new program, and I'll be grandfathered in to get Bonvoy Titanium, which they said will not be offered once the new program rolls out. I doubt that too, and they (of course) couldn't tell me how current Vistana ownership would map into the MVC elite program, except that if you are 5* elite when they move to the new program, you will become Chairman's Club in MVC. Again this was not persuasive, and I am mildly optimistic that if there is a merged elite program, my existing ownership may already be enough to get me to the highest level.

They offered me another Encore Package – all of them were for four nights in a Premium 1 BR – either $995 + $99 for $500 or 100K Bonvoy points, $695+$99 for $250 or 50K Bonvoy Points, or $1695 for 200K Bonvoy points or $1000. I think the Encore Packages are a reasonable deal, and I bought the $695 package. My rationale is that the new changes should be announced by the time I come back to use that package, so I'd want to do an owner update anyway to hear about them.

One of the people I talked to admitted that they really didn't have any details on the new program and suspected that it would be announced later than people are expecting, like probably summer or fall of next year, not January as everyone expects. But that, too, was just a guess.

Oh, they told me that they pay Marriott 1.25¢ per Bonvoy point (so 100,000 Bonvoy points costs them $1250.). No idea if that's true or not. It seems a little high but not completely impossible.

 

[samcar1]

I had spoken to a manager a few months ago who told me not to upgrade to 5* from 4*. He said I would be titanium. We should be getting an email by year’s end and the program should roll out in April. I think 4 and 5 will be titanium

 

[DagnyT]

So I got a pretty funny call yesterday from some sales rep from Vistana basically saying, hey, you've been "specically" selected to help find a way to get you from 3* to 4* before the Marriott merger kicks and all the pricing goes up. Some highlights:

• Because the rep was calling from "corporate" and calls are recorded, she couldn't create a bunch of "fluff" like they normally do in the owner updates.
  (So no making up crap to sell you stuff.)
• The claim is that the points/options when I bought was much lower and once the merger completes, the value will be up above $.71 per point/option and there will ONLY be block pricing and not just add some options here or there, so I should upgrade now and lock in all these great benefits before they're unaffordable.
• She really didn't have any information about how things would work after the merger (and couldn't make anything up because of the recording), but... right now 148,100 gets you 1 week in a 2 bedroom. You're at 220K in the SF. So why don't I just get the 139K options and go to 4*, which is way more desirable. And then you'l have enough to get you to 2 weeks in a 2 bedroom anywhere in the new Marriott system.
• When I asked how she knew this because she didn't have any information about how this was going to work, her answer was... common sense.
• OK, out of curiosity, what's it going to cost? Because she said something about under $.50/option earlier, which is ridiculous, so what are they offering? Well, she doesn't know because that's contracts.... so basically I said, tell me what it's going to cost and I'll see what I think.

OK, so today, I get on a Teams call with her. She stalls trying to pitch the same thing before getting the contracts guy on.
I did finally get to the payoff, which was to see the actual.

Here's what they offered:

• Upgrade to 359K options (so 4*) in Sheraton Flex.
• Retail Price: $254,172 (note that they showed Marriott grids at $272K for 175,000 points)
• They knocked off about $199K on current value and some other incentive
• So with trade in, final purchase at $54,998
• Waive money down (their financing currently running 13.99% on 15 yrs, so no payments 60 days so you can re-fi)
• Waive 2022 maintenance fees. So no fees till 2023
• Receive full 359K options for 2022 with use extended to 12/31/2024

Second offfer was to go up to 257,700, which would cost another $20K, but maintain the chance to get the offer above at the same pricing for some period of time.

So there you go.

Didn't do it for obvious reasons. If I really needed another 100K+ options (which I don't at this point) I would definitely not take SF and there are much cheaper ways to go.
Getting ready to head to Steamboat and SVV over the next few weeks, so will be curious as to what they pitch as it gets closer to year-end....

 

[Veritoalsol]

HI! We went to our owners update at Lagunamar this morning. We only have resales (one in Lagunamar and the other one at SVV for the Staroptions). They basically offered us 44,000 staroptions in westin aventuras for $11,242 with the "one time only" 10% discount for an EOY week, throwing in 3 vouchers of 330,000 bonvoy points for 2275 each. That would grandfather in our Westin Lagunamar resale (its a 2 bedroom lockoff), which would (as we are told) allow us to have access to the MVC network and allow us to gain Bonvoy points every year. To grandfather in both properties, the price was about $19,000. That's a lot of money for us right now - so we did not take that (please tell me i was wrong!). They did offer us an additional week for a one time use, that would also lock in the existing offer for 18 months - at which point my DH caved. Genius of timeshares - please share your thoughts! Part of me is a bit scared of getting locked out of the MVC network if they have access to our properties and that means reservations get impossible. Your wisdom is welcome. The date they mentioned for the merger to be complete was April 2022. We are planning on coming back in March 2022 in any case. Thanks!

 

[alexadeparis]

There is a very good chance that MVC may offer a one time deal for you to become part of the new group for a minimum cost. Is that worth $10,000 to minimize the risk that they won't? Only you can decide. When MVC changed to points they offered some resale owners the chance to become legit. Its very likely that will happen again.

 

[rcv82]

Part of me is a bit scared of getting locked out of the MVC network if they have access to our properties and that means reservations get impossible. Your wisdom is welcome. The date they mentioned for the merger to be complete was April 2022. We are planning on coming back in March 2022 in any case. Thanks!

While they could potentially change the way StarOptions work, they really can’t mess with your underlying ownerships. So you should always be able to use your home weeks as you can now from 8 to 12 months out.


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[cubigbird]

They did offer us an additional week for a one time use, that would also lock in the existing offer for 18 months - at which point my DH caved.

Sounds like you purchased an encore package. Those can be good deals if you use them wisely. We used one in the past as part of a resale retro transaction.

With the announcement of a combined program coming very soon, we are holding off on doing anything more. Cash is king at this point and there are too many different stories coming from sales. Marriott is going to use this combination as an opportunity to generate more revenue. They wouldn’t have bought Vistana otherwise. You didn’t miss out.

 

[Veritoalsol]

Thank you @cubigbird - we're planning on coming back in March so will post here whatever comes out from my owners update

 

[Austinbe]

I just went to a MVC presentation, and for the small sum of $45,000, I could buy into the Marriott club and be guaranteed entrance "because everyone in Vistana is going to have to do this to have access to Marriott resorts". Don't think it's going to happen this way, but I'm sure some people have been sucked in.

I was just told the same thing yesterday but I only had to give them something like $12k more. I said no.

 

[Mowogo]

While they could potentially change the way StarOptions work, they really can’t mess with your underlying ownerships. So you should always be able to use your home weeks as you can now from 8 to 12 months out.


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I'd say they won't change how StarOptions work, but that the pool of inventory is going to be much smaller and only grow smaller as Voluntary properties sell out and owners moving their ownership to trading within DC. The underlying week at the home resort will still exist and exchange in Interval as a week, but anything more than that will depend on how the new program handles the different types of ownerships

 

[fasha39]

WLM presentation this week; the usual theatrical praise/outrage that we are resale owners, adamant that resale owners won’t be able access MVC - asked for proof and was told that “the head guy” said it to the salespeople at a meeting, of course pushed Aventuras, still offering 10% discount plus at least 175,000 Bonvoy points or double options with purchase, no idea when merger will happen other than in 2022, hyped how many Bonvoy points we’d have if option were converted and somewhat interestingly said that post merger all programs will remain separate. I asked for more specifics, the explanation was pretty wobbly but sounds like they won’t rebrand all under one umbrella, grouped with “like” brands. Also asked about what ratio will be used for Vistana options to MVC points, suggestion was that our WKORV OV would equal the same in MVC - reiterated several times that “Ka’anapalI is like gold”, my response was “excellent, happy to hear that so when I use it for MVC it’ll be golden as well” - took more than a few seconds to be reminded that that could only happen if we retro.

So in the end nobody knows anything about post merger, I do not believe resale owners will be shut out - as others have said there may be a fee of some sort to join as was done in MVC prior. This salesperson was harmless, not aggressive but clearly didn’t know anything and just used the same old tactics. We hadn’t done an update for a few years, likely be a few before do it again - took the $100 credit.

 

[rickandcindy23]

All of this speculation is really just that. Think of how badly Marriott has handled the hotel takeover. They really didn't do us any favors with our 700,000 points we had at one time. I am talking hotel side, but I think it's a good foreshadowing of the future with Marriott Vacation Club.

 

[Mowogo]

All of this speculation is really just that. Think of how badly Marriott has handled the hotel takeover. They really didn't do us any favors with our 700,000 points we had at one time. I am talking hotel side, but I think it's a good foreshadowing of the future with Marriott Vacation Club.

Completely separate companies and different levels of pain will go to different types of owners. Voluntary owners will see no change, Mandatory slowly will become more like Voluntary as VSN inventory moves over to the new program. The questions are really for the Developer purchased weeks and points.

 

[VacationForever]

Completely separate companies and different levels of pain will go to different types of owners. Voluntary owners will see no change, Mandatory slowly will become more like Voluntary as VSN inventory moves over to the new program. The questions are really for the Developer purchased weeks and points.

I don't believe VSN inventory will get "moved". The model will be that MVC DC members can book VSN inventory at 8 months. Vistana developer purchased weeks and points will be able to book MVC DC inventory at 8 months as well.

 

[Mowogo]

I don't believe VSN inventory will get "moved". The model will be that MVC DC members can book VSN inventory at 8 months. Vistana developer purchased weeks and points will be able to book MVC DC inventory at 8 months as well.

We know that the new system has a unified currency. We know that the unified system will look a lot more like DC which functions at 13 months for exchanges. And inventory acquired through ROFR or through upgrades is likely to deposit into the new system directly which would in effect remove the inventory from VSN, just a much slower draw down of inventory. If Flex has a free/low cost way to switch to the new system then you could have a lot of inventory coming out of VSN quicker. MVC has zero incentives to support VSN long term.

 

[dioxide45]

We know that the new system has a unified currency. We know that the unified system will look a lot more like DC which functions at 13 months for exchanges. And inventory acquired through ROFR or through upgrades is likely to deposit into the new system directly which would in effect remove the inventory from VSN, just a much slower draw down of inventory. If Flex has a free/low cost way to switch to the new system then you could have a lot of inventory coming out of VSN quicker. MVC has zero incentives to support VSN long term.

How do we know this? Nothing has been announced. We just know they are working on a single point product for sale and reservations. What is looks like, no one really knows. It could very well be more like DC, but we don't know anything beyond a unified currency.

 

[CPNY]

We know that the new system has a unified currency. We know that the unified system will look a lot more like DC which functions at 13 months for exchanges. And inventory acquired through ROFR or through upgrades is likely to deposit into the new system directly which would in effect remove the inventory from VSN, just a much slower draw down of inventory. If Flex has a free/low cost way to switch to the new system then you could have a lot of inventory coming out of VSN quicker. MVC has zero incentives to support VSN long term.

This is why most Vistana owners are not happy that Marriott bought Vistana. MVC Has zero incentives to support any of its customers. It seems that They are the greediest of all timeshare companies.

 

[VacationForever]

We know that the new system has a unified currency. We know that the unified system will look a lot more like DC which functions at 13 months for exchanges. And inventory acquired through ROFR or through upgrades is likely to deposit into the new system directly which would in effect remove the inventory from VSN, just a much slower draw down of inventory. If Flex has a free/low cost way to switch to the new system then you could have a lot of inventory coming out of VSN quicker. MVC has zero incentives to support VSN long term.

Although the new system has not been announced, I don't believe there will be a new unified currency. Some of the discussions I had with the salespeople were that the system will resemble the cross-booking model of the Wyndham/Worldmark/Shell systems.

 

[wuzupdawk]

I had spoken to a manager a few months ago who told me not to upgrade to 5* from 4*. He said I would be titanium. We should be getting an email by year’s end and the program should roll out in April. I think 4 and 5 will be titanium

We had an owners update at the end of October (Westin Nanea) and were told 4* "might" be given Bonvoy Platinum status in the new year, but no guarantees --- it's only rumour and speculation at this point. She predicted that 5* would be Platinum for sure, and that neither 4* nor 5* would be given Titanium status.

We added 1-wk annual Nanea Oceanfront to complement our 2-wk EOY for probably too much $$$ and received 695,000 Bonvoy pts., which we should be able to use at the JW Marriott in Cabo next year, so I don't feel completely taken advantage of LOL.

 

[rcv82]

She predicted that 5* would be Platinum for sure, and that neither 4* nor 5* would be given Titanium status.

Given that 5* already gets Platinum this hardly is impressive.


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[Castle1967]

Just chumming for any TUGGERS with recent owner updates that included discussions about how the MVC/WVC/SVC consolidation (yes, still speculative at best) might go down?

I just had an owner's update while vacationing in Arizona (April 1, 2022 thru April 11, 2022) and going forward 3-star elite will be upgraded to lifetime Platinum and will become Executive Level Members with Marriott Vacation Club (see attached jpeg).
Current 4-star Elite will become lifetime Titanium and will be recognized as Presidential Level Members with Marriott Vacation Club. Depending on the amount of ownership (star options), owners may be recognized as Chairman Level Members with Marriott Vacation Club. The way it was explained to me is it will be based on a conversion equation from Star Options to Destination Points (the currency used by Marriott to book time at their vacation resorts).
Five-star elite will be lifetime Titanium and will be recognized as Chairman Level Members with Marriott Vacation Club.

During the update, we were told they are currently in a soft rollout and the full rollout will happen in about a month (mid to late May).

***Another thing to be aware of is if you own any Aventuras in Puerta Vallarta, you may want to call and convert it to Westin Flex as they have determined they are unable to convert the Westin in Puerta Vallarta to Villas, due to some issues with accomodating previous timeshare owners at the property before the hotel was converted to a Westin. This means you will only be able to use your ownership at Lagunamar or Los Cabos. So, pay the $$ and convert to Westin Flex.

 

[byeloe]

This means you will only be able to use your ownership at Lagunamar or Los Cabos. So, pay the $$ and convert to Westin Flex.

I would wait and see what the actual program is, before giving them any more$$. I don't know how many owners purchased Aventuras for the purpose of going to Puerto Vallarta. You can still get to most of the Westin Flex resorts at 8 months

 

[daviator]

I just had an owner's update while vacationing in Arizona (April 1, 2022 thru April 11, 2022) and going forward 3-star elite will be upgraded to lifetime Platinum and will become Executive Level Members with Marriott Vacation Club (see attached jpeg).
Current 4-star Elite will become lifetime Titanium and will be recognized as Presidential Level Members with Marriott Vacation Club. Depending on the amount of ownership (star options), owners may be recognized as Chairman Level Members with Marriott Vacation Club. The way it was explained to me is it will be based on a conversion equation from Star Options to Destination Points (the currency used by Marriott to book time at their vacation resorts).
Five-star elite will be lifetime Titanium and will be recognized as Chairman Level Members with Marriott Vacation Club.

During the update, we were told they are currently in a soft rollout and the full rollout will happen in about a month (mid to late May).

***Another thing to be aware of is if you own any Aventuras in Puerta Vallarta, you may want to call and convert it to Westin Flex as they have determined they are unable to convert the Westin in Puerta Vallarta to Villas, due to some issues with accomodating previous timeshare owners at the property before the hotel was converted to a Westin. This means you will only be able to use your ownership at Lagunamar or Los Cabos. So, pay the $$ and convert to Westin Flex.

It’s not really “lifetime“ Platinum or Titanium, lifetime status is something different that you earn through stays and by maintaining status for many years. It may seem effectively the same, since if you continue to own your timeshare you will continue to receive the Bonvoy status, but if you no longer own your timeshare, your Bonvoy status will go away too.

The true lifetime status continues regardless what you own.

But so long as you keep your timeshare, the difference may be pretty meaningless since you’ll keep your Bonvoy status either way.

Thanks for posting about your owner update.

 

[cubigbird]

I just had an owner's update while vacationing in Arizona (April 1, 2022 thru April 11, 2022) and going forward 3-star elite will be upgraded to lifetime Platinum and will become Executive Level Members with Marriott Vacation Club (see attached jpeg).
Current 4-star Elite will become lifetime Titanium and will be recognized as Presidential Level Members with Marriott Vacation Club. Depending on the amount of ownership (star options), owners may be recognized as Chairman Level Members with Marriott Vacation Club. The way it was explained to me is it will be based on a conversion equation from Star Options to Destination Points (the currency used by Marriott to book time at their vacation resorts).
Five-star elite will be lifetime Titanium and will be recognized as Chairman Level Members with Marriott Vacation Club.

During the update, we were told they are currently in a soft rollout and the full rollout will happen in about a month (mid to late May).

***Another thing to be aware of is if you own any Aventuras in Puerta Vallarta, you may want to call and convert it to Westin Flex as they have determined they are unable to convert the Westin in Puerta Vallarta to Villas, due to some issues with accomodating previous timeshare owners at the property before the hotel was converted to a Westin. This means you will only be able to use your ownership at Lagunamar or Los Cabos. So, pay the $$ and convert to Westin Flex.

I am not sure that’s exactly true about Puerto Vallarta. Who knows. We may never know. In any case, it has been talked about by upper management in investor meetings that they were looking to sell off that property entirely. It has not yet hapenned but it’s widely known for some time that nothing is likely going to happen there. I agree with others, I would wait and see how this all plays out before spending money emotionally with the developer. The level of trust people place in sales people is astounding. Aventuras has its place, if you prefer 12 month priority at Cabo or are flexible with Lagunamar availability at 12 months. The developer is famous for telling you what you bought before is now bad. Sales depends on solutions to problems created.

 

[tschwa2]

It’s not really “lifetime“ Platinum or Titanium, lifetime status is something different that you earn through stays and by maintaining status for many years. It may seem effectively the same, since if you continue to own your timeshare you will continue to receive the Bonvoy status, but if you no longer own your timeshare, your Bonvoy status will go away too.

The true lifetime status continues regardless what you own.

But so long as you keep your timeshare, the difference may be pretty meaningless since you’ll keep your Bonvoy status either way.

Thanks for posting about your owner update.

It can also really help get you to true platinum lifetime status, I don't think you can get true lifetime titanium unless you are already grandfathered. Once you have had 10 years of platinum and 600 elite nights you are platinum for life. It doesn't matter if your platinum status was a result of timeshare ownership. So once you meet the qualifications for platinum for life you will still have it even without the timeshare.