Need help please (sales rep lied to me)

[Green Tree]

We went to Vegas in July and attended a Hilton presentation. We did not plan to buy. Hilton sales rep started talking about open season booking at $50 to $245 per week once we join and decide to book using cash. I thought this was a great deal. She confirmed with us several times. I asked her to show me how to book these open season booking. She said she could show me after my account was activated. During signing I saw some wording like open season booking $75 to $2000 per night. I stopped and questioned her again. She reassured me. She also said 5800 points will have 7 night studio in high season and 14 nights off season.. I did not even negotiate the price. After we got home, I waited for my account to be activated. Then I discovered I could not find anything at $245 per week. Then I found I bought 4 nights M-Thur at Grand Islander. The contract and the Deed did not mention M-Th either. It just says partial week 2.

I have been very upset and angry. I could not eat or sleep. How could the rep lie to me? I trusted her. Is she still a human being? How can Hilton condone such actions? The rep will not return my texts.

I wrote to Hilton President and General Counsel. Finally someone called me. She would not disclose her real name. Calling herself Ms. G. She wanted to offer me "a ton of points". I said No. I will not want to step into Hilton anymore. Then she wanted to schedule a conference call with the rep, myself and her. So far nothing has been scheduled yet.

What are your suggestions? Any input is greatly appreciated.

 

[Passepartout]

It's kind of unclear what you bought. Did you actually sign up for a timeshare, or just book a 4 night stay? HGVC will honor what is in the contract, but like ALL verbal agreements, the words mean nothing unless they are in the written contract. If you signed it and then let the legally required rescission (cooling off) period expire, we can't help you.

As to the representative's humanity, we've been calling them 'salesweasels' like forever. They will lie, obfuscate, change the subject, deflect, or nearly anything to make the sales quota they are given.

There are no magic words to make this purchase just go away. DO NOT sign up for one of those 'get you out of your timeshare' outfits. They just want more of your money, and if they get that, there is no incentive for them to do any more.

I wish we'd had this conversation before, or shortly after you attended this presentation. At this point, a letter writing campaign and/or spreading this story all over social media where others might see it before signing up are about your only recourse. We have heard of developers letting people off the hook on the condition that they remove negative social media posts.

Good Luck, and Welcome to TUG.

Jim

 

[Green Tree]

Thank you, Jim, for taking the time to write your reply. The time share is 4 nights (M-Thur). But the contract did not say that. It just says partial week 2. I would not be able to find out open season booking lie until my account was activated. What social media should I go to? Youtube? Facebook?

 

[GTLINZ]

The time share is 4 nights (M-Thur). But the contract did not say that. It just says partial week 2. I would not be able to find out open season booking lie until my account was activated. What social media should I go to? Youtube? Facebook?

You are free to post your experience - but unfortunately you are one among VERY MANY who has been taken advantage of by a timeshare shark. You are bound by what is in the contract, not what was said. You also likely have no proof of what was said unless you made a recording - so it will be your word against theirs. Posting will not fix the situation, but it could help somebody else not get into this situation themselves. It is unlikely that any amount of complaining will get you out of the contract. At least that is my impression after being on this BBS for a long time.

I am sorry you are in this situation but as already stated by Jim there is not much you can do (you bought in July and are well past the recission period). You likely paid far more than it is worth (that is the usual situation).

HGVC is a good system once in - you may want to post in the HGVC forum and learn how to make lemonaid by using what you have. Many in your situation have lessened the pain this way by getting some nice vacations cheaper than rack rates - especially if you use studios which are the least amount of points and/or travel off season.

And BTW - open season is comprised of LAST MINUTE inventory (30 days). They MAY HAVE quoted you the cheapest rates in the lowest season somewhere - but it is certainly usually never that cheap. The rates also vary by location and demand. It is also NOT REFUNDABLE if you cannot go. You cannot change the reservation either.

When I got into HGVC in 2005 (resale, thank you TUG) we used open season a lot for last minute escapes. I believe the rates back then were standard across all resorts by unit size and season. It got a lot more expensive a few years ago with demand pricing but still may be worth it to you sometimes once you can see it. That would be secondary to using your points first - which can be used anywhere in the system.

Not sure about the offer you got - but if they are willing to throw some points at you with no additional purchase to appease you, you may want to consider. As you said, i would not ever buy from them again if their offer involves any more money.

Good luck!

 

[Green Tree]

Thank you, Gtlinz. I have spoken to several of the Hilton on the Boulevard people, including one today. She said she would refer me to a customer care specialist and point me in the right direction. Do you know what kind of work does a customer care specialist does at Hilton? To make me feel good or to help me terminate the deal?

 

[LannyPC]

She said she would refer me to a customer care specialist and point me in the right direction. Do you know what kind of work does a customer care specialist does at Hilton? To make me feel good or to help me terminate the deal?

I'm not too sure what a Hilton "customer care specialist" does, but often these fancy titles are just another name for a salesperson whose pay cheque depends on you buying more and more products (such as points).

I don't think there are any entities out there that can help you "terminate the deal", so, as Jim/Passepartout said above, do not go seeking the help of these companies, law firms, or charities that claim they can get you out of your contract or "cancel". Even if the original sales people lied to you, that's not grounds for cancelling what you signed.

Have you paid off everything or do you still have some money owing on what you bought? If so, how much? Answering this can help us give you the best advice for your predicament.

 

[Passepartout]

Thank you, Jim, for taking the time to write your reply. The time share is 4 nights (M-Thur). But the contract did not say that. It just says partial week 2. I would not be able to find out open season booking lie until my account was activated. What social media should I go to? Youtube? Facebook?

If I was wanting to get under their skin and be noticed, I'd post my experience on their facebook, on travelocity, expedia, TUG resort reviews and wherever you think people would look for a recommendation. Don't be slanderous, but be clear that there were misleading promises and obscure (like not getting a rep's full name) representations.

 

[Green Tree]

I'm not too sure what a Hilton "customer care specialist" does, but often these fancy titles are just another name for a salesperson whose pay cheque depends on you buying more and more products (such as points).

I don't think there are any entities out there that can help you "terminate the deal", so, as Jim/Passepartout said above, do not go seeking the help of these companies, law firms, or charities that claim they can get you out of your contract or "cancel". Even if the original sales people lied to you, that's not grounds for cancelling what you signed.

Have you paid off everything or do you still have some money owing on what you bought? If so, how much? Answering this can help us give you the best advice for your predicament.

Hi Lanny:

Thank you for your advice. I was fraudulently induced into signing the contract. The sales rep misrepresented the deal. Even the contract did not spell out the deal either. I missed recession period because I could not find out about the lie until the account was activated. I paid the entire amount of $25K in full plus 2023 of $1400+ maintenance fee. I will not purchase upgrade or buy more points. I will take Jim's advice and continue my letter campaign plus social media. I will even write to FBI and expose their deceit and fraud. That sales rep's real estate license needs to be revoked--so a letter to Nevada real estate commissioner to start the investigation. I plan to lose my money, but will never stop fighting for what is right. Such lie and deceit should never be tolerated.

 

[Green Tree]

If I was wanting to get under their skin and be noticed, I'd post my experience on their facebook, on travelocity, expedia, TUG resort reviews and wherever you think people would look for a recommendation. Don't be slanderous, but be clear that there were misleading promises and obscure (like not getting a rep's full name) representations.

Thank you, Jim, for the great suggestions. This is exactly what I will do. Even in Yahoo Finance under this company's share holder comments so people know they are investing in a company full of crooks.

 

[brp]

Good luck with this fight. I definitely agree with your anger, but fear that this will be an uphill battle. They did things that are certainly unethical. But you will be hard-pressed to find anything actually illegal, unfortunately. As mentioned, anything spoken is not binding.

Cheers.

 

[HuskerATL]

Can you provide more about what you bought? I have never heard of a partial week. Every HGVC timeshare that I am aware of are full weeks. Your contract will say X unit size during a season (platinum, gold, silver, or bronze), at a specific property equivalent to X number of clubpoints. If you bought retail, then they would of also given you bonus points.

That is what you own. A deed for that piece of real estate. The HGV system has other perks like exchanging your week to use another property, RCI, HH, or open season but first it is good to understand what you bought.

 

[drucifer]

Can you provide more about what you bought? I have never heard of a partial week. Every HGVC timeshare that I am aware of are full weeks. Your contract will say X unit size during a season (platinum, gold, silver, or bronze), at a specific property equivalent to X number of clubpoints. If you bought retail, then they would of also given you bonus points.

That is what you own. A deed for that piece of real estate. The HGV system has other perks like exchanging your week to use another property, RCI, HH, or open season but first it is good to understand what you bought.

Agree. Get out your contract and deed. Location, Week #, Size, Time Class (Gold Week, Silver Week etc.) and Points.

By your description, you could have just as easily bought a VIP return package and not even own a timeshare deed. What you are saying is very unclear.

 

[GT75]

I have never heard of a partial week.

I have heard of a few (as reported here on TUG).

 

[HuskerATL]

I have heard of a few (as reported here on TUG).

I didn't know that but here is a thread about it, https://tugbbs.com/forums/threads/the-quin-partial-week-deeds.327458/

 

[4TimeAway]

It's hard to hear your story but it's one that seems to constantly repeat. People are confused about what they bought.

I was recently at one of the presentations and they change the product to lower the price. They leave it up to the buyer to figure out that the product changed and how that impacts the dreams and plans they sold you on. It's a dirty trick.

If it goes beyond just not mentioning the impact of the product change and actually they all it Pitching Heat and claiming an untruth (i.e. lie).

I hear they record every presentation. It might be worth asking for a copy of the recording for your attorney to review. It may not work, but you're probably pretty far into their complaint process by now. Maybe have an attorney on the call with you. Somehow you have to throw them off-balance and get them to make a mistake.

Please realize the first salesperson's job was to make you let down your guard and trust them. They are hoping you'll make the same mistake again.


Maybe you can get an upgrade to a reasonable Platinum, Weeks with say 11,200+ points every year with low maintenance fees, but even that resales for $5,000-ish. Maybe they would credit some additional bonus points at a value of $0.12/each. It would take a lot.

 

[Green Tree]

Agree. Get out your contract and deed. Location, Week #, Size, Time Class (Gold Week, Silver Week etc.) and Points.

By your description, you could have just as easily bought a VIP return package and not even own a timeshare deed. What you are saying is very unclear.

The contract says "Club points--5952 points, recurring right--every year, Season--platinum". Suite configuration: Type V-1 BRD Plus King, Occupancy period: every year. Recurring occupancy right: Annual partial week unit week 2." The deed says the same.

It is not a return package. I paid over $25K plus 2023 maintenance fee.

I did not realize I had bought M-Thur until the account was activated and the account shows Grand Islander M-Thur. Then I realize what the partial week was. Sales rep never told me what I was buying or disclose this purchase was for M-Thur. I believe I probably can win under the contract law. Nevada contract law says that the seller needs to be specific about what they are selling and write it in the contract. If the contract says M-Thur, I may not have a case. But this partial week wording is ambiguous and misleading-- evidence of Hilton's intentional omission. It could mean many things--M-Sat? Friday to Sat? I cannot even re-sell my time share with this deed--who wants to buy a partial week without knowing what it is in writing and up to Hilton to decide? This is an invalid and unenforceable contract under Nevada contract law. This is what I pointed out to the General Counsel. Hope he realizes that if I win arbitration, Hilton has to pay all my attorney fees.

 

[Mongoose]

Unless you have proof, you are stuck with what you signed. I suggest you milk them for all the Bonus points you can and enjoy them. Then write it off as an expensIve lesson. You can buy resale for 95% off and make what you have usable.

 

[Green Tree]

Unless you have proof, you are stuck with what you signed. I suggest you milk them for all the Bonus points you can and enjoy them. Then write it off as an expensIve lesson. You can buy resale for 95% off and make what you have usable.

I think the ambiguous wording "partial week 2" in the contract is evidence and proof of their misleading tactic.

 

[simpsontruckdriver]

The only thing you can do is go after the sales rep's license, which isn't worth much. If Nevada finds that she misrepresented the sale, her license could be suspended or revoked. She could then go to work for a non-licensed sales position somewhere, like car or appliance/cellphone sales.

TS

 

[HuskerATL]

It is the M-Th 1 Bed + plat. It is 1,488 pts x 4. I guess their argument would be about the point amount that is in the contract, not the partial week. This is unfortunate though that you paid $25k for 5,952 pts. Hopefully, you can chat with an attorney who can push the ambiguity angle but HGV could push back and say it is in the contract. Sorry about this and good luck.

 

[Green Tree]

It's hard to hear your story but it's one that seems to constantly repeat. People are confused about what they bought.

I was recently at one of the presentations and they change the product to lower the price. They leave it up to the buyer to figure out that the product changed and how that impacts the dreams and plans they sold you on. It's a dirty trick.

If it goes beyond just not mentioning the impact of the product change and actually they all it Pitching Heat and claiming an untruth (i.e. lie).

I hear they record every presentation. It might be worth asking for a copy of the recording for your attorney to review. It may not work, but you're probably pretty far into their complaint process by now. Maybe have an attorney on the call with you. Somehow you have to throw them off-balance and get them to make a mistake.

Please realize the first salesperson's job was to make you let down your guard and trust them. They are hoping you'll make the same mistake again.


Maybe you can get an upgrade to a reasonable Platinum, Weeks with say 11,200+ points every year with low maintenance fees, but even that resales for $5,000-ish. Maybe they would credit some additional bonus points at a value of $0.12/each. It would take a lot.

Thanks, 4timeaway. Good idea. I will request a recording of the presentation. I do not know such recording existed.

Thank you for the heads up about Hilton giving me an upgrade and many more bonus points. I will say No. Nothing can win back my trust in them.

 

[Green Tree]

It is the M-Th 1 Bed + plat. It is 1,488 pts x 4. I guess their argument would be about the point amount that is in the contract, not the partial week. This is unfortunate though that you paid $25k for 5,952 pts. Hopefully, you can chat with an attorney who can push the ambiguity angle but HGV could push back and say it is in the contract. Sorry about this and good luck.

View attachment 81369

This chart is not in the contract. The "partial week" is in the contract and in the deed.

 

[muscae]

You purchased a deed for four weeknights in a one bedroom plus unit at Grand Islander in platinum season. The points for that deed can be used in any HGVC resort and nearly all Hilton Club resorts (except Hilton Club New York). You can stretch your points to provide more than four nights. For example, you have more than enough points for a one week stay in a 2 bedroom during silver season at either seaworld orlando or flamingo or paradise las vegas. You have more than enough points for more than one week in many studios. You also have enough points for five nights at hokulani m to thur plus the previous sun or following Fri. Or six nights , two sets of 3 mon to thur.night stays at hokulani.

 

[Mongoose]

I think the ambiguous wording "partial week 2" in the contract is evidence and proof of their misleading tactic.

With all sincerity, good luck. Partial week is ambiguous and could mean many things. What really matters is the number of points.

 

[SmithOp]

You can see from the chart that the open season rates she quoted are NIGHTLY rates, not WEEKLY that she let you mistakenly assume, that is a typical TS sales obfuscation. You will get access to RCI and there are some last minute weekly deals in there, but not Hilton quality and not high season.

Good luck!