[merged]Westin Desert Willow (Palm Desert, Calif) opening March 2010

[jarta]

nodge, ... I wasn't commenting on the pool decorative concrete or the deluxe bedroom decorating (both not very good). I was commenting on the perspective of the shot of the living area in the deluxe, smaller 1-br. Sure looks to me like it was taken with a wide angle lens to create a narrowed effect. Was it? ... eom

 

[DeniseM]

nodge, ... Are you sure that picture of the smaller 1-br at WDW is representative? Taking an indoor picture with a wide-angle lens gives the same narrowing effect.

Also, the lead blast against WDW on tripadvisor was by someone from Oregon. Aren't you from Oregon, too? ... eom

nodge, ... I wasn't commenting on the pool decorative concrete or the deluxe bedroom decorating (both not very good). I was commenting on the perspective of the shot of the living area in the deluxe, smaller 1-br. Sure looks to me like it was taken with a wide angle lens to create a narrowed effect. Was it? ... eom

jarta - I don't know what you are trying to imply, but Nodge obviously didn't take the picture, so how would he know what kind of lens was used? It is one of several pictures posted on TripAdvisor from a "Natasha from San Ramon," who also posted a very positive review.

“Wonderful Vacation”
Westin Desert Willow Villas
NatashaSanRamon_CA 9 contributions San Ramon, CA
Mar 28, 2010 | Trip type: Couples 1person found this review helpful

Westin Lobby

Living Room

Kitchen
More photos The Westin Desert Willow Villas is a brand new property with all of the amenities needed for a wonderful escape to the desert. My boyfriend and I we lucky enough to stay at the property for four nights. The decor was absolutely beautiful...

I truly do not understand your overwhelming need to make everything personal. We are not talking about your back yard. We are talking about a resort. If you like it - great! Defend your opinion, but don't insinuate that someone else has maliciously posted pictures or reviews to make the resort look bad!

 

[jarta]

DeniseM, ... Accuracy should matter when you are ridiculing a product. Example? Comparing a photo of the family pool to an artist's rendering of the main pool and criticizing Starwood for "cheaping out" because the photo doesn't look like the rendering. ... eom

 

[DeniseM]

DeniseM, ... Accuracy should matter when you are ridiculing a product. Example? Comparing a photo of the family pool to an artist's rendering of the main pool and criticizing Starwood for "cheaping out" because the photo doesn't look like the rendering. ... eom

As usual, you are "trying" to use deflection, to avoid my point...

And if you want to talk about "accuracy," how "accurate" is your insinuation that Nodge posted that picture and negative review?

 

[nodge]

Comparing the actual pool picture, I think this was the intended rendering

Hold the phone. Are you saying there are two different pool areas at WDW, each with a "bridge" between two pools -- one pool area with the fancy fountain "bridge" (the artist rendering in my earlier post) and one pool area with a cheap sidewalk bridge (the artist rendering above)? If so, does anyone have any photos of the fancy fountain "bridge" pool area?

I've never been to WDW so I don't know. I merely posted here on TUG links to reviews and photos that OTHERS posted on tripadvisor, and compared those photos to SVO’s “artist renderings.”

-nodge, the messenger.

 

[josh2268]

Hold the phone. Are you saying there are two different pool areas at WDW, each with a "bridge" between two pools -- one pool area with the fancy fountain "bridge" (the artist rendering in my earlier post) and one pool area with a cheap sidewalk bridge (the artist rendering above)? If so, does anyone have any photos of the fancy fountain "bridge" pool area?

I've never been to WDW so I don't know. I merely posted here on TUG links to reviews and photos that OTHERS posted on tripadvisor, and compared those photos to SVO’s “artist renderings.”

-nodge, the messenger.

I've never been myself, but based on the pictures I believe this is half? of the other pool. Maybe the bridge is cut off ?

 

[nodge]

I've never been myself, but based on the pictures I believe this is half? of the other pool. Maybe the bridge is cut off ?

Thanks for the new photo! Keep 'em coming!

One would think that if a resort had a fancy fountain bridge feature, and it continued to show off a drawing of that fancy fountain bridge feature on the main page of its web site aimed at inducing new sales from non-SVO owners, and that resort has been opened for over two months, it would have posted a real photo of that feature somewhere by now.

I mean otherwise, to post an image of such a feature, even though you know that you don't actually have it, wouldn't be very "accurate" now would it?

-nodge

 

[jarta]

nodge, ... "I've never been to WDW so I don't know."

In the rendering you have posted in post 105, see the steps in the center and the cabanas. Now look at post 106 and look for the cabanas. Then, look back at the rendering in 105. Thise are the same cabanas.

In the artist's rendering showing the family pool and the bridge without the decorative concrete, the main pool is up those stairs, about 75 feet in and it runs from the center of the rendering to the left side of the rendering.

You can see just a glimpse of the main pool where the man with the white shirt is walking. The glimpse is at his feet just to his right.

The photo in 99 has the umbrellas at the main pool showing on the far right of the photo - beyond the wall where the stairs start.

In your haste to show how cheap Starwood is, you have identified the wrong pool. ... eom

 

[TDS]

Seems like a lot of interest in this property and quite a bit of speculation based on pictures that are available, so here's a rather lengthy review that addresses some of comments from recent posts. I was at WDW about three weeks ago - I also posted a review earlier in this thread addressing some of the comments that were being discussed at that time.

I don't believe the picture from TripAdvisor is reflective of the average 1 BR deluxe - you can see it has two windows, so its an end unit and that might be a slightly different design. We had a 2BR L/O and the deluxe side was in the interior of the building. My spouse and I both agreed that the design of the deluxe unit was far better at WDW than at other resorts. Its larger (I believe about 75 sq ft more than most others), there is a full size fridge, the dining table is larger and there is MUCH better light exposure. In addition to the windows in the living area, the placement of the bathroom and bedroom allow light to enter the living area from the patio off the bedroom. I doubt either of our units had the "outlet situation" identified in the picture - if that was in our units, we never noticed it.

The premium side is slightly smaller and the fireplace sort of sticks into the middle of the room. While we were a little concerned about the design when we first arrived, we decided by the end of the trip that the changes were not problematic. The slightly smaller size compared to other resorts was a non-issue, the placement of the fireplace was a mild visual annoyance more than anything else.

There is no "fancy waterfall" as depicted in the early artists rendering. The second rendering is pretty close the actual design. The pictures look very stark compared to the rendering because of 1) intense sun vs. the soft palate of the rendering and 2) the lack of time to allow the landscaping to mature. From pictures it looks like a lot of concrete walls - when you are there, you can see most of these walls have climbing vines planted that will grow in and greatly soften the look of the walls. What probably would be more concerning to guests, which you can't see from the renderings or the pictures, is that there is a service road (used primarily by carts, but also the occasional full size commercial vehicle) running right along the pool area between the pools and the golf course. It does detract from the resort feel having a concrete road running through the property.

The quality of the villas themselves are really not significantly different than any other Westin properties. The color scheme appears to be a concern for some people - we didn't even think twice about it when we were there. And I would say the couch in the living room was much more comfortable than other villas (WPORV comes to mind as being particularly uncomfortable).

What stood out to me is that the land upon which they had available to build is long and narrow and since the golf course has been there for several years, not much could be done about that (I'm sure this is one of the reasons the service road issue above was unavoidable). What this will mean is than the next phase that will be built will be a significant distance from the clubhouse, however, two additional pool areas are planned for future phases - one adult pool area and another family pool area with its own waterslide. These will not be side-by-side like they are at the main clubhouse - they will have their own "cluster" of villas around them.

WDW is different than WMH, no question. Some will prefer WMH, some will prefer WDW and it all depends on what you are looking for in a property. Not having the hotel combined with the villas changes the vibe of the resort. There is no onsite spa and the golf course is not officially part of the resort, so (at least for now) there is no cart service that will pick you up at your villa and take you to the clubhouse. You have to drive your car or carry your bag about 1/4 mile. I asked a staff person if that was going to change and he didn't know.

Finally, a couple of comments about the TripAdvisor posts. One stated that parking wasn't free - not sure where that come from since it was free when we were there and there was never an attendant at the gate (you access the parking areas with your room card). I also sensed that some of the posts were from people who were expecting that it would feel like a Westin hotel and thus were disappointed. I think everyone here understands the difference between a Westin hotels and Westin villas.

I didn't really take pictures for sharing purposes, but the link below will give you another glimpse of the inside of the units, the view from our deck and the adult pool area. We've stayed at several of the SVN resorts, so have a pretty good basis for comparisons and all in all, we were quite happy with WDW at this stage in its development. Our kids will prefer WDW over WMH because the pool amenities are better at WDW. For golfers, having the course amenities integrated with the resort is nicer at WMH, and while both resorts have excellent 36 hole tracks, I would possibly give Desert Willow a slight edge for quality of play. For those looking for a more complete resort experience, WMH will probably be a better choice. And if you like the grass and landscaping at WMH, you won't find that at WDW. Its very much desert decor and foliage - the only grass you will find is on the golf course.

http://tdswdw.shutterfly.com/

 

[nodge]

Thanks TDS for setting things straight and for the new pix!

Regarding the pool situation, it sounds like SVO originally had grand plans for the family pool that included the fountain bridge (artist rendering no. 1), but then "scaled back" the project to make that bridge just a concrete walkway (artist rendering no. 2). The separate adult pool area is just the single, fountainless pool adjacent to the lobby building shown in your linked pix and Josh2268's post above, and bears no relationship to either of the two SVO published artist renderings of the family pool area.

Thanks to you (and certainly not to SVO or any of its published information about the resort), we all now understand the pool situation at WDW.

Of course, the larger questions still loom as to; 1) why SVO still shows the fountain bridge rendition of the family pool area to potential new owners on its sales web site; and, 2) why someone who didn't know anything about the pool situation at WDW would feel confident enough and compelled enough to write this?

In your haste to show how cheap Starwood is, you have identified the wrong pool. ... eom

The fountain bridge was all just a desert mirage created by SVO's marketing department and kept alive by its sales department.

Please keep posting TDS! We need more posters like you.

-nodge

 

[J&JFamily]

Thanks TDS!

Thanks for the detailed info, TDS, that was very helpful. We have some leftover staroptions for 2010 so we are going to WDW for 5 days this summer. We debated WMH but opted for WDW so that we could check out the new resort. You mentioned that your kids would prefer the pool area at WDW over WMH and I wanted to ask why. We have a 7- and 9-year-old and have stayed at WMH several times. The kids enjoy the pool area and in particular the waterslide. We want to keep our WDW reservation but wanted to make sure that the kids would enjoy the pool area as much as they do at WMH. Thanks again for the info.

 

[TDS]

You mentioned that your kids would prefer the pool area at WDW over WMH and I wanted to ask why.

One reason is that the waterslide at WDW is much larger - the tallest waterslide I've seen at an SVN property. Large enough where kids have to be at least 48" to slide - but with kids your age, that's probably not an issue. Also, there are two separate pools in the family pool area - one with a volleyball net and basketball hoop and another simple swimming pool. It helps separate the activities so if there are older kids playing volleyball, there is still plenty of room for general swimming for other kids in the other pool. There is also a Teen Room and a Family Room near the pool area that has air hockey, pool table and foos ball, plus there is a ping pong table and another pool table outdoors right next to the pool. I don't recall these amenities for kids at WMH. Another nice touch was that there is a locker room near the pool (next to the fitness facility and tennis court) with showers & shampoo, so we would usually have the kids shower there before going back to the villa. It was very convenient. The kids loved it all.

 

[jarta]

nodge, ... Please read TDS' recent post again.

1. The trip advisor picture is not representative.

2. There is no fancy waterfall in the pool that has been built. The second rendering is close to the pool that has been built. But, two more pool areas are still to be built.

In his earlier post from WDW, TDS said the next phase to be completed is at the far end of the narrow property. Then, the middle will be filled in. ... eom

 

[Fredm]

Of course, the larger questions still loom as to; 1) why SVO still shows the fountain bridge rendition of the family pool area to potential new owners on its sales web site; and, 2) why someone who didn't know anything about the pool situation at WDW would feel confident enough and compelled enough to write this?

The fountain bridge was all just a desert mirage created by SVO's marketing department and kept alive by its sales department.

-nodge

nodge,

The pool rendering at the sales website shows villas (not the clubhouse) behind the pool.
Perhaps this is an accurate rendering of the pool yet to be built to service the later phase villas.
Don't know, but clearly it was not an attempt to represent it as the clubhouse pool area.

Given that the clubhouse pool renderings accurately reflect the pools of that area, maybe the website rendering (with the nice bridge) will actually be built.

 

[nodge]

. . .The pool rendering at the sales website shows villas (not the clubhouse) behind the pool.
Perhaps this is an accurate rendering of the pool yet to be built to service the later phase villas. . . .

Hi Fredm,

Thanks for chiming in on this.

Let’s see if I understand this theory. The cheap-looking concrete bridge pools were always intended to be built where they currently are (and with the cheap materials they were built with) near the lobby building, and there is a future plan to build the virtually identically shaped, but much fancier construction quality, fountain bridge pools at a different on-site location as SVO builds-out future phases at WDW. Right?

If so, this then begs two more questions;

1) Why would the future planned “fountain bridge” pools be constructed of higher quality than the already built cheaper concrete bridge pools? Wouldn’t SVO, or any developer for that matter, strive to keep the two different pool areas appearing similar in quality and design?; and,

2) Given the fact that Starwood has told all of its shareholders that all new phases at all SVO resorts have been placed on indefinite hold (aka cancelled), can SVO still legitimately and in good faith tell potential new owners at WDW of this new, fancier, planned pool area at WDW by featuring it on the front page of its sales web site (while also not telling them that this fancy pool area in the picture is only “planned” and the real one actually built is more or less sitting in the middle of a concrete parking lot)?

Between the two competing theories (SVO dumbed down the plans for the family pool area to save a buck, but is still promoting the fancier version to potential new owners vs. SVO plans to build a second, fancier, family pool area in the future), which one do you think is more probable?

-nodge

 

[Fredm]

No theory, nodge.

I don't know what Starwood is going to build.

Just pointing out that the pool rendering with the nice bridge is depicted in front of villas. It is not the clubhouse pool, you were riling about. That's all.

The clubhouse pool renderings, and what was built appear very similar.

If you are saying that the nice bridge (as depicted) will not be part of a future pool, OK. The world will have to suffer through it.

 

[SDKath]

I have to take Nodge's perspective on all of this. The artist rendering of the rooms and the pool area is WAY different than the concrete jungle that was actually built. There is no wide angle lens that can fake the fact that they took out beautiful crown molding for example, initially in the "artist's dream" picture but blatantly absent in the actual photo of the living room.

I mean really, you have to be blind to not see the beauty of the natural curves of the planned pool versus the semicircle of the actual pools that went in. And that "bridge" is just not a bridge. Period. It's a concrete connector that is going to get nice and slippery when the kids run across it.

As for the huge slide, I actually think it was a dumb structure to install. While I am sure it's fun for preteens and teens, for those of us with little kids under 48 inches (which was a LARGE part of the pool crowd at WMH in the fall of last year so don't even tell me that little kids don't go to these resorts), that giant eyesore of a slide system is going to be nothing but disappointments and tantrums galore. They should have picked a slide structure that was less tall and fugly and more kid friendly.

We are going to avoid WDW till I can measure my child at 48". I think that's about 5" to go. Maybe by then Starwood will have the money to add the lovely dark crown molding into the living rooms.

Katherine

 

[Ken555]

This discussion on the pools reminds me of the lazy river promised at WKORVN. It's very easy for sales organizations to become excited about their product and exaggerate the truth when it suits. We shouldn't be surprised if the pretty pictures on the SVN web site aren't 100% accurate.

 

[J&JFamily]

Thanks

One reason is that the waterslide at WDW is much larger - the tallest waterslide I've seen at an SVN property. Large enough where kids have to be at least 48" to slide - but with kids your age, that's probably not an issue. Also, there are two separate pools in the family pool area - one with a volleyball net and basketball hoop and another simple swimming pool. It helps separate the activities so if there are older kids playing volleyball, there is still plenty of room for general swimming for other kids in the other pool. There is also a Teen Room and a Family Room near the pool area that has air hockey, pool table and foos ball, plus there is a ping pong table and another pool table outdoors right next to the pool. I don't recall these amenities for kids at WMH. Another nice touch was that there is a locker room near the pool (next to the fitness facility and tennis court) with showers & shampoo, so we would usually have the kids shower there before going back to the villa. It was very convenient. The kids loved it all.

Thanks, that is very helpful info!

 

[Garnet]

Charge for parking if you rent from Westin

......a couple of comments about the TripAdvisor posts. One stated that parking wasn't free - not sure where that come from since it was free when we were there and there was never an attendant at the gate (you access the parking areas with your room card).
http://tdswdw.shutterfly.com/

We stayed at WMH Easter week. While waiting at the front desk for the couple in front of me wanted to extend their stay. They wanted to add a couple of days. The Westin gal told them they were fully booked, but rates run $359 for the small side and $389 for the larger side, PLUS $15 per day for PARKING. They looked disapointed at both the rates and that there was no room. I haven't looked at booking through TripAdvisor or whoever. Made me happy I wasn't paying those rates though.

 

[jarta]

nodge, ... "Why would the future planned “fountain bridge” pools be constructed of higher quality than the already built cheaper concrete bridge pools?"

Because the fountain bridge main pool area will be a centerpiece in the middle of the resort and the two family pools will be at the ends? The WKV adult pool is smaller, but, IMO, fancier than the larger free-form family pool.

"can SVO still legitimately and in good faith tell potential new owners at WDW of this new, fancier, planned pool area at WDW by featuring it on the front page of its sales web site (while also not telling them that this fancy pool area in the picture is only “planned” and the real one actually built is more or less sitting in the middle of a concrete parking lot)?

Yes, if in good faith the "the real one" will be built that way but has not yet been completed.

BTW, all pools are surrounded by a concrete parking lot. It's where the lounge chairs for tanning are parked. More complete resort = more lounge chairs around the pools and taking up those parking places. Also, there are both a concrete connector step bridge and a fancier, arched bridge at the Lagunamar pools. Traffic flows across both bridges. The fact that both types exist does not mean that all bridges had to be arched.

But, as Fredm suggests, if the fancier bridge is not built, so be it. For now, however, how about letting the resort be fully built and then going there yourself to see what the total experience is like before gnawing on this bone? ... eom

 

[nodge]

No Bids WDW EOY Gold Plus

This ebay auction for an Every Other Year ("EOY") Even Years, Gold Plus Season (Weeks 22-27 and 36-49) 2 bedroom lock-off with free closing costs at the Westin Desert Willow just ended without a single bid.

-nodge

 

[jerseygirl]

Yikes -- $1776 maintenance fee already, when there's usually a developer contribution in the early years? No wonder there were no bids.

 

[nodge]

Yikes -- $1776 maintenance fee already, when there's usually a developer contribution in the early years? No wonder there were no bids.

Must be saving up to build the good pool that they show in the pictures when selling the place.

-nodge

 

[jerseygirl]

Must be saving up to build the good pool that they show in the pictures when selling the place.

-nodge

Wait -- I thought they built the good pool. Oh ... never mind. :ignore: