Marriott / Vistana / Westin merger

[THSMTHS]

We had our owner's update at WKOR on Monday. We own OF at WKORN and a Gold week at Mission Hills. What we were told was that once the merger went through it will be next to impossible to trade our Mission Hills unit for a high demand property at 8 months because we will be competing with all of the Mariott owners. Admittedly, we have used our Mission Hills unit to trade into Atlantis, Langumar, Kuai and WKOR. We were told unless we planned to use our Mission Hills unit during the season we owned we were (can't remember if she called me an idiot or stupid) if we didn't pay $24,000 and buy into the Westin Flex plan as we could rent the unit for less than the association dues. We thanked her and left but still feeling insulted.

I just completed a sale presentation at a Marriott timeshare resort. I was told the merger will only benefit Marriott owners. I was told that if you are a Marriott owner you will have the ability to transfer / trade into Westin / Vistana properties. But it will not let Westin / Vistana book Marriott properties. “Because MARRIOTT bought Westin /Vistana” “We ( Marriott) own them” ( Westin / Vistana) They we’re displaying a whole video on the NEW properties ( Westin’s) Does anyone have any information regarding how they think the merger might play out. They said it might take place by the end of the year. Thanks

So many different stories. We were told that they (sales people) expected the merger to be complete for 2022. One of the things that will need to be done will be to create a common currency. That will include the reassessment of Westin/Sheraton products. Vistana point values do not have the wide range that Marriott products do. This will create some unhappy Westin/Sheraton owners. Currently, deeded owners in the Westin do not have access to inventory of the other Vistana products until 8 mo. from the desired checkin date. Even in the Flex program that was sometimes true depending on the resort. For example, when we had Westin Flex, Westin Kierland Villas could not be booked until the 8 mo. window. For there to be inventory available, a deeded owner had to give up their week. My wish is that original owners (both Vistana and Marriott) would have access to inventory, before it is offered to other parties.

 

[THSMTHS]

It seems like they ended their short lived exit program. I guess they weren’t getting the inventory they hoped for? So if the program isn’t being fully funded, are they scrapping it? This whole thing is a mess! Legacy Weeks, Flex Options, DC, VSN, Home Options what a headache.

Yes, we were told that they were no longer going to fund the program. It's too bad, because I really liked the progam. They are trying to move owners back into deeded properties. Not sure how I feel about all of the moving around and uncertainty.

 

[dioxide45]

There is definitely a finite amount of inventory in the Westin Flex program. About a month ago we were told, that the Flex program will not become fully funded as the originally intended, due to the merger of Marriott and Vistana. For the program to work, Vistana owners had to put their "deeded weeks" into the Flex program. That is no longer happening from what we were told.

There was a time when Vistana was taking "tradi-ins" of Sheraton and Westin weeks and then them upselling on Flex. They would actually take back your week and then you would get an equivalent number of HomeOptions along with whatever you bought. They were loading the trusts with these weeks. That stopped a couple years ago, but I do beleive it is one of the big reasons we see far less mandatory weeks on the resale market today.

 

[dioxide45]

It seems like they ended their short lived exit program. I guess they weren’t getting the inventory they hoped for? So if the program isn’t being fully funded, are they scrapping it? This whole thing is a mess! Legacy Weeks, Flex Options, DC, VSN, Home Options what a headache.

I beleive they still have their exit program. Vistana/Marriott Vacation Club will still take back weeks for free and no compensation. What I found they did end was the "trade in" program.

 

[CPNY]

I beleive they still have their exit program. Vistana/Marriott Vacation Club will still take back weeks for free and no compensation. What I found they did end was the "trade in" program.

I’ve been hearing the vistana exit webpage hasn’t been up for a bit. I checked today and it’s still not loading. I assumed they halted the program.

 

[dioxide45]

I’ve been hearing the vistana exit webpage hasn’t been up for a bit. I checked today and it’s still not loading. I assumed they halted the program.

They are still listed on ARDA's ResponsibleExit.com site with their email and phone numbers you can call. So I suspect it is still going, their inept IT just can't get the website right.

 

[cubigbird]

Yes, we were told that they were no longer going to fund the program. It's too bad, because I really liked the progam. They are trying to move owners back into deeded properties. Not sure how I feel about all of the moving around and uncertainty.

If they are no longer funding these flex programs, it will be a matter of time that developer sales runs out of points to sell. They can’t sell what they don’t have available / sell more points than what’s available inside the trust. I’d be curious to their approach to Aventuras and if they are not planning on funding it further as well.

So then what? They aren’t developing new properties and locations….inventory overall is not increasing and has not for some time.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Yes, we were told that they were no longer going to fund the program. It's too bad, because I really liked the progam. They are trying to move owners back into deeded properties. Not sure how I feel about all of the moving around and uncertainty.

I don't believe this is happening because MVC has moved away from deeded properties. IMO they are in a lull during a changeover. Will know in the next year the direction. In the meantime, I am happy with mandatory deeded weeks.

 

[CPNY]

They are still listed on ARDA's ResponsibleExit.com site with their email and phone numbers you can call. So I suspect it is still going, their inept IT just can't get the website right.

Inept IT is the truth

 

[dioxide45]

Vistgana last funded the Flex Collection Owners Association Inc (Westin Flex) trust in September 2020. The last set of Flex Vacations Owners Association Inc (Sheraton Flex) funding was in January 2020. Of course it has been since the pandemic that Marriott has funded their DC Trust program.

 

[cubigbird]

Vistgana last funded the Flex Collection Owners Association Inc (Westin Flex) trust in September 2020. The last set of Flex Vacations Owners Association Inc (Sheraton Flex) funding was in January 2020. Of course it has been since the pandemic that Marriott has funded their DC Trust program.

I wonder why this is? Are the plans to merge the Flex trusts into DC trust?

 

[dioxide45]

I wonder why this is? Are the plans to merge the Flex trusts into DC trust?

Not sure. I suspect they stopped new conveyances because of covid. Though they did convey a bunch of Westin flex in September. There could be plans to stand up a new trust. Though I haven't found any recordings in Orange County Florida to indicate one has been created.

 

[remowidget]

There was a time when Vistana was taking "tradi-ins" of Sheraton and Westin weeks and then them upselling on Flex. They would actually take back your week and then you would get an equivalent number of HomeOptions along with whatever you bought. They were loading the trusts with these weeks. That stopped a couple years ago, but I do beleive it is one of the big reasons we see far less mandatory weeks on the resale market today.

They still let you requalify resales, but claim that is coming to an end. They have been claiming that for a long time. A friend got an offer to requalify his Kaanapali unit this May, but there is no point for him as it is mandatory and he want to spend that time in Maui anyways.

 

[daviator]

There was a time when Vistana was taking "tradi-ins" of Sheraton and Westin weeks and then them upselling on Flex. They would actually take back your week and then you would get an equivalent number of HomeOptions along with whatever you bought. They were loading the trusts with these weeks. That stopped a couple years ago, but I do beleive it is one of the big reasons we see far less mandatory weeks on the resale market today.

I'm surprised they ended this because it seems like a real winner of a program for the company. Every time they take back a mandatory week and put it in the Flex trust, they are permanently removing it from the resale market and that seems like something that's very much in their interest to do. Not only do they get to make a big margin on the sale of the Flex points that week represents, but they've then taken a valuable resale week and made it pretty much worthless for resale. So if the buy of those Flex Points decides they want out sometime in the future, their easiest choice will be to use the exit program and just deed the points back to Vistana/Marriott, who then resells them again for a big profit.

 

[rcv82]

I'm surprised they ended this because it seems like a real winner of a program for the company. Every time they take back a mandatory week and put it in the Flex trust, they are permanently removing it from the resale market and that seems like something that's very much in their interest to do. Not only do they get to make a big margin on the sale of the Flex points that week represents, but they've then taken a valuable resale week and made it pretty much worthless for resale. So if the buy of those Flex Points decides they want out sometime in the future, their easiest choice will be to use the exit program and just deed the points back to Vistana/Marriott, who then resells them again for a big profit.

I believe they are still doing this (at least they were last November), but probably only with developer purchases. And it didn’t necessarily have to be for Flex. They will give you what you paid on a trade in as long as you bring $10k to the table. This will also let you re-quality a property in VSN and count for status, with $5k for each additional property.


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[Grandma2016]

I believe they are still doing this (at least they were last November), but probably only with developer purchases. And it didn’t necessarily have to be for Flex. They will give you what you paid on a trade in as long as you bring $10k to the table. This will also let you re-quality a property in VSN and count for status, with $5k for each additional property.


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This is what we were offered. 10k to requalify our week 52s at KOR. We are already 5 star elite so we seen no benefit. Then he offered 1 BR OV South 23k and requalify 2 of our 3 week 52s. He said this would give us 2 titanium statuses. We said no thanks.

 

[jackball]

We recently attended an owners update at Nanea. The salesperson told us to never give up our deeded VOI for flex. She said she was still selling deeds but that would change exclusively to flex in early 2022.

 

[mdditt2000]

Also attended owners update this week. No new information on the merge. But they mentioned multiple times inventory was low. Maybe that’s deeds. Honestly they had nothing to sell


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[daviator]

We recently attended an owners update at Nanea. The salesperson told us to never give up our deeded VOI for flex. She said she was still selling deeds but that would change exclusively to flex in early 2022.

Maybe you found the only honest timeshare salesperson out there! I think that was good advice.

 

[dioxide45]

I believe they are still doing this (at least they were last November), but probably only with developer purchases. And it didn’t necessarily have to be for Flex. They will give you what you paid on a trade in as long as you bring $10k to the table. This will also let you re-quality a property in VSN and count for status, with $5k for each additional property.


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This is different than what I was talking about. A couple years ago they were taking direct trade-ins (take backs) of Vistana weeks. They would give you what was paid for the week originally, either by you or the original buyer (on a resale). That credit would go toward a new purchase of pure flex. What you are referring to is simply retroing or requalifying. They don't take back the deeded week. It just becomes eligible for VSN and other network privileges.

 

[rcv82]

This is different than what I was talking about. A couple years ago they were taking direct trade-ins (take backs) of Vistana weeks. They would give you what was paid for the week originally, either by you or the original buyer (on a resale). That credit would go toward a new purchase of pure flex. What you are referring to is simply retroing or requalifying. They don't take back the deeded week. It just becomes eligible for VSN and other network privileges.

I’ve done both a retro keeping my deeded week and turning it in for an “upgrade”. It’s a good way to get rid of a mistake. I was the original purchaser though. I’ve never tried to turn in a resale. I’ve actually both turned in a deeded week for Flex, and Flex for a deeded week. (Long story as to why.) In both cases I re-qualified resale weeks. Bottom line: In my experience if they have the inventory they will trade pretty much any way you want as long as you put at least $10k in.


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[Mowogo]

Maybe you found the only honest timeshare salesperson out there! I think that was good advice.

You can occasionally find them. Actually had one at Wyndham Waikiki Beach Walk when I did an RCI exchange for a Work from Hawaii week last year. When you can get them the "presentation" is much easier.

 

[TJALB]

They still let you requalify resales, but claim that is coming to an end. They have been claiming that for a long time. A friend got an offer to requalify his Kaanapali unit this May, but there is no point for him as it is mandatory and he want to spend that time in Maui anyways.

What exactly does “requalify” mean to someone that purchased a Manditory unit from the resale market? Thanks!

 

[rcv82]

What exactly does “requalify” mean to someone that purchased a Manditory unit from the resale market? Thanks!

It has minor benefit for a mandatory resort but still has a couple benefits, specifically 1. You can trade for Bonvoy points, and 2. It counts toward elite status. Once requalified it is basically like it was purchased from the developer. (I know the Bonvoy point thing is not worth much with the devaluation Marriott has done. It used to be not a bad deal in the old Starwood days.)

Finally, it is possible (but by no means certain) that fully qualified properties will play better in a merged system with MVC.

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[kozykritter]

You also get Bonvoy Gold elite status.