Marriott Destination Points...They have done it!!!!!! {Merged}

[Armada]

According to MVCI.com, if you do not join the points program and deposit a week with Interval, the Marriott Exchange Priority(for other Marriott properties) continues. Previously, it was for three weeks, but the new MVCI website is silent on the length of time.

Also, if you are digging for information at MVCI.com, use the 'site map' after you log in. The layout there will provide you more convenient access to the information regarding the points program.

 

[haleakala20]

big advantage of points chart

As an Asia-Pacific Club Owner I'm not so much surprised and think, I can live with the new OPTION, given from MVCI.
The concepts are similar, the numbers and prices very different.

The swap between credit and purchase has alredy been given, when you look into the MR-points credit and compare it with the points needed to purchase back the same week.
That the chance of MVCI to get their share from unoriented owners.


The benefit of the new points chart list is, that someone at MVCI made a great job, to make all resorts and seasons and even individual weeks through the whole system compareable.
Now we all know, where there is the high and the low demand to weeks of MVCI. This information is very new and much more precise then the II demand listing.

The points used for purchase canb be take with 1:1 to a US$ value and you will get the resale value of a rental week in average.

Thank you MVCI for that listing.


What I still don't understand, is, that the weeks with differnt purchase values do not have the same different linear credit value. Therefore I expect, the full list of credit values will show a linear measurement for the purchase-prices of weeks.

Lest take some more days to investigate. There has to be add'l information to make the individual decision to join that option or not.

 

[floyddl]

2. The new points exchange system does not work for owners of weak trading weeks like mine (Sabal Palms) who must forget about trading for more desirable Marriott weeks and should rely on II for external trades.

II for external trades will be a best option for many as the better Marriott weeks will be seized by Marriott for the points program.

 

[gailo]

vs. Starwood

We do not own Starwood but I remember hearing about buying a resale resort then negotiating to include it if join or buy staroption from the developer later. Starwood owners can speak to this but I can see where future resales may be a tool for something like that. That said I plan to keep my two plat weeks (OP and FC) and use or rent.

 

[pfrank4127]

That's what I am here for, so ingenious people like you can tell me where the advantages are. So far, for my particular situation, I don't see the advantages. Granted it is very early after the announcement. Having purchased to use my resort 3 out of 4 years, I am fine for those 3, but with II weeks now being snatched by Marriott for points weeks I am not seeing how I will find value in the new system. For me, the best option will be to stay in th existing system and rent my week when I choose not to use it and then rent another week where I want to go. The exchange system seems to be out of bounds.

I'm relatively new to the Marriott system so I did not learn all the ins and outs of the old system. I have much more experience with the Disney system and this is somewhat similar. I do like that I can now get two weeks of vacation on my points if I supplement it with a cash reservation for the weekend nights. This is something that I frequently do/did with Disney and felt that it maximized value.

 

[Dean]

I'm going into MY PAGE after logging in. These are MY VALUES and I OWN a 2 BEDROOM Oceanside Platinum. Below is from the site...

Eligible Inventories



Internal Inventory Point Value Enrollment Fee
There are no eligible inventories for enrollment.
SurfWatch
Floor Plan: 2BR + 2BA
View Type: Oceanside/Gardenview
Deeded Id: SF*5443*22*B 5,750 $0.00

SubTotal: 5,750 ✓Calculate

External Inventory Point Value Enrollment Fee
There are no eligible inventories for enrollment.
Barony Beach Club
Floor Plan: 2BR + 2BA
View Type: Ocean Side View
Deeded Id: BB*9313*46*B 1,925 $0.00

SubTotal: 1,925 ✓Calculate


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total (Internal + External): 7,675 - $0.00 $0.00



Your potential points from all Owner Id's is: 7,675

I know, I get the higher numbers as well for SW. But if you look at GO, BB & SW to reserve, you'll see they are all the same for the same view type except that Ocean Vista is less than OF but more than OS. It doesn't make sense you'd get 20% more points that it costs for other points owners to reserve your week. I'm guessing they actually loaded the 3 Br points values to the 2 BR grid. I hope for both our sakes I'm wrong but that has to be the answer. I don't see another situation where anyone is getting a premium like that on their points to reserve. I come to 32K points with the presumed incorrect info, I'll be down to around 30K points on even years if/when they correct it and 4K less on odd years.

 

[tombo]

This I totally agree with this. So Marriott, you're going to treat resale owners differently than developer owners and thus make everyone's resale values signficantly lower as a result? Talk about shooting themselves in the foot! Why would I ever buy developer knowing that if I ever need to sell, forgetaboutit...

Y-ASK

Which is exactly what i will bring up if I decide to sit down with a Marriott sales person to let them explain the new program and answer questions. I am going to mention possibly buying Marriott resale, let him/her explain all the disadvantages that come with buying resale, and let them tell me how resales will be virtually worthless since points have been launched. I will then ask them if they really expect any intelligent consumer to purchase a product that the salesman is telling them is worthless dollarwise as soon as they buy it? I will thank them for explaining to me that what they are trying to sell me for $25000 or more will be worthless if I ever want/need to sell it to someone else in the future. I should be at gifting fairly quickly.

 

[Frisbeeace]

Which is exactly what i will bring up if I decide to sit down with a Marriott sales person to let them explain the new program and answer questions. I am going to mention possibly buying Marriott resale, let him/her explain all the disadvantages that come with buying resale, and let them tell me how resales will be virtually worthless since points have been launched. I will then ask them if they really expect any intelligent consumer to purchase a product that the salesman is telling them is worthless dollarwise as soon as they buy it? I will thank them for explaining to me that what they are trying to sell me something for $25000 will be worthless if I ever want/need to sell it to someone else in the future. I should be at giftng fairly quckly.

He will tell you that this system will hurt the secondary resale market but will strengthen Marriott's Resale operations through which you can sell your week at developer price less a 40% commission. For a $25,000 week, this means $15,000 for you instead of a fraction of that if you sold at Ebay or other means. Hopefully, this might be true.

 

[Darlene]

It looks like I get 1900 points for my fixed Marriott Monarch week, and it takes 5,000 points to book that same week.
Darlene

 

[banquopack]

Point selling

So how much can you get if you join the new program, then sell and transfer your points to another member?

Better and easier than renting?

 

[Asia2000]

Which is exactly what i will bring up if I decide to sit down with a Marriott sales person to let them explain the new program and answer questions. I am going to mention possibly buying Marriott resale, let him/her explain all the disadvantages that come with buying resale, and let them tell me how resales will be virtually worthless since points have been launched. I will then ask them if they really expect any intelligent consumer to purchase a product that the salesman is telling them is worthless dollarwise as soon as they buy it? I will thank them for explaining to me that what they are trying to sell me something for $25000 will be worthless if I ever want/need to sell it to someone else in the future. I should be at giftng fairly quckly.

Three questions:

1. If you buy into the points program, what happens when you resell? Does the points overlay transfer? If so, wouldn't people just pay the current owner to enroll before doing the close on an e-bay purchase or redweek.com purchase?

2. Once you join the new program and choose to stick with the "normal week usage", do you have to pay another fee to switch to points in year #2? If you flip-flop every year, do you have to pay?

3. When do points expire? If it is two years, it will be very difficult to manage unless you vacation a lot of weeks every year. Marriott will be counting on people wasting points through expiration or a weak conversion to MR points.

 

[dioxide45]

Can someone provide instruction for doing the "foux enrollment" to determine the value of the week you own?

 

[jin]

According to the materials on the website, inventory at sold out resorts can come from (i) weeks owners who convert, (ii) weeks owners who trade their units in for marriott rewards points, and (iii) deposits into II, both from weeks owners (may be wrong about this, language is unclear, have read conflicting reports) and from points owners.

I was also told over the phone today that inventory is not allocated between weeks and points, it is simply a first come/ first serve massive free for all at 12 months (or 13 months).

I am now hoping that resale prices of fixed weeks at the best resorts will fall. Those would be great purchases for personal use (but not for trading).

Does this mean that with the Marriott Priority that you may see weeks in II at 12 or 13 mos out that were traded in from points owners? If so this could be a good reason not to enroll.....

 

[Rickh]

maintenance fees increase

Please forgive me if this has been covered - I am trying to clarify my understanding of the maintenance fee increase for existing owners - some have suggested the new maintenance fee will be .40 per point, which is a huge increase relative to what we pay today (we own a 2 bedroom OV at original MOC).

I online chatted with Owner Services, and they suggested that maintenance fees will increase as per inflation and costs to run resort, but not just because a current owner joins the point program.

Does the .40 per point only apply to new purchases or am I missing something.

Thanks for clarifying.

 

[hipslo]

13 Month Window in Points - Consecutive Reservations at Different Properties

Points owners can do the same, and can do so in any daily increments that they desire. Also, I believe the points inventory opens each tuesday for the following week, a couple of days earlier than the thurs or fri that weeks inventory opens.

One thing I havent been able to figure out - premiere and premiere plus points owners can make reservations 13 months in advance. I wonder whether that means they could string together reservations of a couple of days (or more) at "cheap" properties before the desired "hot" week(s) as under the current 13 month system, to get a jump on others trying to reserve at 13 months, or whether a "reservation" would all have to be at the same property, to take advantage of 13 month rule under the points system.

 

[Y-ASK]

He will tell you that this system will hurt the secondary resale market but will strengthen Marriott's Resale operations through which you can sell your week at developer price less a 40% commission. For a $25,000 week, this means $15,000 for you instead of a fraction of that if you sold at Ebay or other means. Hopefully, this might be true.

I heard within this thread and I think I read it online that the Marriott Resale program is dead. Marriott stopped it like a month ago so there goes that argument.

Y-ASK

 

[tombo]

He will tell you that this system will hurt the secondary resale market but will strengthen Marriott's Resale operations through which you can sell your week at developer price less a 40% commission. For a $25,000 week, this means $15,000 for you instead of a fraction of that if you sold at Ebay or other means. Hopefully, this might be true.

I will ask him why I would pay $25,000 hoping to get a $10,000 loss when i can buy a resale at the same resort for $1000 and sell it for zero for a total loss of $1000? I would still be $9000 ahead buying a resale with zero resale value, and that is if marriott can or will sell my developer week (which they won't do untilthey have sold all of their own inventory).

 

[dioxide45]

Please forgive me if this has been covered - I am trying to clarify my understanding of the maintenance fee increase for existing owners - some have suggested the new maintenance fee will be .40 per point, which is a huge increase relative to what we pay today (we own a 2 bedroom OV at original MOC).

I online chatted with Owner Services, and they suggested that maintenance fees will increase as per inflation and costs to run resort, but not just because a current owner joins the point program.

Does the .40 per point only apply to new purchases or am I missing something.

Thanks for clarifying.

I think the new MF structure only applies to those new purchases buying in to the trust. For weeks owners, the new system is just an overlay system.

 

[tombo]

I heard within this thread and I think I read it online that the Marriott Resale program is dead. Marriott stopped it like a month ago so there goes that argument.

Y-ASK

Even better reply to the salesman.

 

[dioxide45]

Even better reply to the salesman.

I am sure it is only dead for weeks ownership. I would think they would replace it with some type of buyback system. They may make offers for prime weeks at sold out resorts in order to get hold of inventory.

Though if it seems like they can take the prime deposits from II, then they don't even need to do that.

I read on the old thread that a salesperson told someone Marriott learned from the mistakes and fallout of other developers (ie *wood). They learned real well how to make it work for them.

It is important to note though that for each week they take from II they have to give something back. II is a week for week system. They can't just take a prime week. They may have to give two shoulder season weeks back. This may be good for those non enrolled weeks owners that trade through II for lower season.

 

[wuv pooh]

It is not false. Now Marriott will give you less points for your deposited week than it will cost the exchanger to exchange for the week you deposited. If my week floats platinum and platinum season weeks range from 5000 points to 6000 points, then I can reserve a 6000 point week to use at my home resort. If Marriott gives me 5250 points when I deposit my week, then I will never be able to reserve a 6000 point week at any resort other than my own. In addition if the person exchanging for my home resort week that I would have used pays 6000 points for the priviledge while Marriott only gives me 5250 points, they are pocketing 750 points per owner. It is a rip off where marriott pays less points for deposited weeks than they charge to redeem them.

It is false. Marriott also gives people MORE points than it takes to reserve in that previous season. It lets people reserve weeks for 4,500 points, 750 less than they gave.

So is Marriott ripping you off or are you ripping Marriott off?

Answer: No one, they are equivalent. The true platinum weeks now cost more than the tarnished platinum weeks.

This has ALWAYS been true, but is now transparent to everyone. Ironically this is the "trade value grid" that everyone has been clamoring for

 

[wsrobinson]

I know, I get the higher numbers as well for SW. But if you look at GO, BB & SW to reserve, you'll see they are all the same for the same view type except that Ocean Vista is less than OF but more than OS. It doesn't make sense you'd get 20% more points that it costs for other points owners to reserve your week. I'm guessing they actually loaded the 3 Br points values to the 2 BR grid. I hope for both our sakes I'm wrong but that has to be the answer. I don't see another situation where anyone is getting a premium like that on their points to reserve. I come to 32K points with the presumed incorrect info, I'll be down to around 30K points on even years if/when they correct it and 4K less on odd years.

I don't know where this will shakeout but...

GV OS OF

BB 3725 4500 5400

GO 4500 5400

SW 3725 4500 5000

These are for 2 bedrooms only. You may be right. If so, it probably won't take them long to fix it. Did you buy your weeks from the developer? Maybe there are addl points if bought thru developer?

 

[pfrank4127]

Can someone provide instruction for doing the "foux enrollment" to determine the value of the week you own?

Log into your Marriott.com account. Click on the link to learn more about points. Then click on the enroll now button. Make sure you check the box saying you agree to the terms and then it should take you to the next page that shows resort values.

 

[Y-ASK]

Which is exactly what i will bring up if I decide to sit down with a Marriott sales person to let them explain the new program and answer questions. I am going to mention possibly buying Marriott resale, let him/her explain all the disadvantages that come with buying resale, and let them tell me how resales will be virtually worthless since points have been launched. I will then ask them if they really expect any intelligent consumer to purchase a product that the salesman is telling them is worthless dollarwise as soon as they buy it? I will thank them for explaining to me that what they are trying to sell me for $25000 or more will be worthless if I ever want/need to sell it to someone else in the future. I should be at gifting fairly quickly.

Me too! I check into Harbour Lakes on July 3rd. Depending on what gifts they offer I will either present my strike three check list up front or during the presentation.

#1. Resale owners pay higher fees to join the club.

#2. Points purchasers will get stuck with a $2,000.00 transfer fee (maybe more) if they ever decide they need to sell their points.

#3. Resale deeds, closed after 6/20/2010, would not be eligible to be added to the club.

Combine all of this together and resale values will drop signficantly over time. Thanks Marriott for treating resale owners/buyers like second class citizens.

Y-ASK

Where do you think all of the necessary maintenance fees are going to come from if there are no resale owners paying those fees?

 

[wuv pooh]

I was also told over the phone today that inventory is not allocated between weeks and points, it is simply a first come/ first serve massive free for all at 12 months (or 13 months).

I think this is the key point to verify. I don't know how they would manage their legal obligation to provide a week to owners if they did not keep a separate inventory.

If they do have a points inventory then the weeks inventory will dry up in II pretty quickly. No developer deposits, no MR deposits, no points deposits, and pretty soon there will be very limited Marriott trades available through II.