Lowballers

[e.bram]

From the looks of Vacationhopeful's LMRs, it likes she is highballing.

 

[AwayWeGo]

Got To Know When To Hold'm, Know When To Fold'm, Etc.

Like going all in with four aces in poker, only to find out one of your opponents has a royal flush.

That's known as getting Royally Flushed.

However that may be, any time you're holding all 4 aces, it's extremely rare for the other guy to be holding an ace-high straight flush.

No problem. The other guy can beat you with just a king-high straight-flush.

( Just saying. )

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

[vacationhopeful]

e.bram ---
The one resort has these listings also. And will rent them out to walkin's for more and cover both our costs. These are offered to TUGGERs (many of which also own at that resort) as a option of not paying MORE to the resort.

As for highballing, duh? As others have stated, a true offer will be considered but when the asking price on a LMR thread is, $75 per night ==> offers come in at $25/night. I do check eBAY auctions for these resorts - most studios are a BIN priced around $500-600/1bdrs get for $599-899 and get sold. Auctions vary a bit more, but are in the same range.

Craigslist has been very helpful at the last minute and I do rent there also. Have you checked those prices?

 

[gandalf252002]

Would you consider this low

Ok, so since we are talking about this, let me ask if you would consider this a lowball offer?

I was just offered $50 a night, for a 3 night stay at a Mountain Run at Boyne (a Ski Resort in northern Michigan) for the weekend of March 9 to 12 in a 2 bedroom. Based on my MF's, this would cost me $360, and even using BG's bonus time (which I can not give to somebody else) would be $251.22.

A quick check on expedia for hotels, to sleep 4 of similar 3 star quality, are at minimum $99 a night with most ranging $150 or more (according to expedia this particular resort has nothing available, and the other 4 or 5 are almost booked).

I am certainly offended by it, as they are out in left field as far as I'm concerned. What they are asking is NOWHERE near the market. I hope this person finds what they are looking for, because I certainly won't be from me!

 

[presley]

Sometimes people won't be able to afford anymore than what they offer. I don't think it is offensive if their choice is to either pay you what they offer, or just not go at all.

There have been many time that I have seen weeks advertised in LMR that I have been interested in, but since I could only stay 2 or 3 of the nights, I wait and watch to see how low the price will go. I have never offered anyone less than what they ask. I wonder if some of the low ballers are in that same type of situation. Maybe they can only use a couple of the nights and that is why they are offering so low.

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

Ok, so since we are talking about this, let me ask if you would consider this a lowball offer?

I was just offered $50 a night, for a 3 night stay at a Mountain Run at Boyne (a Ski Resort in northern Michigan) for the weekend of March 9 to 12 in a 2 bedroom. Based on my MF's, this would cost me $360, and even using BG's bonus time (which I can not give to somebody else) would be $251.22.

A quick check on expedia for hotels, to sleep 4 of similar 3 star quality, are at minimum $99 a night with most ranging $150 or more (according to expedia this particular resort has nothing available, and the other 4 or 5 are almost booked).

I am certainly offended by it, as they are out in left field as far as I'm concerned. What they are asking is NOWHERE near the market. I hope this person finds what they are looking for, because I certainly won't be from me!

I don't understand why you (or anyone) is offended by the offer. It the offer is too low for you to accept you simply say "no thank you and move on". Or better yet respond with with what your price is.

For all you know this might be a person who is actually willing to pay your price, but before they jump in they're going to first sniff around to see if they can find a bargain.

I've certainly done that myself many times. Even bought a few timeshares that way, and I've rented some out at my prices to people who were originally trying to see if they could get a bargain rate from me.

*****

I fail to see the logic in deciding someone is an unqualified prospect simply because you don't like their first offer.

 

[Ridewithme38]

Ok, so since we are talking about this, let me ask if you would consider this a lowball offer?

I was just offered $50 a night, for a 3 night stay at a Mountain Run at Boyne (a Ski Resort in northern Michigan) for the weekend of March 9 to 12 in a 2 bedroom. Based on my MF's, this would cost me $360, and even using BG's bonus time (which I can not give to somebody else) would be $251.22.

A quick check on expedia for hotels, to sleep 4 of similar 3 star quality, are at minimum $99 a night with most ranging $150 or more (according to expedia this particular resort has nothing available, and the other 4 or 5 are almost booked).

I am certainly offended by it, as they are out in left field as far as I'm concerned. What they are asking is NOWHERE near the market. I hope this person finds what they are looking for, because I certainly won't be from me!

Have you had any other offers? If its lose everything or lose a little less....Why Wouldn't you take it? I can't believe you are offending by people giving you money for something that you would lose everything on...if anything you should be grateful for ANY offer, don't forget who's doing who the favor here...It's not you handing over money to help the other one out...they don't HAVE to offer you anything, you could just end up with a unit sitting empty and throwing $840 down the drain

 

[TUGBrian]

do you guys ever counter offer? Just curious.

like if I were interested in buying a car, my first offer to the dealer would not be the most id pay for the car....but something much lower (vs the listed price) to see what the first counter offer was.

 

[ace2000]

Is a lowball offer worse than no offer? Or just more irritating?

 

[sjuhawk_jd]

For all lowballers:

(1) Go to Macy's store right now, ask them if they will take $40 for a $100 winter coat since it is going to be on bigtime clearance 30-40 days from now anyway.
(2) Go to a bakery at 6 PM (one hour before closing), baked goods are already discounted 50%, ask them for further discount since any unsold items will be either thrown away or donated to homeless shelter (thereby losing full value).
(3) Do the same as step 2 at a full service restaurant
(4) Go to a barber shop when he/she is not busy. Ask him/her to take 60% off from the rate since they are not going to make any money at all unless they take your reasonable offer. You see "some money is better than no money."
(5) While you are at it, book a ticket to visit China. You will do very well there. Make sure to make an offer on the ticket to the travel agent, any seats unsold on the plane make no money.

 

[theo]

This logic baffles me, personally...

I am certainly offended by it, as they are out in left field as far as I'm concerned. What they are asking is NOWHERE near the market. I hope this person finds what they are looking for, because it certainly won't be from me!

You are right now, at least by my calendar, just about 9 days away from sitting on a vacant unit, for which you will be paying full 2012 maintenance fees --- whether occupied or not.

It is of course your prerogative to choose to be "offended" by a low offer, but that ego-based choice could (and maybe will) ultimately result in zero income from no rental at all.

Maybe it would help to try to take two steps back and try to stand in the other person's shoes. First, they don't know (...and they couldn't possibly care less) what your annual maintenance fee obligations might be. They might simply decide "I can afford to take a weekend ski trip with its' costs of meals, lift tickets, gas, etc. --- if I can find lodging at "X" price". Accordingly, that "X" price is, predictably and reasonably, what they will offer. What on earth is there to somehow be "offended" about, when you can simply just decline the offer in three brief words (no thank you) if you don't find it acceptable?

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

For all lowballers:

(1) Go to Macy's store right now, ask them if they will take $40 for a $100 winter coat since it is going to be on bigtime clearance 30-40 days from now anyway.
(2) Go to a bakery at 6 PM (one hour before closing), baked goods are already discounted 50%, ask them for further discount since any unsold items will be either thrown away or donated to homeless shelter (thereby losing full value).
(3) Do the same as step 2 at a full service restaurant
(4) Go to a barber shop when he/she is not busy. Ask him/her to take 60% off from the rate since they are not going to make any money at all unless they take your reasonable offer. You see "some money is better than no money."
(5) While you are at it, book a ticket to visit China. You will do very well there. Make sure to make an offer on the ticket to the travel agent, any seats unsold on the plane make no money.

What's your point? If they don't like the offer they will say "no". But you won't get any discount (or added discount) if you don't ask.

 

[vacationhopeful]

Brian,

It is like a yard sale. Some people look around and just LIKE to engage in conversation without ANY serious interest in buying. Free is NOT good enough sometimes at a yard sale.

If someone says, I own at that resort and I receive an offer from them -- it might reflect a reasonable price. But, if they say (in one particular resort combo) I own at C.B. resort, I can expect an offer of 20-30% of my asking value and then their reply is "I would never stay there as it is a lousy resort and I don't like it".

The best ones are "give me your lowest price that you will accept". Trust me, they ALWAYS counter with a price 50% off YOUR already lowest price.

I have started putting into my contracts, that a CHANGE of NAMES to the resort is $100. You can NOT believe the number of cottage businesses who are reselling these vacation condos. And I do sell to resellers ... but I know going into the deal that is the deal.

This is a person to person interchange - not a big car dealer business. The sales rep at a car dealer has a big inventory and a floor manager who has to approve the deal. Most of my renters will call me on the phone before sending me money -- if they call and stick to questions on the resort and area, good. If they said that they just looked at plane tickets, great. Serious and to the point.

If they say they are just checking out options and their only question is either "Will you go lower?" or "what is your bottom price?" Next expect the "pity party" to start - and all I keep thinking then it, "Tell someone who cares".

You quickly get a feel for what is about to be said next.

 

[Ridewithme38]

For all lowballers:

Silly Examples are Silly, i can go through each one of those and point out how they are not comparable to the TS rental model...But for most of those things...i have gotten sharply sharply discounted french onion soup late at the diner, free cupcakes and cookies at the bakery, places like Travelocity and other wholesalers with BID YOUR OWN PRICE, fill those empty seats on planes...The Barber and Sears examples aren't even close to relevent though

I still think you should be thankful anyone makes you an offer and jump on any favor a buyer is offering you!

 

[Ridewithme38]

Brian,

It is like a yard sale.

This is a decent example, we've had 3 garage sales in my life....After all three, what ever wasn't sold was thrown out...it had no value after the garage sale ended...This is why you get things like .50cent books and 3 for $2 Dvd's at Garage sales....Because people are doing YOU a favor by buying....Just like renting a TS with an expiring week

 

[gandalf252002]

To clarify, unlike many others I do not make the majority of reservations in advance, so I loose NOTHING if I don't rent. I book, as needed when someobody wants something when there is availability. Many times I have to turn people away, as there is no availablity. I have had several other offers, and have rented the majority of my 2012 points for a profit this way.

They are certainly not doing me any "favors", and I will never be "grateful" because somebody makes me an offer way less then the market. You make it sound like I'm poor, and have nothing else to gain. On the contrary I AM handing him over money in a sense, as I got get him in the room that he wants (which expedia could not) and for a lower price so I am still saving him money. He just wants more, and I respsect that but as far as I am concerned it is low-ball offer.


Yes, I did respond no, and told him what my rate was and that I was not taking anything less. It was tempting to tell him if you can find something as good, for the price your are asking along with tell him what the market was but I did not to take it. Let him do his own research.

Yes, I have counter offered if I thought that it was worth it for me to come down in price. Generally speaking, I am not in it to make a "profit" but to cover costs only. What I get out of it is cheaper vacations myself, nothing more so I do not take less than what I paid, PERIOD.

The bigger picture here is all about value. There is the market value, the actual value, and the perceived value which of course all different to each individual. The concept of low-baller is always going to be debated if two people do not see the same value in something.

Have you had any other offers? If its lose everything or lose a little less....Why Wouldn't you take it? I can't believe you are offending by people giving you money for something that you would lose everything on...if anything you should be grateful for ANY offer, don't forget who's doing who the favor here...It's not you handing over money to help the other one out...they don't HAVE to offer you anything, you could just end up with a unit sitting empty and throwing $840 down the drain

I don't understand why you (or anyone) is offended by the offer. It the offer is too low for you to accept you simply say "no thank you and move on". Or better yet respond with with what your price is.

For all you know this might be a person who is actually willing to pay your price, but before they jump in they're going to first sniff around to see if they can find a bargain.

I've certainly done that myself many times. Even bought a few timeshares that way, and I've rented some out at my prices to people who were originally trying to see if they could get a bargain rate from me.

*****

I fail to see the logic in deciding someone is an unqualified prospect simply because you don't like their first offer.

You are right now, at least by my calendar, just about 9 days away from sitting on a vacant unit, for which you will be paying full 2012 maintenance fees --- whether occupied or not.

It is of course your prerogative to choose to be "offended" by a low offer, but that ego-based choice could (and maybe will) ultimately result in zero income from no rental at all.

I think that it helps sometimes to try to take two steps back and walk a mile in the other person's shoes. First, they don't know (...and moreover, they couldn't care less) what your annual maintenance fee obligations might be. They might simply be thinking "I can afford to take a weekend ski trip with its' costs of meals, lift tickets, gas, etc. --- if I can find lodging at "X" price. Accordingly, "X" price is, entirely reasonably, what they will offer. What is there to be "offended" about, when you can simply just decline the offer in three words (no thank you) if you don't find it acceptable?

 

[sjuhawk_jd]

What's your point? If they don't like the offer they will say "no". But you won't get any discount (or added discount) if you don't ask.

My point is that nobody I know is shameless enough to do any of these things that I listed (with the exception of priceline to make an offer on airline seat), but for some reason, people feel that they have the right to lowball a vacation rental listing.

 

[sandra kraft]

market value

For the record, ridewithme, one offer does NOT constitute market value. As an appraiser, I can tell you it takes THREE consumated transations to establish market value.

I still say the market dictates the value...If the only offer you get is $20 a nite for your week...THAT is the market and therefore NOT a lowball offer, you guys need to start realizing that and offering your rentals for reasonable rates its silly to ask as much as some of you are asking...

I'm considering putting up the large side of my lockoff TS for rent this year, it falls on the 4th of july and is in a great place for history buffs on the 4th...MY MF's are $816, but this is side only accounts for 2/3rds of that MF, so it will be up for (.66 X $816) $538.56, and really that is a HIGH estimate of what its worth, there are thousands of other factors and i wouldn't blow my nose at only getting $200-$250 for it if that was the only offer

 

[ketamine]

I was stung by a low baller who gave me a story, said it was all her husband would let her pay and that otherwise she would just stay at a nearby Days Inn with their 2 children. I reluctantly settled for $40/night over Christmas break for my 2 bedroom villa in Orlando with MF's of $1500. Time was running out. They lived a drive away from Disney.

After the paypal was executed, I decided to check out the address she gave for the registration. Turns out she lived in an upscale neithborhood in a 6 bedroom 5 bath, 5200 square ft million dollar house. Thanks Zillow!

She wasn't a member of Tug.
Next time....tuggers only.
I guess I was taken !! :

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

My point is that nobody I know is shameless enough to do any of these things that I listed (with the exception of priceline to make an offer on airline seat), but for some reason, people feel that they have the right to lowball a vacation rental listing.

Well, you're certainly free to continue to market your rental as if it were a suit on the rack at Nieman-Marcus.

Most people, however, will consider a vacation rental to be something that is negotiated, that has a finite life and that becomes less valuable as check-in approaches, and is being marketed in an illiquid market where pretty much everything is negotiable.

I negotiate when I buy cars. I negotiate with street vendors in Mexico. I negotiate when I sell my professional services.

+++++

I have people call up who want to hire me who are clearly looking for the lowest possible price for my services and are rather clearly lowballing me. (I don't do Phase I environmental assessments of former gas stations for $500, and I no one else who is competent does so either.)

Unlike you I don't get offended. I just say that I don't do that work for that price, and they are better off talking with another firm.

+++++

I guess I just don't see why I should be offended. There's simply no way that I would ever give a complete stranger permission to dictate my emotions that way.

 

[vacationhopeful]

...After the paypal was executed, I decided to check out the address she gave for the registration. Turns out she lived in an upscale neithborhood in a 6 bedroom 5 bath, 5200 square ft million dollar house. Thanks Zillow! ....I guess I was taken !! :

Maybe she was the maid?:hysterical: :rofl: :hysterical:

For $280, I would have returned the money and told PAYPAL fraud was involved ---- esp if her (sob) story via email was she could only spend $40/night but her address for her Paypal account and cellphone was multi-million dollar house.

I did that when the Paypal address was a warehouse and she claimed to lived elsewhere.

 

[tombo]

I was stung by a low baller who gave me a story, said it was all her husband would let her pay and that otherwise she would just stay at a nearby Days Inn with their 2 children. I reluctantly settled for $40/night over Christmas break for my 2 bedroom villa in Orlando with MF's of $1500. Time was running out. They lived a drive away from Disney.

After the paypal was executed, I decided to check out the address she gave for the registration. Turns out she lived in an upscale neithborhood in a 6 bedroom 5 bath, 5200 square ft million dollar house. Thanks Zillow!

She wasn't a member of Tug.
Next time....tuggers only.
I guess I was taken !! :

E-mail them back and offer her $40 a night to rent her house the next time she is gone on vacation. Tell her that her house looks nice but $40 is all you can afford.

 

[california-bighorn]

I was stung by a low baller who gave me a story.......
After the paypal was executed, I decided to check out the address she gave for the registration. Turns out she lived in an upscale neithborhood in a 6 bedroom 5 bath, 5200 square ft million dollar house. Thanks Zillow!

I guess I was taken !! :

Maybe she can afford a house like this by making smart business decisions

 

[markel]

Funny thread

You can call it what you want. Lowballing. Supply and demand. Doesn't matter. Some of these posters act like they have the golden egg. Indeed you may have NOTHING. I would have no problems "lowballing" any of you and wouldn't care if you were offended.You have a timeshare week, not a cure for cancer. Get real. If you'd rather lose your week instead of getting something for it, then good for you. Smarter wisdom would get you something in return even if it's less then you expect or think you are entitled too. The internet is a powerful thing, deals happen every second. TUG is not the only place to find a deal. It's ashame that most of the
"anti-lowballing" crowd are too head strong to admit that they may not have to offer what they think they have. Times are tough. Good luck to you all.

 

[AwayWeGo]

I Am A Lowballer -- Not That There Is Anything Wrong With That.

Recently some guy on Craig's List had a nice French horn for sale for $400 -- had to sell it that day, he said, to pay a traffic fine.

I could tell from the pictures that it was well worth the asking price, & more, so I jumped right on it -- made arrangements to go see the horn, with $400 cash in my pocket all ready to hand over.

After I took the horn out of the box & looked it over & played on it a little, I said, "So you want $400 for this?"

The guy could have said, "Right." In that case, I would have whipped out 4 Benjamins for him & that would have been that.

Instead, the guy hesitated. "Well," he said, "I maybe could come down a little, based on the condition of the horn."

It had a couple of trivial dents, easily fixable. But he choked & in effect started talking himself down.

So I made a show of deciding how much to offer. The 4 C-notes were folded together in my hip pocket, so I reached back & separated 1 from the bunch so that when I took the money out of that pocket, only $300 would emerge. Then I pulled all my regular walking-around money out of my front pocket, peeled off 3 twenties, put those together with the 3 hundreds out of my back pocket, & said, "OK, I'll go $360."

"I'll take it," the guy said.

I put the money on the table. He picked it up. I closed & latched the horn case. The guy handed me 2 decent mouthpieces & some valve oil. I said, "Thanks," & went out the door with an outstanding lowball horn -- for which I had been prepared to pay the full no-quibble asking price, if the guy hadn't flinched when I asked him to confirm his price.

The guy might have taken even less, I don't know. But paying $350 or below would have been taking undue advantage. As it is, my conscience rests easy knowing I didn't lowball the guy even more than I did.

The fact that I need another horn like a turtle needs a bowling ball is beside the point.

Lowball is as lowball does.

Is this a great country or what ?

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​