Hilton Grand Vacations strikes deal to acquire Diamond Resorts

[dougp26364]

I realize maintenance fees are supposed to be for resort maintenance, but could the no reservation fees be the reason for the exceptionally high maintenance fees for Diamond owners that we are hearing some owners complain about? I will be awfully disappointed after the big announcement if the merger does NOT allow reservations for across both companies.

As to reserving across both companies, I think we need to look at other mergers. The only merger, except for this one, that I have direct knowledge of, is Marriott/Westin. It’s been so long since the announcement and still no notable progress for owners, I’ve essentially lost both interest and hope. Perhaps those with Wyndham/Worldmark can add insight to how that merger and cross reservations have worked.

My hope is it will be simple. My belief is it will be anything but simple and it will be, as it is with Marriott, such a long time we’ll all lose interest except for the tall tales told by the salesmen at the the round tables.

 

[Tamaradarann]

I don't know the history or financial abilities of the few folks that own in both systems so I can't say why they own in both or how happy they are with their choices on either side. For many Diamond owners, one of the big reasons to purchase (or switch our fixed/floating weeks to points) was based on not having to pay exchange (reservation) fees anymore. We currently have almost 400 resorts we can go to without having to pay an exchange fee. As some salesman like to say, our points are like cash. If a reservation is 2,500 points then we just use 2,500 points and that's it. Since we all pretty much agree that any intermingling will cost some type of fee, that is a negative for Diamond owners whereas it isn't for HGVC owners since y'all are used to paying a reservation fee to stay anywhere other than your home resort. Another point is that there are very few locations that HGVC has where there isn't already a Diamond resort and since your resorts seem to be considered more luxurious, they would likely cost more points as well. From the Diamond perspective, would I rather pay 4,000 points for a week at Mystic Dunes in Orlando or 10,000 points for a HGVC in Orlando? Personally, I'm going with the former. I'm not saying that on average HGVC owners are richer than Diamond owners but it is a possibility which is why Diamond owners work hard to maximize their point usage and prefer a system that has fewer "gotcha" fees (such as paying to save points to the following year). Believe it or not, only merging at the Management level WOULD be big (and happy) news for Diamond owners. I'll grant you it wouldn't be for HGVC owners since y'all are looking forward to having more locations to exchange to. Of course, only time will tell what will really happen between us.

 

[Eric B]

.... Perhaps those with Wyndham/Worldmark can add insight to how that merger and cross reservations have worked.

My hope is it will be simple. My belief is it will be anything but simple and it will be, as it is with Marriott, such a long time we’ll all lose interest except for the tall tales told by the salesmen at the the round tables.

With Wyndham/WorldMark, cross-booking over the phone (not online) is possible only with points that were purchased from the developer. There is a fee for doing that and the reservation window opens at a point after the reservation window for owners at a specific resort or owners in general in one of the systems. As a result, the highly desirable units at desirable dates are typically not available for the other side to book. I understand that Wyndham attempted to more fully integrate the two systems when they took over managing WorldMark, but was stymied by the terms and conditions on the WorldMark side - I didn't own in either when that happened and can't provide first-hand recollections of that. I am a retail (and resale) owner on the Club Wyndham and chose to add a resale WorldMark account in order to have better and less expensive access to the resorts on that side that are unique in the paired systems (e.g., Fiji and Coral Baja). There are other benefits that are available on the WorldMark side to resale owners that aren't available on the Club Wyndham side, but it's a bit off topic for this thread.

That seems to be the type of post-merger availability that some posters believe will be available. I would not be surprised to see that happen myself, but only time will tell. It seems rational to think it will be something like that; I don't think cross-system preference/discount in an exchange (either DEX or RCI) similar to the Marriott-Vistana is as likely an outcome unless DEX is further enhanced after the merger, although that could be a possibility. I do agree that it is very likely that any changes will take a long time to happen; the most likely immediate outcome is the sharing of sales leads (i.e., current owners) with the other system.

 

[Tamaradarann]

I don't know the history or financial abilities of the few folks that own in both systems so I can't say why they own in both or how happy they are with their choices on either side. For many Diamond owners, one of the big reasons to purchase (or switch our fixed/floating weeks to points) was based on not having to pay exchange (reservation) fees anymore. We currently have almost 400 resorts we can go to without having to pay an exchange fee. As some salesman like to say, our points are like cash. If a reservation is 2,500 points then we just use 2,500 points and that's it. Since we all pretty much agree that any intermingling will cost some type of fee, that is a negative for Diamond owners whereas it isn't for HGVC owners since y'all are used to paying a reservation fee to stay anywhere other than your home resort. Another point is that there are very few locations that HGVC has where there isn't already a Diamond resort and since your resorts seem to be considered more luxurious, they would likely cost more points as well. From the Diamond perspective, would I rather pay 4,000 points for a week at Mystic Dunes in Orlando or 10,000 points for a HGVC in Orlando? Personally, I'm going with the former. I'm not saying that on average HGVC owners are richer than Diamond owners but it is a possibility which is why Diamond owners work hard to maximize their point usage and prefer a system that has fewer "gotcha" fees (such as paying to save points to the following year). Believe it or not, only merging at the Management level WOULD be big (and happy) news for Diamond owners. I'll grant you it wouldn't be for HGVC owners since y'all are looking forward to having more locations to exchange to. Of course, only time will tell what will really happen between us.

As I stated in my previous remarks the exchange fee when exchanging between the two systems could be $59 or Free. One scenario could be HGVC would have to pay the $59 exchange fee that they normally do and for Diamond Members it would be free as it nomally is. Perhaps Diamond Reosrts International would need be required to reimburse HGVC for the $59 exchange fee if HGVC felt it was being short changed, however, that is certainly a minor point for negotiations which wouldn't effect members direct costs.

Since point banks would stay where they are no addtional fees such as for saving points should be needed. By the way HGVC members also "Work Hard" to maximize their point usage. HGVC members make similar decisions within the HGVC system to maximize the point usage. I won't tell you we do it but we own 6 HGVC timeshares and have stayed for 4 months in a row at the Hilton Hawaiian Village in Honolulu. If you don't know the Hilton Hawaiian Village it is huge and blows the Modern in Honolulu or the KBC in Maui away.

You gave an example or using 4000 points versus 10,000 point to stay for a week in Orlando. I don't where you got the relative point values but I totally agree with your thought about the 4000 point resort. However, the number of points that would be required for exchanges between HGVC Resorts and Diamond Resorts has not been set, and I have no idea how they will determine it, so doing that comparison at this time is impossible.

I can understand your fears that HGVC will change the Diamond system so that your ownership is compromised. Of course we all don't know what will happen, but I believe that what I have stated in my previous posts and he about how the systems can be merged WITHOUT MERGING THE CLUBS is workable and if you want to just use your points in the Diamond System that would be not be impeded nor enhanced.

 

[brp]

If you don't know the Hilton Hawaiian Village it is huge and blows ... the KBC in Maui away.

We,, except for location. I don't know HHV, but I know that it's on Oahu and that's undesirable for us. KBC, on the other hand, is on the Kaanapali Coast, and that is desirable for us. So, I'd say that KBC blows away anything on Oahu since staying in a nice resort located somewhere one doesn't want to be is irrelevant. So "blows away" is very relative.

Cheers.

 

[Fried_shrimp]

As I stated in my previous remarks the exchange fee when exchanging between the two systems could be $59 or Free. One scenario could be HGVC would have to pay the $59 exchange fee that they normally do and for Diamond Members it would be free as it nomally is. Perhaps Diamond Reosrts International would need be required to reimburse HGVC for the $59 exchange fee if HGVC felt it was being short changed, however, that is certainly a minor point for negotiations which wouldn't effect members direct costs.

Since point banks would stay where they are no addtional fees such as for saving points should be needed. By the way HGVC members also "Work Hard" to maximize their point usage. HGVC members make similar decisions within the HGVC system to maximize the point usage. I won't tell you we do it but we own 6 HGVC timeshares and have stayed for 4 months in a row at the Hilton Hawaiian Village in Honolulu. If you don't know the Hilton Hawaiian Village it is huge and blows the Modern in Honolulu or the KBC in Maui away.

You gave an example or using 4000 points versus 10,000 point to stay for a week in Orlando. I don't where you got the relative point values but I totally agree with your thought about the 4000 point resort. However, the number of points that would be required for exchanges between HGVC Resorts and Diamond Resorts has not been set, and I have no idea how they will determine it, so doing that comparison at this time is impossible.

I can understand your fears that HGVC will change the Diamond system so that your ownership is compromised. Of course we all don't know what will happen, but I believe that what I have stated in my previous posts and he about how the systems can be merged WITHOUT MERGING THE CLUBS is workable and if you want to just use your points in the Diamond System that would be not be impeded nor enhanced.

I didn't mean to show any disrespect when I stated "work hard". But since HGVC is week based, you can just go to your week and never have to worry about points or exchanging ever if you wanted, correct? And when you exchange to another HGVC or RCI it's pretty much week for week, isn't it? I'm not really sure how your points side of the house even works since you are deed based. Since Diamond trusts are purely points and you have discount time frames and nightly point cost differences and then you throw in time of year, unit size, particular resort, it take a little more math, IMO, for every reservation we make to get the best bang for your buck with Diamond points because we have no deeded week to fall back on if we wanted.

The point values I used for an example (purely an example) are based on what I normally spend for a week with my points based against what I think we would be charged to stay at an HGVC resort for a week. I used the point costs of what it costs to stay at some of the supposedly nicer Diamond resorts (such as Oceanaire or KBC) and assumed that an HGVC unit, being supposedly much nicer than the average Diamond unit, would command such a point value. Again, a lot of this is purely speculative based on a little bit of fact.

If you don't mind me asking, how did you stay 4 months in a row at a particular resort since your system is based on weeks? Did you book 12 weeks in a row? Did you have to move units in that time? If we make an 84 night reservation, we know beyond a shadow of a doubt that we will be in the same unit for those 12 weeks. If we booked a week at a time, we could very easily be moved because a Platinum owner could select some of the time in that unit with a Diamond Preference which would take priority.

 

[Tamaradarann]

With Wyndham/WorldMark, cross-booking over the phone (not online) is possible only with points that were purchased from the developer. There is a fee for doing that and the reservation window opens at a point after the reservation window for owners at a specific resort or owners in general in one of the systems. As a result, the highly desirable units at desirable dates are typically not available for the other side to book. I understand that Wyndham attempted to more fully integrate the two systems when they took over managing WorldMark, but was stymied by the terms and conditions on the WorldMark side - I didn't own in either when that happened and can't provide first-hand recollections of that. I am a retail (and resale) owner on the Club Wyndham and chose to add a resale WorldMark account in order to have better and less expensive access to the resorts on that side that are unique in the paired systems (e.g., Fiji and Coral Baja). There are other benefits that are available on the WorldMark side to resale owners that aren't available on the Club Wyndham side, but it's a bit off topic for this thread.

That seems to be the type of post-merger availability that some posters believe will be available. I would not be surprised to see that happen myself, but only time will tell. It seems rational to think it will be something like that; I don't think cross-system preference/discount in an exchange (either DEX or RCI) similar to the Marriott-Vistana is as likely an outcome unless DEX is further enhanced after the merger, although that could be a possibility. I do agree that it is very likely that any changes will take a long time to happen; the most likely immediate outcome is the sharing of sales leads (i.e., current owners) with the other system.

It seems like the reservation window for cross-booking from one Club to the other in the Wyndham/WorldMark merger is similar to what I have expressed that might happen in the HGV/Diamond system merger. As expected the highly desireable units at desireable dates are typically not available. That happens now in some HGVC resorts for HGVC members and that is as should be since I believe most members of both Clubs agree that there should be a reservation preference hierarchy going from; Resort Owner, Club Owner Member, Merger System Owner. However, there are still the significant benefits over booking thru RCI of lower or no reservation fees and not having to wait for weeks to be deposited in RCI; whenever that happens. As an HGVC member I know I had to wait and take what I could get in making RCI reservations for highly desireable units using extended seaches for Key West, Maui, Kauai, San Francisco, and Disney Resorts.

 

[Fried_shrimp]

Isn't it curious that while purely Diamond owners are not interested in exchanging into HGVC resorts, those that own both Diamond Resorts and HGVC Resorts seem to be interested!

This is purely a guess but maybe those dual owners bought first in Diamond, then toured and bought at an HGVC property and decided they liked it better? I really don't know why people buy into multiple systems, maybe for the location differences? Maybe they like the perceived better quality of the second system but can't walk away from the first system? I'm sure all of these reasons and many others have something to do with it.

 

[Tamaradarann]

I didn't mean to show any disrespect when I stated "work hard". But since HGVC is week based, you can just go to your week and never have to worry about points or exchanging ever if you wanted, correct? And when you exchange to another HGVC or RCI it's pretty much week for week, isn't it? I'm not really sure how your points side of the house even works since you are deed based. Since Diamond trusts are purely points and you have discount time frames and nightly point cost differences and then you throw in time of year, unit size, particular resort, it take a little more math, IMO, for every reservation we make to get the best bang for your buck with Diamond points because we have no deeded week to fall back on if we wanted.

The point values I used for an example (purely an example) are based on what I normally spend for a week with my points based against what I think we would be charged to stay at an HGVC resort for a week. I used the point costs of what it costs to stay at some of the supposedly nicer Diamond resorts (such as Oceanaire or KBC) and assumed that an HGVC unit, being supposedly much nicer than the average Diamond unit, would command such a point value. Again, a lot of this is purely speculative based on a little bit of fact.

If you don't mind me asking, how did you stay 4 months in a row at a particular resort since your system is based on weeks? Did you book 12 weeks in a row? Did you have to move units in that time? If we make an 84 night reservation, we know beyond a shadow of a doubt that we will be in the same unit for those 12 weeks. If we booked a week at a time, we could very easily be moved because a Platinum owner could select some of the time in that unit with a Diamond Preference which would take priority.

First of all let me clear up that the HGVC system is NOT a weeks system. Yes you buy a week of a certain size, view, and style at a resort and get a Deed, but that is where it ends. The week you buy entitles you to one week in the same unit size, view, style you bought DURING THE SEASON YOU BOUGHT. However, the unit you buy immediately gets converted to points based on resort, unit size, view style and season. You can use all the points you bought during the Resort Owner Preference period which is typically 12-9 months before check in to reserve the exact same unit you bought if it is available which it usually is. When you want to book outside of the resort, unit size, style, and season that you bought you typically must wait until the 9 month mark before check in when the HGVC Club Reservation Period begins and you use now use your points. I would say most owners book during the Club Reservation Period since it is much more flexible and flexible makes HGVC ownership desirable.

OK since I cleared up the weeks versus points issue let me go on. When making reservations during the Club Reservation Period you must book at least 3 nights and can book up to 28 nights on one reservation. (that has changed over the years at one time you could extend a reservation up to about 100 nights which I did.). You are assured you will be in the same room during a reservation, however, you are NOT assured you will be in the same room if you have multiple reservations. You need to talk to the front desk to hopefully make that happen. We have been very sucessful in making that happen.

I hope this makes your understanding of the HGVC system a little better.

 

[Sandy VDH]

This is purely a guess but maybe those dual owners bought first in Diamond, then toured and bought at an HGVC property and decided they liked it better? I really don't know why people buy into multiple systems, maybe for the location differences? Maybe they like the perceived better quality of the second system but can't walk away from the first system? I'm sure all of these reasons and many others have something to do with it.

I own Wyndham, HGVC and Holiday Inn. However I purchased these units before they belonged to any of those clubs. The resorts were independent but were purchased by the larger company and eventually turned into points play. Wyndham I converted the fixed weeks, did an equity trade (to avoid a huge SA), PICed two weeks and made a one time developer purchase of 160K to get me to VIP Platinum level. HGVC, I paid to register a unit I owned in HGVC points, purchased a second unit resale from an authorized HGVC agent which qualified me as Elite when they rolled out the program. I purchased a Las Vegas week on auction in the late 1990s that after several switches in ownership, it ended up as a Holiday Inn week. I was made an offer of $100 to convert to HICV Points. I did.

So I never intended to own multiple points programs, but I ended up there anyway, owning 3.

 

[geist1223]

Worldmark and Wyndham did not merge. Wyndham through a predecessor bought the Develpment Rights from Trendwest. As a separate matter the Independent (LOL) Worldmark BOD hired Wyndham to be the day to day manager of the Resorts. An exchange program has been developed called Club Pass. You have to have WM+A or WM Developer sold Points to use Club Pass. Wyndham likes to inflate numbers so Wyndham count every Worldmark Member as a Member of Club Pass. Though a large number of Worldmark Members can not use Club Pss. The Booking Window for Club Pass i believe opens at 9 months.

WM+A Worldmark Points are Points acquired bebore "XX" date in November 2006 from whatever source. The Exchange Fee is $99. The Point Cost for an Exchange is quite high ie Wyndham Bali Hai 2 Bedroom through RCI is 10,000 Worldmark Points. Through Club Pass the same unit is 20,000 Worldmark Points. It appears that the rough equivalency between Wyndham and Worldmark is 16 to 20 Wyndham Points per 1 Worldmark Point.

 

[brp]

I didn't mean to show any disrespect when I stated "work hard". But since HGVC is week based, you can just go to your week and never have to worry about points or exchanging ever if you wanted, correct?

If you don't mind me asking, how did you stay 4 months in a row at a particular resort since your system is based on weeks?

It's based on weeks in terms of the ownership, and there is the option to use the Home Week booking. Outside of that it's points-based in all practical ways. Book where you want based on nightly points values. And, I believe that any booking using this method, i.e. not your Home Week (but even if your home resort) incurs the same reservation fee (I'm not sure as I do not pay booking fees due to by Hilton Club (bHC) owners having the option to pay an additional $129 annually to have no booking fees).

So, really, for most uses here anyway, this is points-based in terms of use with high flexibility.

(Edit: I had not noticed that @Tamaradarann covered this quite well already in a prior response)

Cheers.

 

[dayooper]

But since HGVC is week based, you can just go to your week and never have to worry about points or exchanging ever if you wanted, correct? And when you exchange to another HGVC or RCI it's pretty much week for week, isn't it? I'm not really sure how your points side of the house even works since you are deed based.

@Tamaradarann explained the system perfectly. I own a 2 bedroom platinum season at The Flamingo in Vegas. That deed comes with 7000 points I can spend on reservations. We can work the systems to our favor. Different seasons and different days cost different points. There are 3 (some resorts have 4) seasons and each season comes with a different amount of points (the MF’s remain the same though). My Flamingo 2 bedroom has 7000 points in platinum season. A gold season 2 bedroom would be 5000 and silver would be 3500 points. There is no bronze season at The Flamingo. M-Th nights cost half the points (700 per night) of F-Su (1400 per night) in platinum, 500/1000 in gold and 350/700 in silver.

Example: Since we did not any points last year, my points were saved to this year so we have 14,000 points to spend. We spent 7000 points on a Standard 2 bedroom platinum week at Ocean Oak. We spent 4400 points on 5 nights (M-F night) on a 3 bedroom gold unit at Elara in Vegas. We also spent 2560 for 3 nights (M-W night) on a platinum 1 bedroom in Chicago. Not gaming the system as much as you do yours (or most people do here), but not bad. We have a good sized family and need the room and only own 1 deed. I could use my points on studios and different seasons and really spread my points. I also spent a minimal amount of upfront money on my deed (bought resale) and I have the same booking windows and fees as any other owner.

Never say never, but my guess is I will never use my home week (or even stay) at the Flamingo.

 

[Tamaradarann]

@Tamaradarann explained the system perfectly. I own a 2 bedroom platinum season at The Flamingo in Vegas. That deed comes with 7000 points I can spend on reservations. We can work the systems to our favor. Different seasons and different days cost different points. There are 3 (some resorts have 4) seasons and each season comes with a different amount of points (the MF’s remain the same though). My Flamingo 2 bedroom has 7000 points in platinum season. A gold season 2 bedroom would be 5000 and silver would be 3500 points. There is no bronze season at The Flamingo. M-Th nights cost half the points (700 per night) of F-Su (1400 per night) in platinum, 500/1000 in gold and 350/700 in silver.

Example: Since we did not any points last year, my points were saved to this year so we have 14,000 points to spend. We spent 7000 points on a Standard 2 bedroom platinum week at Ocean Oak. We spent 4400 points on 5 nights (M-F night) on a 3 bedroom gold unit at Elara in Vegas. We also spent 2560 for 3 nights (M-W night) on a platinum 1 bedroom in Chicago. Not gaming the system as much as you do yours (or most people do here), but not bad. We have a good sized family and need the room and only own 1 deed. I could use my points on studios and different seasons and really spread my points. I also spent a minimal amount of upfront money on my deeds (bought resale) and I have the same booking windows and fees as any other owner.

Never say never, but my guess is I will never use my home week (or even stay) at the Flamingo.

dayooper gave some excellent examples of the use of points and ways to work the system to maximize the points usage. One of the ways you can maximize the points you get is to buy high and use low. Just to give you an idea of how high is high and low is low I will give you the extremes the highest point week that I know of in the HGVC system. A 3 BR Penthouse at the Grand Waikikian in the Platinum Season is 28,000 points/week. The lowest studios that I know of are the Standard Studios in some Las Vegas and Orlando Resorts in Silver Season which are 1100 points/week. The points range per week everything in between these numbers. I think this gives some idea on how you might "work hard" to maximize your points usage. I won't go into some of the instances when one might need to "work hard" to get the nights one wants at resorts and time periods that are in high demand.

 

[Fried_shrimp]

I own Wyndham, HGVC and Holiday Inn. However I purchased these units before they belonged to any of those clubs. The resorts were independent but were purchased by the larger company and eventually turned into points play. Wyndham I converted the fixed weeks, did an equity trade (to avoid a huge SA), PICed two weeks and made a one time developer purchase of 160K to get me to VIP Platinum level. HGVC, I paid to register a unit I owned in HGVC points, purchased a second unit resale from an authorized HGVC agent which qualified me as Elite when they rolled out the program. I purchased a Las Vegas week on auction in the late 1990s that after several switches in ownership, it ended up as a Holiday Inn week. I was made an offer of $100 to convert to HICV Points. I did.

So I never intended to own multiple points programs, but I ended up there anyway, owning 3.

Do you find it hard to manage bookings with 3 different systems (remembering the rules for each of the systems)? I once owned Diamond points, a flex 3 bdrm L/O week at another resort, and finally a fixed week at a beach resort. I found life to be much easier when I got rid of the flex and fixed week and went pure points with one company.

 

[Sandy VDH]

Do you find it hard to manage bookings with 3 different systems (remembering the rules for each of the systems)? I once owned Diamond points, a flex 3 bdrm L/O week at another resort, and finally a fixed week at a beach resort. I found life to be much easier when I got rid of the flex and fixed week and went pure points with one company.

No, I have a good memory, set reminders in my calendar, have good knowledge and use of excel, and I make it work for me. Each system has plus and minuses. Holiday Inn has lots of TX resorts since they took over Silverleaf, and Wyndham has some TX locations too. Makes for easy weekend trips. Hilton is more upscale and has far less locations, but it does have other merits.

It is what it is, I didn't plan it that way, but I got Status on 2 of the 3 for resale pricing, so I can't complain.

 

[brp]

There are 3 (some resorts have 4) seasons and each season comes with a different amount of points (the MF’s remain the same though).

Some have only 2 seasons. W. 57th, for example. Likely others.

Cheers.

 

[dayooper]

Some have only 2 seasons. W. 57th, for example. Likely others.

Cheers.

I was going for simplicity, but yes, most resorts don’t have a silver season. The older resorts usually have a silver season. Older Vegas properties Flamingo and Paradise both have silver while The Boulevard and Elara do not. With the exception of Sea World, none of the Orlando properties have a silver season either. The SW Florida affilliates and South Beach (older resorts) do. No Hawaii resorts have silver. Interestingly enough, the Myrtle Beach and Hilton Head resorts all have silver seasons. They are all under 10 years old. Put in place by Strand Capital, maybe? Chicago also has a silver season and that’s very new. Harsh Chicago winter? Italy doesn‘t have a silver season, but the majority of the European resorts have silver and even bronze (Valdoro in Breckinridge has a bronze season as well).

 

[csalter2]

I initially thought that the merger would be good for DR owners. However, I must say that I am not thinking it may not be as good a deal for us. First, I have been to quite a few Hilton presentations and they throw a lot points around but I notice that they don’t have a lot of properties. I went to two presentations in New York and was not impressed. I have stayed in Hilton Hawaiian Village, it was okay but doesn’t compare to Ko Olina in my humble opinion. I stayed at the Hilton timeshare in Orlando where they boasted of Universal going to build right next to the property. Hilton is fine, but not extraordinary in my opinion. I have been with Diamond since they took over Sunterra. My issue with them has always been their maintenance fees being so high and seeing their resorts being rented for less than what I pay in points. I use DR mainly for Hawaii. I love KBC and The Point but for different reasons. The Point is in a quiet area and it is beautiful and has everything in the unit. I like KBC for its location. It’s close to Whaler’s Village, you can walk to places to eat and there’s a grocery store and pizza shop across the street. They’re affiliate on the Big Island, Vacation Internationale at the base of the volcano is a nice property and close to the Black Sand Beach.
I have not been to the European properties, but my European counterparts enjoy them for holiday.

Diamond is not the best but it is decent. They have some properties that are equivalent to HGVC. My original timeshare company, Epic Resorts, had great locations such as the Daytona Beach Regency, Sedona Summit and the Palm Springs Marquis Villas. Back in the day these were all great places to stay as they were big accommodations and were in great locations. However, they were not ever maintained to the level that they once were after being bought.

I caution HGV owners to not look down their noses at Diamond. Depending on how this merger goes, you have a lot to gain. I feel we as Diamond owners could potentially gain, but I don’t really see that. I see a bunch of new owners who have limited places to go competing with lover 400,000 Diamond owners for units at the most popular times. I hope that it is run similarly like Marriott in which Marriott owners still get preference and Vistana still has their preferences for their properties before they start allowing others to to cross over from other systems.

 

[brp]

I initially thought that the merger would be good for DR owners. However, I must say that I am not thinking it may not be as good a deal for us. First, I have been to quite a few Hilton presentations and they throw a lot points around but I notice that they don’t have a lot of properties.

I didn't quote the whole thing, but some good points. This one in particular- HGVC definitely don't have a lot of locations compared to some. What they do have in those locations, though, are generally very nice resorts. So, for folks who happen to want to visit those locations often, it works well.

For example, we own at W. 57th in NYC and find it quite nice. We got 2-3 times a year and this is a great location and very nice accommodations. Also, the location north of Kona (Waikoloa) is great for us and we go yearly. While we own in Vegas (cheaper MFs), we don't go often. When we do, Elara is very nice.

As you say, from the HGVC member standpoint, I'm looking forward to DRI for added locations. KBC and The Point, in particular as, along with HGVC's Kona properties that covers all of the Hawai'ian islands we care to visit.

I don't yet know the other DRI locations since I expect it will be more than a year before I can actually sue them, but I'm sure that there are others I'd want to try.

Cheers.

 

[NOLA47]

When is it anticipated that we will find out the details of the merger and the benefits to both diamond and HGVC owners? Will the details be released as soon as the merger is approved?

 

[brp]

Will the details be released as soon as the merger is approved?

Highly, highly and, I repeat, Highly unlikely. Bits and pieces will undoubtedly roll out, but I expect a year or so before anything substantive is hammered out.

Cheers.

 

[Magus]

It all depends on where you live and what you want to do - I live within driving distance of HGV DC, Myrtle, Charleston, Hilton Head and Orlando. I also like AI in Mexico, which HGv has good transfer with Fiesta (used a total of 12 bookings in two years counting friends and family, largely Cabo and Cozumel), plus Barbados, Scotland and Italy access, as well as many Hawaii locations and Vegas.

So for where I live and travel and my family and friends whom I gift trips frequently, HGV is very good for location options, not even counting RCI and to be Diamond.

Plus, one of my HGV converts 50:1 with Hilton Honors (and also no club booking fees for all my points), combined with buy 4 nts with pts get 5th free and free weekend night cert + Hilton hotel diamond status with CC = nearly unlimited flexibility worldwide with Hilton, I am thrilled with the HGV system in my two years in the program. With my low MF locations really even 25:1 works for me well. I am looking forward to seeing if Diamond will open up any international locations, even out of season, for me, which would be a huge bonus.

I will certainly not thumb my nose at Diamond members or locations. My wife and I stay at everything from economy to luxury depending on a number of factors and everyone has their own style and budget!

 

[Talent312]

When is it anticipated that we will find out the details of the merger and the benefits to both diamond and HGVC owners? Will the details be released as soon as the merger is approved?

I seriously doubt they'll be that quick to do so.
They'll move their people into key positions and tinker with structure.
It may be a year after that before any major change is announced.
That will likely signal the start of a 3-4 period of adjustment.
-- Just a guess.
.

 

[escanoe]

I expect to begin to have a reasonable sense of where things might land within abt 5 years. Only a small amount of tongue and cheek in that response.