CLOSED: Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana & Marriott Ownerships (Marriott Link + Vistana Discussion)

[CalGalTraveler]

@klpenny Rescind now and wait for the announcement when terms are in writing so you know exactly what you are getting for the money. That deal is not going away. You can always go back later. Or sell/give away the properties and buy resale again.

 

[tstiv1996]

Your resale week and StarOptions may not even be able to be used to book Marriott weeks. We don't know how it will work. Us resale folks may still have to just continue to use StarOptions in VSN. The issue may be how Marriott values weeks and StarOptions. If they allocate points on the week level, people with Hawaii weeks may be more likely to use Marriott points than their StarOptions, but people with high season Kierland weeks may not convert and just continue using StarOptions. All based on speculation of course.

As long as I could book VSN resorts with same StarOptions conversion, I wouldn’t much care about staying at Marriott properties. I just hope my 95,700 SO under new conversion gets me the same villa type everywhere else. That’s why they say don’t buy where you don’t want to stay. Hopefully it’s a non issue, just a little more competitive.

 

[VacationForever]

As long as I could book VSN resorts with same StarOptions conversion, I wouldn’t much care about staying at Marriott properties. I just hope my 95,700 SO under new conversion gets me the same villa type everywhere else. That’s why they say don’t buy where you don’t want to stay. Hopefully it’s a non issue, just a little more competitive.

Currently, your 95,700 SOs do not get the same villa type everywhere else. A 2Br Hawaii Vistana villa requires 148,100 SOs. What you own and the ability to trade in VSN and II won't go away.

 

[tstiv1996]

Currently, your 95,700 SOs do not get the same villa type everywhere else. A 2Br Hawaii Vistana villa requires 148,100 SOs. What you own and the ability to trade in VSN and II won't go away.

Yes I just mean same conversation. For example I could get as high as 1br OF (not ever realistic, just as example) in Hawaii. Just hoping we get the same value out of our SO. In other words my SO holds the same value across VSN after the merge. Hope that makes sense.

 

[vacationtime1]

I don't see Marriott changing VSN at all. It would be a public relations disaster if they cancelled that program and then tried to make VSN owners pay to enroll in a different internal trading system.

What I do see is the possibility that Marriott will starve VSN of tradeable inventory over time by incentivizing VSN owners to pay to enroll in a better system -- or at least a different system with more properties.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

I expect that they would devalue/align SVV with Orlando trades into MVC. So SO exchange values would not change. This would be a disincentive to sign up for the new plan and stick wtih SOs if this came to pass.

We had a similar discussion of "starving inventory" in the existing system over on the Diamond/Hilton thread and although reps like to instill fear that "the sky is falling" no one has reported that it has ever come to pass with impact within last 20 years.

SO owners should hope that they charge a lot to enroll in MVC because that means fewer owners will pay the "ransom" fee and upgrade. This means more inventory remains in the SO pool.

Let's not forget that after 10 years of offering "upgrades" to enroll in the MVC points system, plus offering it for FREE to pre 2010 owners, only 60% of the entire MVC base have enrolled in their points program. That means that 40% of inventory remained as is after a decade of trying to upgrade people to their new program.

 

[tstiv1996]

Well for someone who’s motivation is to play in the SO pool, I guess I feel a little more encouraged. Granted we continue to just be speculative. I agree that it would cause an uproar among a large Customer Base if they didn’t allow us to use SO like we do now. Biggest concern I think for SO owners is the inventory issue.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Well for someone who’s motivation is to play in the SO pool, I guess I feel a little more encouraged. Granted we continue to just be speculative. I agree that it would cause an uproar among a large Customer Base if they didn’t allow us to use SO like we do now. Biggest concern I think for SO owners is the inventory issue.

Traders know that there are risks vs. owning where you want to go in which deed availability is guaranteed. I assume you got this resale for next to nothing. Ride this horse and then dump it when you don't get value out of it anymore. You are not losing a thing. My bet is that your horse will still give you many years of SO value no matter what they concoct.

 

[tstiv1996]

Traders know that there are risks vs. owning where you want to go in which deed availability is guaranteed. I assume you got this resale for next to nothing. Ride this horse and then dump it when you don't get value out of it anymore. You are not losing a thing. My bet is that your horse will still give you many years of SO value no matter what they concoct.

You are very right. That’s what I needed to hear lol.

 

[dioxide45]

Traders know that there are risks vs. owning where you want to go in which deed availability is guaranteed. I assume you got this resale for next to nothing. Ride this horse and then dump it when you don't get value out of it anymore. You are not losing a thing. My bet is that your horse will still give you many years of SO value no matter what they concoct.

We are well over a decade into Marriott's points based system and we are still getting value using Marriott weeks. I suspect the same will be true for VSN. There will be adjustments that need to be made and some weeks and resorts may be harder to book at 8 months, but we will still be able to go most places we can go.

 

[daviator]

It seems to me that if you own deeded weeks, there will always be value there, value that MVC can’t destroy no matter how they change the program. Without access to those deeded weeks, they have nothing to offer, so I think deeded week owners will be ok and VSN members will continue to be able to trade within VSN, at the very minimum. They may well offer free enrollment in the new program, that would be the fastest way to get lots of weeks enrolled and give them a much larger trading/selling pool, if that is their goal.

In that case, we’ll undoubtedly have lots of discussions here on the merits of enrolling in the new program, or not.

Now for those who own only points, there’s more that MVC can do to muck with the value of those points, but I don’t think it’s in their interest to piss off their customer base, so hopefully they won’t do so.

 

[mdragt]

Thanks everyone for the reminders of what we already knew (mostly), but forget when getting sucked into their sales pitches to authorize our weeks "for only 25K." TUG to the rescue again.

We are running away and sending the Encore cancellation document via certified mail. (Damn them they only accept faxes and mail, not email, and I doubt I could get confirmation a fax was received).

I need to get my hands on an Encore cancellation document, can anyone help?

 

[dioxide45]

I need to get my hands on an Encore cancellation document, can anyone help?

It should be included in your Encore Package agreement. The terms of cancellation would be spelled out there. The ability to cancel an Encore Package may not apply in all states. If there is a cancellation or rescission provision, there is no specific document to sent. You would just write up a letter indicating you want to rescind and send it to the address in the agreement.

 

[VacationForever]

When we bought our Encore Package at Westin Kierland in Nov/Dec 2021, there was recission provision, EXCEPT it did not specify the company and an incomplete address. I sent in to Westin Vacation Club, with the partial address, i.e. no Suite number, USPS did not deliver the mail because of "incomplete address". When I saw that it was not delivered through USPS tracking, I looked it up, that same building has Wyndham and MVC Call Center. I then faxed to the listed number and resent the recission request, this time to Marriott Vacation Club and a suite number of the call center which I found on the website. This is really dirty tactic by MVC.

 

[Tucsonadventurer]

When we bought our Encore Package at Westin Kierland in Nov/Dec 2021, there was recission provision, EXCEPT it did not specify the company and an incomplete address. I sent in to Westin Vacation Club, with the partial address, i.e. no Suite number, USPS did not deliver the mail because of "incomplete address". When I saw that it was not delivered through USPS tracking, I looked it up, that same building has Wyndham and MVC Call Center. I then faxed to the listed number and resent the recission request, this time to Marriott Vacation Club and a suite number of the call center which I found on the website. This is really dirty tactic by MVC.

Yup and this will probably get deleted but I am so disappointed that Marriott and Hyatt have both decided not to pull out of Russia .

 

[daviator]

Yup and this will probably get deleted but I am so disappointed that Marriott and Hyatt have both decided not to pull out of Russia .

Presumably they are going to have some real problems getting money from those properties out of Russia, which may force them to make a different decision in time. But I share your disappointment.

 

[Ken555]

Yup and this will probably get deleted but I am so disappointed that Marriott and Hyatt have both decided not to pull out of Russia .

Marriott pauses opening new hotels, investment in Russia

Hotel chain Marriott International Inc said on Thursday it has decided to pause the opening of upcoming hotels and all future hotel development and investment in Russia, following Moscow's invasion of Ukraine.

www.reuters.com

Hilton and Hyatt have a similar announcement.

 

[Tucsonadventurer]

Marriott pauses opening new hotels, investment in Russia

Hotel chain Marriott International Inc said on Thursday it has decided to pause the opening of upcoming hotels and all future hotel development and investment in Russia, following Moscow's invasion of Ukraine.

www.reuters.com

Hilton and Hyatt have a similar announcement.

Ok that has a more positive slant to it. Last I read they were on the short list of companies not pulling out and were not commenting when asked for reasons. Sounds like it is under consideration but Noone at this point is making new investments in Russia so that is good PR. Thanks for posting that. I didn't know about Hilton

 

[TravelTime]

We are well over a decade into Marriott's points based system and we are still getting value using Marriott weeks. I suspect the same will be true for VSN. There will be adjustments that need to be made and some weeks and resorts may be harder to book at 8 months, but we will still be able to go most places we can go.

Are your Marriott weeks enrolled also so you have the option to use DPs if you want? Is there any loss with the DP program if someone bought a Marriott resale week post 2010 or who is eligible for free/cheap enrollment if purchased before 2010?

On the other hand, with Vistana, we have a points program that could be taken away. Many Vistana people will be upset by this bc they like SOs program. Many people paid a lot resale for mandatory weeks and do not want to use DPs.

For people who purchased a cheap mandatory Vistana week, like the ones in Orlando, does it really matter since they paid little for it? I know it is upsetting but they could offload it cheaply too if they do not like the changes.

For non mandatory weeks, are they losing anything?

If the fee to enroll my Vistana week is reasonable, I will enroll it and not care if they take away the SO program. I do not really like SOs because to book anything other than home resort, you need to do it at 8 months. Even at 12 month mark, I hear it is getting hard to book at the 12 month mark too. I like booking DPs at the 13 month for sure. Plus a new combined program will probably get me to Chairman’s Level (fingers crossed).

 

[TravelTime]

Ok that has a more positive slant to it. Last I read they were on the short list of companies not pulling out and were not commenting when asked for reasons. Sounds like it is under consideration but Noone at this point is making new investments in Russia so that is good PR. Thanks for posting that. I didn't know about Hilton

Aren’t hotels just licensing the Marriott name? I think I read that in the past. I think hotel owners pay a licensing fee. If so, Marriott can’t pull out of their agreements until they expire.

 

[dioxide45]

Aren’t hotels just licensing the Marriott name? I think I read that in the past. I think hotel owners pay a licensing fee. If so, Marriott can’t pull out of their agreements until they expire.

For the most part they are. I did do a search and notice I can still book a Marriott property in Moscow on Marriott.com.

 

[TravelTime]

For the most part they are. I did do a search and notice I can still book a Marriott property in Moscow on Marriott.com.

Could that be part of the licensing agreement too for that hotel? If not, hopefully they can remove it.

 

[dioxide45]

Could that be part of the licensing agreement too for that hotel? If not, hopefully they can remove it.

I am sure there is some contractual obligation.

 

[dioxide45]

Well tomorrow is a day we have seen posted that we should see some information from Marriott about a potential new program. Several people have heard at sales presentations the 14th or 15th. I wonder if we will really see anything or if it was just more sales lies?

 

[jabberwocky]

I have a feeling we are in for a great disappointment tomorrow. But I could be surprised if something does come out.