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CLOSED: Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana & Marriott Ownerships (Marriott Link + Vistana Discussion)

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Nick66

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It varies with the resort and season. But you never want to elect DC points to book back at your own resort. You should simply book your week as before. Skim isn't really all that bad as there are underlying reasons that can explain why there is skim. One that has become obvious to many MVC DC owners is that you can book by days, so some orphaned/broken up days go unused. The other reason is the additional housekeeping required for short stays. However, one can argue that owners pay for housekeeping in their MF anyway. Even though there is skim, it really has not affected my satisfaction with the DC program.
Yes I understand that you wouldn’t want to do that, but as I’m piecing this together based on the pictures provided I’m trying to make an educated guess of what my weeks would get me in DC. I own SVR and if it’s based on the week on your deed, it would cost 2900 and 3450 DC points to book what I own. Would I expect to see from a DC election 85%? 90%? Of those amounts?
 

daviator

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It varies with the resort and season. But you never want to elect DC points to book back at your own resort. You should simply book your week as before. Skim isn't really all that bad as there are underlying reasons that can explain why there is skim. One that has become obvious to many MVC DC owners is that you can book by days, so some orphaned/broken up days go unused. The other reason is the additional housekeeping required for short stays. However, one can argue that owners pay for housekeeping in their MF anyway. Even though there is skim, it really has not affected my satisfaction with the DC program.
How does MVC handle housekeeping charges for multiple short stays?

Vistana's policy has always been pretty simple, you get one full clean for each vacation ownership, so if you use one VO for multiple stays, you’ll pay for a clean after the first one. Does DC work the same way? Or do they cover their extra housekeeping costs with the “skim” as you suggest?
 

Mroze

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It seems like we have some conflicting information as to whether a non-retro’ed mandatory will be able to convert to DC points.

If they DO allow it, it starts to make me wonder if the long-term plan is to deprecate VSN and make the DC points the only internal exchange currency. I hope not, as I like the way VSN works.


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In Post #686 above a MANDATORY-RESALE [LINE-4] was Enrolled because it was retro'd.
In Post #686 above a MANDATORY-RESALE [LINE-3] was NOT Enrolled because it was NOT retro'd. Vistana was willing to retro it [thus Enroll] with the purchase of additional FLEX-Points.

Thus, I assume that if a MANDATORY-RESALE is retro'd it will be classified as Enrolled and thus able to convert to DC-Points.
 
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Eric B

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In Post #686 above a MANDATORY-RESALE [LINE-4] was Enrolled because it was retro'd.
In Post #686 above a MANDATORY-RESALE [LINE-3] was NOT Enrolled because it was NOT retro'd. Vistana was willing to retro it [thus Enroll] with the purchase of additional FLEX-Points.

Thus, I assume that if a MANDATORY-RESALE is retro'd it will be classified as Enrolled and thus able to convert to DC-Points.

If you look carefully at the picture, Line-3 appears to have had white out put over the entry in the column for enrolled, similar to the modifications noted in the other lines. I wouldn’t rely on it either way.
 

alexadeparis

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If you look carefully at the picture, Line-3 appears to have had white out put over the entry in the column for enrolled, similar to the modifications noted in the other lines. I wouldn’t rely on it either way.
Yes, I saw that too, but only after taking the photo (they had the sheet backwards facing them in the presentation and I was able to snap a photo when they left) which is why I asked if there was going to be an amnesty type enrollment. I didn’t really receive a definitive answer on that, which is why I plan to wait and see.
 

kozykritter

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How does MVC handle housekeeping charges for multiple short stays?

Vistana's policy has always been pretty simple, you get one full clean for each vacation ownership, so if you use one VO for multiple stays, you’ll pay for a clean after the first one. Does DC work the same way? Or do they cover their extra housekeeping costs with the “skim” as you suggest?
From my understanding MVC doesn't charge any transactional fees included housekeeping, banking, cancellation or guest fees with the exception of a charge to split a lockoff unit in some instances.
 
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dioxide45

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How does MVC handle housekeeping charges for multiple short stays?

Vistana's policy has always been pretty simple, you get one full clean for each vacation ownership, so if you use one VO for multiple stays, you’ll pay for a clean after the first one. Does DC work the same way? Or do they cover their extra housekeeping costs with the “skim” as you suggest?
THere are no additional housekeeping fees with DC. It is all covered somehow in the skim and in the DC annual fee. The housekeeping line item of resort budgets has also gone up considerably since the introduction of DC. So we pay for it, just not at time of reservation or stay.
 

dioxide45

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From my understanding MVC doesn't charge any transactional fees included housekeeping, banking, cancellation or guest fees with the exception of a charge to split a lockoff unit.
No fee for locking off either for enrolled weeks.
 

CPNY

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Yes I understand that you wouldn’t want to do that, but as I’m piecing this together based on the pictures provided I’m trying to make an educated guess of what my weeks would get me in DC. I own SVR and if it’s based on the week on your deed, it would cost 2900 and 3450 DC points to book what I own. Would I expect to see from a DC election 85%? 90%? Of those amounts?
It could cost 2900 to book what you own but you may only get 2500 for electing. This conversion program will work out well for those with prime weeks at prime resorts yielding high DC values. I may have to convert 3 SVV platinum units to get around 4500 DC points. That would be enough to possibly book a week in a one bedroom at a high resort (not prime) In the DCE. In the VSN, I can combine those units and get a week in an oceanfront studio or one bedroom in Maui and still have enough left over for a week at the Harborside.

These valuations are based on the VOI portfolio alexdeparis posted. The values are purely speculation. I could be receiving more or less DC points for my ownerships.
 
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CPNY

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In Post #686 above a MANDATORY-RESALE [LINE-4] was Enrolled because it was retro'd.
In Post #686 above a MANDATORY-RESALE [LINE-3] was NOT Enrolled because it was NOT retro'd. Vistana was willing to retro it [thus Enroll] with the purchase of additional FLEX-Points.

Thus, I assume that if a MANDATORY-RESALE is retro'd it will be classified as Enrolled and thus able to convert to DC-Points.
@alexadeparis Did it miss something? Was the HRA unit enrolled or retro with a purchase or just the WSJ? The HRA was written as a resale in pen, but it also shows VSE ENROLLED.
 

lily28

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how many flex points or total $$ spend did vistana requires to retro your svv resale?
 

kozykritter

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What I suspect will happen is you have to make a concerted decision to participate in the program overall. THat means to enroll your week in the DC program. This is a one time event. Then you will start to be charged the higher DC Club Fee (this starts out at $215 per year). That fee will then include and cover all other fees an owner might pay; VSN fee, SO Banking Fee, SO cancellation fees, II exchange fees. I don't expect one to pay both the DC Club Fee AND the VSN fee.
Makes sense. Once you are enrolled (in my case Flex not weeks) and paying the DC club fee every year, can you rent DC points even if you don't convert any of your VSE ownership that year? Renting points is my personal goal in this cross-linking so I can expand my ownership into MVC on an as-needed basis without using up existing VSE options or buying DC points.
 

dioxide45

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Makes sense. Once you are enrolled (in my case Flex not weeks) and paying the DC club fee every year, can you rent DC points even if you don't convert any of your VSE ownership that year? Renting points is my personal goal in this cross-linking so I can expand my ownership into MVC on an as-needed basis without using up existing VSE options or buying DC points.
If it works like Marriott enrolled weeks, yes you can rent Club Points even if you don't elect Club Points in a given year.
 

CalGalTraveler

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I think the goal here is to make it less attractive to elect Club Points to book either back into your home resort or even back into Sheraton or Westin properties. The primary purpose of electing points will be to book into Marriott properties. If you want to stay at a Vistana property, just stick with VSN.

This nails it. We already have several TS weeks, so our want for occasional MVC doesn't justify $15 - $20k plus $1800 annual MF for the flexibility. So we will likely pass with our WKORV OF Unless they offer this for low cost to mandatory resale.

It will take a very long time to see an effect on Vistana inventory no matter how much fear the reps portray.
 

dioxide45

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Is it cost effective to rent DC points?
They generally rent for just a little more than the maintenance fees on Trust points. You can check out www.vacationpointexchange.com to see what people are asking.

We do some last minute rentals and have found it better to rent from a Presidential or Chairman's Club owner and have them make the reservation for me in order to get the discounts on the number of points needed. In that case, you don't even need to be a DC member or even an owner at all.
 

kozykritter

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They generally rent for just a little more than the maintenance fees on Trust points. You can check out www.vacationpointexchange.com to see what people are asking.

We do some last minute rentals and have found it better to rent from a Presidential or Chairman's Club owner and have them make the reservation for me in order to get the discounts on the number of points needed. In that case, you don't even need to be a DC member or even an owner at all.
How do you join that website to do point exchanges? I tried and it said forbidden, private list. I seem to recall something about making a donation to join.
 

dioxide45

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How do you join that website to do point exchanges? I tried and it said forbidden, private list. I seem to recall something about making a donation to join.
Not sure what the error you are seeing is, but you should just need to register. Similar to registering for the TUG BBS forum.
 

duke

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This reminds me of that Capital One bank commercial with all the Monkeys in the backroom laughing at people calling in with questions..... These guys must have been very High when they put this nonsense together. My bet is 99.9% of current timeshare owners will ignore this crap and just keep using the simple VSN. Also, there is no way the salesperson can explain this to the average person who attends the presentation.
 

Mowogo

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This reminds me of that Capital One bank commercial with all the Monkeys in the backroom laughing at people calling in with questions..... These guys must have been very High when they put this nonsense together. My bet is 99.9% of current timeshare owners will ignore this crap and just keep using the simple VSN. Also, there is no way the salesperson can explain this to the average person who attends the presentation.
VSN may be simple and it’s simplicity allowed for outsize value. DC adds complexity, but that complexity is going to be the price of having access to new resorts. VSN is never going to have more access to inventory Than it does now. And remember that a most owners do not make rational decisions (ie trading in floating week for Flex). Especially when the owners updates have their script pushed to have the benefits of using DC over VSN.
 

VacationForever

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The complexed MVC points requirement based on demand 365 days a year provides for opportunities/value as well as heck-no-way I am using points to book an expensive duration. It is similar to VSN except that VSN's seasons are more straight forward. Without looking at the charts, I roughly know how many SOs are needed for a stay but with MVC, I really don't know until I pull the DC chart. The variation of MVC DC points requirement is significant. With any high point requirement stays, I use II as my first choice and maybe add on lower point requirement days like Sun-Thu, which I do with both VSN and DC.
 

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Moderator Note: There are two threads about this topic (this one and one in the Marriott forum) and both are getting very heavy traffic with Vistana people checking out both. The content in this post is being deleted because I'm following the lead of @DeniseM (Vistana forum moderator) to keep unhelpful/vague commentary out of the sphere, at least for now. Let's wait until everyone gets a chance to learn what needs to be learned, much of which is still unknown, and then we can all bash it to our heart's content. :) <--SueDonJ
 
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DanCali

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There is an irony here. For years, Vistana sold people on the idea of buying the most SOs at the least cost (both purchase cost and MFs) which is how I ended up first buying into WDW… I already owned at WKORV with its high MFs, they convinced me that WDW was much more bang for the buck. Now the chickens have come home to roost and the lower-MF resorts will (mostly) have lower trading power in DC.

- Our WKORVN OF week is worth 8325 points. This is close to what @dioxide45 had guessed they would be worth. Orlando for us isn't great (2625) and our SDO Plat is worth around (can't recall the exact number).

The one exchange here nobody is talking about is the rental market. Both VSN and DC are artificial values, but cash is probably the best metric. Even if VSN were to go away tomorrow, a WKV 2BR Platinum owner can rent out their week and use that cash to book a 2BR at WKORV most weeks of the year for about the same dollar amount. There is absolutely no incentive to convert a WKV week in the DC given rental values.

I do find a few things interesting. If WKORVN OF weeks are worth 8325 points those points currently have a rental value of about $5700 (0.68/point) . I suspect that's much higher than those weeks actually rent for which would give owners an incentive to convert weeks and rent out those points. With an increased supply of points rental value of points may actually drop, which would mean that the MFs for DC points (currently ~$0.65/point) may actually end up being higher than the rental value of the points. I can't see how that helps Marriott's cause of selling points as a valuable thing... Technically when rental values drop below MFs resale values should be zero - just look at Orlando weeks.
 

bogey21

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Moderator Note: There are two threads about this topic (this one and one in the Marriott forum) and both are getting very heavy traffic with Vistana people checking out both. The content in this post is being deleted because I'm following the lead of @DeniseM (Vistana forum moderator) to keep unhelpful/vague commentary out of the sphere, at least for now. Let's wait until everyone gets a chance to learn what needs to be learned, much of which is still unknown, and then we can all bash it to our heart's content. :) <--SueDonJ
All I did was quote and agree with part of post 709. You delete me and leave it up. What goes...

George
 
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