CLOSED: Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana & Marriott Ownerships (Marriott Link + Vistana Discussion)

[timsi]

I would agree, they won't pay an Exchange Company Dues to Abound, but there is this "beyond what is payable to Network Operator for membership in the Network". So I think VSN members still pay the fee, just to VSN instead, as the Network is defined in the document as VSN.

View attachment 63230

"Network or VSN means the Vistana Signature Network, the service name given to the variety of exchange and reservation services and vacation and travel benefits currently offered, and the restrictions currently imposed by Network Operator for Network Resorts. The Network is an exchange program offered by Network Operator, an exchange company. Network Operator means Vistana Signature Network, Inc., a Delaware corporation, its successors and permitted assigns."

To me it sounds like you continue to pay the existing fees to Vistana for Vistana (the Network) not for Abound. I do not see any mention that you have to pay additional money for the Exchange (Abound).

 

[dioxide45]

"Network or VSN means the Vistana Signature Network, the service name given to the variety of exchange and reservation services and vacation and travel benefits currently offered, and the restrictions currently imposed by Network Operator for Network Resorts. The Network is an exchange program offered by Network Operator, an exchange company. Network Operator means Vistana Signature Network, Inc., a Delaware corporation, its successors and permitted assigns."

To me it sounds like you continue to pay the existing fees to Vistana for Vistana (the Network) not for Abound. I do not see any mention that you have to pay additional money for the Exchange (Abound).

I agree. I think we are both saying the same thing.

 

[jabberwocky]

I wonder if the second point would apply also to those of us that have requalified a resale voluntary unit as it was not purchased through an authorized resale agent? When I read this I'm thinking it is specifically defining those who can participate:

1) Developer purchases or resales through an authorized resale agent at any time (including after August 8, 2022
2) Anyone in VSN prior to August 9 who purchased resale that is unauthorized.

Eligible Vacation Ownership Interests (“VOIs”):

• Are those that are enrolled in VSN and were purchased from the Developer or through an authorized resale agent.
• VOIs that were enrolled in VSN prior to August 9, 2022 that were purchased through an unauthorized resale agent or HOA resale offer will be given the opportunity to elect to receive Club Points and apply toward Owner benefit level.

The next following point I think just clarifies that VSN enrolled resales post-8/8 will not be in Abound. That resolves any uncertainty that might have existed from the prior points.

VOIs purchased through an unauthorized resale agent or HOA resale offer on or after August 9, 2022, and VOIs not enrolled in the VSN are not eligible.

 

[timsi]

I agree. I think we are both saying the same thing.

It also seems to suggest that those with Vistana and Marriott VOIs will continue to pay 2 separate sets of fees and will not necessarily save on annual membership fees. I am not surprised if Marriott is not giving up a revenue stream for no good reason.

 

[remowidget]

I think the opt-out option may be there for some people that only own one week and don't qualify for 3* and only use their home resort where they would see an increase in the VSN fee when it goes to the Abound Club Fee. The current VSN Fee is $160 and the Abound Club Fee would be $230. They may be willing to provide those owners an opt-out to prevent a lot of complaints about the fees.

That doesn't make sense to me. The chart I've seen shows all enrolled owners paying Club dues. I think it is more likely there will be a fee to enroll mandatory resales. If so, it seems like mandatory resale owners who were lied to about this and made a purchase might have standing in a lawsuit.

 

[dioxide45]

It also seems to suggest that those with Vistana and Marriott VOIs will continue to pay 2 separate sets of fees and will not necessarily save on annual membership fees. I am not surprised if Marriott is not giving up a revenue stream for no good reason.

We did see this in the Marriott FAQ;

 

[timsi]

That doesn't make sense to me. The chart I've seen shows all enrolled owners paying Club dues. I think it is more likely there will be a fee to enroll mandatory resales. If so, it seems like mandatory resale owners who were lied to about this and made a purchase might have standing in a lawsuit.

If I had a dollar for every lie said during an owner update...

 

[Jimmyboy]

Looks to me that VSN members in good standing are not required to pay Exchange Company Dues...... As per Section VI 3 in the attachment, page 14?

Yep that what it says. So I wonder why a vsn owner would want to opt out?

 

[Jimmyboy]

I would agree, they won't pay an Exchange Company Dues to Abound, but there is this "beyond what is payable to Network Operator for membership in the Network". So I think VSN members still pay the fee, just to VSN instead, as the Network is defined in the document as VSN.

View attachment 63230

My guess we will see this when the billing comes out for 2023.

 

[dioxide45]

My guess we will see this when the billing comes out for 2023.

Flex owners have noticed that the VSN Fee is excluded from their annual maintenance fee bill this year. I suspect it will be billed separately going forward.

 

[kozykritter]

Flex owners have noticed that the VSN Fee is excluded from their annual maintenance fee bill this year. I suspect it will be billed separately going forward.

The invoice had language saying club dues would be billed separately prior to December going forward.

 

[Red elephant]

Just attended an update at SBP and they tried to sell me Sheraton flex and said they can retro only Nanea into flex so I can choose to use the home options as flex in any given year if I owned Sheraton flex. Only SBP and Orlando are selling flex right now and it’s about to end. They are the only ones that can do this with Nanea and only Nanea no other resort .

 

[kozykritter]

The Club Dues situation is murky at best. There could be three different fee options: those participating in Abound Exchange ($230), those not participating in Abound automatically paying a Consolidated VSN fee ($230) but can opt out of the consolidation and pay a standard VSN fee ($160) plus transaction fees. Or it could just be Abound Exchange fee ($230) or the standard VSN fee ($160) plus transaction fees for those not in Abound. Or it could be completely different. We need more info, please!

 

[vacationtime1]

Just attended an update at SBP and they tried to sell me Sheraton flex and said they can retro only Nanea into flex so I can choose to use the home options as flex in any given year if I owned Sheraton flex. Only SBP and Orlando are selling flex right now and it’s about to end. They are the only ones that can do this with Nanea and only Nanea no other resort .

Sleazy sales techniques. They knew you owned Nanea and used FOMO (and a bunch of lies) to attempt to separate you from your money.

The best information we have right now is that if you bought Nanea from the developer, you are Abound-eligible without doing anything further.

 

[Red elephant]

Sleazy sales techniques. They knew you owned Nanea and used FOMO (and a bunch of lies) to attempt to separate you from your money.

The best information we have right now is that if you bought Nanea from the developer, you are Abound-eligible without doing anything further.

They were saying I could buy flex and they would add Nanea for me to use as flex options in interval.
when I refused he comes back and says BTW new for 2023 Nanea can be used as flex options in interval. So I say why where you trying to sell me Sheraton flex to do that if I have that option starting in 2023?

 

[Red elephant]

The other thing I was told is that any resale bought after that 8/9 date will not have access to Abound and if you requalified it would not give you elite benefits only access to Abound.

 

[Red elephant]

They are selling hybrid weeks and Sheraton flex at SBP from foreclosed ownership.

 

[dioxide45]

The other thing I was told is that any resale bought after that 8/9 date will not have access to Abound and if you requalified it would not give you elite benefits only access to Abound.

Well, we do know it will provide Elite benefits in Abound, we just aren't clear on how mandatory pre 8/9 qualify for Abound.

 

[dsmrp]

Hmm, if Westin Flex is nearly sold out ( if we believe Sales), what are those Westin based sales people trying to push now until the October go-live of Abound operations? DC points?

We have a WDW stay in September. Be interesting to see what they try to sell us.
Or if they'll have any more info that what's here on TUG. I don't think I could get DH to attend another 'update' tho. For him it's almost as bad as a root canal LOL.

 

[Red elephant]

Hmm, if Westin Flex is nearly sold out ( if we believe Sales), what are those Westin based sales people trying to push now until the October go-live of Abound operations? DC points?

We have a WDW stay in September. Be interesting to see what they try to sell us.
Or if they'll have any more info that what's here on TUG. I don't think I could get DH to attend another 'update' tho. For him it's almost as bad as a root canal LOL.

I was told today that Westin flex is no longer being sold only Sheraton flex at SBP and Orlando. Everyone is selling club points ( Abound).

 

[dioxide45]

Hmm, if Westin Flex is nearly sold out ( if we believe Sales), what are those Westin based sales people trying to push now until the October go-live of Abound operations? DC points?

We have a WDW stay in September. Be interesting to see what they try to sell us.
Or if they'll have any more info that what's here on TUG. I don't think I could get DH to attend another 'update' tho. For him it's almost as bad as a root canal LOL.

I got the impression from our last sales presentation that they were nearly out of Westin Flex. THey seemed to be scraping bottom. They will transition over to selling Abound Club Points and talk those up like they are the greatest thing and how Flex plain sucks...

 

[remowidget]

• Eligible Vacation Ownership Interests (“VOIs”):
  • Are those that are enrolled in VSN and were purchased from the Developer or through an authorized resale agent.
  • VOIs that were enrolled in VSN prior to August 9, 2022 that were purchased through an unauthorized resale agent or HOA resale offer will be given the opportunity to elect to receive Club Points and apply toward Owner benefit level.
• VOIs purchased through an unauthorized resale agent or HOA resale offer on or after August 9, 2022, and VOIs not enrolled in the VSN are not eligible.

I would guess that "purchased through an unauthorized resale agent" is referring to mandatory resales that haven't been requalified.

Does "HOA resale offer" mean resales that have been requalified? If so, there could be a fee for any requalified weeks to play in Abound.

 

[dioxide45]

I would guess that "purchased through an unauthorized resale agent" is referring to mandatory resales that haven't been requalified.

Does "HOA resale offer" mean resales that have been requalified? If so, there could be a fee for any requalified weeks to play in Abound.

HOA resale is a week that is owned by the HOA and sold to existing (or sometimes new) owners. Just the HOA selling weeks vs the developer.

 

[bobpark56]

It was included but somehow I forgot to add it to the combined PDF I created on Adobe.com. I have updated my original post with the chart and the updated version is in this one too.

Hmmmm...From the MVC points chart for Westin Lagunamar, it looks like Marriott is trying to do away with Vistana's Gold week designation for the first 4 weeks of January. I think I'm going to hang onto our Star Options & Home Options.

 

[byeloe]

Hmmmm...From the MVC points chart for Westin Lagunamar, it looks like Marriott is trying to do away with Vistana's Gold week designation for the first 4 weeks of January. I think I'm going to hang onto our Star Options & Home Options.

That's one of the first things that we noticed also. My wife had made that prediction awhile ago. January gold season was one of the reasons that we purchased our resale mandatory units