California COVID-19 guidelines / Dec 2020 Cancellations by Marriott/II [MERGED]

[davidvel]

Interesting how this will play out in Tahoe...

So I assume Marriott Timber Lodge will similarly close on the CA side, but you can stay a mile away in Harrah's or a couple miles away in the timeshares up in Kingsbury Grade as they are in Nevada. So weird...

(Sorry, I know off topic from NCV so mods feel free to move. I was more referencing CA closures as a whole)

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I've been thinking the same, which is why I've been involved in this thread. Your post motivated me to retrade my Timber Lodge first of January week to Ridge as insurance.

 

[winger]

Do what you want and think is best. [Deleted] The state has not imposed any rules, orders or any restrictions on travel, and no travel quarantine is in place.

The headlines claiming that there has been some new "spike" relates only to positive tests, based upon more tests. The positive rate has not significantly increased yet.

California has had a spike in positive tests, due almost exclusively to an incredible increase in testing. The positivity rate remains well under the WHO's 5% threshold for lockdowns. [deleted] CA's positive test rate has hovered around 4% or so throughout the pandemic. This is due (I'll give him credit here), to the strong early mask mandate where people interact. Masks are helping here, but there is no spike as you will read in the media, in anything other than tests.

The state standards require counties to close things down when the number (not percentage) of positive tests increase, regardless of the fact that we are now testing at 5x levels from before. So 5x more tests equals about 5x more positive tests. 3rd grade math. This is why San Diego went to purple stage today, and Orange County will next week. But nothing has really changed. Hospital and ICU (including COVID care) availability is extremely high. But we are shut down to the purple tier. Sadly this [deleted] causes dingbats to then ignore smart controls like masks and social distancing...

My understanding is that one metric used for the latest restrictions is # of available ICU beds in a certain specified region falls below 15%. So, it is not just # of positive cases. Also remember two things - 1) higher positive cases should result in more hospitalizations, and there is a lag time in weeks on this. Deaths follow even further downstream. 2) higher COVID hospitalizations WILL MEAN lower quality of timely care for people needing other non-COVID related attention. Aside from available ICU beds, another resource in all this is medical staff. Over burdened medical system means stressed medical staff and I believe all of us want fresh nurses or doctor attending to us if we or loved ones end up in urgent care or emergency.

 

[davidvel]

My understanding is that one metric used for the latest restrictions is # of available ICU beds in a certain specified region falls below 15%. So, it is not just # of positive cases. Also remember two things - 1) higher positive cases should result in more hospitalizations, and there is a lag time in weeks on this. Deaths follow even further downstream. 2) higher COVID hospitalizations WILL MEAN lower quality of timely care for people needing other non-COVID related attention. Aside from available ICU beds, another resource in all this is medical staff. Over burdened medical system means stressed medical staff and I believe all of us want fresh nurses or doctor attending to us if we or loved ones end up in urgent care or emergency.

You're quoting a post of mine from almost a month ago, November 14.

You state some things, but don't really make a point.

San Diego has 24% ICU capacity, with the ability to ramp up more if needed, due to robust county and city management, and compliance by residents.

Yet, we are grouped by the state's leader with surrounding counties that can't manage their populations and have non-compliant citizens. So we are shut down and people are losing their jobs and businesses, and lives.

San Diego Icu availability =24%
So cal region=10.9%

Today, no new deaths in San Diego.

The regional system has been gerrymandered to ensure the whole state is shut down. This is not science, it is politics.

 

[sjsharkie]

I've been thinking the same, which is why I've been involved in this thread. Your post motivated me to retrade my Timber Lodge first of January week to Ridge as insurance.

Probably less risky. Even though the order could be lifted by Jan, probably a safer bet that Nevada does not impose a lock down.

Obviously TL is nicer and closer to gondola, but Stagecoach lift is likely less crowded and not too far from Ridge. It gets so packed at the gondola near TL - and its tough to socially distance down there. Up on the mountain I have less worries.

Now all we need is more snow Safe travels.

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[gln60]

You're quoting a post of mine from almost a month ago, November 14.

You state some things, but don't really make a point.

San Diego has 24% ICU capacity, with the ability to ramp up more if needed, due to robust county and city management, and compliance by residents.

Yet, we are grouped by the state's leader with surrounding counties that can't manage their populations and have non-compliant citizens. So we are shut down and people are losing their jobs and businesses, and lives.

San Diego Icu availability =24%
So cal region=10.9%

Today, no new deaths in San Diego.

The regional system has been gerrymandered to ensure the whole state is shut down. This is not science, it is politics.

100% CORRECT

 

[CA Richard]

We received this email from MVC last night regarding our upcoming reservation for December 13:


Dear Owners,

Due to the unprecedented situation surrounding the spread of the Novel Coronavirus (COVID-19), we wanted to make you aware that the Public Health Officer of the State of California issued a Regional Stay at Home Order on December 3, 2020 ("Order"), which provides for criteria that, when met for a specific region of California, implements prohibitions of the Order for that region of California. The Order, among other things, prohibits most travel in a region of California in which the criteria has been met. As of Sunday, December 6, 2020, the region that includes the resort has met the criteria for travel limitations to be enacted.

As a result of the Order, reservations for arrivals to Marriott's Desert Springs Villas prior to December 29, 2020will be canceled.

Due to the unprecedented situation surrounding COVID-19, please note the following for your canceled reservation:

• Upon cancellation of your reservation, your Vacation Club Points will be returned to your Holding Account and can be used for a villa reservation or select Explorer Collection offerings within 120 days of arrival, instead of the previous 60 days of arrival.
• For Vacation Club Points expiring anytime in 2020 or 2021 and placed into your Holding Account in connection with this canceled reservation, the expiration deadline will be extended through December 31, 2021. The December 31, 2021extension will be applied to the Vacation Club Points associated with this canceled reservation and placed into your Holding Account within two weeks.
• For reservations that include a Resort Credit, the Resort Credit will also be canceled and the Vacation Club Points associated with the Resort Credit will be returned to your Holding Account and can be used in the same manner as the Vacation Club Points returned to your Holding Account in connection with this canceled reservation.

Please visit the Marriott Vacation Club® website for the most current information regarding the status of resorts.

If you are traveling to Marriott's Desert Springs Villas with respect to supporting "critical infrastructure" or as otherwise permitted by the Order, please call Owners Services to request a reinstatement of your reservation. Please note that Owners traveling to the resort will be required to complete an acknowledgment upon arrival to the resort certifying their stay will be in compliance with the Order.

We thank you for being part of the Marriott Vacation Club family and appreciate your understanding as we work with all Owners to navigate this unprecedented situation.

 

[alchook]

Interesting. I have a reservation starting December 21 at Shadow Ridge and haven't gotten anything like that. I had asked about cancelling it earlier and was told that since the points I was using expire at the end of the year I would lose them.

 

[davidvel]

Probably less risky. Even though the order could be lifted by Jan, probably a safer bet that Nevada does not impose a lock down.

Obviously TL is nicer and closer to gondola, but Stagecoach lift is likely less crowded and not too far from Ridge. It gets so packed at the gondola near TL - and its tough to socially distance down there. Up on the mountain I have less worries.

Now all we need is more snow Safe travels.

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk

Yes, actually Sacramento region, that contains Tahoe, has not yet shut down and ICU capacity is around 20%. TL could be open at the start of the year. But if it shuts down this week some time, the order stays in place at least 3 weeks, getting to the end of the year.

We decided to go with the more sure thing, versus nicer area and resort. Now, let it snow.

 

[jpc763]

Interesting. I have a reservation starting December 21 at Shadow Ridge and haven't gotten anything like that. I had asked about cancelling it earlier and was told that since the points I was using expire at the end of the year I would lose them.

I just read on https://hub.vacationclub.com/properties/ that the golf course at Shadow Ridge is closed. So only thing open that I can see is the pools which is crazy to me given how little social distancing happens in the pool.

 

[alchook]

I just read on https://hub.vacationclub.com/properties/ that the golf course at Shadow Ridge is closed. So only thing open that I can see is the pools which is crazy to me given how little social distancing happens in the pool.

It seems the driving range and golf school are closed. The course is still taking tee times.

 

[tatmtr7]

I spent quite a bit of time today with them as I have reservations beginning December 26 and 27. All,is canceled and they will deposit a week with II in place of my weeks . The week has many restrictions so doubt how feasible it will be to use. I just hope they don’t begin opening the resort on December 29 and rent out the villas that were to be occupied by owners or guests. If they do then it is win situation for them as they recoup the $$$ and they charge high fees for the 2 bedroom villas.
I understand everyone is feeling pain and that this is trivial compared to illness etc. I just wish the week they deposit wouldn’t expire by the middle of next December and the guidelines are use only 120 days out. Hard to use when the vaccine probably won’t be available to all for quite awhile.

 

[OlaWeybridge]

We received this email from MVC last night regarding our upcoming reservation for December 13:


Dear Owners,

Due to the unprecedented situation surrounding the spread of the Novel Coronavirus (COVID-19), we wanted to make you aware that the Public Health Officer of the State of California issued a Regional Stay at Home Order on December 3, 2020 ("Order"), which provides for criteria that, when met for a specific region of California, implements prohibitions of the Order for that region of California. The Order, among other things, prohibits most travel in a region of California in which the criteria has been met. As of Sunday, December 6, 2020, the region that includes the resort has met the criteria for travel limitations to be enacted.

As a result of the Order, reservations for arrivals to Marriott's Desert Springs Villas prior to December 29, 2020will be canceled.

Due to the unprecedented situation surrounding COVID-19, please note the following for your canceled reservation:

• Upon cancellation of your reservation, your Vacation Club Points will be returned to your Holding Account and can be used for a villa reservation or select Explorer Collection offerings within 120 days of arrival, instead of the previous 60 days of arrival.
• For Vacation Club Points expiring anytime in 2020 or 2021 and placed into your Holding Account in connection with this canceled reservation, the expiration deadline will be extended through December 31, 2021. The December 31, 2021extension will be applied to the Vacation Club Points associated with this canceled reservation and placed into your Holding Account within two weeks.
• For reservations that include a Resort Credit, the Resort Credit will also be canceled and the Vacation Club Points associated with the Resort Credit will be returned to your Holding Account and can be used in the same manner as the Vacation Club Points returned to your Holding Account in connection with this canceled reservation.

Please visit the Marriott Vacation Club® website for the most current information regarding the status of resorts.

If you are traveling to Marriott's Desert Springs Villas with respect to supporting "critical infrastructure" or as otherwise permitted by the Order, please call Owners Services to request a reinstatement of your reservation. Please note that Owners traveling to the resort will be required to complete an acknowledgment upon arrival to the resort certifying their stay will be in compliance with the Order.

We thank you for being part of the Marriott Vacation Club family and appreciate your understanding as we work with all Owners to navigate this unprecedented situation.

I recieved this response today. We exchanged our Newport Coast week for this week through Interval. Here's the problem:
I don't understand under what legal terms Marriott can shut down their 3 palm desert timeshares but keep open their Marriott Desert Springs Hotel next door. If Marriott as an organization is making the decision that it's unsafe to run lodging or that it violates some new stay at home order, then it must shut down all of it's operations in California. Please give me your thoughts. It sounds like a class action suit to me.

 

[VacationForever]

I recieved this response today. We exchanged our Newport Coast week for this week through Interval. Here's the problem:
I don't understand under what legal terms Marriott can shut down their 3 palm desert timeshares but keep open their Marriott Desert Springs Hotel next door. If Marriott as an organization is making the decision that it's unsafe to run lodging or that it violates some new stay at home order, then it must shut down all of it's operations in California. Please give me your thoughts. It sounds like a class action suit to me.

View attachment 29729

It is not a Marriott problem. The CA governor order indicates that if travel is for critical infrastructure, for instance travelling doctors and nurses, the hotels must keep the doors open for them. They need a place to stay.

 

[davidvel]

I recieved this response today. We exchanged our Newport Coast week for this week through Interval. Here's the problem:
I don't understand under what legal terms Marriott can shut down their 3 palm desert timeshares but keep open their Marriott Desert Springs Hotel next door. If Marriott as an organization is making the decision that it's unsafe to run lodging or that it violates some new stay at home order, then it must shut down all of it's operations in California. Please give me your thoughts. It sounds like a class action suit to me.

View attachment 29729

You don't reference anything to support that the hotel will remain open (to anyone other than essential infrastructure workers). Where are you getting this info?

 

[SueDonJ]

I recieved this response today. We exchanged our Newport Coast week for this week through Interval. Here's the problem:
I don't understand under what legal terms Marriott can shut down their 3 palm desert timeshares but keep open their Marriott Desert Springs Hotel next door. If Marriott as an organization is making the decision that it's unsafe to run lodging or that it violates some new stay at home order, then it must shut down all of it's operations in California. Please give me your thoughts. It sounds like a class action suit to me.

Class action against which company? Marriott Vacations Worldwide, the timeshare company, and Marriott, Int'l., the hotel company, are two completely separate companies.

It may be that the hotel is also contacting guests to cancel non-essential stays but we'd have no way of knowing that unless someone on TUG is holding a hotel reservation.

 

[BJRSanDiego]

I spent quite a bit of time today with them as I have reservations beginning December 26 and 27. All,is canceled and they will deposit a week with II in place of my weeks . The week has many restrictions so doubt how feasible it will be to use. I just hope they don’t begin opening the resort on December 29 and rent out the villas that were to be occupied by owners or guests. If they do then it is win situation for them as they recoup the $$$ and they charge high fees for the 2 bedroom villas.
I understand everyone is feeling pain and that this is trivial compared to illness etc. I just wish the week they deposit wouldn’t expire by the middle of next December and the guidelines are use only 120 days out. Hard to use when the vaccine probably won’t be available to all for quite awhile.

I have received a Marriott replacement week and they seem to trade pretty well and maintain Marriott priority. The ones that I've received were good for around 1 year or a bit more.

 

[oneohana]

Yes, actually Sacramento region, that contains Tahoe, has not yet shut down and ICU capacity is around 20%. TL could be open at the start of the year. But if it shuts down this week some time, the order stays in place at least 3 weeks, getting to the end of the year.

We decided to go with the more sure thing, versus nicer area and resort. Now, let it snow.

Sacramento Region is down to 18.8% ICU availability. Checking in on 12/12 at TL hopefully they can hold out til then.

 

[Big Matt]

Class action against which company? Marriott Vacations Worldwide, the timeshare company, and Marriott, Int'l., the hotel company, are two completely separate companies.

It may be that the hotel is also contacting guests to cancel non-essential stays but we'd have no way of knowing that unless someone on TUG is holding a hotel reservation.

I have a question based on an assumption that I've had for a long time (that may be incorrect). I always thought that the sales people were all employees or contractors of MVW, but the hotel management folks are with Marriott International. Is this right or wrong?

Either way, a class action lawsuit in a pandemic is in bad taste IMO.

 

[Jwerking]

Been following this discussion as we had two II exchanges booked in Palm Desert for last two weeks in January as part of a cross country road trip along with 2 weeks in Sedona and 2 wks in Lake Havasu booked via real cheap RCI extra vacation weeks.

Now, clearly confirmed that the Marriott Desert Palm resorts will be closed thru Dec and will continue until Covid ICU improve. We pulled the plug and decided to cancel our trip out West. Thank goodness for free Marriott retrades, I was able to rebook the II exchanges to two Ocean Pointe in West Palm Beach. Glad I woke up early this morning at 6:30 EST and found a number of Marriott weeks available for January. Was able to keep retrading until I got consecutive weeks - yahoo! Small consolation after canceling our original exchanges to the Marriott Waiohai for our annual 2 month winter trip to HI.

This has certainly been a memorable year for timeshare travel. Good luck to everyone else for rearranging their CA Reservations.

 

[gln60]

Been following this discussion as we had two II exchanges booked in Palm Desert for last two weeks in January as part of a cross country road trip along with 2 weeks in Sedona and 2 wks in Lake Havasu booked via real cheap RCI extra vacation weeks.

Now, clearly confirmed that the Marriott Desert Palm resorts will be closed thru Dec and will continue until Covid ICU improve. We pulled the plug and decided to cancel our trip out West. Thank goodness for free Marriott retrades, I was able to rebook the II exchanges to two Ocean Pointe in West Palm Beach. Glad I woke up early this morning at 6:30 EST and found a number of Marriott weeks available for January. Was able to keep retrading until I got consecutive weeks - yahoo! Small consolation after canceling our original exchanges to the Marriott Waiohai for our annual 2 month winter trip to HI.

This has certainly been a memorable year for timeshare travel. Good luck to everyone else for rearranging their CA Reservations.

Smart move.....Florida is a great place to be the next couple of months..great beaches..fabulous weather...very nice Marriots on the beach and No Chance of any last minute lock downs like in California..we will be headed down to Beach Place Towers in Fort Lauderdale for 2 weeks in mid January...our annual trip to celebrate my wifes birthday...enjoy your trip

 

[dougp26364]

You're quoting a post of mine from almost a month ago, November 14.

You state some things, but don't really make a point.

San Diego has 24% ICU capacity, with the ability to ramp up more if needed, due to robust county and city management, and compliance by residents.

Yet, we are grouped by the state's leader with surrounding counties that can't manage their populations and have non-compliant citizens. So we are shut down and people are losing their jobs and businesses, and lives.

San Diego Icu availability =24%
So cal region=10.9%

Today, no new deaths in San Diego.

The regional system has been gerrymandered to ensure the whole state is shut down. This is not science, it is politics.

if it were strictly science, we wouldn’t be in as bad of a position as we find ourselves. But since politicians are elected officials they need to do what they think looks best in the eyes of the voters

 

[dougp26364]

Been following this discussion as we had two II exchanges booked in Palm Desert for last two weeks in January as part of a cross country road trip along with 2 weeks in Sedona and 2 wks in Lake Havasu booked via real cheap RCI extra vacation weeks.

Now, clearly confirmed that the Marriott Desert Palm resorts will be closed thru Dec and will continue until Covid ICU improve. We pulled the plug and decided to cancel our trip out West. Thank goodness for free Marriott retrades, I was able to rebook the II exchanges to two Ocean Pointe in West Palm Beach. Glad I woke up early this morning at 6:30 EST and found a number of Marriott weeks available for January. Was able to keep retrading until I got consecutive weeks - yahoo! Small consolation after canceling our original exchanges to the Marriott Waiohai for our annual 2 month winter trip to HI.

This has certainly been a memorable year for timeshare travel. Good luck to everyone else for rearranging their CA Reservations.

my view right now from Ocean Pointe.

 

[SueDonJ]

I have a question based on an assumption that I've had for a long time (that may be incorrect). I always thought that the sales people were all employees or contractors of MVW, but the hotel management folks are with Marriott International. Is this right or wrong?

Either way, a class action lawsuit in a pandemic is in bad taste IMO.

I think at this point all of the personnel working onsite at the timeshare properties are employees/contracted by MVW, except for employees at any of the facilities that lease onsite space (such as the spa onsite at Barony Beach Club.) Offsite there may still be some crossover in the IT systems if MVW is still using segments of the MI reservation system but I don't remember when they last provided an update on when/if that will change.

The hotel properties aren't owned by MI but instead pay licensing fees to put the Marriott name on their doors. I think personnel at each individual hotel are a mix of employees from MI and employees/contractors of the company that owns the property, but at each MI requires that the owners fill certain front-facing positions with MI employees.

About a possible class action no matter which companies are involved, I think that when the timeshare docs explicitly state that MVW has the right to restrict occupancy based on state/local mandates during one-off events out of their control - and no obligation to compensate owners/guests for such losses - it's a waste of time and money to challenge them.

 

[jancurious]

Sacramento Region is down to 18.8% ICU availability. Checking in on 12/12 at TL hopefully they can hold out til then.

I live in the Sacramento Region and listened to Dr. Mark Ghaly's (our California HHS Secretary) update yesterday. He projects the Sacramento region will fall below 15% by the end of this week. Once a region falls they have 48 hours to initiate compliance. You may just make it!

 

[bogey21]

[Political - deleted]