[ 2017 ] How to compare point systems?

[DeniseM]

Vistana also sells a points program now (separate from deeded weeks) - are you calling this RTU?

 

[TUGBrian]

Im not calling it anything =D...if there is something wrong with one of the figures let me know, im only inputting information I get from members sofar! ive changed vistana to read "both" now.

 

[DeniseM]

Under the Deeded or RTU column, you have "deeded - RTU - or both," and you have "both" for Wyndham - which has deeded weeks and points.

How are you defining RTU on the chart? Are points that do not have an underlying deed, RTU? If so, Vistana offers that at some resorts now, and we believe that will be their focus in the future.

 

[rhonda]

How about a row indicating ownership/membership expiration?

Contract has set expiration?

• WM: No
• DVC: Yes (date varies by resort)
• others?

 

[nuwermj]

Marriott Destination fees on 4150 points are $2,373 -- $0.5272 per point plus $185 program fee.

 

[TUGBrian]

perhaps a better description or terminology would be applicable for the deeded/rtu line...something to indicate the difference between an actual deeded property you own forever...and systems where you are simply paying for access to points within the system and dont actually own anything tangible?

 

[CO skier]

I think once this is done itll make for a great link for just about anyone who posts in the newbies section looking for help in picking a first timeshare for sure!

and likely lead to tons of other questions!

I think it is important to keep in mind the target audience for this excellent chart that compares the most basic properties of each systems' program.

Does someone new to timeshares care about the deeded versus RTU ownership types? imo, not in the beginning when they are just trying to narrow down the choice to a few. Does the OP who started all this necessarily care about how ownership is defined within any system? Probably not, and they probably would not know what "RTU" means. (How many posts have we read about confusing abbreviations).

I do not think deeded ownership offers anything "tangible" versus Right To Use. It is a timeshare; it is not like you can use it as collateral for a "timeshare equity loan" on a deeded timeshare. As an experience timeshare owner, I find non-deeded timeshares to be preferable -- much easier to transfer ownership.

Long story short, I think the type of ownership is not a primary concern for new owners, and the subtleties would just confuse potential new timeshare owners. These subtleties can be explained in detail within the links to the FAQ for each timeshare system, if the owners in any particular system find it of major importance. (In the WorldMark system, for example, it could be explained in one, short sentence).

Considering all this, I suggest deleting the "Deeded or RTU?" row from the comparison chart.

 

[DeniseM]

I do not think deeded ownership offers anything "tangible" versus Right To Use. It is a timeshare; it is not like you can use it as collateral for a "timeshare equity loan". As an experience timeshare owner, I find non-deeded timeshares to be preferable -- much easier to transfer ownership.

Maybe with some systems, but the new Vistana RTU points are not a good deal, so the difference is significant.

However, I agree that for newbies, the chart will just be a starting point for lots of research and questions.

 

[CO skier]

Maybe with some systems, but the new Vistana RTU points are not a good deal, so the difference is significant.

However, I agree that for newbies, the chart will just be a starting point for lots of research and questions.

An excellent example of how different each system may be and why it is so difficult to capture something as important as this in the systems-wide overview of the Chart.

Once someone has settled on Vistana and maybe one or two others, they can delve into the FAQ for the systems of interest to explore the critical differences that simply cannot be summarized in a Chart. Experienced owners within each system will, hopefully, have addressed the significant issues in the more detailed FAQ.

 

[TUGBrian]

im ok with eliminating that row...do we have something more useful to replace it with?

 

[TUGBrian]

just uploaded a new version...i moved the avg points row up to replace the deed/rtu row...so now we have the blank at the bottom. if we dont find another universal/simple item to toss in there...i will just remove the row completely.

 

[planzfortomorrow]

Great chart!!! I would have found it helpful when I was first learning about TS's as the points just don't mean much unless you already know each of the systems.

Hyatt has ROFR. I would say the differences between resale and developer are minor; the only thing is that you can't use your points for hotel stays.

Didn't Disney block resales from buying all season passes? Or something similar? Seems like they just changed something about 6 months ago which would have bothered me (if you previously owned resale then you were grandfathered in). I don't own DVC but will occasionally look into it, "just in case".

 

[TUGBrian]

how about something like "resale value"...with terms like "none" for systems like dri/hgcv all the way up to "significant" like DVC at the other end.

that sort of thing would get me to do a doubletake and ask further questions for sure!

 

[TUGBrian]

id thing something along the lines of

Marriott - modest
hilton - modest
vistana - low
hyatt - modest
wyndham - low
worldmark - low
bluegreen - none
disney - high
dri - none
hicv - none
shell - none

(cant wait to see what kinda debate this causes!)

 

[nuwermj]

(cant wait to see what kinda debate this causes!)

Looks good to me. But there should be a date stamp as things can change in a year. (Unless you're going to update it regularly).

 

[TUGBrian]

im not sure any of those have changed in the past few years, but should the situation arise its not difficult to update at all.

 

[CO skier]

id thing something along the lines of

Marriott - modest
hilton - modest
vistana - low
hyatt - modest
wyndham - low
worldmark - low
bluegreen - none
disney - high
dri - none
hicv - none
shell - none

(cant wait to see what kinda debate this causes!)

I think "Ease of Exit" would be more important, and would still capture any resale value. If a timeshare has some resale value it would be easy to exit.

WorldMark may have relatively low resale value, and Wyndham may have negative to low resale value, but on average either can be returned at no cost to Wyndham through Ovation. That is a definite plus. Either would be "Easy" to exit once done with the timeshare.

Another system that has no resale value and no buyback program would be "Difficult" to exit.

 

[rhonda]

im ok with eliminating that row...do we have something more useful to replace it with?

How about referencing 'Expires?' instead of the Deed/RTU issue? The DVC boards field many questions about when one resort expires vs another -- so I feel it is an important characteristic of timeshare evaluations.

 

[TUGBrian]

I think disney is really the only one that actually expires doesnt it?

 

[rhonda]

I think disney is really the only one that actually expires doesnt it?

Well, that might be. I don't know for all -- but, yes, DVC will expire.

In that case, perhaps the Expiration is the "last mile" exit strategy as requested above?

 

[rhonda]

WM added a "**" for ROFR. I don't think it belongs in the WM column. Was it, perhaps, intended elsewhere?

 

[TUGBrian]

might have been just a mis-label by me (chances are high)..ive removed it...but clearly it was meant to go somewhere?

(note page is current as of this posting)

 

[DeniseM]

vistana - low

The problem with "averages" is that there is a huge range within the system, so an "average" answer really doesn't mean much. There are Vistana timeshares that you can't give away, and Vistana timeshares that sell for $10-20K.

 

[TUGBrian]

the same can be said for most any system on this chart.

however i think its fair to say that the average vistana resale week has little to no resale value.

 

[Sandy VDH]

HICV time window is

3 yrs (home week)
13mo(home resort)
10mo(any)