[2013] Beware Redweek4less / IA Vacations / VP Title / [see new names below][merged]

[Sunbum]

I wish I knew what makes these guys so bad because they do sometimes have some good Marriott auctions and as Cory mentions they do complete some deals. I don't think they're blatantly fraudulent but often times so incompetent it borders on criminal negligence.

I'm trying to figure out why. Are some of the timeshares foreclosures that are tougher to process? I just don't get how they can be so bad with so many.

I think it is a bit of a Ponzi. They tell most with disputes that they will refund their money, but I don't think they have it. They have to go out and sell another week that they can't close on, to get the money to pay off the last guys. I have been waiting for 10 weeks since they said that would refund my money in full??? it is $15k and is taking them a long time to scrape together.

They also told the BBB that they would refund in full. That was 10 days ago and still not a word from them. They no longer respond to my inquiries as to where my money is.

 

[suzannesimon]

They are a Ponzi scheme, pure and simple. My daughter bid on one of their Ebay auctions, a Marriott KoOlina. She wasn't the winning bid but they contacted her to sell her one at the same price. She was prepared for it to take a few months due to the reviews here. They kept telling her that it hadn't passed ROFR. After 3 months she called Marriott and found out there was no owner with that seller's name and it had never been submitted for ROFR. My daughter told IA Vacations if she didn't have her money back in 48 hours, she was turning the matter over to her brother, a white collar frime agent with the FBI. She got the money back with a note that the sellers had decided not to sell after all (excuse me, wasn't there a contract?).

I think they do get some people to sell with them. Maybe those are the ones they put on ebay. The losing bidders then get contacted to buy other weeks that they don't have and bogus contracts are written. Over time, they try to complete those sales when they find other sellers but there are clearly more buyers than sellers so a lot money is coming in and a little money going out when they find real sellers.

I checked their real estate license which expired months ago and is still not renewed. I'm sure it was because it is very dangerous to operate their business as a licensed broker because they are open to all kinds of fines and jail time. It is easiervto fly under the radar withoutva license.

My daughter thinks the reaL problem comes with ROFR resorts which take a long time to close because they can't really submit it to the resort until they find a real seller.

 

[durrod]

Have you contacted the TN consumer affairs agency?
I too have been take it by this company. Bought a DVC in ebay with them that they never transfer or even show proof that it existed. They took the bill me later money and never close on anything. They already started their excuses and delay tactics to give me a refund.

 

[suzannesimon]

My daughter was going to contact the Tn authorities. She lives in Memphis. She wanted to make sure their check cleared first. I was going to go after their broker license, but, alas, they don't have one.

 

[Beaglemom3]

My daughter was going to contact the Tn authorities. She lives in Memphis. She wanted to make sure their check cleared first. I was going to go after their broker license, but, alas, they don't have one.

Suzanne,
Please read my posts at 22 & 39.
I had the same experience that your daughter did, but did not send them any money.
Let me know if I can help.
B.

 

[suzannesimon]

My daughter got her money back quickly when she threatened to get the FBI involved. She also reported them to Ebay and Paypal, but I am appalled that Tennessee hasn't shut them down. What is the point of Consumer Protection if they take a "Buyer Beware" attitude? Also, that Ebay continues to allow them to post there.

 

[Beaglemom3]

My daughter got her money back quickly when she threatened to get the FBI involved. She also reported them to Ebay and Paypal, but I am appalled that Tennessee hasn't shut them down. What is the point of Consumer Protection if they take a "Buyer Beware" attitude? Also, that Ebay continues to allow them to post there.

Ah, did not catch the first part, sorry (tired).
Agree. Tennessee does nothing and the same for Ebay. I reported them to Ebay and have not heard back.

 

[pathways25]

Ah, did not catch the first part, sorry (tired).
Agree. Tennessee does nothing and the same for Ebay. I reported them to Ebay and have not heard back.

So I'm in the same boat as many of the other posters on this thread. IA Vacations owes me a lot of money for a DVC contract that they failed to deliver. I've been trying to get my money back from them since last July with no success. I've even been through the BBB twice. Both times, IA Vacations acknowledged that they owed me the money, but they still have not sent me what I am owed.

The next step would appear to be legal action. Can anyone suggest any other routes to try before going to court? (Unfortunately, I don't have a relative in the FBI... )

Thanks!

 

[suzannesimon]

I don't think you have to have an FBI relative, but you can certainly tell them that you are going to report them to the FBI. It is definitely an interstate white collar crime which I think would apply. Then really report it to the FBI if they don't pay up.

 

[csxjohn]

I don't think you have to have an FBI relative, but you can certainly tell them that you are going to report them to the FBI. It is definitely an interstate white collar crime which I think would apply. Then really report it to the FBI if they don't pay up.

I would like to see someone in this situation just go to the FBI and see what they can do about it. Forget the threats of taking it to the feds, just report it and see what can be done.

 

[suzannesimon]

I'm emailing my son now to find out who to contact. He lives in Hawaii so they are still asleep out there.

 

[suzannesimon]

I'm emailing my son now to find out who to contact. He lives in Hawaii so they are still asleep out there.

My son got back in touch. He said the Tennessee Attorney General is the best place to start. They have to investigate and the more complaints, the better.

http://www.tn.gov/attorneygeneral/cpro/filecomplaint.html

He said the FBI would also investigate: mailto:Memphis@ic.fbi.gov

He said he would not personally get involved unless there was someone on the inside who could tell him how it all works. Everything I've heard is this is a family-owned business - both IA Vacations and the Title Company are one and the same. I would think the Title operation would be the easiest to go after since they are more regulated.

 

[pathways25]

My son got back in touch. He said the Tennessee Attorney General is the best place to start. They have to investigate and the more complaints, the better.

http://www.tn.gov/attorneygeneral/cpro/filecomplaint.html

He said the FBI would also investigate: mailto:Memphis@ic.fbi.gov

He said he would not personally get involved unless there was someone on the inside who could tell him how it all works. Everything I've heard is this is a family-owned business - both IA Vacations and the Title Company are one and the same. I would think the Title operation would be the easiest to go after since they are more regulated.

Thanks for the info! I will send IA one more ultimatum, though I know they won't respond, then I'll start with the TN Attorney General's office. I just don't have a good feeling that they can/will do anything about this. It seems that suing them in small claims court is the only viable way to recover and even then, they may be judgement proof.

 

[csxjohn]

Thanks for the info! I will send IA one more ultimatum, though I know they won't respond, then I'll start with the TN Attorney General's office. I just don't have a good feeling that they can/will do anything about this. It seems that suing them in small claims court is the only viable way to recover and even then, they may be judgement proof.

Why not go straight to the FBI. If the seller is committing a federal crime they may take action?

 

[suzannesimon]

I bet the Attorney General would at least write IA a letter inquiring about their practices in your situation which would put you at the top of their refund list to get the DA off their backs. Remember it's a Ponzi scheme. Some people get their money back, some actually get timeshares after many months or years. Many get nothing. IA just has to slow the process down because they don't really have a real timeshare to sell you yet.

 

[pathways25]

I bet the Attorney General would at least write IA a letter inquiring about their practices in your situation which would put you at the top of their refund list to get the DA off their backs. Remember it's a Ponzi scheme. Some people get their money back, some actually get timeshares after many months or years. Many get nothing. IA just has to slow the process down because they don't really have a real timeshare to sell you yet.

I looked carefully at the website that you suggested a few posts back and the process looks very much like the BBB process, except that it moves more slowly. They stress that they have no legal authority to compel the business to do anything so in the end, if the business does not remedy the situation, you are forced to go to the courts.

In my case, IA has already stated that they cannot deliver the timeshare. They have also already agreed that they owe me my money back. Further, they have not stated that they won't pay me, they just don't respond to any communication and of course, they haven't paid me.

 

[suzannesimon]

My daughter was in the same position. She threatened them with the FBI if she didn't 't get the money in 48 hours . They Fed Exed the check to her the next day.

They have to do one of 2 things with their sales - find a real seller who wants an immediate sale at the price you agreed to or sell enough phony timeshares that they can get the cash to return to you.

 

[TexinTX]

Finally Transfered by read on for possible real estate fraud.

FINALLY CLOSED!

ebay auction won for $1690 on 11/21/13
paid $2,573.00 (includes closing costs + transfer fee) on 11/23/13
initial contract and paperwork sent in to them 11/25/13
ROFR/estoppel request sent in 11/27/13
ROFR/estoppel response received 12/23/13
2014 maint fees paid: 01/02/14
recorded deed: 01/06/14 (with ERROR)
correction deed recorded: 01/13/14 (see interesting notes afterwards)
Confirmation from HGVC of completed transfer: 02/20/14

Total time 3 months.

Notes:
1) Keep on top of them every couple of weeks just to make sure they are moving along

2) Contract stipulated they could use whichever deed type they wanted. I changed contact to indicate that only warranty deed was acceptable. They opted in the end for a 'special warranty deed', but as owner bought from HGVC so no real problem (I would not have accepted a non-warranty deed).

3) Modified contract to include clauses for refunds in case the deal cannot close.

4) DEED ERROR: Cut and paste error, they stated the governance of covenants of another HGVC property and not HGVC South Beach, which required a correction deed to be recorded. Recommend you check all paperwork they submit (some other postings indicate even name on deed wrong). I don't know if or how much this delayed HGVC completing transfer.

5) Some real estate shenanigans : They slip in the same signature page (of previous owner) for the 2 deeds. Also the signature page was dated even before the auction was won. This could be considered fraud, but apparently a common practice in real estate deals from my research. The notary could also face legal charges for it if it's proved that he notarized a loose page on a contract (thereby aiding the fraud).

 

[suzannesimon]

The problems that I have heard of with this seller is that they may work fine with the ebay auction. The problem occurs when they offer the non-winning bidders a "second chance". What they told my daughter is that they had others and would sell them to her for her bid price. They then come up with a sales contract with their name as a seller. These are the ones that are the real problem because they don't have a real property yet. They just hope to find one before the buyer gets suspicious. It may also keep them in good status with Ebay as long as the property they are auctioning has a real seller of a real week.

 

[pathways25]

Got my money back, finally!

I bet the Attorney General would at least write IA a letter inquiring about their practices in your situation which would put you at the top of their refund list to get the DA off their backs. Remember it's a Ponzi scheme. Some people get their money back, some actually get timeshares after many months or years. Many get nothing. IA just has to slow the process down because they don't really have a real timeshare to sell you yet.

So as I mentioned a week ago, I sent IA Vacations one final demand email where I told them that I would escalate the dispute if they did not refund my money. The sent me a check for the full amount the next day. They had my money for nearly a year and I've been fighting for over 6 months to get my money back so I'm really glad it's finally over!

Regarding what suzannesimon said about IAV being a Ponzi scheme, I think I wouldn't go that far. A Ponzi scheme implies fraudulent intent and I don't think that's the case here. My guess is that since the economy is improving, the number of desperate sellers has declined sharply, especially for the higher end properties that they can sell for real money. Since their revenue is based on collecting the upfront fee, I'll bet it's dropped quite a bit and they're having cash flow issues which is why they are slow-paying or no-paying people.

Anyway, I'm glad I can finally put this behind me!

 

[suzannesimon]

I'm so glad that you received your money. My daughter was thrilled when she received hers. Ponzi scheme or not, they are selling timeshares that they don't have to sell. I believe that is against the law.

 

[durrod]

I am also glad to say they also return my money they hold for 5 months.
They kept delaying the refund saying it would take 7-10 days to " process it", I disputed the purchase with bill me later and looks like that help (don't know for sure) as the closing company sent an email telling a refund was sent. Got the money an I am glad it's over. They were selling high end units (DVC) and never deliver or show any proof of the contract. Unfortunately ebay it's getting to many bad sellers who don't deliver or take way to long to do so.

 

[Egret1986]

Congratulations!

So as I mentioned a week ago, I sent IA Vacations one final demand email where I told them that I would escalate the dispute if they did not refund my money. The sent me a check for the full amount the next day. They had my money for nearly a year and I've been fighting for over 6 months to get my money back so I'm really glad it's finally over!

Regarding what suzannesimon said about IAV being a Ponzi scheme, I think I wouldn't go that far. A Ponzi scheme implies fraudulent intent and I don't think that's the case here. My guess is that since the economy is improving, the number of desperate sellers has declined sharply, especially for the higher end properties that they can sell for real money. Since their revenue is based on collecting the upfront fee, I'll bet it's dropped quite a bit and they're having cash flow issues which is why they are slow-paying or no-paying people.

Anyway, I'm glad I can finally put this behind me!

I've been a buyer of several timeshares from them. I only had an issue once and it did take some arm-twisting (dispute with credit card company) to get refunded a maintenance fee that I had to pay that was supposed to have been included.

I feel that I've been pretty "lucky" with my dealings with them.

Way to go in getting your money back!

 

[Sunbum]

Still Hope?

I have been waiting for my refund for months now. The deal started last June. They have stopped responding to my e-mails totally now.

Extremely fustrated

 

[suzannesimon]

You have to threaten them. Call and tell them you are contacting the Tennessee attorney general and/or FBI to report them if you don't get your money within 5 days. They seem to respond to legal threats.