[2006] SVO Resale: Yes you can requalify/retro [MERGED]

[Pindento]

Thanks Fredm and YYJMSP!

I have to admit that I didn't read every page of this thread until today, just scanned it again to find the PhilyPhan post in Aug of '09 - very suspicious stuff. I've been really interested in buying a couple resales to consider options for the upgrade and requal approach along with a developer purchase, and this mornings conversation took the wind out of the sails.

Hasn't taken the option completely out of consideration without a developer purchase ... but I sure do agree with responses to PhilyPhan post - no harm in buyers working within whatever "the rules" are to find the optimal value. Gives existing owners additional options to sell, and gives buyers additional motivation to enter the market. There's little chance I'd consider a developer purchase without this option. If they have buyers beating down the door for a direct purchase without a resale re-qual/upgrade option, more power to 'em ... but I wouldn't be able to understand turning down a segment of the market.

Regards and thanks again,
Vincent

 

[Fredm]

Thanks Fredm and YYJMSP!

I have to admit that I didn't read every page of this thread until today, just scanned it again to find the PhilyPhan post in Aug of '09 - very suspicious stuff. I've been really interested in buying a couple resales to consider options for the upgrade and requal approach along with a developer purchase, and this mornings conversation took the wind out of the sails.

Hasn't taken the option completely out of consideration without a developer purchase ... but I sure do agree with responses to PhilyPhan post - no harm in buyers working within whatever "the rules" are to find the optimal value. Gives existing owners additional options to sell, and gives buyers additional motivation to enter the market. There's little chance I'd consider a developer purchase without this option. If they have buyers beating down the door for a direct purchase without a resale re-qual/upgrade option, more power to 'em ... but I wouldn't be able to understand turning down a segment of the market.

Regards and thanks again,
Vincent

My experience has been that Starwood sales reps will work with you to retro-qualify a secondary market purchase, if that is the only way they will make a direct sale.

I agree that the retro-qualification program is a source of secondary market buyers, and discontinuing it will have an adverse impact on demand.

 

[SCMom]

We were offered the possibility of retro on Saturday

We just spent a week at Westin Mission Hills (purchased a cheap Getaway.). It was our first trip to a Westin property since we bought our SDO last summer. We did the Owner's Update and, of course, they were blown away by how much I know about the system (thanks to TUG!). Both the saleswoman and her manager were dying to sell us a Gold Plus WDW week worth 81,000 SOs and try to retro my SDO. Price would have been about 21K. They were not sure if my SDO could be retroed and I didn't have them do all the research because we weren't really going to buy. They were certainly not talking about no more retro. Incentives were bonus 148,000 SOs plus 80,000 SPs. Problem is that WDW MFs are $1,500 a year. When the closer guy offered me a 3 night return plus 50,000 SPs for 1,400, it wasn't too hard to say no as I had just stayed for a week on a 375 Getaway.

 

[jerseygirl]

I think the retro process still exists as evidenced By SCMom's recent experience but I think the upgrade opportunities may be gone.

 

[YYJMSP]

We just spent a week at Westin Mission Hills (purchased a cheap Getaway.). It was our first trip to a Westin property since we bought our SDO last summer. We did the Owner's Update and, of course, they were blown away by how much I know about the system (thanks to TUG!). Both the saleswoman and her manager were dying to sell us a Gold Plus WDW week worth 81,000 SOs and try to retro my SDO. Price would have been about 21K. They were not sure if my SDO could be retroed and I didn't have them do all the research because we weren't really going to buy. They were certainly not talking about no more retro. Incentives were bonus 148,000 SOs plus 80,000 SPs. Problem is that WDW MFs are $1,500 a year. When the closer guy offered me a 3 night return plus 50,000 SPs for 1,400, it wasn't too hard to say no as I had just stayed for a week on a 375 Getaway.

We had a similar experience back in March this year, but they were trying to get us to buy Lagunamar as Desert Willow was "sold out" for now...

I think the only difference in what they offered was price was a tiny bit higher and the return incentive ("Explorer package") was for 5 days instead of 3 days.


We did an Owner's Update in Maui in July, and the sales guy was a bit poo-poo on the whole requalification thing, but I think it was just him not getting a sale of an "upgrade" to our WKORV property -- they wanted us to buy a OF unit at today's developer prices if we traded in our IV Deluxe at 2005 prices. Um, no thanks...

 

[oneohana]

I think the retro process still exists as evidenced By SCMom's recent experience but I think the upgrade opportunities may be gone.

Upgrades with a retro as of 2 weeks ago are still there.

 

[jerseygirl]

Upgrades with a retro as of 2 weeks ago are still there.

Upgrade of a resale? If yes, very nice! Pls detail (whatever you're comfortable with).

 

[YYJMSP]

Cut-and-paste from our sales rep:

We are still selling all of the resorts (since most locations do have off season weeks available); but if you are speaking of the top platinum plus season, the resorts that we mainly have some sort of inventory for right now are The Westin Lagunamar and The Westin St. John Resorts. The Westin Desert Willow Resort, The Westin Riverfront Mountain Resort and The Westin Lagunamar Ocean Resort were all out of available inventory for the Platinum Plus Season, but we just recently released more for the Cancun Resort and the Colorado Resort. However, there are some contingencies on the way they are selling the Platinum Plus Season at the Colorado Property. They are only selling Ski Season with the purchase of a 2nd week (2 week package). As for The Westin Desert Willow Resort, they do not have any Platinum Plus Season inventory currently available; they will have more once they wrap up some more building and register the villas to be sold, but for now they only have the other seasons available.

In regards to the retro guidelines (re-qualification of resale inventory), below you will find the current retro guidelines as they currently exist.

To retro a resale purchase of one of our existing properties into the Starwood Vacation Network for FULL membership privileges, you must purchase an interest directly from Starwood (Developer) as follows:

**If the new purchase (Developer Purchase) is for inventory within the continental U.S. or Mexico, the purchase price must meet a minimum of $20,000.

**If the new purchase (Developer Purchase) is for inventory in Hawaii or The Caribbean (Bahamas or St. John), the purchase price must meet a minimum of $40,000.

At the present time, there are no other options available with regards to resale inventory.

 

[Pindento]

Thanks YYJMSP !

Good info ... I'll try not to be a pest , but as for the final comment "At the present time, there are no other options available with regards to resale inventory." .... do you get the impression he's suggesting an upgrade of a resale is not an option?

 

[YYJMSP]

Thanks YYJMSP !

Good info ... I'll try not to be a pest , but as for the final comment "At the present time, there are no other options available with regards to resale inventory." .... do you get the impression he's suggesting an upgrade of a resale is not an option?

As far as I know, upgrades to resales weren't an option -- when we were in Hawaii this summer, they offered to let us use the original purchase price (from 5+ years ago) of our units against a new purchase, but they had put down $0 as the original price on the resale unit in our account.

 

[pathways25]

Thanks YYJMSP !

Good info ... I'll try not to be a pest , but as for the final comment "At the present time, there are no other options available with regards to resale inventory." .... do you get the impression he's suggesting an upgrade of a resale is not an option?

I believe the option to retro on upgrade was taken away about 18 months ago. You can look over this lengthy thread that talks about it:

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96596

 

[YYJMSP]

Upgrade of a resale? If yes, very nice! Pls detail (whatever you're comfortable with).

I'm going to speculate that this is the same as what we were offered in July.

You can upgrade your existing unit (any property it sounded like) to a more expensive developer unit at the same resort, and they would credit your original purchase price against the cost of the new unit. The catch seemed to be that they put down an original purchase price of $0 on our previously requalified unit.

If the difference was greater than the requalification threshold ($20K mainland, $40K elsewhere), you could retro an existing resale.

 

[Pindento]

I believe the option to retro on upgrade was taken away about 18 months ago. You can look over this lengthy thread that talks about it:

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96596

Thanks, I read the thread. One thing I struggled with ... if the requirement is $20K "new" money on the upgrade, and they're filling in $0 on the upgrade ... to Katherine's point, they're not upgrading anything, they're just selling a new developer purchase without anything in return for the unit being "upgraded" from. Well, I guess the only value you're getting is relief from the MF obligation - so, in essence ... this formula suggests that SVO values the existing week you have as a burden rather than an asset ...

 

[jerseygirl]

I'm going to speculate that this is the same as what we were offered in July.

You can upgrade your existing unit (any property it sounded like) to a more expensive developer unit at the same resort, and they would credit your original purchase price against the cost of the new unit. The catch seemed to be that they put down an original purchase price of $0 on our previously requalified unit.

If the difference was greater than the requalification threshold ($20K mainland, $40K elsewhere), you could retro an existing resale.

Thanks YYMSP. That's similar to what I've been told as well.

 

[YYJMSP]

Thanks YYMSP. That's similar to what I've been told as well.

The sales guy had drawn a great big line right through the requalified unit listing on our "portfolio sheet" that he had with him -- a not so subtle hint that it was worthless from his point-of-view...

 

[DanCali]

The sales guy had drawn a great big line right through the requalified unit listing on our "portfolio sheet" that he had with him -- a not so subtle hint that it was worthless from his point-of-view...

Did you draw a line through their unit listed on their pricing sheet and tell them it would be worthless from the market's POV in 7 days?

 

[SDKath]

Did you draw a line through their unit listed on their pricing sheet and tell them it would be worthless from the market's POV in 7 days?

LOL! Now that's funny...

Katherine

 

[YYJMSP]

Did you draw a line through their unit listed on their pricing sheet and tell them it would be worthless from the market's POV in 7 days?

Nah, I did worse than that

After his upgrade pitch didn't work (I explained to him how it would take 20+ years for me to break even on the new money I would give him for absolutely no increase in benefit), he went in to the "let's get you the last step up to 5 Star Elite".

I then explained to him that the only benefit that would gain me (from my personal point-of-view) would be SPG Platinum, and I could go "stay" at my local Four Points 25 single nights in the year (which would qualify me for SPG Platinum from nothing if necessary) for less than the cost of the additional MFs for the 2 new units he was trying to sell me.

The look on his face was priceless as he promptly lead me down the hallway to collect my $$ incentive...

 

[rebrewer]

Any recent experiences with upgrades and/or retros?

 

[clsmit]

In Maui they are buying back selected properties to upgrade into WKRORV/N but a pretty substantial additional payment is required (~$75K (not in finance, don't use M for 000). As the remaining original inventory (WLR, WDW, SVV) decreases they will continue to try to get inventory through a variety of means.

 

[boisebruin]

Just returned from WKORVN update

they are still doing the retro, except my sales lady called it legitimizing my resale purchase. They would give you full rights for the resale week if you bought any unit there, including EOY 1bedroom or lagunamar at $29K. It would take me to 3* elite, which I'm not sure helps me that much. It would basically give me SPG points. Not sure it's worth buying from the developer.

 

[DeniseM]

they are still doing the retro, except my sales lady called it legitimizing my resale purchase. They would give you full rights for the resale week if you bought any unit there, including EOY 1bedroom or lagunamar at $29K. It would take me to 3* elite, which I'm not sure helps me that much. It would basically give me SPG points. Not sure it's worth buying from the developer.

"Legitimizing" :hysterical: What a load of do-do!

Don't do it - 3 Star Elite has no real value. Unless you are going clear to 5 Star Elite, there is no reason to buy from the developer.



*If you are a newbie that stumbled upon this thread, please note that it is from 2006, and the "requalifying" rules have changed significantly.

 

[Ken555]

"Legitimizing" :hysterical: What a load of do-do!

I agree with Denise, but I'd use a different four letter word to describe it.

 

[ada903]

I am not sure if this is old news or new news, but a friend of mine who is at Lagunamar said they are now offering upgrades cross-property - so you can upgrade from Vistana Villages to Lagunamar, for example. Not all properties are eligible, it seems. They also still do the retro of existing properties with an upgrade purchase, including the "cross-property" upgrades.

 

[KACTravels]

Yes, at Lagunamar last week they offered us a "potential cross property" upgrade for our EOY WPOR - but they wanted $30K new money and would have sold us an Annual WLR and Even EOY WLR. They also said the "cross property" deals had "business rules" and they were not sure if the specific offer would be approved.